Barclaycard Cca Received

[yousef1973]

HI

CAN SOMEONE PLEASE HELP

 

On 1/09/09 I requested my cca from barclaycard. It arrived today on 10/09/09. All they have sent is a blank contract, nothing filled not even my name, no signiture...nothing totally blank. Enclosed they also sent me conditions of use and in a separate letter a barclaycard conditions.

 

Now since the contract is totally blank, that cannot be enforceable, surely.

 

Can someone please advice what step I should take next, as in 2 days the 12 days to provide the information will be up.

 

PLEASE HELP!!!!

[dx100uk]

typical of bc

 

you need to do some reading in the barclaycard forum

 

dx

[BankFodder]

Reply immediately and complain that they have not sent you a true copy of the CCA and that unless they comply that they would be in breach of their statutory obligations and you will consider that you are not bound by any alleged agreement with them.inform them also that as they have hitherto been unable to supply a true copy of the CCA that the account is now formally in dispute.

 

Send this letter by recorded delivery

[debt4get]

Your ref

 

Re: my request under the Consumer Credit Act 1974

Thank you for your recent letter sent to me, the contents of which are noted. I appreciate your quick response to my original letter. However, the reply received by me does not fulfill your requirements under the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

The Act demands that I be supplied with a true copy of any properly executed credit agreement that exists in relation to the above account. I may ask for this on demand providing that a fee of £1.00 is paid. This fee was sent with my original letter.

My request remains outstanding. The documents supplied, like the one you sent in your reply, does not constitute a true copy of any credit agreement that may or may not have been signed by me on the opening of this alleged account. These documents neither confirms that I am liable for any alleged debt to you, nor gives me any chance to evaluate whether any original agreement was ‘properly executed’

I still require you to send me a true copy of the original credit agreement that you allege exists. As you will know, under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, a judge is not permitted to make any enforcement order unless the creditor can provide a true signed copy of the original credit agreement. This means that unless you can produce such an agreement, this alleged debt is not enforceable in law.

You had until xx/xx 2009 (12+2 working days after the request was made) to provide me with the true copy I requested. You will then be in default of my request. Any account I hold with you is now in legal dispute. Whilst the account remains in dispute, you are not permitted to ask for any payment, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you. Furthermore, whilst the dispute remains, you are not entitled to charge any interest on the account, nor make any further charges to the account. Additionally, you are not entitled to register any information on this account with any credit reference agency.

To register information with a credit reference agency, you must have written consent from the customer to collate and share such information. This consent is given in the form of a signed credit agreement, so until you produce such an agreement, you may not do this.

The requirement for consent to share data is a clear requirement of the Data Protection Act 1998. Any such attempts to share my data without my consent will be met with a complaint to the Information Commissioners Office the time limits, which are laid down in the Consumer Credit (Prescribed Periods for Giving Information) Regulations 1983 are clear. You must supply an executed credit agreement within 12 + 2 working days of a proper CCArequest. If you fail to comply with a legitimate request the account enters a default situation.

To sum up, I will not be making any payments to you until you provide me with the document I have requested. Whilst you remain in default of my request, you are not permitted to take any action against this account. This includes adding further charges and passing any information to the credit information industry.

I expect you to write to me confirming that the account has been closed and no further action will be taken.

I look forward to your reply.

 

Yours faithfully

 

you can send this if you like

[yousef1973]

thank you, i will write to them on monday, it will be 14 days, also they tried calling me today.

thank you, will get back when they reply,

[yousef1973]

Keep Getting texts and calls from mercers, when i tell them they are in default or will be in few days time, they then go quiet.

 

Got a letter from barclaycard today,telling me I am behind on payments and are offering to help me by offering 2 options:

 

1..pay £2.383 and they will credit mty account with £300

2..pay £990 and they will credit my account with £150

 

I can take advantage of either of these great options before 25th september.

 

great they are too helpful....obviously the offer is too good and i cant accept....am i right???

[yousef1973]

Another call from idiot mercers. telling me to make minimum payment or the account is going to be passed onto external debt agency now.

also barclaycard has got an offer this month 50% of settlement.

 

telling me its serious now.

 

i told her its in dispute now, but she reckons that does not matter.

