Bristow & Sutor 1st Visit what to do next ??

[klesqus]

Hello,

 

Bit of long story but I will try to make it as brief as possible. I have gone into arrears with Council Tax (this is a second ocassion) because the I was strugling to pay the previous repeyment plan kindly offered by B&S. In the end I have paid the first one off but in a result I have gone into arrears with the current Council Tax bill. I have found this morning a letter in my letterbox (copy attached). Nobody knocked on my door and I have been charged for it. It is saying it is the first visit, can somebody advise me what steps I should take now, what letters should I send (any templates are much appreciated).

Thanks in advance for any help and keep up the good work.

 

Thanks

klesqus

[rebel11]

Hi kle

 

Welcome to CAG

 

The guys will advise as soon as they are available.

[Surfer01]

As a matter of interest did these "kind" people give you a breakdown of visits and charges on the first lot of arrears as they may owe you some money if they hiked up various fees etc.

Secondly are there any charges or a breakdown on the letter dropped through the box today as their charges for council tax are limited.

[klesqus]

Hello,

 

Thanks for replying. I do belive I have asked for the breakdown on the fees, payments and charges. I think I might have that somewhere. I will post it as soon as I will find it, but I am new to the forum and I don't know how to post the attachments in normal size and quality. On the front it is saying that the Total amount owed is 1080.01 including visit cost of 24.50 per liability order. On the back of the letter it is saying that:

We are prepared to allow you to pay in instalments as detailed below:

First payment of 100.01 by 11/01/11

Followed by 10 weekly payments of 98.00 to clear the balance.

 

So that makes repayments of arround 400 per month. I just lost my job and I can't afford to make that kind of payments.

 

Please advise me what to do.

 

Thanks

Klesqus

[klesqus]

As a matter of interest did these "kind" people give you a breakdown of visits and charges on the first lot of arrears as they may owe you some money if they hiked up various fees etc./QUOTE]

 

Hi,

 

I got the statment of the account. The fees and charges I can find on that account (except of Card Transaction Fees) are:

17/08/10 41.00 Levy Fee

17/08/10 12.00 W/Poss Up To: 17/08/2010

17/08/10 24.50 Redemption Fee (Head H)

29/10/10 230.00 Van/Abortive Removal Fees

 

That's it. I dont know what the Head H means next to Redemption Fee and I do think that 230 GBP Removal Fees are bit high.

 

Please let me know what you think.

 

Thanks

[Surfer01]

Can you confirm with the council at the earliest oportunity the amount on the liability order. Send the bailiffs something along these lines;

Dear Sir

 

With reference to the above account, Can you please provide me with a breakdown of the charges.

 

This includes:

a - the time & date of any Bailiff action that incurred a Fee.

b - the reason for the fee.

c - the name(s) of the Bailiff(s) that attended on each occasion a Fee was charged.

d - the name(s) of the Court(s) the Bailiff(s) was/were Certificated at.

e - the date of the Certification.

 

This is not a Subject access request under the Data Protection Act S7 1998 so does not incur a fee of £10. You are obliged to provide this information.

 

I require this information within 14 days.

 

Yours faithfully

 

Ripped off customer"

 

Did you make any council tax payments during 2010. If you are now unemployed you need to put in a claim as soon as possible if you have not done so as this will impact the current outstanding amount and reduce it!.

[Surfer01]

Seems out posts crossed, but the good news is that the bailiff is trying to rip you off with excessive fees. How many visits did they pay to your house and on what goods did they levy? They woudl have left a cpoy of the levy with you.

[klesqus]

Hello,

 

Thanks for replying. They visited my house 3 times as far as I can remember. First one when my wife (doesn't speak english very well) let him in the house and she signed the WPO the goods that they seized was only a PC, LCD TV and some furniture. Second time was when I was defaulted one payment and they send one of the bailiffs to my house (nothing happend). Third time was when they sent Removal team.

