My debt... more from the dreaded HFO Services *** Discontinued ***

[Innsmouth]

Sorry for the bump , but could anyone take a look at this for me?

[ScarletPimpernel]

Dear Sirs,

 

 

Re: HFO Case No: XXXXXXX

 

 

I refer to your letter dated xxxx and headed ‘Notice of Additional Charges and Further Recovery Action’.

 

On July 3rd 2008 I made a formal request for a true signed agreement for the alleged account under ss.77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

 

You have failed to comply with this request, and the account has now entered into default.

 

The documents that you are obliged to send me include a true copy of the executed agreement. If the executed agreement contained any reference to any other document, you are also obliged to send me a copy of that document.

 

Your failure to comply with my request within the statutory time limit renders the alleged debt UNENFORCEABLE in law. In addition, if this non-compliance continues for a further 30 days then a summary, criminal offence is committed. Take this out - the offence was removed by the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008.

 

Whilst in default, neither you nor the original creditor:

• may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.
  
• may not add further interest or any charges to the account.
  
• may not pass the account to a third party.
  
• may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.
  
• may not issue a default notice related to the account.
  

Your letter is an unlawful demand for payment, contrary to the CCA 1974 and also constitutes an unfair and aggressive practice under the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008.

 

You should take this letter as a formal complaint; I require you to provide me with your official complaints procedure, and your proposals for resolving my complaint.

For the avoidance of doubt, I formally dispute the alleged debt on the grounds that you have provided no legal evidence to substantiate it. Your attention is drawn to your obligation under the Office of Fair Trading Guidance on Debt Collection to suspend all collection activity until the dispute is resolved.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter. If you or the original creditor is unable to comply with my formal request, I require you to confirm this in writing. If you do not understand this letter, you should seek professional advice.

 

Yours Faithfully

 

 

 

There's my suggestions.

[Innsmouth]

ScarletPimpernel that is fantastic, thank you very much indeed.

[mystic98]

never been on this site b4. but when searching for hfo you guys came up just had to registar and tell you guys. 3 days ago a parcel slip came through my door, never thought anything of it so i phoned up and confirmed my details address etc thing a pasckage was arriving, nothing came untill yesterday a letter from hfo in a pack saying the same as innmouth, so i phones them today and spoke to some jumped up prat making me feel really bad, when i said i would arrange payment, he was very quick to get my details, b4 i could agree to anything he was talking about a dd to be set up, i wasnt happy with this so i sugested a standing order instead at least then i can control it but the answer was we dont do that kind of payment method. when i explained that on the pack that they sent me a method of payment has and i quote

by debt card/credit card

by direct debit

by standing order

by post- only cheque or postal order

at

[mystic98]

never been on this site b4. but when searching for hfo you guys came up just had to registar and tell you guys. 3 days ago a parcel slip came through my door, never thought anything of it so i phoned up and confirmed my details address etc thing a pasckage was arriving, nothing came untill yesterday a letter from hfo in a pack saying the same as innmouth, so i phones them today and spoke to some jumped up prat making me feel really bad, when i said i would arrange payment, he was very quick to get my details, b4 i could agree to anything he was talking about a dd to be set up, i wasnt happy with this so i sugested a standing order instead at least then i can control it but the answer was we dont do that kind of payment method. when i explained that on the pack that they sent me a method of payment has and i quote

by debt card/credit card

by direct debit

by standing order

so why couldnt he set that up

i feel abit annoyed with all this and after reading all the post about them here am starting to think are they there to help or rip us off.

 

 

by post- only cheque or postal order

at any bank

so

[emmaf01]

They are not there to help us- they are there to maximise their profits by squeezing every last penny out of us by whatever means they deem necessary.

[Innsmouth]

Update: after sending off my last letter back in August, I received no further phone calls from HFO, nor did I receive any reply regarding my request for their complaints proceedure.

 

Today I received a letter from Turnbull Rutherford Solicitors reading:

 

Dear Sir,

 

Re. HFO SERVICES LIMITED

 

With reference to the above matter and your request for the copy of the signed agreement under Section 78 (6)a of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, please find enclosed the document as requested.

 

We now look forward to your offer of payment by return to avoid any further action being taken against you.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

........

 

The following was enclosed:

 

 

This is not a bad scan, the document is actually as grainy and unreadable as this (although obviously I have blurred my details out).

 

I can vouch that this is the form I filled in, but is this an actual copy of my agreement, and if so is it enforcable?

 

Also, just to confirm that this was not sent to me within the required time period.

 

Help is appreciated as always.

[sillygirl1]

It IS NOT a copy of your agreement - it is a PRE APPROVED APPLICATION FORM - which is not what you asked for - I have a load of these, not filled in at all and they are not the kind of document they can use to take you to court on. You need to reply back to them that this doesn't prove you took up an agreement, and you need the agreement.

 

Somebody else will be along soon to advise further.

[Docman]

No prescribed terms,not enforcable.

