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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Mackenzie Hall. Do any of you know of them?


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Yes, am aware of the Consumer Protection Act!

Consumer Protection Act 1987 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

However, in this particular case, surely they meant the, Data Protection Act?

 

They probably meant CPUTR Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 - The Office of Fair Trading

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Either way they were wrong as they did not say it correctly.

OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

Essex girl in pc world looking 4 curtains 4 her pc,the assistant says u dont need curtains 4 a computer!!Essex girl says,''HELLOOO!! i,ve got WINDOWS!!'.

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There is only one Consumer Protection Act, which can be used in relation to defective products e.g. PPI for instance:

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts1987/pdf/ukpga_19870043_en.pdf

 

In this scenario, it is not a case of what, they, probably meant!

 

Firms, cannot put into writing, a statement and then go back and say;

oh, we didn't really mean the, Consumer Protection Act (1987).

 

I would suggest, that their choice of wording could be contrued as misleading to the Consumer.

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Regulation 3 of the CPUTR will implement Article 5 of the UCPD and generally prohibits all unfair commercial practices. This general prohibition protects against unfair commercial practices which do not fall into the specific prohibitions of misleading and aggressive practices or the 31 specifically banned practices as set out in Schedule 1 of the CPUTR. It is therefore designed as a “safety net” and is drafted to catch all unfair commercial in any business

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Well whilst I say thank you for the legislation I again ask - has a case such as this made it to the courts? Has, for example our dear 'playmates' such as MH EVER been taken to court reagrding SB debts and their 'naughty' games? Trading Standards can be useful when they act however there's one thing in them being 'interested' versus them taking 'action' .

 

Michael

When I was young I thought that money was the most important thing in life; now that I am old I know that it is. (Oscar Wilde)

--I like to be helpful wherever possible however I'm not qualified in this field. I do consider carefully anything important (normally from personal experience) however please understand that any actions taken are at your own risk--

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found this site and find it very interesting what i have been reading.

 

today had a phone call from MH, ( would love to know how they got my number as i'm ex dir)

anyway the caller said all calls are recorded and he wanted to confirm some details with me, I asked what was it about and he said I NEED TO CONFIRM DETAILS WITH YOU BEFORE I CAN SAY? he wanted my address to start with? i asked again what was it about and he said the same thing again about confirming MY details (they have my phone number so they must know my address too Right?)

i just said if your not going to tell me what its about i'm not talking, he then started to say Yet again ( and you could hear he was getting a bit mad) I NEED TO CONFIRM DETAILS FIRST, i then said ok if your not going to say what its about i'm going and hung up on him

 

 

i have taken a copy of the letters giving on this forum and if i get one from them then they will get one from me.

 

what i need to ask is i have been Advised if i send the letter to them I am to Add my name in in Caps before printing it out I was told NOT to Sign it?

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what i need to ask is i have been Advised if i send the letter to them I am to Add my name in in Caps before printing it out I was told NOT to Sign it?
There is no legal requirement for you to provide a hand written signature.

Select committee on Trade and Industry minutes of evidence

(1996 Legislative working party)

 

2. The working party looked at the legal issues regarding the terms document, writing, signature, instrument, and records of transactions and originality. The Government's current proposed legislation focuses particularly upon the issue of signature. The working party considered the leading case in English law on signature methods, Goodman -v- J Eban Limited. That decision established that:

 

2.1 mechanical signatures using rubber stamps, printing or typewriting were valid in english law;

2.2 a signature can be by a mark rather than a name as long as evidence can be given to indentify the placer of the mark and the intention to sign; and

2.3 words other than a name can amount to a signature if the necessary intention to sign can be proven

 

Now although this working party was looking into the Electronics Commerce Bill it points to . .

 

Goodman v J Eban Ltd (1954)

 

A solicitor signed a solicitors bill with a rubber stamp which contained the name of the law firm. In the judgment it was determined that the rubber stamp was a valid signature, even theough the Solicitors Act of 1932 required a solicitors bill to be signed; it was established that it is enough to demonstrate that the rubber stamp was affixed by the solicitor with the intention to sign the solicitor's bill.

 

So now taking the highlights above I go to:

 

Interpretations act 1978

 

Schedule 1

 

1973 c.37.

 

"Writing" includes typing, lithograpgy, photography or other modes of representing or reproducing words in a visible form and expressions refering to writing can be construed accordingly

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MH - Cunning things they do....

Send letter to 'The Occupier'

Send letters to 'you'

Send text messages

Call you

Send Lanline Phone BT messages (you call back and listen to MH wanting you to call them back)

Luckily they do not have my email or they'd be sending mails too!

In fact MH use every available option to attempt to 'put on you'

 

The odd occasion I've actually spoken to some 'character' I always asked (as mentioned previously) for them to have a sexy young lady to call me back and chat with me - They never took up on that offer! LOL However that kind of 'banter' is a good way of getting rid of them off the phone!

