UKPCS Operator Pictures MNPR PCN - no windscreen PCN left - parking in Parent and Child bay without a child - Abbeywood shopping centre, Filton, Bristol BS34 7JL ***Cancelled on Appeal***

[mclaresw]

Hi,

I had visited Abbeywood shopping centre on my own, as had to quickly run to a few shops. 

My baby was not well so had left him home.

I had initially parked in a normal bay, but as I was finishing off the shopping my husband called to inform that baby had woken up and started crying. As I took the car I remembered I had forgotten something, so quickly parked at mom and baby and returned in 5 mins.  But I have been slapped with a parking charge for that short period I had left the car there. I had the baby seat in the car.

Is there any chance for me to request someone to take a look at this once again. 

I also have plantar fasciitis on my right foot and if someone would check the cctv can see me limping.

I just did not have the energy to walk up and down in pain and thought it was only for a few mins. please someone help me.

Thanks in advance.

[honeybee13]

Hello, welcome to CAG.

Who is the ticket from please, local authority or a private parking company?

Best, HB

[dx100uk]

this is UKPCS so its a private parking company

moved the the private parking forum.

1st it is not a fine, you cant be fined on private land for anything and even if you could there is no fine for parking in a P/C bay.

its a speculative invoice because the driver supposedly broke some imaginary contract when they drove in.

 do not appeal

could you please complete this:

 

dx

 

[lookinforinfo]

It will be interesting to see the PCN as it should show photos of your car arriving at the parent and child bay.....

[mclaresw]

For PCN's received through the post [ANPR camera capture]

(must be received within 14 days from the Incident)

Please answer the following questions.

1 Date of the infringement 22nd October 2023

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] 24th October 2023

[scan up BOTH SIDES as ONE PDF- follow the upload guide] please LEAVE IN LOCATION AND ALL DATES/TIMES/£'s

3 Date received 25th October 2023

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?] N

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? When I selected appeals process on the website it shows more pics of my car being parked in the parent and child bay. I am assuming someone was observing me getting into the car without a child but there is no photographic evidence to it

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal] Not yet but I am considering

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up have not appealed yet, can I first pay and then appeal to ensure I am not charged anything more than £60.

7 Who is the parking company? UKCPS

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Abbey wood shopping park, Filton, bristol

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under.

IAS www.theIAS.orgThere are two official bodies, the BPA and the IAS. If you are unsure,

please check HERE

If you have received any other correspondence, please mention it here

Copy the windscreen or ANPR section to your thread and answer the questions...

……....

In either case scan up bothsides of any letters/tickets in or appeals made out to ONE MULTIPAGE PDF ONLY

 

 

[honeybee13]

Please don't appeal, we'll explain why not.

HB

[Nicky Boy]

Appealing could inadvertantly disclose that you were driving.

POFA 2012 requires the PPC's to comply with all sorts of rules in order to transfer the liability for the parking charge from the driver to the registered keeper. You could lose that protection by revealing you were the driver.

No, you can't pay and appeal. If you read their paperwork (which you haven't yet uploaded) their stupid rules will tell you this.

Please also capture and upload the photos from their website.

if this was an attendant taking pics (sounds like it was), they've also not complied with POFA 2012 delivery times for the ticket.

Start reading around the forum to educate yourself on the type of "businesses" you're dealing with.

Get out of your head now that PPC's are legitimate, reasonable, law abiding companies.

Read up!

Start with our successes forum...

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/347084-ppc-successes-no-questions-please/page/16/#comment-5231630

 

[mclaresw]

CamScanner 11-01-2023 16.35.pdf

Please find attached the parking charge notice

[Nicky Boy]

Haha,

I've gotta go for now.

I'm sure the regulars will have plenty to say about this one later.

[mclaresw]

Please find attached pics that they have taken while the car was parked. Also the car is in my husband's name and I was the driver at the time of the incident. 

Shall I go and speak to the Asda store manager. I was visiting Asda at the time of the incident. Is that worth a shot ?

parking charge pics.docx

[FTMDave]

More later this evening - work calls now - but Asda are generally superb at getting tickets cancelled.

[FTMDave]

Unfortunately there is a problem with my cunning plan of writing to the Asda CEO (Asda cancel tickets virtually always).  This appears not to be an Asda car park, sure there is an Asda shop there, but UKPCS's invoice refers to "Abbeywood Shopping Park".  It will be the shopping park that called UKPCS in.

There is a snail mail address here  https://www.abbeywoodshoppingpark.com/contact.php  Write to them, include a copy of UKPCS's invoice & proof of purchase at Asda, emphasise that you do have a small child, you can't understand why you got the invoice for parking in a parent & child bay without a child, and ask them to get the ticket cancelled.

There are no guarantees - but it has to be worth a try.

4 hours ago, mclaresw said:

can I first pay and then appeal to ensure I am not charged anything more than £60.

No you can't, you either pay £60 to make this go away or fight it.

UKPCS are well known to us - they never, ever, ever, ever, ever accept appeals - ever.  That's when the person making the appeal has an excellent case.  You case is rubbish as you did actually break the rules on their silly signs so I don't know why you're considering appealing.

