Inside a DCA!

[car2403]

Forgive us but the answer was not in post 294 . It was a point of veiw . I repeat my question , but slightly differantly worded . In the CC ACT does it say all statements of account should be complete ?

 

Your question is off topic, however;

 

1974 Act - no

2006 Act - yes

[car2403]

Thanks guys I believe one year is a bit too late to get judgement set aside - I feel so cross with myself for allowing this to happen.

 

Funnier things have happened if you get the right Judge!

[Falkirk1298]

Fascinating stuff OTB, and a question if I may. I your experience, on what grounds would an OC ask a DCA to return an account to them?

[make them aktiv runners]

If you directly make an OC aware that a debt is unenforceable, IMO they must recall it and cannot ever sell it again. Any thoughts OTB?

[onthebrink]

Thank you for the informative thread OTB . I have a few questions regarding how DCA's work .

 

(1) When they send those letters with half of the contents visible through the large window of the envelope , is this just a 'mistake' or a deliberate ploy at trying to 'embarass' the alleged debtor into paying with information such as 'your account in arrears' to be seen by a sizeable portion of british postal workers and whoever might live in your premisis ?

No. Most DCAs use a computerised system of delivery which automates the procedure. I mean, would you lick 1000 envelopes a day. And to be honest, I doubt the postie notices with the amount of mail they have to deliver.

 

(2) These autodialler computers they use . I have had a lot of success with just putting the number these autodiallers call from on the choose to refuse list . Is this a major inconvenience for them ? ie, not impossible to circumvent .. use another telephone to dial from, but then you would have the trouble of having somebody physically dial the numbers up and the call is not on the 'system' as such. Not then part of the integrated call/monitor/recording / archiving system they'd want all your calls to be contained within.

The system can identify the following: busy engaged, dead number, call barred, fax, data communication (modem) and can update the file accordingly. The system can also automatically register a 'fault' on the line with BT if it keeps getting an 'engaged' tone. As a last resort your file can be passed to a team leader for a manual call. It should also be noted that only large DCAs have automated call centres, the small DCAs remain on a manual dial up system.

 

(3) Do DCA's deliberately employ unknowledgeable people in positions ( such as complaints/ compliance etc) where they can be used to declare in their ignorance, a statute barred debt is not statute barred ,for example, when it is possible such ill-knowledge leads to the befuddling and confusing and negating of genuine and legitimate claims from alleged debtors concerning such debts ?

Not intentionally no. there is a high turnover rate at DCAs, as you can imagine. So sometimes it can be just a case of getting 'a body' on the phone that can read a script.

 

(4) Have you ever been aware of any kind of nefarious activities that have been alleged to have taken place in some dca's. Such as (dca) making a payment to an account to break an otherwise 6 year statute barred period or use of photoshopped signatures ?

Not in any DCA I worked in, nor would I accept such behaviour. But that is not to say it don't happen. The smaller the outfit the more likely the procedures and controls will be poor, likewise, you do tend to find in-house DCAs make up the rules as they go along.

 

Many Thanks )

 

Hope this helps

[onthebrink]

Fascinating stuff OTB, and a question if I may. I your experience, on what grounds would an OC ask a DCA to return an account to them?

 

Many reasons really, here's just a few:

 

Dispute on the account

Amount owed incorrect

counter claim issued

debtor death

default incorrectly issued

Payment received via another DCA

etc.

[onthebrink]

If you directly make an OC aware that a debt is unenforceable, IMO they must recall it and cannot ever sell it again. Any thoughts OTB?

 

I did say in my first post that I would always answer question as the DCA would act, and not based on my opinion or on the morality or ethics of the question.

 

Taking that into account:

 

I would say the only definitive way of proving a debt is unenforceable, and thus further action justified, is in county court. Until that point both the debtor and the OC/DCA may have different views on the debts validity. It's only the district judges opinion that matters really.

 

[PriorityOne]

If you directly make an OC aware that a debt is unenforceable, IMO they must recall it and cannot ever sell it again. Any thoughts OTB?

 

Not in my case, Activ. An unenforceable A&L account was sold to Fenton Cooper before being re-flogged to Mack Hall.

