So the "offence" is that you didn't pay and display. As DF said the most this would have cost them would be the cost of the P&D ticket plus a few quid for their costs. £145 is clearly a penalty and any reasonable DJ would see right through that. Parking Eye have lost several cases in court on the genuine pre-estimate of loss (or GPEOL) defence. That's not the only defence you can use, of course. Parking Prankster's website has tons of good information specifically aimed at fighting Parking Eye in court. Have a look there. They would only be able to claim reasonable costs if they win, and even then it would be at the judge's discretion. Also, legal fees in the small claims court are capped so as to make it fair for Joe Public to be able to take on massive companies like Microsoft or Apple without fear of getting slapped with a huge legal bill if they lost.

They don't have any kind of claim against you, they're just chancing their hand. Having written to them several times in appeals you will have inevitably identified yourself to them as the driver. This generally isn't advisable but what's done is done now, and it's not necessarily critical. These kinds of claims can be easily defended, but we'll get to that in good time. What are the current parking conditions on the car park? If there's no entrance/exit barrier now is it pay and display or free up to a certain time limit etc? Also ideally we'd need to know what the initial ticket was for, e.g not buying a ticket / parking in an incorrect bay / overstaying etc?

For future reference POPLA's decision is not binding on the appelant in any way, so you'd be under no obligation to pay anything even if you lost the appeal. Irrelevant now though, first things first. Are the court papers genuine? They should have a court stamp and a case number on them. It's not unheard of for companies to send out fake forms or ones marked as "DRAFT" in order to scare people. If they are genuine, you'll need to file an acknowledgement of service, indicating that you intend to defend the claim in full. This gives you extra time to compile and submit a defence.

I had a charge notice cancelled this morning from UKCPS so they can be easily defeated. I think as long as you word the challenge correctly (personally I don't like to use the word "appeal", it makes it sound like they have some authority and that you are pleading with them), they'll know they are dealing with someone who is clued up on how they operate, they'll allow the appeal as a damage limitation exercise. They know it will cost them a lot more to go to POPLA and that their chances of success are infinitesimally small. VCS v Ibbottson is a very good ruling to quote. DJ McIlwaine got it spot on, the onus is on the claimant to mitigate any losses as much as possible, so if the parking attendant saw the driver leave the premises, the fact that he didn't try to stop them or warn them that it was against "the rules" sinks any claim that they would have had.

Good morning, what's this in my mailbox? Looks like my sternly worded appeal worked. I'm actually quite surprised since a couple of years ago, I never would have imagined that these clowns would allow an appeal. Although I suppose now that they're getting repeatedly shafted at POPLA, it's a kind of damage limitation for them. A gesture of goodwill though? How nice of them, how philanthropic... I'm actually a bit disappointed that they folded at the first hurdle though. I was looking forward to putting them under the cosh at POPLA. Oh well, there's always another day..

As a fellow Cardiffian I wish you good luck with this, but I don't think you'll get anywhere with the small claims court. Just as the PPC wouldn't be able to prove that a £100 parking charge is a genuine pre-estimate of loss, unfortunately it works both ways. Writing a soft letter of appeal to the PPC, then going online and submitting an appeal to POPLA hasn't cost you £100, and you won't be able to prove that it has. I suppose you could invoice them for paper, envelopes, stamps, plus your time spent dealing with this but again I don't think a judge would rule that a fair claim for £100.

Having seen certain PPCs in the past take a cheque sent in F&F settlement, cash it then continue to pursue the keeper for the outstanding amount. I wouldn't trust them to not accept it, but to cash it anyway. You have to understand that you're not dealing with reasonable people here. I'd draft the letter stating that the driver has acknowledged that they were unable to buy a ticket, and that you are willing to offer £10 in full and final settlement of the matter (£6 for the parking and the remaining £4 to cover their reasonable costs). In other words, get them to agree to it in writing before you send the cheque.

At best, the most they would have her "bang to rights" for would be the cost of the pay and display ticket that she didn't buy. Not £60 and definitely not £100. It sounds like you may have already received the NTK in the post (does it say "Notice to keeper/owner/hirer" or similar?) you will need to lodge a soft appeal with the parking company. This forum doesn't advocate non payment of reasonable parking fees in mitigation you could offer the cost of the pay and display ticket for the night shift (and not a penny more) in full and final settlement, but I'll leave that up to you to decide. Make it clear though that if they refuse to uphold your appeal, you want them to provide a POPLA code.

