Employer Not Paying Wages

[rippedoff15]

Over the last few months my daughter's employer has been paying all staff late and her monthly wage late in fact 2 months behind and due to this happening and the stress, she has been forced to leave the company and started a new job which is way forward, her old employer has still not paid my wages and its been 9 weeks and the amount is over £4000.00 and they are now not giving any information when this will be paid. Over recent months due to have no wages she has had to live on my credit cards which are all at maximum and we have been supporting her paying her mortgage and bills which is now crippling every month.    

I need advice in how to resolve this major issue quickly and to bring closure 

 

[BankFodder]

Please will you tell us the name of the company.

Also, how much are we talking about?

How long has has she been working there and has she accrued any holiday pay

[BankFodder]

Also please tell us the precise date that she left the company

[rippedoff15]

The company is Advanced Oncotherapy and employed there for 3 years and left on 9th June, and had no wages for 9 weeks. And no information when wages & outstanding holiday will be paid, staff still employed are in the same situation as well. 

 

[honeybee13]

The comments on glassdoor aren't all favourable and the company don't seem all that well organised, according to what people are saying. I'm not a member but a google search shows that at least one person mentions late payments.

For a stockmarket quoted company this is disappointing.

Security | Glassdoor

WWW.GLASSDOOR.COM

HB

[rippedoff15]

Never been an issue until December 2022 and since then late payment of wages and now no information nor any payment of outstanding wages. Totally agree the directors getting paid and not paying the staff. 

 

[BankFodder]

I have put the word out to one of our people @Emmzzi who is extremely knowledgeable about employment law but in the meantime I would suggest that you make an immediate complaint to the employment tribunal.

You have a very short time to do this – the time limit is three months and I understand that your daughter has already left her job nine weeks ago.

You need to get this going.

She would be claiming unfair dismissal on the basis that she has been constructively dismissed. It's a long time since I've done this kind of stuff but I can tell you the constructive dismissal if actively means that the employers have created a situation which is so intolerable that they have effectively dismissed your daughter even though it was her choice to go.

I would say that not being paid for any particular period of time would be an intolerable situation and she will be justified in leaving. She has been working there for more than two years and presumably more than 16 hours a week so she has employment rights.

The other reason you need to get going is that presumably this company is in trouble and they may pull the plug before you know it and then there will be no action before the employment tribunal or elsewhere.

As a backup action, you can also sue in the County Court – but unfair dismissal damages would be far more interesting.

Hopefully @Emmzzi will be along before too long and will either confirm what I say give you further advice or give you better alternatives.

[Emmzzi]

Hello,

if all she seeks is the unpaid wages, small claims court will be faster and easier. Send a letter before action, outlining what is owed and giving say 14 days to respond before a claim is raised.

if she wants any unpaid holiday owing and a notice period, then proceed as @BankFodder suggests above, being aware there is a bigger backlog for ETs than Small Claims and it may take longer.

Neither route is speedy I am afraid.

[rippedoff15]

Well been stressful few weeks, we contacted ACAS and they accept the complaint and ACAS started action using the early consolation and ACAS confirmed they are speaking to the Employer but getting nowhere in fact every call was no staff to deal with this matter at this time. However last night ACAS ended the early consolation stating the employer has now refused to deal with this matter and they have issued a certificate and stated my daughter now has 1 month less 1 day to make a claim for constructive dismissal. 

With regard to outstanding wages which currently is £4,775.50 this has not been paid nor any information when it will be paid, the company have issued May & June pay slips again no payment. We have started to input using the MoneyClaim Online and looking at filing against the company & the CEO / director as well as person.  

Our Plan 

1, Issued both the company & the CEO letter before action giving 14 days notice ( Just need to find draft copy ) 

2, On day 15 if payment not made to my daughter submit the paperwork to the court via MoneyClaim Online - To both company & CEO / Director who are registered at the same address (Company House confirms the company is still active)

3, Once court papers submitted online issue both parties the particulars of claim ( Our Evidence May, June payslips & letter from company referring to non-payment of wages to all staff also letter stating all staff will receive one-week wage to cover any charge s incurred with no payments made to my daughter.    

Question - The company are based to London City, can we ask any hearing be held in our local County Court as cannot see on the paperwork where any hearing will be held. 

Any feedback will be much appreciated 

[BankFodder]

If you are going to go the County Court route then given the fact that it has gone to ACAS and you have your certificate, I would say that this is probably a good basis for dispensing with the letter of claim and going straight to MoneyClaim.

I would suggest in that case that you send them an email today saying that you will be issuing the claim on Tuesday if they don't make an immediate payment to you – and provide your bank details.

Once you have issued the claim, then wait for the 14 days to adapt to see if they file defence. C the defence but be prepared to apply for summary judgement immediately.

