Boots - We are watching you!

[whirlybird]

Evening All,

 

Came accross a particularly nasty situation today and wondered if anyone could shed some light

 

Went to Boots and lady in front of me at counter asked for co-codamol tablets.Assistant proceeded to ask lady for her name/address and doctors details as she apparantly buys this product once a week.Poor woman, struggling with baby in pram,gave all her details and practically fled from shop in embarassment.Shop assistant went about this as if she had been caught shoplifting and in full earshot of me and any other passer-by.

 

Question I have is: are pharmacies allowed to ask your GPs details and write to them regarding an over the counter product they deem you shouldnt be using?

 

I felt uncomfortable just watching this scene (shop assistants demanding medical records?) as the girl wasnt even a pharmacist.

 

Is this a policy of Boots or can anyone demand to examine our medical records without our permission?

[blitz]

Boots will not be able to examine your medical records, I assume they will only inform the gp about how much co-codamol the person is buying. There is nothing stopping boots from requesting the information, however afaik you can refuse (boots will then refuse to sell the tablets as within their rights)

 

Its the same with a TV, before a retailer sells a TV they must take the name and address of where the tv is going. Its a heavy fine if these details aren't take and retailers should refuse to sell you the TV if you don't comply.

 

Co-Codamol is alot stronger then most pain killers, I personally thought it was a prescription drug, but there are reasons its over the counter and not on the shelf.

[whirlybird]

Thanks blitz

 

This was a new one on me as I personally have never been asked such details and the lady being served was taken aback.

 

The pharmacist was in the background but was not called over which I would have done if in doubt about selling a painkiller.This was a shop assistant demanding GP details from a customer, no prescription involved.

 

What next, Tesco informing GPs how many bottles of merlot are in your basket?

 

The point is, surely if there were grounds to ask for GP details, would a qualified pharmacist not be best placed to ask, not a shop assistant?

 

This is aside from the fact that this was all done quite indiscreetly in front of complete strangers.

 

Thanks again for your reply

Whirly x

[tiglet]

There are different strengths of co-codamol - the one available over the counter (usually labelled paracetamol and codeine) is 8mg of codiene and 500mg of paracetamol per tablet.

 

It's perfectly legal to buy this drug over the counter and all i can think of is that they believed the person may be planning to self-harm or has become addicted to them and so are covereing themselves by notifying her GP.

[davethorp]

Co-Codamol is alot stronger then most pain killers, I personally thought it was a prescription drug, but there are reasons its over the counter and not on the shelf.

 

Co-codamol comes in two guises that I have come across (there may be more). The over the counter version has 500mg of paracetamol and 8mg of codeine per tab. The prescription strength has 500mg of paracetamol and 32mg of codeine per tab

 

EDIT tiglet beat me to some of the details

[whirlybird]

It was the bog standard over-the-counter variety, no prescription

 

I just still fail to understand why a shop assistant can demand access to GP medical records without at least asking a pharmacist.

 

I take your point on the self-harming and addictive issues with painkillers, which is why I would have expected the pharmacist to have at least been asked to speak to the lady.

 

Dont know if this is a Boots policy or a badly trained assistant. Either way I wont be going to Boots for anything other than shampoo and cotton wool in future!

[gizmo111]

I don't know the legalities behind it and can only assume as others have above it is to protect the person buying the tablets, I do know that if it was a relative of mine I would be grateful that someone had seen what they may have saw as a potential tragedy and acted on it.

And I am sure if the worst did happen the media would be calling for the stores to be more responsible.

Intrusive and clumsily handled maybe, but this is a possible case of damned if they do and damned if they don't.

[buzby]

This is ridiculous! Up until May this year it was possible to purchase a box of 60 soluble Boots Co-codamol (or Solpadene or Ultramol) and you were usually limited to the single box. Suddenly they halved the box size, you could not only by a box of 32. Did the price half? What do you think?

