why you shouldnt use section 77/78 CCA 1974 if you want the signed agreement

[MarkieMark]

I have been there and can only hold opinions on what happened and matters raised before me.

Edited February 5, 2009 by MarkieMark

[foolishgirl]

All threads I have read seem to relate to getting the debt written off does anyone have information on any threads were the debt had been repaid in full. Ive asked this question so many times please someone out there save my sanity and eyeballs.

 

Do you mean a full & final settlement, tumble? Or do you mean the creditor has admitted there is no debt liability?

 

Suggest you start your own thread on this & post a link to it here if rather than hijacking this thread with a completely different subject.

[tumble]

FG I did this in post 336 and 338 quite offey with thread etiquette

 

Thanks

[MarkieMark]

foolishgirl

 

I have been in a court room as a litigant in person and the defendent had three solicitors defending him... yes it was stressful and nerve racking but you had to stand your ground.... if you do your homework you will be fine touch wood I was fine and won the case.

 

I rejected their part 36 offer and went ahead with the trial. Lets be honest these people do this for a living unlike me who just has an interest in law as a hobby.

[foolishgirl]

I have been in a court room as a litigant in person and the defendent had three solicitors defending him... yes it was stressful and nerve racking but you had to stand your ground.... if you do your homework you will be fine touch wood I was fine and won the case.

 

Me too, markie, on many, many occasions, on both sides of the table & have the notches on my gun to prove it.

[deepdebt]

HI All,

So is there any conclusion to this thread after 5hrs of reading and eye strain.

I see several people are already using CPR 31.16 route which seem to be ignored by the DCA's / OC so where does this leave us?

 

I like a lot of people of this forum have CCA'd Barclaysharks (got nothing yet) and so SAR just recently, shame we all can't join in together for a class action or something like that.

 

Me, well I'm just starting down the CCA route, will then go onto SAR and depending on what I receive may consider the CPR 31.16 but wonder if a rabbit was pulled out of the hat at the last minute what I could get hammered for in costs as they are entitled to claim search fee's.

 

I think this forum is fantastic, I thank people like pt for starting such an interesting thread and only hope one day I can get my life back!!!

[angel_1]

HI All,

So is there any conclusion to this thread after 5hrs of reading and eye strain.

I see several people are already using CPR 31.16 route which seem to be ignored by the DCA's / OC so where does this leave us?

I like a lot of people of this forum have CCA'd Barclaysharks (got nothing yet) and so Subject Access Request just recently, shame we all can't join in together for a class action or something like that.

Me, well I'm just starting down the CCA route, will then go onto Subject Access Request and depending on what I receive may consider the CPR 31.16 but wonder if a rabbit was pulled out of the hat at the last minute what I could get hammered for in costs as they are entitled to claim search fee's.

 

I think this forum is fantastic, I thank people like pt for starting such an interesting thread and only hope one day I can get my life back!!!

 

 

i totally agree with you all day i keep coming back for more info its been like an obsession today for me, in a nice way though

 

i have cca then sar, now on some of my threads im in limbo, and thinking and reading all about the cpr ruling, its makes sense to me to know what the creditors do have before any court action is done, and im understanding this from this thread, i guess you can only try it with one of your creditors and see what you get and then post here for advice

 

of course we all are trying to make some sense of all this and i do want my life back - i feel though its all im thinking off just lately

 

keep happy all laters angel x

[Becca00]

Sorry, I'm confused here as Simon says we would be "liable for charges and interest unpaid and debited to the account in the intervening period." I thought that while an account was in dispute they couldn't add interest or further charges?

 

DD

 

Daniella, I was also under the impression that there should be no interest or charges applied to the account (in theory) and that if an enforcable cca were produced payments would begin again from that point and you wouldn't have to backdate them to when you stopped paying. I asked about this in my thread and Rory32 advised me payments wouldn't have to be backdated.

[deepdebt]

Hi Angel 1,

Yes I have a few threads in limbo too and yes its playing on my mind a bit hence reading lots and lots in the hope of as simulating lots of information/legal stuff/letters/strategy etc. and find some confidence from somewhere.

 

Hi Becca00,

Yes I need to establish this situatiion aswell, an answers anyone???

[simon the poet]

hi

 

I was involved in a case a few months ago and the solicitor representing us tried to press the point you raised about the charges and iterest applied to the account whilst the agreement was in default due to none compliance. The judge rules that there was nothing within the law that says thes charges were not due and the debtor hac to repay .

I notice that the 2006 actulaly states that no charges can be made whilst the creditor is in default for not providing statements which is a rule under the new act, perhaps this was added to rectify the ommission.

 

Simon

[the_shadow]

Daniella, I was also under the impression that there should be no interest or charges applied to the account (in theory) and that if an enforcable cca were produced payments would begin again from that point and you wouldn't have to backdate them to when you stopped paying. I asked about this in my thread and Rory32 advised me payments wouldn't have to be backdated.

 

This is just a thought and possibly my opinion.. so dont shoot me down in flames if its wide of the mark

 

The very fact that they always write back saying that they do not consider the account in dispute means that they can a) continue to send info to CRA's and b) continue to accrue interest and apply charges....... in their eyes anyway!