Look up CPR 24 on the County Court website and you will learn something about summary judgement – which basically means that you argue to the judge that there is no chance of success and that the court should award you judgement without even going to trial.

You are dealing here with a business which appears to be in trouble and you probably need to get your foot in the door – get a judgement at least so that you are a preferred creditor – and then get the judgement transferred up to the sheriffs for High Court enforcement.

 

[rippedoff15]

Question can we filing against the company & the CEO so if the company go bust the CCJ is still active against the CEO  

[BankFodder]

It is called "piercing the corporate veil" – and it is pretty difficult to do. You would have to show some real wrongdoing in order to get beyond the limited liability protection.
Look it up on the Internet – by all means include the CEO unless you find a downside. I'm afraid it's in a bit out of my experience.

[BankFodder]

Incidentally, an application for summary judgement – CPR 24 – would have to be made by application notice form N244 which I'm afraid will cost you about 250 quid although you will have that sum awarded to you once you get judgement.

Of course the problem is always will be enforcement but I think that speed is of the essence here.
 

As @Emmzzi has pointed out, the IT route is probably going to take a long time.
However, if there is any money outstanding in lieu of notice or holiday pay – I don't see any problem adding that your County Court claim.

 

[rippedoff15]

We have given detailed list of outstanding money requesting payment and sent the email with delivery & read receipts. Personally don`t think they will pay and we will submit claim online Monday, spoken to ACAS this morning and they have said my daughter has good case of constructive dismissal and she should file this through to the Employment Tribunal using a solicitor so we now are looking into this as well, as we only have short window t file and been quoted 1 month less 1 day from ACAS .  Currently due to this my daughter is now in debt for £6k and very stressed and upset. 

[BankFodder]

There is no need for you to use a solicitor in this case.

I am quite sure that you can start the process off yourself and it seems to me that there is no defence to the facts at all.

The main issue will be a question of trying to press ahead for a good level of compensation

[rippedoff15]

I have submitted the Employment Tribunal which was very simple to complete, question regarding the court action do we send to the companies registered office as per companies house as they also have another office in London as well. we have sent email today and got delivery & read receipts coming they have been opened.   

[BankFodder]

Now here's a little problem that I'm not certain about.

I'm not sure if you can run parallel cases on basically the same issue – although until somebody stops you I suggest that you go ahead with the caveat that if you can't and you pay some claim fees, it may be that one of the claim fees – either for the IT or for the small claims court will probably not be refundable.

I don't have time to have a look round the Internet at the moment – maybe you could search and see can you bring simultaneous claims for unfair dismissal in the industrial tribunal and also bring a parallel breach of contract case in the County Court.
It may be that you can bring breach of contract case in the County Court and then explained to the IT that you are seeking a reduced settlement for unfair dismissal to take into account the money you have received through the County Court system.
I'm afraid I really don't have the answer to hand.

Maybe @Emmzzi or my site team colleague @Andyorch will have an idea.

[BankFodder]

Employment+tribunal+and+County+Court+claim+at+the+same+time - Google Search

WWW.GOOGLE.COM

 

 

[Emmzzi]

You cannot have the same case heard twice so one claim will stop when the other concludes. You can pursue elements which are for related, but not the same, matter.

 

 

[Emmzzi]

Employment claims in the civil courts - Working Families

WORKINGFAMILIES.ORG.UK

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Some types of employment-related claims can be brought in the civil courts, rather than in an Employment Tribunal. This advice page offers a high level...

 

[rippedoff15]

Well its October and 6 months and still have not paid the outstanding wages, we have completed the ACAS route and they have issued certificate, we have passed everything to the employment tribunal and they have sent letter of claim and given a date on 16th Jan 2024. The employer has sent letter only to staff still employed stating they are aware ex staff have sent claims to London & Manchester and requested all claim be heard at the same time ?????? 

They have said their is still no date when funds will be released, very frustrating they still are not send any information to staff if they have left the business. 

We have set information we have to send to the tribunal which we will complete as per the dates.   

 

[rippedoff15]

Well still no payment from the company, we have submitted claim to the Employment Tribunal along with 48 other claimants and the court have confirmed they are all the same so joined together and heard as group, the court have sent all the details to the company as well. 

We had text message from the company saying in simple terms, they will agree to making payments for outstanding wages only and will not agree to payments relating to pensions nor any compensation as they have been informed the Employment court is not enforceable. Hoping the employment court will acknowledge the claim / judgement. 

 

 

[stu007]

HI

You need to send a copy of that Text from the Employer to the Employment Tribunal to make them aware of this.

Also them stating a judgement by an Employment Tribunal is unenforceable well I would love to know where they are getting there Legal Advice.

