Phonecall from ASDA.

[Squirrel64]

Hi,

 

On Tuesday 19th January 2010 I had my first online delivery from ASDA, Newgate Lane, Fareham. I did not hear the driver knock so he telephoned me to let me know he was here. His number was stored on my mobile at 18.31 on 19-1.

 

This morning 22/1/10 between 5 and 5.30 am I received 3 telephone calls from this same number. Two rang of before I could answer the 3rd I answered and so it logged on my phone as received at 5.30. The caller immediately cut off. I switched off my phone to prevent further calls.

 

At about 12 pm today I telephoned ASDA head office to report this incident. Shortly thereafter (S) from ASDA Fareham telephoned me. She asked for the number that had called me. She then told me that this number emphatically did not belong to any of her drivers. She had checked both their work and personal mobiles and had all their numbers and so I was mistaken in my belief that I had been telephoned by an ASDA employee.

 

I telephoned the number on my mobile using my home phone, the person who answered identified himself as (A) and confirmed that he was an ASDA employee. I asked him to go to (S) and tell her it was him who phoned me. He replied 'I was asleep at 5.30, why would I phone you?' I replied that it was irrelevent why, only that he did and he should admit this to his manager. He said (S) was with him now and would phone me back.

 

(S) phoned back. She stated that the phone I had called was (A) private phone. She stated that (A) partner had confirmed that he was asleep at 5.30 and that there was no record on his call log of a call to me at 5.30 and no reason why he would phone. She implied that unless I could supply her with a reason as to why this man had telephoned then I was clearly mistaken. I asked why when she had asked the drivers for their phone numbers (A) had failed to supply her with this one. I said that it is beyond my capabilities to fake a call onto my phone log but ridiculously easy to delete a call from the log. (A) partner would be most likely to confirm he was asleep since she has a vested interest in covering for him. Further, that unless she was awake then how could she confirm that he was asleep? It occured to me that since the phone cut off twice this suggests that the caller did not call accidently. (A) then went on to cover his tracks, not giving his number to (S) and deleting the call log.

 

Next (M) telephoned me. I pointed out to him that apart from everything else I was most troubled that his staff were storing confidential customer information on their private home phones to use for their own amusement. He said that there were awaiting a new driver phone and that in the meantime staff were using their own phones. He agreed that it was most likely that (A), for whatever reason had called me. However he continued to ask me to speculate as to why until eventually I got cross and told him that I did not care why. At this point I informed (M) that I had spoken to both him and (S) for some considerable time and yet neither of them had even come close to apologising. Then was a long silence and then (M) suggested that 'an apology goes without saying'. He stated that he would personally ensure that (A) removed my phone number from his mobile phone.

 

I was disappointed and frustrated at their blase attitude and ended the call.

 

Later it occured to me that I should actually have some confirmation that this had occurred. I phoned' the store manager,(Edit) to see if he could provide me with written confirmation. He was unable to take my call as he was in a meeting. Staff said he would call me when he was free. I telephoned again at 17.30 to be told he was in a conference call and would return my call within half an hour. I telephoned at 19.00 to be told that the manager had gone home. Apparently he is unconcerned that his staff have breached the Data protection act and invaded my privacy for their own purposes. I wondered if drivers hold onto phone numbers can they also access further information about customers like bank details? Since ASDA are not bothered if they harrass customers in the middle of the night would they decline to take responsibility if staff helped themselves to card details?

 

Today I again telephoned ASDA at approx 18.00 I told them I intended to email the Sun Newspaper as I felt that this information was of public interest in that customers need to know that their information is not secure. I further told them I intended to complain to the ombudsman about their breach of the data protection act (http://www.city.ac.uk/ic/dataprotection/dpwhatis.html) and I asked if I could have an email address for ASDA so that I could forward my emails as a matter of courtesey. The chap I spoke to was unable to give a head office email. I then asked for an email address for the chairman of ASDA. I was told this would not be made available to me as it was a breach of the data protection act.

 

I have (A's) no. My call log shows that he phoned' me at 18.31 19/1 legitamately to tell me he had my shopping and again at 5.30 on 22/1 for reasons best known to himself. I have received the most feeble of apologies from ASDA and absolutely no confirmation that they have removed my details from A's phone. They will not reply to me to reassure me that my details have been removed. Is this man CRB checked? Am I safe? ASDA dont seem to care. Can you help?

 

.

 

 

 

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Edited January 26, 2010 by maroondevo52
Removed names

[maroondevo52]

Hello and Welcome, Squirrel64.

 

I will move your post to start a new thread for you in the appropriate Forum.

 

Regards.

 

Scott.

[MARTIN3030]

You should put your complaint in writing to Adsa Data Protection Manager

If you are not happy with the response,then file a complaint with the ICO.