That was it. Thanks for your interest and help so far.

 

Thanks

Klesqus

[ploddertom]

Hello,

 

Thanks for replying. They visited my house 3 times as far as I can remember. First one when my wife (doesn't speak english very well) let him in the house and she signed the WPO the goods that they seized was only a PC, LCD TV and some furniture - can you expand on the furniture please. Second time was when I was defaulted one payment and they send one of the bailiffs to my house (nothing happend). Third time was when they sent Removal team. - any reason why removal did not take place

That was it. Thanks for your interest and help so far.

 

Thanks

Klesqus

 

Do you know how much the Liability Order was for as confirmed by the Council.

 

PT

[klesqus]

Hello,

 

I don't know how much was the Liability Order but I can confirm it tomorrow (should I go to the council office or just phone them). By "some furniture" I meant 3-seater sofa and 2 armchairs. The removal did not take place as I paid the full outstanding balance (managed to borrow the money from my ex-employed).

 

Thanks in advance for any help.

 

Klesqus

[ploddertom]

Hello,

 

I don't know how much was the Liability Order but I can confirm it tomorrow (should I go to the council office or just phone them). By "some furniture" I meant 3-seater sofa and 2 armchairs. The removal did not take place as I paid the full outstanding balance (managed to borrow the money from my ex-employed).

 

Thanks in advance for any help.

 

Klesqus

 

Ring the Council by all means as it is a simple request. How many of you are in the household & if they removed the items listed on the Levy what other seting would you be left with? I appreciate you have now paid in full but do you know how much in total charges the bailiff has applied? It will still pay you to write to them and see what they say as I think there may be more than what you have listed above.

 

PT

[klesqus]

Ring the Council by all means as it is a simple request. How many of you are in the household & if they removed the items listed on the Levy what other seting would you be left with? I appreciate you have now paid in full but do you know how much in total charges the bailiff has applied? It will still pay you to write to them and see what they say as I think there may be more than what you have listed above.

 

PT

 

Hi,

 

There is only three of us, my wife, myself and my 4 year old autistic daughter. If they would remove those items there would be no setting left at all. We might be getting bit confused here. The charges listed in my previous post was for the last debt which is alreaqdy cleared. I have requested that just after I paid it as I felt that those charges ar way to high. I can take the picture of the statment to show what thet wrote on it. The liability order has been made out for 1055.51 so they added 24.50 for delivering the letter without even knocking on the door. There is no WPO written against the new one, but I was wondering if they can use the WPO which has been sign by my wife for the previous debt.

Thanks for help

 

KP

Edited January 7, 2011 by klesqus

[ploddertom]

This gets even more intriguing due to your daughter's disability as your household should clearly have been identified as "vulnerable" in which case the Bailiff failed in his resposibility to return the debt immediately back to the Council. Also as your wife's first language is not English this also was enough to put your household into the "vulnerable" category.You can read the deatils at this website:

http://www.dca.gov.uk/enforcement/agents02.htm#part10

With reference to your seating arrangements I assume you therefore have no dining room furniture - table & chairs? If this was the case then the bailiff seized goods that were exempt from seizure. Were any of the goods seized seized subject to any outstanding finance?

 

I can nearly feel a Formal Complaint coming on

 

PT

[hallowitch]

but I was wondering if they can use the WPO which has been sign by my wife for the previous debt.

 

no

[ploddertom]

May I suggest you contact the Council and ask them:

1 - How much each Liability was for

2 - The period of time each one covered

3 - The dates each were passed to the bailiff

 

You then write to the Bailiff and ask for a breakdown of chrages on each account they held for you. Here's an example, adapt as you see fit and sent by both email and post using Signed For.

 

"From:

My Name

My Address

 

To:

Acme Bailiff Co

Bailiff House

 

Ref: Account No: 123456 & 654321

 

Dear Sir

 

With reference to the above accounts, Can you please provide me with a breakdown of the charges.

