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    • If anybody has any advice here, it would be greatly appreciated, I already suffer with pre-existing disabilities & have struggled with this so far. 
    • so return of goods order etc etc read upload  scan pages to jpg, redact in mspaint. the convert to and merge to one mass PDF  read upload and use the online listed sites for all 3 stages. do you want to keep the car? i will guess this was a manual paper claimform direct from the co.court or was it org sent from salford bulk processing and has just got reaq ssigned?      
    • Speaking of the reformatory boys, here they are with all of their supporters, some of whom traveled with them from miles away, all carefully crammed together and photographed to look like there were more than about 80 .. rather like Farages last rally with even fewer people crammed around what looked like an ice cream van or mobile tea bar ... Although a number in the crowd apparently thought they were at a vintage car rally as they appeared to be chanting 'crank-her'. A vintage Bentley must be out of view.   Is this all there is? Its less than the Tory candidate. - shut up and smile while they get a camera angle that looks better
    • in order for us to help you we require the following information:- Which Court have you received the claim from ? Canterbury Name of the Claimant ? Moneybarn No 1   How many defendant's  joint or self ? One Date of issue –  29/05/24 Acknowledged by 14/06/24  Defence by 29/06/24  Particulars of Claim PARTICULARS OF CLAIM 1.  By a Conditional Sale Agreement in writing made on 25th August 2022. Between the Claimant and Defendant, the Claimant let to the Defendant on Conditional Sale. A Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi (200 P S) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200cc (Sep.2015) Registration No, ******* Chassis number ***************** (“The Vehicle”).  A copy of the agreement is attached  2.  The price of the goods was £15,995.00. The Initial Rental was £8500.00.  The total charge for credit was £3575.;17 And the balance of £11,070.17 was payable by 59 equal consecutive monthly instalments of £187 63. payable on the 25th of each month. 3.  The following were expressed conditions of the set agreement, Clause 8: Our Right to End this Agreement  8.1   Subject to sending you the notice as required by law, any of the following events will entitle us to end this Agreement: 8.1.2  You fail to pay the advance payment (if any) or any of the payments as specified on the front page of this agreement or any other sum payable under this Agreement. 8.1.3 If any of the information you have given us before entering into this Agreement or during the term of this Agreement was false 8.1.4 We consider, acting reasonably, that the goods may be in jeopardy or that our rights in the goods may otherwise be prejudiced. 8.1.5 If you die 8.1.6 If a bankruptcy petition is presented against you; if you petition for your own bankruptcy, or make a live arrangement with your creditors or call a meeting of them. 8. 1.7 If in Scotland, you become insolvent or sequestration or a receiver, judicial factor or trustee to be appointed over any of your estate, or effects or suffer an arrestment, charge attachment or other diligence to be issued or levied on any of your estate or effects or suffer any exercise, or threatened exercise of landlords hype hypothec 8.1.8 If you are a partnership, you are dissolved 8.1.9 If the goods are destroyed, lost, stolen and/or treated by the insurer as a total loss in response to an insurance claim. 8.1.10 If we reasonably believe any payment made to us in respect of this Agreement is a proceed of crime. 8.1.11 If steps are taken by us to terminate any other agreement which you have entered into with us. Clause 9.  Effect of Us Terminating Agreement 9.1 If this Agreement terminates under clause 8 the following will apply 9.1.1 Subject to the rights given to you by law, you will no longer be entitled to possession of the goods and must return them to us to an address as we may reasonably specify, (removing or commencing the removal of any cherished plates) together with a V5 registration certificate, both sets of keys and a service record book. If you are unable or unwilling to return the goods to us then we shall collect the goods and we'll charge you in accordance with clause 10.3 9.1.2 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you for all payments and all other sums do under this agreement at the date of termination 9.1.3 We will sell the goods or public sale at the earliest opportunity once the goods are in a reasonable condition which includes a return of the items listed in clause 7.1.4 9.1.4 We will be entitled to immediate payment from you of the rest of the Total Amount Payable under this agreement less: ( a) A rebate for early settlement ias required by law which will be calculated and notified to you at the time of payment (b) The proceeds of sale of the goods (if any) after deduction of all costs associated with finding you and/or the goods, recovery, refurbishment and repair. Insurance, storage, sale, agents fees, cherished plate removal, replacement keys, costs associated with obtaining service history for the goods and in relation to obtaining a duplicate V5 registration certificate 4, The following are particulars required by Civil Procedure Rules. Rule 7.9 as set out in 7.1 and 7.2 of the associated Practice Direction entitled Hire Purchase Claims:- a)     The agreement is dated 25 August 2022. And is between Moneybarn No1 Limited  and xxxxxxxxx under agreement  number xxxxxx. b)    The claimant was one of the original parties to the agreement. c)    The agreement is regulated under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. d)    The goods claimed Ford Ranger 3.2 TDCi ( 200 PS) 4x4 Wildtrack Double Cab Pickup 3200 cc (Sep2015} Registration No ^^^^^^^ Chassis number ***************** e)     The total price of the goods £19570 f)     The paid up sum £1206 5 g)    The unpaid balance of the total price £7505 (to include charges) h)    A default notice was sent to the defendant on 20th February 2024 by First class post i)      The date when the right to demand delivery of the goods accrued 14 March 2024 j)      The amount if any claimed as an alternative to delivery of the goods 7505 22 include charges 5.  