 

They got no joy from it though.... :grin:

[JonCris]

CPR 13 none receipt has been revoked as a defence

[Rahl]

(1) When they send those letters with half of the contents visible through the large window of the envelope , is this just a 'mistake' or a deliberate ploy at trying to 'embarass' the alleged debtor into paying with information such as 'your account in arrears' to be seen by a sizeable portion of british postal workers and whoever might live in your premisis ?

No. Most DCAs use a computerised system of delivery which automates the procedure. I mean, would you lick 1000 envelopes a day. And to be honest, I doubt the postie notices with the amount of mail they have to deliver.

 

Well, I had the idea that those type of letters would still be produced under an automated system, nobody needs to deliberately write one and lick the envelope down. All it needs is a certain format , a template they could easily call up for those alleged debtors needing a little more 'incentive' to pay . I just wonder how it is that you never really see the same thing happening with other automated procedures, your council tax bills, utility and credit card bills.. you only get this 'mistake' with dca's. And not just one of them , it seems a prevalent 'mistake' across the dca spectrum.

[R B 1968]

Good morning OTB and a Happy Easter to you.

Scenario = CCA default, CCA offence committed, a/c passed from original CC to DCA AND then case reported to Trading Standards.

What would the DCA action be to this - would they defend or drop like a hot potato ?

Thank you,

R

[sillygirl1]

I think they'd pass it onto another DCA - in which case another report to TS would be in order, citing BOTH DCAs - Curlyben has an excellent 'youre the second lot to go forth and not mulitply' letter around.

[R B 1968]

Thankyou Silly - repy appreciated and makes sence however I'd be interested to hear what the view from the inside says - OTB - as our opinion / thoughts may not be reciprocated by these DCA's ?

Happy Easter,

R

[R B 1968]

PS Apologies for my awful spelling / grammar - you wouldn't believe I have actually had an education - unfortunately not in fast'ish 2 finger typing !!!

[PriorityOne]

Good morning OTB and a Happy Easter to you.

Scenario = CCA default, CCA offence committed, a/c passed from original CC to DCA AND then case reported to Trading Standards.

What would the DCA action be to this - would they defend or drop like a hot potato ?

Thank you,

R

 

Morning & Happy Easter !!

 

Unfortunately, TS do not pick this one up in the way that we would like and, although they may encourage you to make a formal complaint, those details are only taken into account if TS get enough complaints from other people as well. They're not interested in individual cases.... so DCAs have no reason to be scared of anything. In my experience, they just sell the account on

 

With no CCA though, this is nothing more than a pain in the ass... since there is nothing a new lot can do with it either.

[onthebrink]

Good morning OTB and a Happy Easter to you.

Scenario = CCA default, CCA offence committed, a/c passed from original CC to DCA AND then case reported to Trading Standards.

What would the DCA action be to this - would they defend or drop like a hot potato ?

Thank you,

R

 

In my experience TS are a blunt knife when it comes to complaints and more often than not take very little interest in individual compliants. Even when they did the DCA response was a generic 'the debtor has not exhausted our complaints procedure' (you would then get a letter from TS asking to make a complaint to the DCA and your back to square one). If you had exhausted the DCA complaints process TS would be notified that the complaint could not be resolved but enforcement action would continue. Rarely do TS get heavy without a lot of simular complaints.

 

Normally the DCA would then pass then account on to a new DCA either by a mutual assignment agreement or total sale at a reduced rate.

[onthebrink]

Morning & Happy Easter !!

 

Unfortunately, TS do not pick this one up in the way that we would like and, although they may encourage you to make a formal complaint, those details are only taken into account if TS get enough complaints from other people as well. They're not interested in individual cases.... so DCAs have no reason to be scared of anything. In my experience, they just sell the account on

 

With no CCA though, this is nothing more than a pain in the ass... since there is nothing a new lot can do with it either.

 

LOL.

 

I should read later post before posting a response could save me all that typing.

[R B 1968]

Thank you Priority One and OTB.

[car2403]

Morning & Happy Easter !!

 

Unfortunately, TS do not pick this one up in the way that we would like and, although they may encourage you to make a formal complaint, those details are only taken into account if TS get enough complaints from other people as well. They're not interested in individual cases.... so DCAs have no reason to be scared of anything. In my experience, they just sell the account on

 

With no CCA though, this is nothing more than a pain in the ass... since there is nothing a new lot can do with it either.