 

Michael

(cynical mode on)

When I was young I thought that money was the most important thing in life; now that I am old I know that it is. (Oscar Wilde)

--I like to be helpful wherever possible however I'm not qualified in this field. I do consider carefully anything important (normally from personal experience) however please understand that any actions taken are at your own risk--

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Another good way is to forget your post code, address, DOB etc. If they can't do data protection they can't talk to you

 

When this Company Zinc contacted me (they seem to have taken this from MH) the womna wanted my address and date of birth before she could talk about "my account" with them.

 

She got a bit stroppy when I told her that as I didn't have an "account" with them I was not going to divulge that information.

 

She called back again two days afterwards, and said the same thing, to which I replied that the information was confidential and none of her business.

 

That seemed to put her off for a week or two, but they called while i was out last week.

 

She will get the same response if she calls again.

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Hmm, data Protection opens up the proverbial can of worms. HSBC have not asked for such information for a couple of months now.

 

Michael

When I was young I thought that money was the most important thing in life; now that I am old I know that it is. (Oscar Wilde)

--I like to be helpful wherever possible however I'm not qualified in this field. I do consider carefully anything important (normally from personal experience) however please understand that any actions taken are at your own risk--

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Now, I'm about to make a few of you chuckle and MH get upset

 

There are new domanin endings that are available for sale and MH hane not bought theire

 

their actiual domain is Home – Mackenzie Hall | Debt Recovery Agency in the UK.

 

the domain (available to register by anyone) is

 

http://www.mackenziehall.co

 

They have not bought it yet, so if someone was to buy it they could set up a contact email address such as [email protected]

 

Oh am I stirring the manure :D

 

for those that don't know domain names are like phone numbers - they are usually given on a first come first serve basis. MH had 3 months up till last Tuesday to buy this domain (as they have a business website of a similar name) prior to it going on general release

 

ps

 

if anyone wants to buy it you could buy it through

 

123-reg | Domain names | Domain name registration (thats who I use) cost £30+vat - others are cheaper but don't process things as quick

 

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

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I am Skint (as per title), so I'm glad that MH don't have it.

 

You now have options;

 

I fell out with a builder (ripped me off), so I bought his web domain and directed it to rogue traders

 

You could call them and offer to sell it, but be careful- this could be construed as extortion.

 

You could offer to give people email addresses that end in MH domain.

 

You could put up a page expresing your opinion- remeber you are entitled to your opinion- make sure you state clearly that any info is your opinion and may not be totally factual

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a "better" way is to give them a false DOB

 

when they queery it- you repeat it

 

if they contest it you tell them that you ought to know your own DOB

 

they will then tell you that they cannot continue the conversation as you did not pass the security questions

 

you will laugh as they put the phone down!!

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Hi all

 

been a long time since i posted but been enjoying myself reading about this lot today.

 

Got my first letter from them this morning stating Door step assment by an authorised Merit force collector. Authorised by who exactly???? certainly not me to enter private property and come to my door.

 

The debt in question is very old and without boring you all there is a very long tale to it. Think this debt has been to just about every DCA in the uk so it seems we are moving up to scotland now!!!

 

As you can tell by my tone im not worried. Saw off at least 30 other DCA's so bring on the new.

 

I have had every trick in the books, Thretened Bankruotcy, Balifs, CCJ's Closure of my business, repossesion of my house, Killing of my cat (which ive never had a cat by the way) contacting neghbours even a you have won a prize ring this number.

 

Just wanted you all to know you are not alone and they never give up so just roll with it and have a bit fun along the way at their expense.

 

x

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Oh sorry forgot to say todays letter also holds the phrase "if you are not the named person above please contact us quoting address ID xxxxxxxxx to stop further communication"

 

If they were really going to send someone to my doorstep then you would think they would know i lived there first.

 

Do they really think i believe that a phone call to them would stop communication??

 

must think we were born yesterday.

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Oh l like that line cause its against the law for you to open mail not addressed to you.

OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

Essex girl in pc world looking 4 curtains 4 her pc,the assistant says u dont need curtains 4 a computer!!Essex girl says,''HELLOOO!! i,ve got WINDOWS!!'.

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Sadly not or i would have laughed a little more.

 

They got a little posher and sign Assessment Manager now, all adds up to the same though.

 

i still love the line "we will have to advise our client to take further appropriate action".

 

Theyve been advising them of that for the past 10 years you would think they would get the hint that i know they cant touch me. By the way the debt has risen by 5K during that time despite the fact interest was frozen.

 

The best bit no CCA and no SAR provided, police have spoken to them as have trading standards just give up!!!

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  • 7 months later...
  • 7 years later...

This topic was closed on 03/06/19.

If you have a problem which is similar to the issues raised in this topic, then please start a new thread and you will get help and support there.

If you would like to post up some information which is relevant to this particular topic then please flag the issue up to the site team and the thread will be reopened.

- Consumer Action Group

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