At the date of service of the notice the instalments were £562.89 in arrears. 6. By reason of the Termination of the Agreement by the notice, defendant became liable to pay the sum of £7502 7. The date of maturity the agreement is 24th August 2027. 8. Further or alternative by reasons of  the Defendant breaches of the agreement by failing to pay the said instalments, the Defendant evinced an intention no longer to be bound by the Agreement and repudiated it by the said Notice the claimant accepted that repudiation 9. By reason of such repudiation the claimant has suffered loss and damage. Total amount payable £19570 Less sum paid or in arrears by the date of repudiation £12064 97 Balance £7505 (to include charges.) ( The claimant will give credit if necessary for the value of the vehicle if recovered.)  The claimant therefore claims 1.    An order for delivery up of the vehicle 2.    The MoneyClaim to be adjourned generally with liberty to restore,  Upon restoration of the MoneyClaim following return or loss of the vehicle. the Claimant will ensure the pre action protocol for debt claims is followed. 3.    Pursuant to s 90 (1)  of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. An order that the Claimant and/or its agents may enter any premises in which the vehicle is situated in order to recover the vehicle should it not be returned by the Defendant 4.    further or alternatively damages 5.    costs Statement of truth The Claimant believes that the facts stated in these Particulars of Claim are true. The Claimant understands that the proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes or causes to be made a false statement in the document for verified by statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth. I am duly Authorised by the Claimant to sign these Particulars of Claim signed Dated 17th of April 2024  What is the total value of the claim? 7502   Have you received prior notice of a claim being issued pursuant to paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) ? No   Never heard of this   Have you changed your address since the time at which the debt referred to in the claim was allegedly incurred? No   Did you inform the claimant of your change of address? n/a Is the claim for - a Bank Account (Overdraft) or credit card or loan or catalogue or mobile phone account? No   When did you enter into the original agreement before or after April 2007 ? After  Do you recall how you entered into the agreement...On line /In branch/By post ? In a garage  Is the debt showing on your credit reference files (Experian/Equifax /Etc...) ? Yes  Has the claim been issued by the original creditor or was the account assigned and it is the Debt purchaser who has issued the claim. Original Were you aware the account had been assigned – did you receive a Notice of Assignment? n/a   Did you receive a Default Notice from the original creditor? They said sent but nor received   Have you been receiving statutory notices headed “Notice of Sums in Arrears”  or " Notice of Arrears "– at least once a year ? None seen   Why did you cease payments? Still Paying,   What was the date of your last payment? Yesterday  31st May 2024   Was there a dispute with the original creditor that remains unresolved? No   Did you communicate any financial problems to the original creditor and make any attempt to enter into a debt management plan? Yes on 12 Feb 2024   What you need to do now.   Can't scan, will do via another means as you cant have jpg  
    • Now that is an interesting article which adds afew perspective that I hadn't thought significant - but on reflection of the perspectives offered ... Now Starmer is no Blair, however 'blairite he may be perceived, but the Tories aren't tories and aren't even remotely liberal   The fast 'unannounced and unexpected election call from sunack may well be explained by the opinion linked that he hoped reform would be unprepared and effectively call a chunk of Farages largely empty bluster - making him look even more of a prat, leave scope for attacks on shabby reform candidates and mimimise core vote losses to reform - while throwing the 'middle ground' (relative) tories TO THE DOGS - and with the added bonus of likely pacifying his missu' desire to jogg off to sunny cal tout suite somewhat   thumb in the air - I expect about 140ish tory seats, but can hope for under a hundred Reform - got to admit the outside possibility of 1, maybe 2 seats with about 8% of the vote - but unlikely. I think projections of over 10% of the vote for reform is nudged and paid for speculation - but possible with the expected massive drives from Russian, Chinese and far right social media bot and troll prods targeting the gullible.
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Sale Of Goods Act (buying A Vehicle) - Your Rights