 

The address is;

Data Protection Officer

ASDA Online Exclusive

MMT Centre

Severn Bridge

Aust

Bristol

BS35 4BL

 

 

Here your complaint SHOULD be taken seriously,and be dealt with properly.

[buzby]

I must say, I do feel you have completely over-reacted to a situation and as a result done the technology no favours.

 

Why?

 

You are making heavy weather of a situation, whilst unfortunate, was neither malicious or with intent to alarm or cause distress. ANY number dialled by a mobile is 'stored' and overwritten after a further 10 (or so) calls are dialled. If the calling phone does not dial any numbers subsequently, then the last number remains in memory and can be dialled (often erroneously) on the press of just two buttons - sometimes not even then, as I've dialled my last called number inadvertently simply by having the phone in my back pocket, and was completely unaware of this.

 

Since ANY phone in the world can call you, you are making yourself available to all callers, and bearing in ming the stink (unjustified, in my view) you are creating over this) you appear to be promoting the idea that anyobe calling you should simply withold their number - and to resolve this problem, swithch their phone to NOT sending caller ID. You'll then -if the situation was to be re-run - have recieved some annonymous calls, of which you would have no idea whatsoever who was calling.

 

Is that a better solution? I don't think so.

 

As for Martin;s suggestion of contacting ASDA's data compliance officer, I really cannot believe he's suggested such a thing, and hopfully, he was having a laugh.

[Bookworm]

Martin didn't "suggest" anything, he merely supplied the best address for OP to have his concerns heard.

 

As for over-reacting, you do not know what OP's circumstances are.

 

For instance, if I were to get calls at 5.30 in the morning now, I'd be annoyed, yes, but that probably would stop there.

 

4 yrs ago, when my mum was dying and that every time the phone rang, it could have been THE one giving me the news, I wouldn't have been able to shrug it off so easily. I am a fairly traditional person in that aspect that I don't expect phone calls before 8 am and after 9 pm unless it's an emergency, and a phone ringing early in the morning usually means bad news, so yes I can understand the reaction.

 

We don't know OP's circumstances and therefore all we can do is help him direct his complaint, not derail him from it simply because we don't agree with it. It could be an old person feeling besieged in his home as it is, a battered wife, a rape victim. It may not. Point is, YOU don't know and neither do I. So instead of criticising that person, let's just help where we can. Seems fairly logical to me.

[labrat]

or alternituvly it could be a touchscreen phone, mine once dialed several people in the middle of the night due to a book falling over and landing on the phone.

 

the employee may simply have no idea that they have phoned you

[buzby]

What relevance as the OP's circumstances? Is a genuine error somehow less excusable because you've had a tough day or the wife gives you a hard time? It might make a reaction more understandable, but not excusable.

 

So instead of harping on about imagined circumstances that have no relevance to the matter at hand, perhaps you should resist when adding nothing to the debate?

[buzby]

or alternituvly it could be a touchscreen phone, mine once dialed several people in the middle of the night due to a book falling over and landing on the phone.

 

the employee may simply have no idea that they have phoned you

 

Precisely. The situation is hardly ideal, and I've unknowingly made a fair few calls when challenged, denied - because I genuinely had no knowledge of the calls that were actually made. It makes you feel a prat, but nothing to get into a lather about!

[mightymouse_69]

I agree with buzby here, my current phone it terrible for calling people by accident. I have lost count of the times when it has called a number and all the person on the other end can hear is me in a lecture or at work!

 

By all means make a complaint, but i would of thought you have complained already... and should have established that since (s) was not aware of making calls, this was all an accident!

[Bookworm]

What relevance as the OP's circumstances? Is a genuine error somehow less excusable because you've had a tough day or the wife gives you a hard time? It might make a reaction more understandable, but not excusable.

 

So instead of harping on about imagined circumstances that have no relevance to the matter at hand, perhaps you should resist when adding nothing to the debate?

"Harping on"? Charming as ever!

 

It is VERY relevant, despite you as usual dismissing any other opinion than your own as irrelevant.

 

I'll try to keep it simple for those who don't seem to understand the basics of customer care:

 

Was a mistake made, voluntarily or not? YES

Does the consumer feel aggrievated, whether you think it is over nothing or not? YES

Does the consumer have every right to express his grievance to the company? YES

Will he get satisfaction? Who knows? But who are we to try and stop him?

 

Incidentally, something which seems to escape people here is that he has a very valid point as regards the Data Protection Act. An employee who has a number which was given to him by the company to be used in the process of business and stores it on his private phione, regardless of the reasons why, is causing the company to be in breach of the DPA.

 

It may well be - and is fairly likely - that the number was dialled by accident. That doesn't excuse the fact it was dialled at all. "I didn't mean to do it guv" has never been a great excuse. It's even less so when the company denies it and tries to blame the customer.