 

Agreed, P1.

 

Remember that the CCA missing has no legal effect on the debt, so it still exists - they even argue that they can still pursue you for it. (Which I disagree with, re: harrassment, etc)

 

It is in somewhat bad taste that they get away with selling a debt in dispute because there is no CCA, regardless of following their complaints procedure or not, though isn't it? I'm assuming that's a deliberate ploy to entice you to pay, by trying to p you off as much as possible, onthebrink? Probably works in some cases as well!

 

My question would have to be, how seriously do these DCA's take their own complaints process? Now we can complain to the FOS, this should be the first line of attack in these cases, shouldn't it?

[make them aktiv runners]

It appears the FOS expect the DCA's complaints procedure to be exhausted first. The FOS charge DCA's £400 but to be honest I am not sure if the actual legal technicalities mean they get this just from the FOS receiving any letter. The easiest solution is to enter into an absolute minimum amount of correspondence with a DCA before instiagting their complaints procedure, that way the FOS involvement later is more likely to incur a charge.

[car2403]

It appears the FOS expect the DCA's complaints procedure to be exhausted first. The FOS charge DCA's £400 but to be honest I am not sure if the actual legal technicalities mean they get this just from the FOS receiving any letter. The easiest solution is to enter into an absolute minimum amount of correspondence with a DCA before instiagting their complaints procedure, that way the FOS involvement later is more likely to incur a charge.

 

The FOS will want any complaints procedure exhausted before investigating - that isn't just complaints about DCA's.

 

The charge is £450 to investigate, but is applied by the FOS member - (the DCA, in this case) the FOS is free to complainants.

 

The FOS will refuse the complaint if you haven't followed the companies internal complaints process, as they "haven't had the opportunity to respond in full".

 

I would say enter in to correspondance the DCA surrounding the issue, then make a complaint in writing when they don't respond favourably - not stating your case early on may be detrimental to the outcome later. Again, if you haven't stated your complaint to the DCA effectively, but add to it later when/if the FOS get involved, the FOS will say the company hasn't had the opportunity to respond and refuse the complaint.

 

The reason I asked that is that I believe not many people being pestered by these DCA's realise that they have a complaints procedure at all and certainly don't know that they can go to the FOS in the first place.

 

OTB; is this a delibrate ploy to avoid formal complaints and where does the FOS fit in to your "procedure/process" posts, regarding roles within the DCA and methods of collection, etc?

[PriorityOne]

It appears the FOS expect the DCA's complaints procedure to be exhausted first. The FOS charge DCA's £400 but to be honest I am not sure if the actual legal technicalities mean they get this just from the FOS receiving any letter. The easiest solution is to enter into an absolute minimum amount of correspondence with a DCA before instiagting their complaints procedure, that way the FOS involvement later is more likely to incur a charge.

 

Yes... FOS do expect the Complaints Procedure to be exhausted before they'll get involved. That doesn't stop the FOS contacting the DCA to get "a wriggle on" though, if it drags on too long.... I have one going through at the moment. In my case, FOS contacted the DCA ages ago, giving them a fair chance to put things right (as if). Needless to say, they didn't/couldn't/haven't... which is why I've written to FOS again (with a ref. number this time).

 

I'm assuming this is the point when the charge could come into it.... when the DCA will be given an opportunity to give me what I'm after (wise), or face a full investigation (unwise).

 

Meanwhile, I wait with baited breath.... :grin:

[The GodMother]

car.

 

I thought the rules on complaining to the FOS was a letter saying this is our final response or not delt with within 8 weeks.

 

Chrissi

[The GodMother]

OTB.

 

just a question 4 u but will give u a bit of back round first.

 

Have a acc with littlewoods and they passed it to In house who were told were to go due to the letter being recieved by my after i had CCAd littlewoods.

 

Now i have not had any demand letters other than statements from littlewoods or the in house DCAs since october of last year.

 

NDR have not contacted me since i told them were to go. littlewoods last corresponded with me in Dec with there statement which i recieved in january.

 

what is the possibility that the acc has been passed to a non in house DCA and if so how long would it usually take for a DCA to contact me?

[car2403]

car.

 

I thought the rules on complaining to the FOS was a letter saying this is our final response or not delt with within 8 weeks.

 

Chrissi

 

Correct.