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    • Thanks FTMDave, I like the cut of your jib - I'll go with that and obtain proof of postage. Encouraging that NPE have never followed through and seem to blowing hot air, let's see where they go after this   Regards
    • Please see my comments in orange within your post.
    • no i meant the email from parcel2go which email address did they send it from and who signed it off (whos name is at the bottom)
    • I understand confusion with this thread.  I tried to keep threads separate because there have been so many angles.    But a team member merged them all.  This is why it's hard to keep track. This forum exists to help little people fight injustice - however big or small.  Im here to try get a decent resolution. Not to give in to the ' big boys'. My "matter' became complicated 'matters' simply because a lender refused to sell a property. What can I say?  I'll try in a nutshell to give an overview: There's a long lease property. I originally bought it short lease with a s.146 on it from original freeholder.  I had no concerns. So lender should have been able to sell a well-maintained lovely long lease property.  The property was great. The issue is not the property.  Economy, sdlt increases, elections, brexit, covid, interest hikes etc didn't help.  The issue is simple - the lender wanted to keep it.   House or Flat? Before repo I offered to clear my loan.  I was a bit short and lender refused.  They said (recorded) they thought the property was worth much more and they were happy to keep accruing interest (in their benefit) until it reached a point where they felt they could repo and still easily quickly sell to get their £s back.  This was a mistake.  The market was (and is) tough.   2y later the lender ceo bid the same sum to buy the property for himself. He'd rejected higher offers in the intervening period whilst accruing interest. Lenders have a legal obligation to sell the property for the best price they can get. If they feel the offer is low they won't sell it, because it's likely the borrower will say the same. I had the property under offer to a fantastic niche buyer but lender rushed to repo and buyer got spooked and walked.  It had taken a long time to find such a lucrative buyer.  A sale which would have resulted in £s and another asset for me. Post repo lender had 1 offer immediately.  But dragged out the process for >1y - allegedly trying to get other offers. But disclosure shows there was only one valid buyer. Again, points as above. Lender appointed receiver (after 4 months) - simply to try acquire the freehold.  He used his powers as receiver to use me, as leaseholder, to serve notice on freeholders.  Legally that failed. Meanwhile lender failed to secure property - and squatters got in (3 times).  And they failed to maintain it.  So freeholders served a dilapidations notice (external) - on me as leaseholder (cc-ed to lender).   (That's how it works legally) Why serve a delapidations notice? If it's in the terms of the lease to maintain the property to a good standard, then serve an S146 notice instead as it's a clear breach of the lease. I don't own the freehold.  But I am a trustee and have to do right by the freeholders.  This is where matters got/ get complicated.  And probably lose most caggers.   Lawyers got involved for the freeholders to firstly void the receiver enfranchisement notice. Secondly, to serve the dilapidations notice.  The lack of maintenance was in breach of lease and had to be served to protect fh asset. Enfranchisement isn't something that can be "voided", it's in the Leasehold Reform Act 1967 that leaseholders have the right to buy the freehold of the property. It's normal, whether it is a "normal" leaseholder or a repossession with a leasehold house, to claim this right of enfranchisement and sell the property with said rights attached and the purchase price of the freehold included in the final completion price. That's likely what the mortgage provider wished to do. The lender did no repairs. They said a buyer would undertake them. Which was probably correct. If they had sold. After 1y lender finally agreed to sell to the 1st offeror and contracts went with lawyers.  Within 1 month lender reneged.  Lender tried to suggest buyer walked. Evidence shows he/ his lawyers continued trying to exchange (cash) for 4 months.  Evidence shows lender and receiver strategy had been to renege and for ceo to take control.   I still think that's their plan. Redact and scan said evidence up for others to look at? Lender then stupidly chose to pretty much bulldoze the property.  Other stuff was going on in the background. After repo I was in touch by phone and email and lender knew post got to me.   Despite this, after about 10 months (before and then during covid), they deliberately sent SDs and eventually a B petition to an incorrect address and an obscure small court.  They never served me properly.  (In hindsight I understand they hoped to get a backdoor B - so they could keep the property that way.)  Eventually the random court told them to email me by way of service.  At this point their ruse to make me B failed.  I got a lawyer (friend paid). The B petition was struck out. They’d failed to include the property as an asset. They were in breach of insolvency rules. So this is dealt with then. Simultaneously the receiver again appointed lawyers to act on my behalf as leaseholder. This time to serve notice on the freeholders for a lease extension.  He had hoped to try and vary the strict lease. Evidence shows the already long length of lease wasn't an issue.  The lender obviously hoped to get round their lack of permission to do works (which they were already doing) by hoping to remove the strict clauses that prevent leaseholder doing alterations.  You wouldn't vary a lease through a lease extension. You'd need a Deed of Variation for that. This may be done at the same time but the lease has already been extended once and that's all they have a right to. The extension created a new legal angle for me to deal with.  I had to act as trustee for freeholders against me as leaseholder/ the receiver.  Inconsistencies and incompetence by receiver lawyers dragged this out 3y.  It still isn't properly resolved. The lease has already been extended once so they have no right to another extension. It seems pretty easy to just get the lawyer to say no and stick by those terms as the law is on your side there. Meanwhile - going back to the the works the lender undertook. The works were consciously in breach of lease.  The lender hadn't remedied the breaches listed in the dilapidations notice.  They destroyed the property.  The trustees compiled all evidence.  The freeholders lawyers then served a forfeiture notice. This notice started a different legal battle. I was acting for the freeholders against what the lender had done on my behalf as leaseholder.  This legal battle took 3y to resolve. Again, order them to revert it as they didn't have permission to do the works, or else serve an S146 notice for breach of the lease. The simple exit would have been for lender to sell. A simple agreement to remedy the breaches and recompense the freeholders in compensation - and there's have been clean title to sell.  That option was proposed to them.   This happened by way of mediation for all parties 2y ago.  A resolution option was put forward and in principle agreed.  But immediately after the lender lawyers failed to engage.  A hard lesson to learn - mediation cannot be referred to in court. It's considered w/o prejudice. The steps they took have made no difference to their ability to sell the property.  Almost 3y since they finished works they still haven't sold. ** ** I followed up some leads myself.  A qualified cash buyer offered me a substantial sum.  The lender and receiver both refused it.   I found another offer in disclosure.  6 months later someone had apparently offered a substantial sum via an agent.  The receiver again rejected it.  The problem of course was that the agent had inflated the market price to get the business. But no-one was or is ever going to offer their list price.  Yet the receiver wanted/wants to hold out for the list price.  Which means 1y later not only has it not sold - disclosure shows few viewings and zero interest.  It's transparently over-priced.  And tarnished. For those asking why I don't give up - I couldn't/ can't.  Firstly I have fiduciary duties as a trustee. Secondly, legal advice indicates I (as leaseholder) could succeed with a large compensation claim v the lender.  Also - I started a claim v my old lawyer and the firm immediately reimbursed some £s. That was encouraging.  And a sign to continue.  So I'm going for compensation.  I had finance in place (via friend) to do a deal and take the property back off the lender - and that lawyer messed up bad.   He should have done a deal.  Instead further years have been wasted.   Maybe I only get back my lost savings - but that will be a result.   If I can add some kind of complaint/ claim v the receiver's conscious impropriety I will do so.   I have been left with nothing - so fighting for something is worth it. The lender wants to talk re a form of settlement.  Similar to my proposal 2y ago.  I have a pretty clear idea of what that means to me.  This is exactly why I do not give up.  And why I continue to ask for snippets of advice/ pointers on cag.  
    • It was all my own work based on my previous emails to P2G which Bank has seen.
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      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Parking without permit....7 months on!