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Hi

Not sure if this helps or this may apply but I know that a finance company are jointly liable for any words or actions that happen within that agreement and as such I you may be able to go down the anteceded negotiations route. I have attached wording my solicitors letters not sure if its any use here as mine was car dealer doing a runner without clearing finance. Good luck with it and sorry if this doesnt help your case

 

 

We refer to your letter xxxx, which is marked “without prejudice”. We do not agree that the contents of this lettere are to be treated as such.

In your letter you have failed to deal with any of the points raised in our previous correspondence to you and in particular no reference has been made as to why the case of Forthright Finance Limited v Ingate does not apply in this situation.

As you will no doubt be aware the principle in this case is that a dealer’s words or actions “relate to” the principle regulated agreement, so as to form part of the antecedent negotiations for that agreement within the meaning of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 Section 56, if they are “all part of one transaction” or part of the same “package”.

In order to avoid our Client taking further action we will need a full explanation from you as to why this case does not apply and also why the definition as contained in Section 56 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 does not apply. It is still our Client’s position that the part exchange of the Fiat Punto for the Mini financed by Finance Company forms part of one transaction and was part of the package agreed with Motor Dealere, therefore our Client contends that you are vicariously liable for the dealer as a “negotiator” within the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

Please can we have your detailed response within 7 days of the date of this letter.

Me

A&L - Overdraft / Charges On Hold £300

 

Mum v's the DCA

NatWest. No CCA - For around 6 months no DCA has chased for this amount :D

MBNA. No CCA - First Court Claim :( Panicking. Just about to start the small claims

Lloyds TSB. Overdraft / Charges On Hold Waiting for test case

 

Sister

Halifax - No CCA. Keep getting the man and his dog chasing, again the 'go away' letter is sent :p

M&S - Have CCA. Nothing for 2 years from anyone?! :)

Argos - No CCA or DCA involved for over 2 years now :)

Next - No CCA or DCA involved for over 2 years now :)

4 x Others accepting token payments of £1 as CCA in place.

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  • 2 months later...
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  • 3 weeks later...

please please can i have a copy of that letter i am desperate to get something firm going now, after the 20th ... yes 20th tme the new car has dieed and needed towing.

 

i have tried to write before but would like to start with the letters from scratch. so if it goes as far as the court i have done everything

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  • 4 weeks later...
Hello Simon,

 

Would you email me a copy of your letter please. I'm having problems with a dealer at the moment - this would be very helpful.

 

Thanks, Dawn

 

 

Im also in the middle of a car problem and have found the information given by consumer direct (trading standards) very good .. they give good advice and will email you templates of letters you may require.

 

Cheers

 

Mark

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hi, i am in a similar situation, would you be able to forward on the letter to my email account.

 

[email protected]

 

your help is very much appreciated.

 

kind regards

 

Brook Townsend

 

 

Sale of Goods Act

 

Hi Everyone, just to give you a bit of background on my story before I start with the SOGA!