 

so i said ok and cut her off

[dx100uk]

yep

well done

 

keep it up.

 

dx

[yousef1973]

I have received a 3 page letter from barclaycard today, very complicated one I think. Am not sure what the next response should be.

 

Please someone advice.

 

The letter as follows :

 

Dear Mr xxxxxxx

 

BARCLAYCARD SERVICES

 

ACCOUNT NUMBER XXXXXX

 

Reference : Section 78 of the credit consumer act 1974

I write further to your letter whereby you note dissatisfaction to the documents you received in relation to a request made under section 77/78 of the consumer act 1974

 

Firstly, credit cards are regulated under section 78. Section 78(1) of the Acts states that the creditor shall give the debtor a copy of the executed agreement and a statement of account which is practicable to refer. Regarding a statement of account which is practicable to refer, the letters which we send in response to a section 78(1) request includes this information. To cover the issue of executed agreement.

 

How does the Act define an “executed agreement”?

 

“Executed agreement” is defined in section 189 of the Act as, “a document, signed by or on behalf of the parties, embodying the terms of a regulated agreement”.

 

What do the rules say about providing a copy?

 

The consumer credit (cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983 (“the regulations”) made under the Act deal with how we are to provide a “copy” of an agreement supplied to a debtor should be a ‘true’ copy. Regulation 3(2) provides that a copy may omit certain information, which allows you to be provided with a true copy, not a complete copy.

 

What happens if the original agreement has be varies since it was originally signed?

The regulations also set out what should happen where the agreement has been varied since it was signed. Regulation 7 provides creditors with a choice of including in the copy of the executed agreement either a copy of the latest notice of variation relating to each discrete term which has been varied, or an easily legible statement of the terms varied. Regulation 7 does not state that the copy of the agreement shall include a statement of the original terms as well as a statement of the varied terms. Regulation 7 allows us to provide you with a “true copy” which sets out the terms and conditions current at the time of provision of the copy.

 

Conclusions in relation to the document we have to provide

 

A “copy” of an agreement will satisfy the requirements even if the signature box and/or the signatures are not included as clarified by regulation 3(2) of the consumer credit (cancellation notices and copies of documents) regulations 1983.

 

The definition of “executed agreement” refers to a document embodying the terms of the regulated agreement.

When this is read with regulation 7 - for agreements that have been varied - a copy of the original agreement would not embody its terms. A copy of the agreement as varied would embody its terms.

 

The issue of what is an executed agreement has been interpretated in High Court. It was held that an executed agreement begins as the credit agreement which is sent to the cardholder when they receive their credit card; therefore, establishing what is the original executed agreement. When the agreement has been varied, Regulation 7 mentioned above applies.

 

To summarise, if the agreement has not been varied, we must send the original executed agreement; this would be the agreement which is currently regulated. If the credit agreement as this will contain the terms of the regulated agreement. We have sent you this and the original executed agreement for reference.

 

To address any issue about our lack of compliance with section 60 of the consumer credit act 1974. Section 60 relates to the form and content agreements. All Barclaycard credit agreements are in compliance with this. You may state that the application form which we provided you, for reference, when you made the request under section 78 does not adhere to section 60. This is not a complete copy of your application form, but rather an excerpt to show you signed a contract with us. When you completed your application form, the document would have been presented to you in full, in a legible form, and would have adhered to the requirements under section 60 of the consumer credit act 1974.

 

I hope this letter has helped with your concerns about the documents you have been supplied with under section 78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. As our response fulfils the obligation under section 78 of the consumer credit act 1974, you should carry on paying the debt you have accrued on your account. We do not class the account as in dispute, you have been supplied with the relevant documentation under section 78 of the consumer credit act 1974, and we will carry on with collection services. If you send us further correspondence questioning compliance with these areas of the law, we are not obliged to respond beyond the statutory response we have already given you. We would require you to provide comprehensive legal and documentary evidence to support your claim to ascertain whether response is necessary.

 

Yours Sincerely

 

Katy Bateman

 

Barclaycard Customer services

Edited September 24, 2009 by yousef1973

[yousef1973]

hl

[dx_]

Sorry if stupid question, I actually don't know the answer. Should you request a CCA before reclaiming charges? Or is a CCA for reclaiming the PPI?