 

Let's face it, all the person at the other end of the phone had to do was to say: "Very sorry, Mr x, we'll speak to all the drivers and make sure they delete the numbers as soon as they have finished with them, please accept our apologies and thank you for bringing it to our attention", possibly offer a voucher or free delivery or somethign equally minor to the company if the apology wasn't sufficient and that would have been the end of it.

 

If there's something I have learnt in a career of customer service, it's that even when you say no, you can't blame the client and dig your heels in (even if he's in the wrong). Say sorry, say it won't happen again, thank them for bringing it your attention, that defuses the situation in the vast majority of cases. Most people who call are aggrieved because they already know that they face an uphill battle just to be listened to. If they get someone with an attitude of "well, it's your fault" or "nothing we can do", they'll get angrier. Give them the impression that they are special, that you care about their call, even if it's the 1000th one you have dealt with on the same subject that day, and you'll be able to close your case there and then in the majority of cases.

[MARTIN3030]

"What relevance as the OP's circumstances?"

 

These things can cause lots of trouble for partners whether they are innocent or not.

 

 

"was neither malicious or with intent to alarm or cause distress."

 

 

The OP seems to think different and whether it was INTENDED to cause distress is neither here nor there-the fact is that it DID.

 

We could say that the banks do not intend to cause distress when they take charges from a persons benefits-but does that excuse the actions ?

 

 

As for Martin;s suggestion of contacting ASDA's data compliance officer, I really cannot believe he's suggested such a thing, and hopfully, he was having a laugh.

 

 

I suggested "such a thing " because the OP has not had an explanation given that is satisfactory,because it WAS a breach of her privacy-she is entitled to know,and because the Data protection manager is the person who should be in a position to give the answers.

 

The OP came here for advice,and opinions-I gave mine and you have given yours.

I dont think theres any question as to who she will be listening to.

[loopinlouie]

I think the asda data protection manager is a good route. For instance why did asda not give its drivers an asda mobile, a cheapy they sell to us of the counter for about 20.00 and give one to all drivers. At the end of the day they could have retained them for data protection reasons and then kept them incase a such problem happened again, as in their phones need replacing again.

 

Small ammount speant no customers chance of any inconvinience.

 

It rests with asda why they let this happen mistake or not, I wouldnt have been happy and felt very unsafe if this had happened to me, but there we go we are all different.

[haggis1984]

You should put your complaint in writing to Adsa Data Protection Manager

If you are not happy with the response,then file a complaint with the ICO.

 

The address is;

Data Protection Officer

ASDA Online Exclusive

MMT Centre

Severn Bridge

Aust

Bristol

BS35 4BL

 

 

Here your complaint SHOULD be taken seriously,and be dealt with properly.

 

Prob worth making you aware Squirrel that if you don't get a satisfactory response from the Data Protection Officer your next stop will be a complaint to the Information Commisioners Office. They are seriously slow (months and months) dealing with complaints. If they find in your favour all they will do is write Asda a polite letter.

 

Speaking as someone who has a habbit of getting ****ed at things others may find insignificant I find it helpful to think about what exactly I want to achieve, and how Im gonna feel if I put a load of effort into letter writing and dont achieve anything. Would you be happy with a letter of apology? (This may be the best you can hope for) If not maybe its not worth the hassle.

[MARTIN3030]

The reason these sorts of incidents repeat themselves Haggis is because theres lots of apathy and a thinking that its not worth the hassle.

Truth is that rules and guidelines are in place that should enable a data subject to privacy,and those who are trusted to store and process it,to uphold the principles within the DPA.

Of course I agree with you,the complaints process with the ICO is incredibly slow,but maybe that illustrates how many people are now seeking to uphold their rights.

 

A County Court has the remit to award up to £1,000 for a breach of the first principle of a DPA breach-this illustrates how seriously it can be viewed.

Quite a few CAG members have gone on to pursue compensation and won it.

No doubt Buzby will be aghast that I should mention this,but I did not make the rules-nor the recourse available,I am just telling as it is.

As a moderator I would be failing if I was unable to support consumers on here and tell them to forget it.

[haggis1984]

The reason these sorts of incidents repeat themselves Haggis is because theres lots of apathy and a thinking that its not worth the hassle.

Truth is that rules and guidelines are in place that should enable a data subject to privacy,and those who are trusted to store and process it,to uphold the principles within the DPA.

Of course I agree with you,the complaints process with the ICO is incredibly slow,but maybe that illustrates how many people are now seeking to uphold their rights.

 

A County Court has the remit to award up to £1,000 for a breach of the first principle of a DPA breach-this illustrates how seriously it can be viewed.