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Last September whilst visiting my daughter in Edinburgh, I parked without displaying a permit (not knowingly..I had placed it on the dashboard and assumed, as it was very windy that night when I parked and dark, it blew out of the car without me noticing).

Anyway, at 7 o'clock on a Sunday morning a parking ticket was put on the windscreen asking for £70. I hadn't paid this and had no further correspondence about it until 2 days ago when I received a letter from a recovery agency, now wanting £140! The day after the letter arrived this was followed by a phone call from same recovery firm. My husband is the named keeper and he thinks I should pay it. What do you think...I am mystified why it would take them 7 months to follow this through .

Should I not have had letters from the parking people themselves before involving a 3rd party?

I would welcome any advice from those who know better than me. Thanks.

Edited by Mousiemouth
typos, inaccurate in places
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Mouse over the word ignore and follow the advice given. I'm not sure about scotland, but In England and wales, it would be VERY stupid for a parking company to send it to a DCA and claim it is a legitimate debt.

  • Confused 1

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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the law in Scotland makes it even harder for the parking company to try and enforce its contract and they should know that. There is also no law of trespass in scotland so they cant claim for damages by trespass either. How did they get your telephone number- If you are listed in the phone book then that would explain but if it isnt they have breached the Data Protection Act.

Write to the DCA and tell them that the debt is denied and any further phone calls or demands from them will be treated as harassment and will result in both civil and criminal procedures against them.

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the law in Scotland makes it even harder for the parking company to try and enforce its contract and they should know that. There is also no law of trespass in scotland so they cant claim for damages by trespass either. How did they get your telephone number- If you are listed in the phone book then that would explain but if it isnt they have breached the Data Protection Act.