Correct, ignoring is no longer the best option. Simply write a "soft appeal" to CEL (there are plenty of templates and examples available on this forum and elsewhere). All you need to include is a single reason why they shouldn't have ticketed you, I would simply say that the signage on the site is incorrectly positioned and does not conform to the BPA's AOS Code of Practice. Make sure you make it crystal clear that you are requesting a POPLA code should they not uphold the appeal. Send it off with proof of postage (available for free from your local post office I believe), and wait a couple of weeks. They will deny the appeal of course, but should then provide you with the 10-digit POPLA code. This costs them about £28 per code generated. Once you have this, appeal to POPLA using the GPEOL argument. They will lose, and that will be the end of the matter, they've lost about £30 for the POPLA and DVLA fees, and it's cost you nothing except for a few sheets of paper and a couple of stamps.

You have left your vehicle details visible on the attachment, it may be worth redacting this and resubmitting it first of all. Are you sure this fake court document came from Expedion, as it has ANPR Ltd listed as the claimant? Whoever it is, the fact that they haven't filed a court claim yet speaks volumes. It's inevitable that they're just trying to scare you into paying up because if they really wanted to file a small claims case, it takes less than 5 minutes to do via MCOL, so it's safe to assume that they would have simply done it by now if they were serious. However, sending out fake court documents to scare people is a big no-no. It can be seen as abuse of the court process for financial gain. However they have marked it as a draft/copy, so it's a bit of a grey area. Someone with a bit more knowledge could probably clear that one up. I would write back to ANPR directly stating that they have failed to respond to your request to provide a POPLA code in response to your initial appeal letter dated xx/xx/2014, and as such are in breach of the BPA's AOS Code of Practice. Also state that the document that has been sent to you is clearly designed to intimidate and threaten, but that you intend to defend any claim made against you in full. This may put them off from proceeding any further. As for Expedion, I would either ignore them, or possibly send them a short letter simply stating that the debt is in dispute and to refer it back to their client. I wouldn't get too hung up on the 2 minutes time difference, it's not likely to make any difference if it does come to a court hearing. Any case can be easily defended using the GPEOL argument.

Hi Lynette Could you provide a bit more information? Are they alleging that you have parked without authorisation or in an incorrect location etc? Is it a free car park with a time limit / pay and display / permit parking etc? Thanks CD

Read up a few posts. POFA doesn't apply in Scotland, so there is no matter of keeper liability. The parking company would still need to identify the driver, as they did in England & Wales pre-POFA. Simply ignoring remains the best option in these cases.

Cheers again DF. FYI the date of the alleged "offence" was the 5th September and the NTK is dated 7th October. So they're out of time then? Vinny: Not that I have to justify my actions to you, but there were about 15 disabled spaces free when I parked. I did so knowing I was going into the centre, albeit for a few minutes. There were still 15 disabled bays free when I returned to my car 10 minutes later, so in other words I didn't stop anyone parking there. Plus, for all you know I might actually hold a disabled badge and may have simply neglected to display it. However as Dragonfly correctly stated above, disabled spaces on private land are just nicely painted bits of tarmac, with no legal backing at all. I could park horizontally across three disabled bays if I wanted to and although it'd be a bit of a daft thing to do, there's naff all these idiot parking companies can legally do about it. So what's the view like from that high horse?

No worries, I already have my POPLA appeal written out and ready to go. I'm not worried about this shower of unwiped arses in the slightest, just wondering how I can make things as difficult as possible for them. The best thing about this change in the procedure is that you can include all kinds of funny stuff in your appeal to them. When I wrote to them I commented that they'd have more chance of success by taking me to court for breaching the Misuse of Teaspoons Act 1976. When I revisited the centre on Friday night, it crossed my mind to park in the disabled area again, or to park across two spaces to get another NTK, and cost them an extra £27 at POPLA.

There was no photographic proof of any kind on the NTK, nor was there any link to a website where you can view said images. That's right, I went into the centre with my daughter who was meeting some school friends to go to the cinema. I paid for her ticket at the desk myself and got my ticket validated in the process.