[Nicky Boy]

Don't be so harsh on the OP Dave...

Pictures of an empty car is evidence that there were no children present?

Laughable!

 

The PPC has also not respected POFA in any way.

As stated on their stupid NTK "Notice to Keeper" (which should have been sent through the post MUCH later), this was a "MNPR"... So, they should have stuck a "Notice To Driver" on your windscreen.

Then, when you ignore that, they should send out the NTK... (29 to 56 days later I believe.)

 

If you want to fight this, you've got an extremely good chance of batting it away and CAG will advise you along the way.

However, be prepared to put up with months of ignoring stupid letters.

If you want it all to just go away, pay up...

We DO hope you're a fighter...

[lookinforinfo]

 Have  they also included photographs of your entry and departure times in the car park?

That  will prove that for most of the time you were not parked in the accompanied child bay and should tell how long you stayed in that last bay. 

Their PCN is not compliant with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 which govern the private parking companies.

They are supposed to specify the period of parking on the PCN which implies a start and finishing time. All they have said that the parking period begins with the time immediately preceding the breach with no finishing time. And they don't eve state a starting  time-was it a second before or a minute before?

They have also omitted "(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)" which should have been included in their statement that the PCN payment can be transferred to the keeper. That is an error in itself compounded by not specifying  the period of parking.

As they will be pursuing your husband, he would not be liable for the charge now since they have not complied with the terms of the Act. This is why we ask that an appeal is not paid since the keeper can inadvertently reveal who was driving. Especially as the  Appeals  document  often ask who the driver was.

It looks as if the manual photographer did not photo you all the time therefore could not tell whether  you came back to your car with children. So you have to include in your Witness statement that Met are put to strict proof that children were not present n your car when you left.

I wouldn't lose any sleep over the PCN. If they get as far as Witness Statements being required they should give up then.

 

 

[dx100uk]

5 hours ago, mclaresw said:

Is there any photographic evidence of the event? When I selected appeals process on the website it shows more pics of my car being parked in the parent and child bay. I am assuming someone was observing me getting into the car without a child but there is no photographic evidence to it

please go capture these and get them all up here in one multipage pdf 

read upload

 

 

[mclaresw]

Have included all the pics in this doc here.

 

parking charge pics.pdf

[mclaresw]

Should I say that my husband was with our baby in some other shop? 

I am desperate for this to go away. 

[FTMDave]

1 hour ago, Nicky Boy said:

Don't be so harsh on the OP Dave...

I meant a rubbish case with UKPCS Nick, meaning they would never accept an appeal!

With the rest of the world the OP has a great case!

@mclaresw Write to the shopping centre tomorrow, 1st class letter.  We have had several cases resolved this way.  Of course there are no guarantees.  But nothing ventured ...

[mclaresw]

Shall I write exactly what happened to the shopping centre or what should I write in the letter, could u pls help me.

[honeybee13]

Tell them what you've told us, such as what's in post #1. You can pop the draft letter on here and we'll help you to refine it.

HB

[lookinforinfo]

There is no need to lie. They have only taken about four pictures of you car when you first parked in the family bay. They haven''t put when you pulled out of that bay so they cannot prove who was in the car then. So if you say that you put them to strict proof that you didn't pick up children when you left then their PCN is wrong as they have no proof of how many, if any, children were in your car. That way you don't have to lie and they cannot prove that there were no children in the car with you.

I didn't see the arrival and departure time photos of your car. of course it suits their case that they don't show them.

[mclaresw]

Please check the letter drafted 

 

 

Parking Charge Cancel Request.pdf

 

I have found my first bill with Asda and that was paid at 13:07:43 and pics of my car were taken at 13:12 and 13:13

[FTMDave]

There is no need to go into such detail.  Also, just in case the shopping centre don't cooperate, you shouldn't be outing the driver.  The letter should be sent by your husband, sending communications "on behalf of" just gives the other side an excuse not to cooperate.  I would also include a phone number and e-mail address as that just encourages them to get it cancelled and quickly confirm the same to you.  Keep it short & sweet -

Dear Sir/Madam,

Subject: Notice to Keeper [PCN: xxxx] [24/10/2023]

I write to you in respect of the above parking invoice issued to my vehicle which was issued for the alleged reason “In Parent and Child Bay without a child” at the Abbey Wood Shopping Park on 22/10/23 @ 1:14pm.

I kindly request that you cancel this charge of £60.

I am a genuine customer of the Shopping Park as you can see from the attached screenshot of purchases made from different shops in the Park on that day.

I also have a 5-year-old child so am at a loss as to why the parking attendant thought I was abusing the car park facilities.  Indeed the attendant did not say anything to me and I found no ticket affixed to the car.

I look forward to receiving confirmation that the ticket has been cancelled as soon as possible.

Yours faithfully,

[Nicky Boy]

Nice one Dave, no untruths in that one.

[mclaresw]

Thank you so much everyone. I will send the letter asap