EPC UK Debt Collector - Unpaid Toll Fees in Portugal

[WenDeeDoll]

We have travelled to Portugal several times over recent years and have just received 4 letters from EPC (a UK company who I believe have bought debts from Vialivre who the Portugues Toll Agency in Portugal) demanding payment for alleged unpaid hire car toll fees in Portugal between 2018 and 2021. 

An example of one demand; £45 toll fee plus a Vialivre administration fee around £48, £103 total.

EPC have added another admin fee of £134, totally roughly £228.

These demands state the registration plate, that we have no idea is the car we hired or not, and the journeys made,

As these notifications are the first we have received we are in shock and don't quite know what to do and wonder if this is enforceable and/or even lawful. We always paid, or attempted to pay, our tolls at the post office before we returned home but unfortunately no longer have proof of payment.

Also, there was never a mechanism in place to pay the tolls for our return journey to the airport as it took 24 hours+ before toll charges are registered there.

Really appreciate any guidance and/or advice you are able to give.

[honeybee13]

Hi. We've heard of this before, it's happening all over Europe sadly. And there are questions over the legality. 

Do you think they got your details from the car hire people?

The guys should be along to advise.

HB

[WenDeeDoll]

Thank you for responding to my post, really appreciate it! 

I have no idea where they got our details from and can only assume initially from the car hire company we used at the time.

I haven't reached out to the car hire company as I very much doubt they would be able to advise us from a legal standpoint.

[Nicky Boy]

@FTMDave

I believe Dave will have some helpful input here...

[WenDeeDoll]

Thanks Nicky Boy, really appreciate your taking the time to respond.  Is there any way I can reach out to Dave or do I wait in hope that he reads my post?

[AndyOrch]

 

Welcome to the forum

He will have already had notification from his name being being referred to above.

Topic moved to Debt collection Agencies Forum.

 

Andy

 

 

.

[WenDeeDoll]

Thank you Andyorch, really appreciate your interest and responding.

[FTMDave]

You should be able to bat this away very easily.

Can you please upload one of these demands, redacted of your personal details?

You say that EPC have bought these debts but I strongly suspect they haven't.  Their webpage says they "administer the collection" and "collect outstanding toll fees" which tends to suggest they are acting as a powerless debt collecting agency.

https://www.epcplc.com/portuguese_road_tolls

I'm writing during my lunch break but promise to be on the forum this evening after I knock off work.

[dx100uk]

if you type in epc in our search top right you'll see there are numerous threads here on this DCA

a dca  are not a bailff and have zero powers on any debt no matter what its type.

ignore them 

here is an example

 

[WenDeeDoll]

Hi Dave, thank you very much for getting back to me on this, really appreciated. I have attached both front and back pages of one of the demands that I hope helps.  Thanks again!

 

EPC letter.pdf

[dx100uk]

notice how the cheeky dca epc double the cost by adding their fake charges

absolute astounding

[Nicky Boy]

And they probably pocket the lot themselves...

[WenDeeDoll]

Thank you very much for taking the time and interest in my post and for your valuable feedback, really appreciate it!

[FTMDave]

Say you & I were in legal dispute.  I could sue you and you could sue me.  Your best mate couldn't sue me.  My next-door neighbour couldn't sue you.  Because the case would have nothing to do with them.

And this is the situation with EPC or indeed any other debt collector.  They can do nothing.  It isn't their debt.

We have several EPC threads here and after all the threats nothing happened.

I think Nicky Boy wanted me to contribute as I have seen off the real owners of a debt for a motoring infringement in an EU country, but your situation is even easier.  Relax & ignore the threats.

[WenDeeDoll]

Thank you very much Dave, your logic makes perfect sense and is music to my ears!

I have one more question please, if I may,

that is in relation to paragraph 3 on the back page of the notifications from EPC 'How to Present a Complaint' and there it states "A complaint can be presented online.

The EPC Group will then place your case(s) on hold and if necessary, forward your complaint or question for consideration to Vialivre SA"

Therefore, can I can safely assume EPC are NOT owners of the alleged debt and as you eluded to previously "administer the collection" and "collect outstanding toll fees" which tends to suggest they are acting as a powerless debt collecting agency?

Once again, very many thanks for your invaluable time and support.

[FTMDave]

Yes - you're spot on.

[FTMDave]

Have a read of the last posts on istrianadventurer's thread  https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/459903-fine-from-epc-for-having-no-vignette-in-hungary/#comment-5219106

The news is good

 

Edited November 20, 2023 by FTMDave
Typo

[dx100uk]

or post 6 in the same thread... from me.

dx

 

[WenDeeDoll]

You guys are simply the best and I cannot thank you enough for your interest and support! xox

[Nicky Boy]

Pass the word along about us...

[WenDeeDoll]

Absolutely, and already am.  

[WenDeeDoll]

Good moring guys

Further to previous correspondence, just received the attached correspondence and would be extremely grateful for further thoughts please?

Thanks again!

EPC 6 Dec 2024.pdf

[Nicky Boy]

What a lovely "Information notice"...

And they've even been kind enough to "extend the due date"... How thoughtful!

 

Just a thought for the team...We've seen a few of these now. I'm wondering about data protection concerns.

As we are no longer in the EU, so should EPC be obtaining data from the DVLA and presumably passing it on to another EU country?

I see that they are members of BPA, so are they using KADOE to obtain keepers details for use in a foreign country?

I understand tha the DVLA are supposed to only issue data for valid reasons...

Would it be worth asking the OP to send a SAR to DVLA and EPC to find out what reason is being used to obtain their info and whether the data is being shared abroad?

[WenDeeDoll]

Hi Nicky Boy

Thank you very much for taking the time to respond, much appreciate as always! As this 'alleged' toll fee contravention is for a hired car am I right to assume the DVLA will not be involved?

Thanks again

[FTMDave]

Nick is spot on.

How kind of them to send all this free tourist information for Portugal.  I went to Portugal for Euro 2004 and I will certainly bear their advice in mind should I have a return visit.

None of which has any relevance to them pursuing you for money.

All over Europe, if you don't pay what you should, you get penalties to pay on top ... not an extension of 28 days!!!  They have kindly given you this extra time because they know full well they can't do anything to you.  Relax and ignore. 

Nick, I would presume it was the car hire company that gave the details.  Sure, EPC are a member of the BPA, but I don't think that's directly relevant.