Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • A full-scale strike at the firm could have an impact on the global supply chains of electronics.View the full article
    • He was one of four former top executives from Sam Bankman-Fried's firms to plead guilty to charges.View the full article
    • The private submersible industry was shaken after the implosion of the OceanGate Titan sub last year.View the full article
    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

I am a debt collector


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 5786 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

For my two pennies worth - notsoevil I'd wager that your "happy...I've received cards" people knew little of their rights, were scared, embarrased or worse and would think you were only interested in "helping them". Your industry would not exist if the original lenders were not so quick to ditch people who are in genuine trouble. Take a long hard look at the names of the DCA's who crop up time and time again here and the appaling and often illegal practices they engage in - is your company there?

Just remember one thing DCA's work on a commission basis or no collection no fee.

DCA's have no interest in the debtor its the nature of the business - anybody who tells you otherwise is telling porkies - don't take my word for it check the Credit Industry magazines.

Although I admire your bottle in posting here I am at a loss to understand why? Unless of course there is somthing your not telling us???

 

 

100% agree with this its what I have been trying to say much better put though

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Replies 193
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Sorry had doctors appointment :(

I have had first hand experience with nasty DCA, one telling me years ago to give her the money I had put aside for my childs nappies that month or else she would take me to court! I put the phone down on her, called back up, spoke to much reasonable lady who said I make payment the following month.

 

I think in any company there are bad eggs who just want the money, I get paid basic so I not after making any money on what I collect.

 

I am here to offer help to people who have had a bad experience or are at a loss as to what to do next.

 

In regards to Inc and Exp so many people forget to put clothes allowance, TV licence etc.

 

If you get child benefit remember you are within your right not to include in your inc exp, some dcas try to say it is an income but child benefit is for childrens costs full stop. The same with disablity allowance if you are disabled and get help with costs for travel etc you dont have to include this.

 

Inc and Exp must be reasonable though, I did have one lady try to tell me her food bill per month was £600 for a family of 2 adults and 2 kids under 10 years. I questioned it and she said the CAB told her that was the amt she could put down. I explained that it is not a reasonable figure and she did give me the actual spending per month.

 

On that though I find a lot of people actual say they spend on less then I think is a reasonable amount! I think most people spend about £90 per week on food for a family of 4 and I think that is a fair amt to put on inc and exp.

 

MOST DCA do record calls, if they are recording they will tell you when you call them, if they call you ask them (they dont have to tell you when they call you, it will be in their letters however prob in small print). Always ask at beginning of call, before you have ID yourself.

 

My company certainly does record, as I have had to listen back to calls after complaints were made to make a judgement.

 

In regards to banks and credit card companies being them main culprit I have come across two schools of thought:

 

The credit card companies are constantly putting up their limits often without you asking, this ofcourse increases your spending allowance. The banks also were in any case offering loans to any body and therefore allowing people who cant afford to repay to get into debt.

 

However the other agrument would be that the CC companies and the banks dont force people to spend the money, if you have spent the money you need to pay it back.

 

If you have offered repayment and it is refused, send in your request with inc and exp send it recorded and also send copy to original creditor.

 

Charging orders on houses etc are not really worth trying to do unless they have a valid reason, if you dont think they do, see a solictor (such as you have been repaying).

 

You can also say at the start of conversation I would like to remind you that your phone call are recorded as I am recording this conversation. If they refuse to talk - call back speak to manager. My mobile phone can record calls!

 

My training states that it is my job to get the money repaid either in full or asap, but without causing any more financial distress to the debtor. We cant advise but can give personal opinions, which is what I do.

 

Some debt help companies charge to help you - do not go to these! It makes no sense at all. See one that doesnt charge like CAB.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's a scenario:

 

Your or your DCA business are on commission and you know the alleged debt is either statute barred, unenforceable, full of unlawful charges, marked against the wrong person or some other inconsistency what do you do when the alleged debtor calls you or writes to you?

 

A. Inform the alleged debtor of their rights and tell them we won't trouble you again and have a nice day!

 

or

 

B. Chase them, break them down, bully them, threaten them, launch half baked County court claims, send out statutory demands or generally coerce them into paying some money.

 

I know its a tough question but what do you think?

Link to post
Share on other sites

When I am told it is the wrong person I confirm it is indeed the wrong person and remove address from file, send it back for tracing.

 

If it is unenforceable most cases is that it was unenforceable at time of being "sold" to DCA so therefore goes back to client with request for them to invesitgate the reason it was sold. I had one of those yesterday!