Quite a few CAG members have gone on to pursue compensation and won it.

No doubt Buzby will be aghast that I should mention this,but I did not make the rules-nor the recourse available,I am just telling as it is.

As a moderator I would be failing if I was unable to support consumers on here and tell them to forget it.

 

Totally agree.

 

Didn't get a feeling of what sort of outcome the OP is hoping for, or what they'd be happy with.

 

Of course apathy causes these incidents to repeat, but everyone has to decide for themselves which issues they want to fight and which to let go. No idea what else the OP has going on at the moment, or how much spare time and energy they have. Jjust wanted to make the OP aware that they could expend a lot of energy on this over a long time, so it's a good idea to have in mind what you want to achieve, and how you're going to feel at the end.

[MARTIN3030]

Look how many people fobbed the OP off when they just wanted an explanation ?

It would not have been too difficult to have given an apology then and maybe thrown in a tenner voucher as a goodwill gesture.

We dont expect this sort of response from a company like ASDA.

Its likely that the Data Protection Officer will want to see those earlier responses.

If he/she is able to reiterate the importance of doing things by the book,then there will be lessons learned.

Much of the problems are down to the ignorance of employees and knowing their obligations in applying the DPA.

Its only situations like this,which can bring some education,and also impliment procedure to prevent it from happening again.

[Kraken1]

Could the OP pursue this with asda and maybe the ICO? Yes, if they want to. they should ask what they want to get out of it first though.

 

Is there any point? I don't think so. I think it will cause more stress in the long term. Will they get anything out of it? I doubt it. Is this even a breach of the DPA? Maybe not, although it isn't my field so take take that as gospel. Even if it is a technical breach, I dare say that they could explain it with 'accident guv' and if the claim is laid out as above, I would not be surprised if the claim is giggled at.

 

I therefore vote Buz.

[MARTIN3030]

Vote Buz ?

 

"Is this even a breach of the Data Protection Act? Maybe not, although it isn't my field so take take that as gospel."

 

So if its not your field how can you even arrive at an opinion ?

 

"Even if it is a technical breach, I dare say that they could explain it with 'accident guv' and if the claim is laid out as above, I would not be surprised if the claim is giggled at."

 

Accident guv ? I dont think so.

ASDA can giggle at their peril.

[Kraken1]

I feel I can give an opinion as I have good general legal knowledge, and life experience.

 

As you know law is very specialist and you can need quite detailed knowledge in certain fields. For eg employment chaps are useless when it comes to tax.

 

This is why I added the caveat to my opinion, too many people here are armchair experts and give questionable advice or opinion as fact. Readers need to know how sure i am before accepting my advice.

 

In this case I maintain that this particular complaint is going nowhere, unless asda want to be generous.

 

as to who will end up giggling - I suspect time will tell. I'd appreciate it if the OP would post again saying how much progress he/she has had with this complaint.

[MARTIN3030]

Yes that would be a good idea.

It needs to be dealt with in writing,so my guess is that its not going to be resolved too quickly.

[Squirrel64]

Kraken 1 I have his logged call on my phone. I spoke to him. That is how i know his name. Asda admitted staff use personal phones to call customers and that this is wrong. I have proof. Why is this going nowhere? are they allowed to hand my personal details to staff so that they may stalk me at their leisure? I am at a loss to why you think I have no point! I switched off my phone to avoid this loser and lost a day at work because I inadvertantly lost my alarm. Do you think this is ok?

[Kraken1]

I think you need to show that they have done something wrong in law. I've not seen that yet. Is it stalking? Not sure. The Protection from harassment act needs a course of conduct which I'm not sure I'm seeing here, so that falls down.

 

No-one has yet cited precedent or statute as to what they've done wrong save perhaps for an error dialing. Happens all the time.

 

the burden of proof is on you, and personally, I'm not yet persuaded. this is only my opinion thought. I might be wrong, as I pointed out above, this is not my field of expertise.

[Squirrel64]

The data protection act clearly states that personal information is not for general dissemination but is only for lawful use by said company. He rang me 3 times at 5.30 am. For what purpose? on his on personal phone? If ASDA permitted him to do that then I have the right to know why? If he did that without their permission ASDA have breached the data protection act. ASDA have admitted that they do not require staff to phone customers during the night for any purpose. I have logged his calls at 5.30 am. surely the burden is on them to explain why.

[Squirrel64]

further they have refused my request to provide written confirmation that they have removed my number from their employees phones and indeed from their own records. Are you saying it is acceptable for staff to plunder confidential customer information for their own purposes? Is he entitled to plunder my card details too?

[Squirrel64]

error dialing? rubbish! three times - no. if so why delete it? why lie? an apology at the outset would have sufficed with an assurance that my details had been rendered safe.