 

Unfortunately, telling HFO/Turnem & Rachett won't stop them (hello Mr T, ar you having a nice day?)

[leedsangel]

Innsmouth,

 

Make a complaint to the Companies Investigation Bureau regarding HFO Services.

[Innsmouth]

I've actually gone through the process of reporting HFO to Trading Standards and I know that they have been in touch with HFO regarding them harrassing me on the phone and not responding to my CCA request.

 

Are there any templates or suggestions as to how I should respond to what they have sent me? And should I direct my response to HFO, Turnbull's or both?

 

Cheers all!

[42man]

Thank you for your response to my request under the Consumer Credit Act section 78.

 

I am pleased to see that you confirm this as a true copy of the original agreement executed by yourselves on the XXXXX.

 

As you must realise this agreement does not conform to sections 60(1) and 61(1) of the Consumer credit Act and is therefore unenforceable under section 127(3) of the same act.

You had until (date here) to provide me with the true copy I requested. After that date you entered into default of my request and I am therefore advising that the matter is now in dispute . Whilst the matter is in dispute, you are not permitted to ask for any payment, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you. Furthermore, whilst the dispute remains, you are not entitled to charge any interest on the account, make any further charges to the account or pass the account to anybody else.

Please note you may also consider this letter a statutory notice under Section 10 of the Data Protection Act to cease processing any data in relation to this account with immediate effect. This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies including any defaults. Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data. It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’, you must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends.

 

Should you fail to respond within 21 days, I will expect that this means you agree to remove all such data.

 

[DonkeyB]

Oh dear... will these numpties never learn? I think even if they're told a million times what the law is, they will simply ignore it. I begin to wonder if TR employ anyone other than idiot trainee solicitors and paralegals who can make no sense of the law.

 

42man is (as usual) spot on and, sadly, you'll need to jump through more hoops. Don't be surprised if they still issue a claim though, via Northampton so they don't have to attach any supporting documents - they usually do, even with an application form like this - so be prepared.

Edited October 14, 2008 by DonkeyB
typos

[Innsmouth]

Wow, it's been nearly 2 years since I last heard from HFO but they've reared their ugly heads once again...

 

I've replied to my old thread to preserve the previous posts. The last letter I sent to them was as per 42man's suggestion above.

 

On 22nd Nov 2008 - I received a call from a gentleman from HFO who was attempting to convince me to set up a payment plan and said he had a lot of influence and could help me. He asked me if he should put me down as "refusing" to set up a payment plan, and I responded that if they could satisfactorily respond to my requests for a true copy of the agreement then I would be happy to discuss a plan.

 

He also said that I am accruing interest daily and said that HFO was a Factoring company for Barclaycard and not a DCO. I reminded him that the account was in dispute and should not legally be accruing interest. Call ended with me requesting that the caller re-read the contents of the last letter I sent, and comply with my wishes before contacting me again.

 

I heard nothing else until 7th July 2010, when someone from HFO called me. I explained that I had previously asked to not be contacted by telephone and that I would treat any calls as harrassment.

 

That day I also received a REMINDER - NOTICE OF ASSIGNMENT letter (dated 6th July) from HFO saying my balance was due for payment and should I act within 14 days, they may be able to negotiate a discount or freeze the interest on my account. The letter was not signed by anyone and had no individual contact details.

 

I planned to respond but it's been a busy past couple of weeks and I have yet to do so.

 

This morning I received a letter dated 16th July 2010 which reads as follows:

This is in reference to your BARCLAYCARD account no. XXXXXXX which, as notified to you earlier, was sold to HFO Capital Limited on 06 Nov 2007. We have tried contacting you on the phone and on the addresses available with us. However all our efforts to communicate with you have been in vain.

 

Our credit search indicates that you have a mortgage for XXXXXXXX property which is owned by. [sic] In this situation, HFO has three options to choose from:

 

1) Initiate legal action against you and secure the debt with a charge against your property. The join owner, if applicable, will be notified of this litigation. Your debt will continue to accrue interest at HFO's contractual rate of 12%.

 

1) [this is not my typo, it does list 1 twice!] Agree a settlement figure with you which will allow you to pay and [sic] amount less than the balance mentioned above: or

 

2) Agree a reasonable payment arrangement with you towards the full amount.

 

In the event that you fail to contact me within 3 days, I will have no option but to forward this account to our solicitors who will commence legal action with a view to enforcing judgement

 

against your property or obtaining an Order to Obtain Information against you. The order will require you to provide a complete record of your financial activity for a period as far back as 3 years and to make a full declaration on oath of all your declared and undeclared income and assets.

 

I would advise you to call me on 0203 024 9652 at the earliest.

Also enclosed with the letter is a full page, colour print out of my street (which appears to be taken from Google Street View or similar) and a print out of my Credit Report as taken from the Experian credit report site.

 

Firstly, this immediately struck me as intimidation, quite literally suggesting they "know where I live" as well as threatening my wife with whom I share the mortgage for our house.