Cheers Dragonfly, most interesting reading. The centre car park is not ANPR equipped, you take a ticket at the entry barrier, and get it validated when you make a purchase at one of the centre's outlets before leaving, so in other words it's free for users of the centre. If you're not using the centre there's a pay machine outside which you can use, although it's generally cheaper to go and buy a bag of crisps in one of the bars to get your ticket validated. No, I no longer have the envelope that the NTK came in. I believe the notice was dated 7th October but I'll need to double check (the notice itself is in a drawer at my office, while I'm at home today). Of course it's a template letter which states that I had missed the 14 day window to pay the reduced charge of £60, as set out in the terms and conditions "listed on the ticket which was affixed to my vehicle". On another note, I was there again on Friday night, and saw the same Orangutan fix a sticker to a white van that was parked in one of the disabled bays, he photographed the vehicle from all angles including a closeup of the NTD affixed to the windscreen, so presumably they are told to do this as proof that a ticket was attached, in case someone claims to not have been given one.

Had my first PPC invoice for a few years and my first since the game changed (the last couple I had were in early 2012 which I used to just ignore). I parked at the Red Dragon Centre in Cardiff briefly on September 5th to drop my daughter off at the cinema. As I was only dropping off I stopped in a disabled bay. Came back out of the centre 5 minutes later to find UKCPS's pet Orangutan taking a picture of the front of my car. A few words were exchanged, but to cut a long story short I got in and drove off before he could write the "ticket" out and stick it to my windscreen. The first and only correspondence I've received is the NTK in the post on the 8th October, but by that point it had already risen to £100 from £60. I've already sent my soft appeal back to UKCPS and requested a POPLA code. I know I can already easily challenge and win under GPEOL but I'm curious if the lack of a presence of a windscreen NTD will further sink their claim? Cheers CD

The entrance sign on Street View shows 3 hours free, although this is from 2011 so it may well have changed in the meantime. Just simply reply to the parking company's NTK with a soft appeal, making sure you request a POPLA code. They'll reject the appeal of course, but once you have the POPLA code you can go from there.

I live not far from there and I believe it's free parking with a time limit, not pay-and-display (unless they've changed it very recently). It's a fairly large retail park with about 15 different stores and a Pizza Hut, so you could easily spend more than 3-4 hours there on a Saturday if you were to go shopping then stop off for some lunch.

Utter cobblers, it's not an authorised transaction at all if you were forced to pay under duress. This is standard procedure from them to refuse to issue the chargeback. Keep on at them and keep asking to be transferred to someone more senior. it's quite normal for the bods in the bank call centres to refuse. Put in an official complaint and even if they refuse, you can take the case to the financial ombudsman.

They might as well say on their signs that "vehicles left unattended will be sold to travelling gypsies" for all the good it would do them. They can put whatever they want on their signs, it doesn't necessarily give them the right to do so. Clamping over a previous unpaid debt is unlawful, regardless of the circumstances. Debts are supposed to be pursued legally via the county court system. What the clamping companies are doing is tantamount to walking up to someone, taking their mobile phone out of their pocket and refusing to give it back as they apparently owe you money. The police would have none of this and would quite rightly arrest you for theft. Why they refuse to take action against these cowbow clamping firms for doing essentially the same thing and can call it a civil matter is beyond me. Keep those other tickets, they may come in handy as evidence if you do have to take the landowners and clamping company to court. In the meantime, keep hassling your bank.

Template LBA's are available on the Consumer Direct site. I'm sure you can find one that you can modify to suit your purposes. Basically what they've done is wholly illegal on virtually every front, and it's extremely frustrating that the police can wash their hands of it by saying it's a civil matter when it's clearly tantamount to extortion. You'll need to write two LBA's to both the parking company and the church (or whoever owns the land - as they are responsible for the actions of their agents). In the meantime though, keep hassling your bank, if there's no joy with the monkey on the phone keep escalating up the food chain. It might be worth cancelling your card altogether, or reporting it as lost. If the payment hasn't been processed yet, this should block it, also if you've given your card number to these crooks over the phone, cancelling the card might be a sensible precaution.

What they said, chargeback, now. All you need to tell the card company is that you were forced to pay under duress (use those exact words) to get your car back. £425 is clearly an unreasonable and grossly overinflated fee, even by the BPA's own dubious standards. As for the damage to your tyre, if you wanted to you could take the enforcement company and landowners to small claims court to recover the cost of replacing/repairing the tyre. It's up to you whether you want the hassle.

It's still an unlawful seizure of property. They can't simply take someone's car and hold it to ransom over a supposed unpaid parking debt. That's what the courts system is there for.

The police won't help you at all with this, they'll say it's a civil matter. It's a simple unenforcable speculative invoice though. It's a free car park so they can't penalise anyone for parking there. You may get a pile of threatening letters but it's all a load of bull, they cannot touch you. Basically just ignore all the letters and they will go away eventually.