[yousef1973]

i am not claiming in charges, i requested by cca, they sent me a blank agreement with terms and conditions. i then sent a letter of dispute and they replied with this letter.

 

would like to know what should be next move

[dx100uk]

Sorry if stupid question, I actually don't know the answer. Should you request a CCA before reclaiming charges? Or is a CCA for reclaiming the PPI?

 

 

you need to start your own thread or is this related to one you already have?

 

a cca will give you the details of the agreement you signed with the creditor, unless you disputing the enforcability of that agreement, there is little point in requesting it, as for reclaiming either unlawful charges/fees or PPI, an SAR is the better route, as this will reveal all the info the OC has on your inc statements, thus allowing you to total whatever you wish to reclaim. you can also request a copy of the agreement etc within an sar request too.

 

dx

[yousef1973]

I have received a 3 page letter from barclaycard today, very complicated one I think. Am not sure what the next response should be.

 

Please someone advice.

 

The letter as follows :

 

Dear Mr xxxxxxx

 

BARCLAYCARD SERVICES

 

ACCOUNT NUMBER XXXXXX

 

Reference : Section 78 of the credit consumer act 1974

I write further to your letter whereby you note dissatisfaction to the documents you received in relation to a request made under section 77/78 of the consumer act 1974

 

Firstly, credit cards are regulated under section 78. Section 78(1) of the Acts states that the creditor shall give the debtor a copy of the executed agreement and a statement of account which is practicable to refer. Regarding a statement of account which is practicable to refer, the letters which we send in response to a section 78(1) request includes this information. To cover the issue of executed agreement.

 

How does the Act define an “executed agreement”?

 

“Executed agreement” is defined in section 189 of the Act as, “a document, signed by or on behalf of the parties, embodying the terms of a regulated agreement”.

 

What do the rules say about providing a copy?

 

The consumer credit (cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983 (“the regulations”) made under the Act deal with how we are to provide a “copy” of an agreement supplied to a debtor should be a ‘true’ copy. Regulation 3(2) provides that a copy may omit certain information, which allows you to be provided with a true copy, not a complete copy.

 

What happens if the original agreement has be varies since it was originally signed?

The regulations also set out what should happen where the agreement has been varied since it was signed. Regulation 7 provides creditors with a choice of including in the copy of the executed agreement either a copy of the latest notice of variation relating to each discrete term which has been varied, or an easily legible statement of the terms varied. Regulation 7 does not state that the copy of the agreement shall include a statement of the original terms as well as a statement of the varied terms. Regulation 7 allows us to provide you with a “true copy” which sets out the terms and conditions current at the time of provision of the copy.

 

Conclusions in relation to the document we have to provide

 

A “copy” of an agreement will satisfy the requirements even if the signature box and/or the signatures are not included as clarified by regulation 3(2) of the consumer credit (cancellation notices and copies of documents) regulations 1983.

 

The definition of “executed agreement” refers to a document embodying the terms of the regulated agreement.

When this is read with regulation 7 - for agreements that have been varied - a copy of the original agreement would not embody its terms. A copy of the agreement as varied would embody its terms.

 

The issue of what is an executed agreement has been interpretated in High Court. It was held that an executed agreement begins as the credit agreement which is sent to the cardholder when they receive their credit card; therefore, establishing what is the original executed agreement. When the agreement has been varied, Regulation 7 mentioned above applies.

 

To summarise, if the agreement has not been varied, we must send the original executed agreement; this would be the agreement which is currently regulated. If the credit agreement as this will contain the terms of the regulated agreement. We have sent you this and the original executed agreement for reference.

 

To address any issue about our lack of compliance with section 60 of the consumer credit act 1974. Section 60 relates to the form and content agreements. All Barclaycard credit agreements are in compliance with this. You may state that the application form which we provided you, for reference, when you made the request under section 78 does not adhere to section 60. This is not a complete copy of your application form, but rather an excerpt to show you signed a contract with us. When you completed your application form, the document would have been presented to you in full, in a legible form, and would have adhered to the requirements under section 60 of the consumer credit act 1974.