 

This includes:

a - the time & date of any Bailiff action that incurred a Fee.

b - the reason for the fee.

c - the name(s) of the Bailiff(s) that attended on each occasion a Fee was charged.

d - the name(s) of the Court(s) the Bailiff(s) was/were Certificated at.

e - the date of the Certification.

 

This is not a Subject Access Request under the Data Protection Act S7 1998 so does not incur a fee of £10. You are obliged to provide this information.

 

I require this information within 14 days.

 

Yours faithfully

 

Ripped off customer"

 

Address to send by post:

Bristow & Sutor

Bartleet Road

Washford

Redditch

Worcestershire

B98 0FL

email: [email protected]

 

PT

[klesqus]

This gets even more intriguing due to your daughter's disability as your household should clearly have been identified as "vulnerable" in which case the Bailiff failed in his resposibility to return the debt immediately back to the Council. Also as your wife's first language is not English this also was enough to put your household into the "vulnerable" category.You can read the deatils at this website:

 

With reference to your seating arrangements I assume you therefore have no dining room furniture - table & chairs? If this was the case then the bailiff seized goods that were exempt from seizure. Were any of the goods seized seized subject to any outstanding finance?

 

I can nearly feel a Formal Complaint coming on

 

PT

 

Hello,

 

We do have a table in the living room but we haven't got a dinning area with designated dining furniture. So without the the sofa and the armchairs we wouldn't have nothing to sit on. I did inform the bayliff last time that we do have a disabled child ( even showed them the letter from DLA to prove it but his respose was that he doesn't care because I was working. None of the items on the levy was on finance and I did not have a car at this point. Regarding the letter should I send it recorded delivery or can I email them? They did have my email account on the file.

 

Thanks

[ploddertom]

Send the letter tonight by email and tomorrow pop a copy in the post sent Signed For (Recorded) - don't forget to both account numbers on it as you want the breakdowns for both. I believe you have some arguable points with them.

 

PT

[klesqus]

Hello,

 

I just had an email from B&S. Please have a read through and let me know what you think.

 

We can firstly confirm all of our bailiffs are certified at Redditch Magistrates court and then the certificates are signed by Judge at Worcester Court.

 

We can confirm the following for the reference FOR-T/16390:

 

Our bailiff Mr B A attended on the 23.06.09 at 13:29 and a fee was incurred of £24.50 this was a 1st visit ATL Fee (Attendance to Levy)

 

Our bailiff Mr A B attended on the 13.07.09 at 16:12 and a fee was incurred of £18.00 this was a 2nd visit ATL Fee (Attendance to Levy) Mr B then re attended at 19:23 on 13.07.09 and the following fees were incurred:

 

A Levy Fee of £36.00

A Walking Possession Fee £12.00

A Redemption Fee £24.50

 

We can confirm the following for the reference FOR-T/16656:

 

Our bailiff Mr D H attended on the 17.08.10 at 18:07 and the following fees were incurred:

 

A Levy Fee of £41.00

A Walking Possession Fee £12.00

A Redemption Fee £24.50

 

Our bailiff Mr M T Attended on the 29.10.10 at 12:39 and a Van Fee of £230.00 was incurred.

 

For a breakdown of the levy fee this information is provided on the back of the blue document which was left with you on the 13.07.09 and 17.08.10 this document is called a Notice of Seizure of Goods. Also on the back of this document is an explanation of what a Walking Possession agreement is. The redemption fee is

 

'The charge is made under schedule 5 and is payable for the release of the listed goods back to your control. It is similar to the fee payable to reclaim (or redeem) items pledged to a pawnbroker as security for a loan or the final payment of a hire purchase agreement'

 

The following bailiffs that visited your property when fees were incurred were certified on the following dates, Bailiff certificates are renewed every 2 years so some of the bailiffs may have been certified again after the visits on your accounts so we can only provide the up to date information.