 

So in this new enlightened restriction, this woman is buying only half the dosage available 6 months ago, and they want her details? Of course, it she got her Boots Advantage points, they wouldn't have asked (as they would know who she is) but having spoken to the UK Drug and Medicines agency about the pricing issues (nothing to do with them) there is no mandated requirement for personal details, or indeed any problem in visiting every chemist in the high street and beyond to get a single box per purchase. Laughable, just laughable!

[tomterm8]

There are different strengths of co-codamol - the one available over the counter (usually labelled paracetamol and codeine) is 8mg of codiene and 500mg of paracetamol per tablet.

 

It's perfectly legal to buy this drug over the counter and all i can think of is that they believed the person may be planning to self-harm or has become addicted to them and so are covereing themselves by notifying her GP.

 

Codiene can be highly addictive (ironically, for something that's sold for headaches, one of the side effects can be headaches )

 

From what the shop assistant said, I expect they believe the woman might be addicted.

 

That's more likely than suicide, because she wouldn't keep on coming back every week:)

[tiglet]

Unless they believed she was stock-piling them. But i do agree, addiction is more likely.

[blueskies]

This is ridiculous! Up until May this year it was possible to purchase a box of 60 soluble Boots Co-codamol (or Solpadene or Ultramol) and you were usually limited to the single box. Suddenly they halved the box size, you could not only by a box of 32. Did the price half? What do you think?

 

So in this new enlightened restriction, this woman is buying only half the dosage available 6 months ago, and they want her details? Of course, it she got her Boots Advantage points, they wouldn't have asked (as they would know who she is) but having spoken to the UK Drug and Medicines agency about the pricing issues (nothing to do with them) there is no mandated requirement for personal details, or indeed any problem in visiting every chemist in the high street and beyond to get a single box per purchase. Laughable, just laughable!

 

It was a lot earlier than May this year. The rules changed in September 1998 to allow a maximum pack size of 16, or 32 if sold in a pharmacy. This applies to all drugs containing paracetamol or aspirin.

[neuroboy]

Codiene can be highly addictive (ironically, for something that's sold for headaches, one of the side effects can be headaches )

 

One of the stated side effects of the anti-depressants I was taking a while back was 'depression, and increased thoughts of self-harm or suicide'. Just lovely.

[Weird Al Yankovic]

Restricting people buying aspirin is ridiculous.

 

How many people with suicidal tendancies have been saved for goodness sake? Surely somebody who has had their fill of this world would realise instead that jumping in front of the bus would produce the same end?:?

[Goldlady]

What next, Tesco informing GPs how many bottles of merlot are in your basket?

 

 

Aaargh - I find it tough enough when the checkout girl shouts out 'alcohol' because she is too young to sell it.

[poppynurse]

I believe the theory behind reducing the number of tablets containing paracetamol being purchased was to reduce the huge number of on 'impulse' suicide attempts - not sure if this has been achieved. There is no way to stop someone who is serious stockpiling or using different shops. As a nurse who has cared for many folk who have taken overdoses, many on the spur of the moment and later regretted, some of whom did not come to the hospital until a day or two later and who subsequently developed liver failure, I am for anything that may reduce the likelihood.

[patdavies]

It was a lot earlier than May this year. The rules changed in September 1998 to allow a maximum pack size of 16, or 32 if sold in a pharmacy. This applies to all drugs containing paracetamol or aspirin.

 

Which is why I buy in the US now during trips, I come back with suitcases rattling.

 

I buy Ibuprofen and paracetamol(acetaminophen) in tubs of 500 for about $6 (under £3). I also get a Tylenol version of Night Nurse at $4.98 (about £2,50) for a pack of 2, in cherry flavour. A single NN costs over £5 here.

[GlasweJen]

If this woman goes in every week and buys a box of co-codomol then i think the assistant was right to be worried and ask questions. Boxes of tablets all say that if symptoms persist consult a doctor which this person obviously hasn't if she hasn't got a prescription for something more suitable yet.