 

I hope this letter has helped with your concerns about the documents you have been supplied with under section 78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974. As our response fulfils the obligation under section 78 of the consumer credit act 1974, you should carry on paying the debt you have accrued on your account. We do not class the account as in dispute, you have been supplied with the relevant documentation under section 78 of the consumer credit act 1974, and we will carry on with collection services. If you send us further correspondence questioning compliance with these areas of the law, we are not obliged to respond beyond the statutory response we have already given you. We would require you to provide comprehensive legal and documentary evidence to support your claim to ascertain whether response is necessary.

 

Yours Sincerely

 

Katy Bateman

 

Barclaycard Customer services

[dx100uk]

i can only re-interate what i said in my previous post.

 

follow what others are doing.

 

effectively, if its deemed unenforcable then you could stop payment, however it does not make the debt go away.

might make them accept a low F&F but BC are a hard nut to crack.

 

might be an idea to waitr for it to be farmed out to a dca, the make a 10% F&F to try and close the matter.

 

'what was the idea behind the cca request? do you deny the debt is yours or have just hit hard times and cannot afford to pay it at their expeccted level?

 

dx

[yousef1973]

hard time, not working cant afford to pay

 

shall i justleave it for now and just ignore them

[yousef1973]

does the above letter require any replies or not. As they are saying they are right in everyway, and the account is not in dispute and payments should be made as normal. they have stated all consumer acts ,i am wrong and they are right.

[GAVBU28]

I can't really comment on the contents of that letter, but what I can tell you is the only real way of finding out what Barclays hold on you is to SAR them directly. Then they must supply everything they hold on you and you'll see if they have a signed contract with you or not.

 

I'm currently dealing with cabot over a debt with barclays. Cabot have supplied, from barclays, a signed document by me from 1992, so I'd say if they had one, they'd have supplied it.

 

Good luck

[the_shadow]

does the above letter require any replies or not. As they are saying they are right in everyway, and the account is not in dispute and payments should be made as normal. they have stated all consumer acts ,i am wrong and they are right.

 

Give me your address and I'll send you a letter stating the moon is made of cheese

 

It gets to the point that whatever you send back to them will be ignored anyway.. they will never admit its unenforceable or that they may not even have the document... to much to lose from them.

 

S.

[yousef1973]

ok, thanks will ignore the idiots

[Undercover-Elsa]

Hi Yousef,

Some more discussion on receiving this type of response to CCA request here:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/211306-new-tack-supplying-cca.html

 

Hope this helps,

Elsa x

[Huff&Puff]

That letter is just standard BC drivel, trying to explain why the law does not apply to them. It is quite safe to ignore it, lots of other CAGgers have.

[yousef1973]

Barclaycard Has No Passed This Account To Wescot

They Are Telling Me, I Have Till 19th January To Take Action Or They Will.

Door Step Collector Or

Court Action.

 

This Account Is In Dispute As No Cca Has Been Provided.

 

Should I Do Something, Or Just Ignore It?

[Huff&Puff]

You can:

 

a) Ignore

b) Send them the "bemused" letter for passing on an alleged debt that is in dispute.

c) Complain to Trading Standards and the OFT for passing on an alleged debt that is in dispute. You can also do this in conjunction with either of the above if you wish.

[yousef1973]

RECEIVED A LETTER FROM WESCOT TODAY

AS FOLLOWS :

 

PLEASE FIND ENCLOSED AS REQUESTED A COPY OF THE ORIGINAL AGREEMENT RELATING TO THE ABOVE ACCOUNT.

 

AND THEN IT JUST GOES ON STATING PAYMENT IS REQUIRED IN FULL, PLEASE SEND IT TO........AND SON ON AND ON.

 

1 X COPY OF BARCLAYCARD APPLICATION IS ATTACHED, IT IS JUST A COPY OF A BRAND NEW FORM.

TOTALLY BLANK, NOTHING FILLED IN, NO NAME, NO ADDRESS NO SIGNITURE JUST BLANK.

 

1 X COPY OF BARCLAYCARD CONDITIONS OF USE...AGAIN A COPY TAKEN FROM A NEW CONTRACT.

 

DOES THAT MEAN THEY HAVE NOTHING?

 

WHERE DO I GO FROM HERE?

 

PLEASE HELP!!!:-|