 

Mr B A – 16.12.09

Mr A B – 27.04.09

Mr D H – 16.12.09

Mr M T – 03.09.10

 

We trust this is all the information in which you ghave requested.

 

Yours faithfully

 

Bristow & Sutor

 

 

Thanks in advance for any help.

 

KP

Edited January 8, 2011 by klesqus

[ploddertom]

May I suggest you edit the post and remove all the names therein please.

 

PT

[jenren321]

PT: is this how they are getting around charging thee hedder h fee?

 

sorry for replying on your post, i am also having issues with bristow and sutor

[ploddertom]

PT: is this how they are getting around charging thee hedder h fee?

 

sorry for replying on your post, i am also having issues with bristow and sutor

 

Sorry having a thick Saturday, I don't quite understand the question.

 

My interpretation of the Head H fee is that you would have had to have had your goods levied/seized initially, failing to pay what is due the Bailiff has turned up and removed said goods to a local auction house. However prior to the sale you come up with the cash and pay the debt and all associated charges - therefore no sale can take place and you are free to collect your goods.

 

I believe there are a lot of different interpretations of this Fee. However Wilson v South Kesteven District Council (2000) EWCA Civ 218 seems to suggest my view.

 

PT

[ploddertom]

 

We can confirm the following for the reference FOR-T/16390:

 

Our bailiff Mr B A attended on the 23.06.09 at 13:29 and a fee was incurred of £24.50 this was a 1st visit ATL Fee (Attendance to Levy)

 

Our bailiff Mr A B attended on the 13.07.09 at 16:12 and a fee was incurred of £18.00 this was a 2nd visit ATL Fee (Attendance to Levy) - I don't have a problem with either of these Visit Fees, however I assume on both occasions you were out? Mr B then re attended at 19:23 on 13.07.09 and the following fees were incurred:

 

A Levy Fee of £36.00 - I still believe this shouldn't be allowed due to you wife not having a comprehensive grasp of the English language, what was written on this Notice of Seizure

A Walking Possession Fee £12.00 - if the above argument fails did she sign it and did she realise what she was signing

A Redemption Fee £24.50 - I believe this isn't valid

 

We can confirm the following for the reference FOR-T/16656:

 

Our bailiff Mr D H attended on the 17.08.10 at 18:07 and the following fees were incurred:

 

A Levy Fee of £41.00 - as above, did they levy the same goods again

A Walking Possession Fee £12.00 - as above

A Redemption Fee £24.50 - as above

 

Our bailiff Mr M T Attended on the 29.10.10 at 12:39 and a Van Fee of £230.00 was incurred.

 

For a breakdown of the levy fee this information is provided on the back of the blue document which was left with you on the 13.07.09 and 17.08.10 this document is called a Notice of Seizure of Goods.

 

Are they also saying that no visit was made between Levying on the 1st Account to them revisiting 11 months later? Were any payments made in this interim period?

 

Sorry if I appear to be going over old ground but am trying to get a clear picture in my mind.

 

PT

[jenren321]

A Redemption Fee £24.50

The redemption fee is

'The charge is made under schedule 5 and is payable for the release of the listed goods back to your control. It is similar to the fee payable to reclaim (or redeem) items pledged to a pawnbroker as security for a loan or the final payment of a hire purchase agreement'

 

is this how they are saying they can get around charging a hedder h fee even though the said goods wasnt removed?

[ploddertom]

A Redemption Fee £24.50

The redemption fee is

'The charge is made under schedule 5 and is payable for the release of the listed goods back to your control. It is similar to the fee payable to reclaim (or redeem) items pledged to a pawnbroker as security for a loan or the final payment of a hire purchase agreement'

 

is this how they are saying they can get around charging a hedder h fee even though the said goods wasnt removed?

 

My interpretation of this is at Post 21

 

PT

[jenren321]

thanks PT, so its just another [problem] trying attempt at getting more money.

 

sorry for high jacking your thread