[ZR120]

cant some of these prescription drugs be used to create illegal drugs? If I recall they can be used to create very nasty examples like Cystal Meth. Wether it was for this reason, or reasons mentioned earlier in the thread i totally agree with them consulting her GP

[tiglet]

I think the point is also that they would be advising her GP, rather than her GP giving out her details, which I believe was a concern of the OP.

[dave]

Laughable, just laughable!

 

I wish it was laughable. It's sad is what it is.

 

The OP asked, "What's next?"

 

I would hazard a guess at what's next:

 

You buy a pack of smarties from Tesco. You use your 'points card' or whatever it's called (I will NEVER have one of these from any shop), one of the directors of Tesco is also on the board of directors of Equifax (or one of the other two, I forget which, but it's not relevent), and also on the board of Westcott.

 

I would guess that should you fall behind on a payment on anything (which is very likely as the cost of things is going up far faster than inflation, thanks to taxes and fuel costs (which are NOT counted in inflation calculations...????!!), then Westcott could ask "well, if you are so skint, how can you afford luxuries like Smarties?"

 

Or of course, Tesco could refuse to sell you Smarties as you 'owe' the money to Westcott.

 

It's just around the corner. The systems are in place already.

 

Scary isn't it.

 

Where does it end? 1984 is where it ends.

[Guest Gertie100]

I saw this happen in another Boots last week. The woman refused to sell co-codamol to an elderly lady in front of me. Apparently the GP had instructed them not to do so...

I think the issue here is that possibily the GP hadn't informed his patient was going to do this...and surely if the GP is worried about the purchase of these tablets for a specific patient, they should get the patient in the surgery and talk about the worries....

Who knows perhaps they did?

 

Ah well, off to buy some smarties in Asda (not Tesco for fear of dave at my door!)

[buzby]

If this woman goes in every week and buys a box of co-codomol then i think the assistant was right to be worried and ask questions. Boxes of tablets all say that if symptoms persist consult a doctor which this person obviously hasn't if she hasn't got a prescription for something more suitable yet.

 

If only it was as easy as you make out. Our family gets through a box of Solpadene (60) each week. This equates to 15 doses per person every 7 days. (You are allowed a maximum of 4 doses in any 24 hour period, so before abuse becomes an issue, a person would have to take 28 doses weekly (56 tabs). Because of the revised box sizes, I have to make two visits to buy less than the legal dosage maximum, as they dropped the pack size but not the maximum dosages.

 

My doctor is fully aware of what I do, and ever since I was 11 I have had suffered from ongoing headaches than a barrage of tests from blood to eyesight have not identified the source. Since these tablets are on available on prescription, I'm unable to get them on a valid prescription, so I have to purchase them retail (and now at 50% additional cost due to the pack size change).

[tomterm8]

It might be worth going to your doctor, Buzby. As I said, Solpadene if used for long periods of time, even within the amount of dose you are using, can actually cause headaches. It could be that you would be better off on a different painkiller. Of course, ther are a huge number of reasons for these kind of problems.

[tiglet]

I agree with tomterm - you really should push your GP to investigate the cause more thoroughly. failing that, he should either change your pain relief (you may require weaning off it by now) or, preferably, refer you to the pain management team at your local hospital. The nurses there are especially trained to ensure the maximum effectiveness of drug combined with the minimum side effects/addiction issues. also, if they believe that more investigation is needed, they will speak to their consultant and get you referred for further tests or to see an appropriate consultant that way.

[buzby]

Afraid BTDT there is no addiction as there are times no dosage is required for 3 or 4 days, this discounted the theory dependence. Also I can spot the paracetamol-induced headaches and ignore those should they occur. It's also worth pointing out that I only use the soluble product which is more kindly to your system, but since I'm effectively taking them under doctor's supervision, short of a quick trip to the guillotine, there's not a solution in sight. CoCodamol Xmas Gift vouchers anyone?