Write to the DCA and tell them that the debt is denied and any further phone calls or demands from them will be treated as harassment and will result in both civil and criminal procedures against them.

I don't know where they've got my phone number from as I'm not listed in the phone book. The letter I have is from TNC Parking Services, acting on behalf of their client, P4 Parking. I think they are a debt collection agency with a 'parking services' division. The wording on the letter says '...their client P4 has instructed them to make recovery'.

I read that a NTK has to be issued not later than 56 days after the NTD, since 7 months has elapsed since the NTD, and this is the first letter received, does that make their demands nul and void? Thanks to all for your advice.

Edited by Mousiemouth
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Ignore them.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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The fact that it relates to parking charge from a private company, you can either ignore or challenge the legitimacy of the claim in writing. You are under no obligation whatsoever to engage with debt collectors and they can do nothing other than make boring noises.

Can you remember precisely where in Edinburgh you received this charge and I will look further into it.

 

Furthermore there is no obligation in Scotland to name the driver. Therefore he could argue harassment with whoever appointed the parking agent.

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The fact that it relates to parking charge from a private company, you can either ignore or challenge the legitimacy of the claim in writing. You are under no obligation whatsoever to engage with debt collectors and they can do nothing other than make boring noises.

Can you remember precisely where in Edinburgh you received this charge and I will look further into it.

 

Furthermore there is no obligation in Scotland to name the driver. Therefore he could argue harassment with whoever appointed the parking agent.

 

Thanks for that Crocdoc. I was parked at Springfield st, Eh 6 if that helps. Do you know if I am right about the timespan in sending a NTK?

Edited by Mousiemouth
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totally ignore them in Scotland

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Thanks for that Crocdoc. I was parked at Springfield st, Eh 6 if that helps. Do you know if I am right about the timespan in sending a NTK?

 

The timespan is only set by the British parking Association who are of no importance as they are merely a represenative body of the private parking operators.

Both of these comanies you mention are Members of the BPA, the address provided in Dalry /Gorgie is as far as I can see managed by P4. TNC as you rightly state are merely debt collectors and have no legal status of any description, furthermore you are under no obligation whatsoever to engage with them. The only problem you may have is repeated phone calls, however you can always let them listen to Jeremy Kyle on the telly which in itself should drive them mad in a reasonably short period of time.

 

You have two opitions, simply ignore as DX states.

Alternatively you could write and deny all liablity, then of course you could argue harrasment if the collection calls persist.

 

Many people in Scotland have tried and failed to get these companies into court. As it stands there is nothing they can do apart from make threatening noises.

 

I hope this information is of assistance.

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  • 3 months later...
Thank you for that, another call today so a letter is on the way making all the points shared here.

 

Hello there,

 

Got done in exactly the same place and got the £140 demand letter from TNC. How did you get on with them? Did you get off with paying after you sent the letter? Our employees both never seen any signs.

 

Hopefully hear from you soon

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Hi mak. WHat country do you live in? There is different advice for you depending whether you live in scotland or england.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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  • 3 weeks later...

I'm having the same sort of problem.

 

I was parked in Edinburgh on private land but on the road,

not in a bay or on any lines and I wasn't causing an obstruction.

 

I'm guessing I got the ticket though as it's still their land.

 

I received the parking ticket from p4 parking which I ignored as advised.

 

5 months later I got a letter from TNC parking services demanding that I pay £140.00 or challenge the matter within 14 days.

 

I wrote to them explaining that I was on the road, but received another letter before my 14 days were up demanding I pay within 28 days

or they'd pass this matter over to their litigation department.

 

Some people say to just ignore it but they know I was the driver so does that make it easier for them to take me to court?

 

Also will the charge go up before I receive a court letter.

 

I'm not sure about the Scottish law when it comes to this so any advice would be great!!

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as post 10

 

now ignore them

willy waving

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Still get calls from TNC but not as regular. Follow the advice offered on here, it's sound and sensible. Whereabouts were you parked (don't say exact street). How would they know it was you that was driving....?

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The advice on here has been great!

 

but I stupidly sent them a letter explaining that I was parked on the road in the Leith area

but not in a bay or on lines so they can assume now that I was the driver.

 

I got another letter today saying final demand for payment and that I have 14 days to pay

( my 28 days from the last letter isn't even up yet)

 

They said they'd recommend their clients to take legal action and legal action will be taken.

 

I'm just worried now that because I sent them that letter, it will now be easier for them to take action.

Thanks for your help!

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matters not what you sent

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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As stated, the law in Scotland is defferent to that in England and Wales so you will not be taken to court because the parking companies are not THAT stupid so they rely on bullying and fibbing to get you to pay up. Again, telling them you were the driver makes no odds as the Protection of Freedoms Act doesnt apply in Scotland either.

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