 

My main causes for concern are:

 

1) That they might start hassling my wife, or that they could somehow affect her credit rating;

2) The Credit Report print out they have enclosed does appear to show a 'default' on my history dated 20th June 2010;

3) That they are continuing to charge interest at a rate of 12% despite the debt having been in dispute for well over a year;

4) They are only giving me 3 days to respond.

 

My first thought for action would be simply to send a letter similar to my last one, providing the history of pervious communication, reminding them that the debt is in dispute and also pointing out that their letter is an unlawful demand for payment and also constitutes an unfair and aggressive practice under the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008.

 

Does this seem like a wise course of action? Has anything changed recently with regard to my legal rights?

 

As always, the time and assistance from CAG forumsters is much appreciated!

[sillygirl1]

Get Trading Standards involved pronto, and the OFT and contact Tony Hetherington at the Daily Mail, clear breaches of the Data Protection Act, CCA Regulations and goodness knows what else.

 

I would also contact the police and let them know you are being illegally harrassed by this lot and it is NOT a civil matter any more.

 

Get your local MP involved as well.

[42man]

You are absolutely correct....IMHO This company are sailing incredibly close to the wind, as if they haven't had enough trouble in the past..!! this is oppressive and threatening behaviour and any impression that they convey by showing you a picture of your house, can only have the desired effect of causing fear. What makes this worse is that they have obviously completely ignored your previous correspondence and continue with this type of behaviour....I would say that this is potentially phsychological harrassment. I URGE you to copy all your documents and send them to your local trading standards AND the OFT, as well as your local MP. I feel this is almost verging on blackmail....

[42man]

Can I also strongly suggest that you get a telephone recorder too....

[sillygirl1]

Send them back the "We know where you live" (except this is supposedly their Indian office....)

 

Bing Maps

 

and contact Weybridge police to let them know they have broken the law, and point out that it is not a civil matter, it is blatant harrassment.

[smith_j]

I would also recommend a complaint to the police as well (not 999 unless anyone was actually at your property)

[broken arrow]

I would contact Barclaycard and find out when and to who the debt was sold.

 

Which HFO are chasing you, Services or Capital.

[Innsmouth]

Thank you for the prompt responses guys.

 

I have drafted the following:

Dear Sirs,

 

 

Re: HFO Case No: 50166608/IMPM8

 

 

I DO NOT ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEBT TO YOUR COMPANY

 

 

I refer to your letter dated 16

th

July 2010, which I received this morning, 20

th

July 2010.

 

 

May I remind you that, as stated in my previous letter dated October 23

rd

2008 (please find copy attached), that this account is in default and the matter is still in dispute.

 

 

Whilst the matter is in dispute, you are not permitted to ask for any payment, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you. Furthermore, whilst the dispute remains, you are not entitled to charge any interest on the account, make any further charges to the account or pass the account to anybody else.

 

 

Your letter is an unlawful demand for payment, contrary to the CCA 1974 and also constitutes an unfair and aggressive practice under the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008.

 

 

I also consider enclosing a picture of my street to be an unreasonably aggressive act with the intention of psychological

harassment.

 

 

As you have failed to comply with my legal requests and continue to conduct yourselves in an oppressive and threatening manner, I will be taking this matter further by contacting both Trading Standards and the Office of Fair Trading, as well my local MP and the police.

 

 

Yours Faithfully,

 

If nobody has any suggestions for amendments, then I'll be sending this out tomorrow, as well as writing to TS, OFT, my MP and calling the Police.

 

Thanks again for all the advice, I will continue to update the thread with future episodes...

 

edit: @Broken arrow - it's HFO Services. Would I have anything to gain from contacting Barclaycard? I'm just concerned if I get them involved, it'll simply mean more letters to write/respond to.

[broken arrow]

have a read through this....

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/245294-vjohn82-hfo-services-limited-5.html

[42man]

It might also be worth mentioning any future telephone calls..

 

I am writing in relation to the quantity and frequency of telephone calls that I have received from your company, which I deem to be personally harassing.

 

I have verbally requested that these stop, but I am still receiving calls. (Delete if necessary)

 

I now require all further correspondence from your company to be made in writing only.

 

I am of the view that your continued harassment of me by telephone puts you in breach of CPUTR2008 in line with the OFT's guidelines on Debt Collection and the Protection from Harassment Act 1997.

 

If you continue to harass me by telephone, you will also be in breach of the Communications Act (2003) s.127 and I will report you to, OFCOM, Trading Standards and The Office of Fair Trading, meaning that you could be liable to a substantial fine.

 

Be advised that any further telephone calls from your company will be recorded.

 

 

 

[42man]

I'm also wondering if the supplier of the streetviewing application knows that it is being used commercially !!! could well be an infringement of copyright.

[Ell-enn]

Please make sure you send the letter to HFO by recorded delivery or they will simply deny receiving it. Keep a copy of the letter together with the signature receipt which you can print off the royalmail website a few days after posting - keep somewhere safe in case you need to prove they received it.