 

What annoys me is when we are repeatly told wrong number but no one updates the system , it is alway me that does it!

Link to post
Share on other sites

See, I've got some doubts as to whether you really are a staff member on a DCA. The vast majority of DCA job adverts I've seen have a basic + O.T.E. quoted. Are you actually a DCA staff member, or do you work for an OC?

i will be off site for the next month or so. if you have any problems, feel free to report the post so a moderator can help you.

 

I am not a qualified or practicing lawyer.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The credit card companies are constantly putting up their limits often without you asking, this ofcourse increases your spending allowance. The banks also were in any case offering loans to any body and therefore allowing people who cant afford to repay to get into debt.

 

However the other agrgument would be that the CC companies and the banks dont force people to spend the money, if you have spent the money you need to pay it back.

 

Yes but they force the limit on you even though it is irresponible lending, it gives the debtor a false sense of security, it is wrong why give someone who earns £12,000 per a year a credit card with £5,000 limit explain?

It is simply wrong of the creditor to do that if they did not then lots of peeps on here would be better off and peeps like you would be out of a job and too right as the job you do is the worst I would rather be a traffic warden at least you can reason with them face to face (sometimes)

 

Still lots of guests on this thread the mind boggles!!!!

Edited by adamski

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, I've seen job adverts from MOST of the DCA's. Haven't seen one from dlc, though, but they aren't a major player.

i will be off site for the next month or so. if you have any problems, feel free to report the post so a moderator can help you.

 

I am not a qualified or practicing lawyer.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Still lots of guests on this thread the mind boggles!!!!

 

I was one of them. I only usually log in when i have something to say or ask. I spend hours and hours reading here ~ unlogged in. No doubt quite a few others do too ;-)

 

DLC might not be 'major players', but they are as bad as they come and the reason i went searching for help on t'interweb and found this website :D

Link to post
Share on other sites

Notsoevil, I haven't got any comments on what you have said so far, but merely say; Welcome to the forum. As you are a debt collector, I hope you will see the frustrations that you may have heard over the phone/on the doorstep and maybe have a better understanding as to why it happens.

.

FSA Waiver on Bank Charges:http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/dir_quart_0709.pdf

Link to post
Share on other sites

Example of irresponsible lending with one of my cards: credit limit started at 1k, I was earning about 12k at the time. In about five years the limit increased by 2k at a time up to 10k, all I ever paid was the 2.5% minimum payment by direct debit. By then I was self employed and my account with the same bank as the card company was totally up the creek.

BANK CHARGES

Nat West Bus Acct £1750 reclaim - WON

 

LTSB Bus Acct £1650 charges w/o against o/s balance - WON

 

Halifax Pers Acct £1650 charges taken from benefits - WON

 

Others

 

GE Money sec loan - £1900 in charges - settlement agreed

GE Money sec loan - ERC of £2.5K valid for 15 years - on standby

FirstPlus - missold PPI of £20K for friends - WON

Link to post
Share on other sites

Example of irresponsible lending with one of my cards: credit limit started at 1k, I was earning about 12k at the time. In about five years the limit increased by 2k at a time up to 10k, all I ever paid was the 2.5% minimum payment by direct debit. By then I was self employed and my account with the same bank as the card company was totally up the creek.

 

Excellent example Goldlady but I was 5k on 12k but 10k is absolutley irresponsible in the true meaning of the word surely some experts on the forum can maybe point us in the right direction of how to complain about irresponsible lending please!!! this in IMHO is th reason why the country is verging on recession and the reason this forum is so popular great as is it is.

 

By the way where is the OP?

Edited by adamski

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Guest forgottenone

Okay, I have been guilty of 'lurking' as well ... well, start of the week ... as a 'guest' ... only cos I couldn't use my keyboard, due it having died Monday ... so could only 'view'. :D

Link to post
Share on other sites

Guest forgottenone
Vinnie

 

Each time I see that I can't think of whether it's their actual name or just a clever play on the hard man image many would associate with some DCA approaches in the form of Vinnie Jones. Just a thought.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Who do you work for NSE? If you're intent is sincere you should reveal that at least instead of upsetting people here who have been treated appalingly by your industry...

 

That is a loaded question ie it may not be that easy.

Would there be an issue with NSE revealing who you work for?

Some DCA's may not want their staff on Forums such as this.

.

FSA Waiver on Bank Charges:http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pages/Doing/Regulated/Notify/Waiver/pdf/dir_quart_0709.pdf

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...