 

I bought a used Smart car just over three months ago (I know you're all going to tell me that that was the first mistake I made, but hey!) from an independent garage and last weekend it died on me! I got it recovered to my local Merc garage who told me that it needed a new engine and turbo!! - total cost £4000! I only paid £3500 for the car so it is basically written off. I did take out a private warranty with the vehicle (Warranty Direct) but they have refused to pay out because they say that the fault was with the car before the policy was taken out! How did I guess they would say that!! Now, I could persue Warranty Direct at this stage to get them to prove that the fault was already there but this could prove costly for me due to all the "small print" in their policy terms that they could get me on so it seems (in my case anyway) that the SOGA is the way to go.

 

So, over the last week or so I've been swatting up on the Sale of Goods Act and it seems that I am entitled to ask the garage to repair the vehicle or to refund me. It's a bit mind boggling but I think I do know my rights now. Turns out that up until 6 months after the sale of the vehicle, it's up to the dealer to prove that the fault wasn't there when he sold it to me. Can't really see how he would do that so that must be a good thing. It's called the "Reversed Burden of Proof".

 

Now, if you've had the car for more than 6 months then it can be a little more difficult as it is then up to the purchaser to prove that the fault was there when it was bought - but don't be put off by this if you are convinced that you were sold a dudd - it just means that you might have to find an independent mechanic to do a report on the vehicle - the cost of this could then be reclaimed by you from the garage if it turns out that (in the opinion of the independent mechanic) the fault was already there.

 

Anyway, back to my story! The engine is still in my car at the moment so the dealer would have to have it stripped down (at his own expense) if he doesn't agree with me that the car had an inherent problem. If it does go to court (small claims court in my case) and he still can't prove it, I am entitled to ask for a full refund, interest, costs & compensation. So, from his point of view, he's got a difficult decision to make - either pay me back now or risk having to shell a lot more money - especially if he has to have the engine stripped down too.

 

I am also entitled to ask for a replacement car or hire car whilst we are in dispute. If the dealer declines to do this then I can recover any costs incurred for hiring a vehicle and add it to my claim.

 

Now, the main reason for my post is this:

 

I'v got a letter that was put together by myself and a firm of solicitors that outlines my rights and the dealers responsibilities under the Sale of Goods Act. It's basically the first letter you need to send out to the garage - and gives them a defined timeline to which they should respond before further action is taken.

 

If anyone is in the same situation as I am and you would like a copy of the letter PM me with your email address and I can send you the Word file.

 

I'll be sure to keep you updated as to how I get on with my case! and will have available any other letters that I have sent in due course.

 

Simon

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Hello, I am having a similar problem with a car dealer who refuses to acknowledge or pay for work required to a second hand car. I am now ready to speak to a solicitor and take court action. (Can anyone recommend a solictor with experience in this field)

 

Summary of situation: car is 3 and half years old, has few scratches/faults. Find that CD player don't work, it leaked water in rain etc. When I took this to a specialised garage to get quote, the mechanic there told me that I had a problem with the faulty catalytic converter. This was a problem me and my wife actually brought to the dealer's attention. The 2 salesmen told me it was normal, and it would go away after 15-20 minutes of driving. After 2 months of calling and writing them, I get the problem fixed, but now I am not getting any response from the dealer to reimburse me. Also, they have totally ignored the faulty CD player, and leaking water.

 

Please send me a copy of the letter, or let me know of a decent solicitor.

 

Thanks in advance (and well done for your court success - shame you had to take the long route - I don't want to got this way, but got no choice). :sad:

[email protected]

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Hello, I am having a similar problem with a car dealer who refuses to acknowledge or pay for work required to a second hand car. I am now ready to speak to a solicitor and take court action. (Can anyone recommend a solictor with experience in this field)

 

Summary of situation: car is 3 and half years old, has few scratches/faults. Find that CD player don't work, it leaked water in rain etc. When I took this to a specialised garage to get quote, the mechanic there told me that I had a problem with the faulty catalytic converter. This was a problem me and my wife actually brought to the dealer's attention. The 2 salesmen told me it was normal, and it would go away after 15-20 minutes of driving. After 2 months of calling and writing them, I get the problem fixed, but now I am not getting any response from the dealer to reimburse me. Also, they have totally ignored the faulty CD player, and leaking water.