The following Government link is an Automatic PDF Download from HM Courts & Tribunal Service Form EX727 (have a good read of it)

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6527c019aea2d00013219c2e/EX727_0923.pdf

This is Registry Trust Ltd Link:

Enforce an Employment Tribunal

WWW.REGISTRY-TRUST.ORG.UK

This is   Make a claim to an employment tribunal If you win your case link:

Make a claim to an employment tribunal: If you win your case - GOV.UK

WWW.GOV.UK

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How to take an employer to a tribunal: the hearing, what happens if you lose your case, how to appeal.

 

[rippedoff15]

Email from the Employer today and ET3 form sent to the Employment Tribunal they are admitting they have not paid staff and listed wages outstanding.

I write in response to the letter from the Employment Tribunal dated 14 November 2023, a copy of which is attached for convenience.

 In that letter, the Tribunal explained that:

 1.       the Claims would be heard together;

2.       the files would be referred for consideration by a Judge once the Respondent had had the opportunity to submit a response to each of the Claims (the Responses);

3.       a copy of the claim forms and the service papers in respect of the Claims would be copied to the Respondent; and

4.       if the Respondent sought to oppose the claims, it should submit draft Responses accompanied by an application for an extension of time explaining why the Responses were not served within the time period originally given.    

 Following this letter, the claim forms and service papers in respect of the Claims were sent to the Respondent on 14 November 2023 save for those for ***********  and Mr ********* which were sent on 28 November 2023.

In accordance with the instructions of the Tribunal, I attach to this letter draft Responses to the Claims.  For the avoidance of doubt, there are 24 draft Responses, relating to the following claims:-

Full list of Claimants 

The reason that Responses to the Claims were not served within the time period originally given is that the Respondent did not receive them, and only saw the claims when we received the Tribunal’s email of 14 November 2023. In the email of 14 November 2023, it was explained that proceedings were served at the Respondent’s registered office (*******************). The registered office is visited once per week but no post from the Tribunal has been found. The Respondent has been served with related proceedings by the London Central Tribunal but these were sent to the address at ( *************), and these were received safely and responses served in time.   

 Accordingly, I would be grateful if the Tribunal could treat this letter as the Respondent’s application for an extension of time for presentation of the Responses to the Claims of 28 days from the date on which the Respondent received the majority of claim forms in respect of the Claims (i.e. 14 November 2023), in accordance with Rule 20(1) of the Employment Tribunals Rules of Procedure 2013 (the Tribunal Rules). 

 This application is in accordance with the Overriding Objective for the following reasons:

 1.       Allowing the Respondent to submit the Responses will allow the Tribunal to determine the cases fairly and justly, with accurate information about the sums alleged to be owed and allowing the parties to be on an equal footing.

 2.       The failure to file the Responses in time was due to the Claims not having been received, for reasons beyond the Respondent’s control (and it has responded to all other related claims that it has received by the required deadline).

 3.       The Respondent would be prejudiced if it were unable to contest these claims, particularly in circumstances where some of the Claimants are claiming sums to which they are not entitled via a claim in the Employment Tribunal.

 4.       The Respondent has prepared draft Responses to 24 claims, as soon as reasonably practicable, to minimise further delay.

 5.       I do not anticipate that there would be any prejudice to the Claimants in the Tribunal granting an extension of time to the Respondent to file the Responses. The Respondent, on the other hand, would suffer significant prejudice if it were not allowed to present the Responses and to have the opportunity to contest some of the amounts claimed.

 I confirm that I have complied with Rule 30(2) of the Tribunal Rules and have copied this letter to the Claimants in the Claims, who should notify the Employment Tribunal of any objections within seven days of receipt of this letter.

[rippedoff15]

Email from the Employment Court today, so reading the email the court are saying outstanding wages must be paid but no mention of compensation, so employer can stop paying staff wages so staff have to find new employment and staff do not get compensation this be classed as constructive dismal ?   

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

This email has been blind copied to the claimants.

Regional Employment Judge ****** has directed that we write to the claimants about the letter from the respondent asking for an extension of time, and the proposed response form in each claimants’ case which will become effective if time is extended by the Tribunal. These were sent to the claimants by the respondent on 30 November 2023. The Regional Employment Judge directs that any further objections to the application to extend time for the responses must be provided by 5 January 2024.

The claimants should note that the Tribunal has no jurisdiction to make an award in respect of payments that should have been made to the pension scheme, because that is a matter for the Pensions Regulator, and claimants who are still in employment cannot claim notice pay.   As for outstanding wages and holiday pay, will the claimants please confirm whether you accept the amounts which the respondent proposes to admit, and if you do not accept them please explain why that is and the amount you are claiming.  Tribunals awards for arrears of pay/holiday pay are made in gross terms so that the employer can deduct tax and national insurance when the payment is made.  Please reply by 5 January 2023.