 

If as some people on here say sending recent t&c's is allowable as a response to a S77-78 request then possibly they can safely say they have responded and the account is not in dispute, hence the charges and interest.

 

It all comes down to which side the OFT would rule for I suppose, if they agree that the account is in dispute then their banking guidelines should protect you from having extra charges/interest during that dispute period... if as we all know the OFT is toothless and says it doesnt think the account is in dispute just not enforceable in court then I imagine they'll rule the banks/credit card companies can continue charging....

 

Thoughts?

[lexis200]

That sounds quite a reasonable thought to me pmw1971:)

 

I think the banks saying they do not consider the account to be in dispute rests around the fact you are not disputing an amount on the card, but the fact that they have an enforceable agreement.

 

I annoyingly can't remember who said it, but I asked what exactly puts an account into dispute on another thread, as banks obviously write back saying nothing does, the FOS say having a complaint with them doesn't, and neither of them think that a dodgy agreement does. From what I remember, for there to be a dispute on the account there needs to be reason to believe the balance on the account is wrong.

 

I suppose once you are absolutely sure they do not have an agreement/do not have an enforceable agreement you could claim this as they should not have added the interest, but until then you are querying the agreement itself, not the amount owed. I guess though if you were going for charges the account would be in dispute as you are definitely saying the balance is incorrect there.

 

Btw - if whoever kindly spelt this out for me in the first place reads this and I've completely got it wrong in the re-writing, please correct me!!

 

Having said that, I still put it in my letters to them, primarily because it seems to annoy them:D

[simon the poet]

Hi

When the agreement for a loan is defaulted because the creditor doesnt present a copy under section 77 the agreement in theory cannot be enforced unless the court says it can. But the agreement still exists and even though it is default the creditors say that untill the loan is settled the repayments are still due.

Even if the agreement is found to be unenforceable under the cca the creditors are still within there rights to pursue the debt they just cannot pursue through the courts. So if an agreement is temporarily unenforceable due to late presentation of an agreement then there is nothing within the act to say that any payments due within that time are waved.

 

Simon

[noomill060]

Our rather fierce local lady DJ suggests strongly to everyone, prior to the start of the days proceedings to go out and try and sort a deal out between themselves, and that all documents which each party intends to rely on in court must be disclosed to the other side prior to returning back.

 

Her favourite tale is of a farmer who some time ago, produced some vital document in a dramatic flourish from his inside pocket (Hollywood style, rather like the barrister pulling an agreement out of his ass) announcing it as proof positive of his side of the story.

 

When asked why this wasnt disclosed, he said- "I like to keep some things close to my chest, your Holiness"

 

"Well", said the DJ "I can tell now, Mr Farmer, that it will have to stay there"

 

He wasn't allowed to present this vital piece of evidence and lost his claim.

Edited February 6, 2009 by noomill060

[Kraken1]

trial by ambush was so much more exciting. Curse Lord Wolfe....

[foolishgirl]

What a sensible lady DJ noonmill. Bet it cuts her court time by half too.

[deepdebt]

Hi CAGgers,

 

So have we discovered anything???

 

Can people but their acoount in dispute if no CCA received or not?

 

Any answers, maybe pt could advise?

[millymollymoo]

Hi has anyody got the pdf for this oft booklet. all the links shows that it has been removed from the OFT site.

 

oft786a.pdf

 

this was the link originally:http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/rep...it/OFT786a.pdf

 

regards

 

Milly x

Edited February 9, 2009 by millymollymoo
added link that will not work

[tifo]

Hi has anyody got the pdf for this oft booklet. all the links shows that it has been removed from the OFT site.

 

oft786a.pdf

 

Yes, i have a copy ...

 

It's this :

 

Consumer Credit (Agreements) Regulations 1983 as amended by the 2004 Amendment Regulations

Consumer Credit (Disclosure of Information) Regulations 2004

Consumer Credit (Early Settlement) Regulations 2004

Frequently asked questions (FAQs)

April 2005

Edited February 9, 2009 by tifo

[foolishgirl]

The CAG Regs link is here:

http://www.consumerforums.com/resources/templates-library/57-statutes/176-consumer-credit-act-1974-and-related-regulations-

[tifo]

Here you are, OFT 786a pdf ...

MEGAUPLOAD - The leading online storage and file delivery service

[barcaboy]

Sent off me CPR requests but yet no reply,

I have noticed that DCAs have registered defaults against my accounts.

Can I contact the DCAs and request CCA and ask them if not they should remove any defaults against me.

Is ther a template to do this Lowell are one DCA

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated

[lexis200]

Hi barcaboy

 

You can do this, but from what I've read it's very hard to get them to remove defaults even when you can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that they should not be there.

 

I'm not sure if there is a template to use, but I'm sure someone in the know will be able to point you to it if there is one.

[millymollymoo]

Here you are, OFT 786a pdf ...

 

 

Hiya tifo:)

 

Thank you for your help. I havent downloaded yet. Is the megaupload ok as it says something about spyware on mcafee site advisor:confused:

 

 

MillY X

[tifo]

Is the megaupload ok as it says something about spyware on mcafee site advisor:confused:

 

 

MillY X

 

Never had a problem with it yet ...