 

Please send me a copy of the letter, or let me know of a decent solicitor.

 

Thanks in advance (and well done for your court success - shame you had to take the long route - I don't want to got this way, but got no choice). :sad:

[email protected]

 

SOGA

 

Section 14 [2] deals with instances where goods are usable but have some form of defect. Examples include Rogers and Another v Parish (Scarborough) Ltd and Another 1987 where the Court of Appeal held that a series of defects in a Range Rover made it unmerchantable (not of satisfactory quality) even though it was fit to drive.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi All,

 

I am going through the same thing, I bought an Audi A3 for £9.5k 2 weeks ago and took it to Lancaster Audi to have it inspected as warning lights were coming on. Audi advised that in AUgust 07 they sent an invoice to the ex keeper advising it needed a new engine. the ex keeper (a well known high street bank!) then sold it to the car dealer without a new engine!!!

 

My solicitor has sent a letter to the car dealer today advising he has until next tues to either fix it or refund me.

 

Apparantly my sol said that if i want a repair, then its up to the dealer to prove the fault wasnt there-He will have a job as I have an invoice from Audi in Aug 07 advising new engine needed and Audi have told me no new engine has been put in

 

If I want a refund the its up to me to prove that the car was unfit for purpose and my sol said this audi documnet will prove it as well so looks like I have got him but the car dealer still tells me to f&^k off when I try and sort this out without legal action!!

 

The car dealer is currently running up extra damages of £250 per week for my hire car and looks like im going to have a court date and hoepfully take him to the cleaners for being arrogant when he knows I have evidence to prove both ways!!

 

I will keep you all updated on my progress in the next few months, if anyone else is in a similar position to me then I may be able to give you a copy of the letter that car garge has been issued with or do any of you have any advice for me??

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Sale of Goods Act

 

Hi Everyone, just to give you a bit of background on my story before I start with the SOGA!

 

I bought a used Smart car just over three months ago (I know you're all going to tell me that that was the first mistake I made, but hey!) from an independent garage and last weekend it died on me! I got it recovered to my local Merc garage who told me that it needed a new engine and turbo!! - total cost £4000! I only paid £3500 for the car so it is basically written off. I did take out a private warranty with the vehicle (Warranty Direct) but they have refused to pay out because they say that the fault was with the car before the policy was taken out! How did I guess they would say that!! Now, I could persue Warranty Direct at this stage to get them to prove that the fault was already there but this could prove costly for me due to all the "small print" in their policy terms that they could get me on so it seems (in my case anyway) that the SOGA is the way to go.

 

So, over the last week or so I've been swatting up on the Sale of Goods Act and it seems that I am entitled to ask the garage to repair the vehicle or to refund me. It's a bit mind boggling but I think I do know my rights now. Turns out that up until 6 months after the sale of the vehicle, it's up to the dealer to prove that the fault wasn't there when he sold it to me. Can't really see how he would do that so that must be a good thing. It's called the "Reversed Burden of Proof".

 

Now, if you've had the car for more than 6 months then it can be a little more difficult as it is then up to the purchaser to prove that the fault was there when it was bought - but don't be put off by this if you are convinced that you were sold a dudd - it just means that you might have to find an independent mechanic to do a report on the vehicle - the cost of this could then be reclaimed by you from the garage if it turns out that (in the opinion of the independent mechanic) the fault was already there.

 

Anyway, back to my story! The engine is still in my car at the moment so the dealer would have to have it stripped down (at his own expense) if he doesn't agree with me that the car had an inherent problem. If it does go to court (small claims court in my case) and he still can't prove it, I am entitled to ask for a full refund, interest, costs & compensation. So, from his point of view, he's got a difficult decision to make - either pay me back now or risk having to shell a lot more money - especially if he has to have the engine stripped down too.

 

I am also entitled to ask for a replacement car or hire car whilst we are in dispute. If the dealer declines to do this then I can recover any costs incurred for hiring a vehicle and add it to my claim.

 

Now, the main reason for my post is this:

 

I'v got a letter that was put together by myself and a firm of solicitors that outlines my rights and the dealers responsibilities under the Sale of Goods Act. It's basically the first letter you need to send out to the garage - and gives them a defined timeline to which they should respond before further action is taken.

 

If anyone is in the same situation as I am and you would like a copy of the letter PM me with your email address and I can send you the Word file.

 

I'll be sure to keep you updated as to how I get on with my case! and will have available any other letters that I have sent in due course.

 

Simon

 

 

Simon, can you please send me the details of your solicitor. much appreciated. I am now ready to throttle the car dealer for non-reply (2 months since last correspondence sent by me), so I am presuming that only a court order will get them to listen. Thanks in advance.

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It don't look like we are going to hear from Simon any more as this thread is pushing two years old now, so I would suggest all those that have asked for a copy of the letter etc start their own thread with their problem and so that others may assist.

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  • 1 month later...

I went through the same problem a few months ago, i have put the letter that my solicitor sent to the car dealer below (you just need to fill in the blanks) Good Luck!!

 

Dear Sir

Re: xxxx(car)

Our Client: XXX

Date of Purchase- XXXXX

We write to advise you that we act on behalf of XXX and we have been instructed to write to you in relation to the above vehicle.

We understand from our client that on the XXXX, he purchased the above vehicle from you for £XXXX. A copy of your sale invoice is attached hereto for your ease of reference. Our client has informed us that since his purchase of the vehicle he has experience significant problems with the car’s XXXXXX. The vehicle has been inspected by XXXX and a long standing engine fault has been identified. Lancaster Audi have further advised our client that the vehicle is unsafe to drive and as such we have advised our client that the vehicle is defective.

TAKE NOTICE that our client hereby formally rejects the vehicle under s.14 (2) and s.14 (3) of the Sale of Goods Act 1979. Due to the fault with the vehicle’s engine you have failed to discharge your implied duty under s. 14 (2) of the Sale of Goods Act that the vehicle be of satisfactory quality and further under s. 14 (3) that the vehicle be reasonably fit for purpose.

You have until XXXXX(allow 7 working days) next to arrange for the engine faults to be corrected or to collect the vehicle from our client’s address and refund the purchase price to him. If our client does not hear from you or the vehicle is not collected by you and the purchase monies refunded within the specified time period then our client will arrange to have the vehicle delivered to your place of business and will commence legal proceedings to recover the purchase price together with interest and costs without further notice.

Yours faithfully

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I have a similar problem but the garage has gone into liquidation.

The cam belt went in the first 2 months and it had been replaced only 3000 miles prior to purchase. An independent report which i had done states it was due to the cam belt not being correctly fitted during that repair.

Under the Sale of Goods Act I have written to American Express (credit card -not charge card) claiming the repair costs but they say that as the car was second hand they are not paying.

I think I should go down the small claims route - what are your opinions.

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I thought that if you bought goods on a credit card then you have some sort of cover for this. If you are rejecting the car under the SoGA 1974 then I dont see the difference in a second hand car.

 

Maybe you should read carefully through your T&C's and see if "buying second hand goods" is excluded from their protection policy!

 

If it isnt then I would ask AA to confirm exactly within the T&C that it states you are not covered because you bought second hand!!

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Well done Simon........... I know this is a long shot, I bought a car with the mileage altered, service history book, which was a fraud. Taken car to garage and will need to spend over £600.00 to get up to scratch. Have been in touch with just about every organisation and told my rights are limited because it was a private sale. Do you think I have any hope ???

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Well done Simon........... I know this is a long shot, I bought a car with the mileage altered, service history book, which was a fraud. Taken car to garage and will need to spend over £600.00 to get up to scratch. Have been in touch with just about every organisation and told my rights are limited because it was a private sale. Do you think I have any hope ???

Hi Pomella, It looks like Simon no longer uses this thread, try starting a new one under your own title and i am sure you will get all the help you need. But back to your question I take it you have proof of tampering because the DVLA take a dim view of this, as for your service history book to be honest is just a selling tool, but there again i might prove the vehicle milage is not correct.

I take an independent garage has shown you evidence of clocking like the numerals do not line up. or do not work at all, or if its digital the pixels are broken. The dash has been removed with evidence of the scratches to screw heads. Check these out because the more muck you throw something will stick, Cheers Kev

 

 

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Thanks Kev

 

The milaege (according to MOT history) read 135k in 2007 then 62k in Jan 2008. I have informed the DVLA but they are not interested and told me to call Police who can't help either.

 

It just seems people can break the law and tamper with Mileage readings without any consequences......... maybe thats why they do it!!

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Thanks Kev

 

The milaege (according to MOT history) read 135k in 2007 then 62k in Jan 2008. I have informed the DVLA but they are not interested and told me to call Police who can't help either.

 

It just seems people can break the law and tamper with Mileage readings without any consequences......... maybe thats why they do it!!

 

Try the Trading Standards these are definately the people you should see as their work includes dealing with misdescribed vehicles, mileometers which have been turned back (known as 'clocking'), unroadworthy vehicles (those that would fail an MOT), sub-standard vehicle servicing, traders selling vehicles in residential areas, misleading prices and incorrect credit advertisements. The DVLA are the Vehicle Inspectorates who do the MOT, now there must be something should be doing even if means looking into a complaint.....whats the point in paying your speeding fines:-D

 

 

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Hi Simon, I tried to PM you but it seems you are over your limit for messages. I am experiencing similar problems so it would be great if you could email a copy of the template to me? Please PM me when you have the time and I'll send you my email. Thanks!

Please don't act on my advice without seeking a legal/expert opinion on the matter.

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Sale of Goods Act

 

Hi Everyone, just to give you a bit of background on my story before I start with the SOGA!

 

I bought a used Smart car just over three months ago (I know you're all going to tell me that that was the first mistake I made, but hey!) from an independent garage and last weekend it died on me! I got it recovered to my local Merc garage who told me that it needed a new engine and turbo!! - total cost £4000! I only paid £3500 for the car so it is basically written off. I did take out a private warranty with the vehicle (Warranty Direct) but they have refused to pay out because they say that the fault was with the car before the policy was taken out! How did I guess they would say that!! Now, I could persue Warranty Direct at this stage to get them to prove that the fault was already there but this could prove costly for me due to all the "small print" in their policy terms that they could get me on so it seems (in my case anyway) that the SOGA is the way to go.

 

So, over the last week or so I've been swatting up on the Sale of Goods Act and it seems that I am entitled to ask the garage to repair the vehicle or to refund me. It's a bit mind boggling but I think I do know my rights now. Turns out that up until 6 months after the sale of the vehicle, it's up to the dealer to prove that the fault wasn't there when he sold it to me. Can't really see how he would do that so that must be a good thing. It's called the "Reversed Burden of Proof".

 

Now, if you've had the car for more than 6 months then it can be a little more difficult as it is then up to the purchaser to prove that the fault was there when it was bought - but don't be put off by this if you are convinced that you were sold a dudd - it just means that you might have to find an independent mechanic to do a report on the vehicle - the cost of this could then be reclaimed by you from the garage if it turns out that (in the opinion of the independent mechanic) the fault was already there.

 

Anyway, back to my story! The engine is still in my car at the moment so the dealer would have to have it stripped down (at his own expense) if he doesn't agree with me that the car had an inherent problem. If it does go to court (small claims court in my case) and he still can't prove it, I am entitled to ask for a full refund, interest, costs & compensation. So, from his point of view, he's got a difficult decision to make - either pay me back now or risk having to shell a lot more money - especially if he has to have the engine stripped down too.

 

I am also entitled to ask for a replacement car or hire car whilst we are in dispute. If the dealer declines to do this then I can recover any costs incurred for hiring a vehicle and add it to my claim.

 

Now, the main reason for my post is this:

 

I'v got a letter that was put together by myself and a firm of solicitors that outlines my rights and the dealers responsibilities under the Sale of Goods Act. It's basically the first letter you need to send out to the garage - and gives them a defined timeline to which they should respond before further action is taken.

 

If anyone is in the same situation as I am and you would like a copy of the letter PM me with your email address and I can send you the Word file.

 

I'll be sure to keep you updated as to how I get on with my case! and will have available any other letters that I have sent in due course.

 

Simon

kl

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