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    • yet another Brexitish failure   England set to miss post-Brexit targets to clean up rivers by 2027 INEWS.CO.UK Nearly 80 per cent of England's rivers, lakes and coastal waters may fail to reach a 'good' standard by 2027, a post-Brexit watchdog warns  
    • No. The defence is different. Their defence paragraph 2.7, 2.8, 2.9, 2.10 – for the first time makes reference to an alleged term between the Packlink/EVRi contract which apparently specifically excludes the effect of the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999. If this is true then it is very likely that they will have closed that loophole because the 1999 act specifically allows itself to be excluded by an express term within the principal contract I think that you will have to do ask the court to require them to provide evidence by way of presenting their contract and also the date that this new amendment was inserted. I understand that your claim refers to an item which was lost a year or so ago. These give us the date. We would certainly want to know that this amendment predates the date when you first contracted with Packlink to send the item. I would want to say to the court that in the absence of their willingness to confirm with evidence the date that this contractual amendment was made, that the court should assume that this was a recent amendment and was therefore not in force at the time you made your contract. We have third-party defences on this sub- forum which are fairly recent and there has been no mention of this exclusion of the 1999 act. I think we can take it that this is something that they have put together very recently. Secondly, even if they want to exclude your third party rights, it does not absolve them from the negligent handling of your item and in respect of an action for negligence you have first party rights. You don't have to rely on third party rights – although of course, you didn't allege negligence in your original claim. We didn't advise you to do so. Maybe shortsightedly we didn't foresee this contractual amendment. Of course assuming that this contractual amendment is true – although I expect it has only been added recently – what they are saying here is that nobody in the United Kingdom who makes any contract with any parcel delivery company using Packlink will have the right to bring a claim for lost or damaged or even stolen parcels. These people have lost their moral compass. It is shabby treatment of ordinary customers who pay their money and who repose their trust in these parcel delivery companies. No wonder that the Paralegal Children are now ashamed to sign off these documents with their own names. In terms of parcel tracking information – apparently it has been destroyed according to their own data protection policy. That's their business. It's got nothing to do with you and they can't use this to frustrate the six year limitation for bring a breach of contract action or the three-year limitation period for bringing an action in negligence or other tort. There reference once again to the exclusion of the 1999 Act but this time apparently in the contract between you and Packlink – is irrelevant because the exclusion has to be in the commercial contract between Packlink and EVRi – which they have referred to in their paragraph 2.7 et cetera of their defence. I'm assuming that you propose to go ahead with this case. Please let us know when you respond and we will go forward. In the meantime, I suggest that you write a letter to EVRi. Referred to their paragraph 2.7 et cetera and asked them for a copy of the contract and confirmation of the date on which the exclusion of third party rights term was included in it. Tell EVRi that if they do not answer or if they refuse that this will be brought to the attention of the judge. Tell them also that you notice that they say that they have destroyed data in line with their data protection policy. Inform them that they do not appear to have disclosed this data protection policy to their customers. Please will they forward you a copy of it and once again if they failed to respond or if they refuse that you will bring this to the attention of the judge as well. I suggest that you post a draft of the letter here so we can have a look    
    • Good morning dx100UK Could I send the update to you privately? Regards
    • On the other thread you posted on, you asked about immigration issues. We aren't qualified to give that advice, sadly, you would need to find an authorised adviser. 'It is a criminal offence for a person to provide immigration advice or services in the UK unless their organisation is regulated by the Office of the Immigration Services Commissioner (OISC) or is otherwise covered by the Immigration and Asylum Act 1999. Members of certain professional bodies may give immigration advice without registering with OISC.' How to become a regulated immigration adviser - GOV.UK WWW.GOV.UK  
    • Hi. Can you show us the letter from the police please? Cover up your name and address. Our upload guide will help you. HB
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

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      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Disputed EE account ***Resolved***


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Mum's partner can no longer use a mobile phone. He has however been paying EE over £40 a month since 2006.

 

EE initially couldn't trace any account in his name despite giving them bank details etc, but then did find it when I said OK, give us the money back then .... They've ignored all requests for documentation so far, have known for 4 months that alleged account holder has a Power of Attorney in place, but have apparently set the debt collectors on him anyway. He's not received any correspondence from EE or the debt collector.

 

EE have provided some numbers associated with the account, none of which match his last number, which he would have last used at least 3 years ago. He does still have the phone and it has a Sim card in it, but heaven only knows where the charger is. One of the numbers EE provided apparently has recent regular usage, data as well as calls and texts. I can just about believe he might have, accidentally or otherwise, made a call, but sent a text or used data? No chance.

 

Other than repeating the request for documentation, any other suggestions?

RMW

"If you want my parking space, please take my disability" Common car park sign in France.

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The sim card doesn't show any phone number, managed to find a charger that fits and turn the phone on, it's none of the numbers EE provided.

 

EE are simply being obstructive - they've effectively refused to provide any documentation and have ignored any and all evidence that it might not be his account (including that it's set up from a different address), they simply keep repeating that until I tell them to cancel, they'll keep charging line rental though until I accept the account is Mum's partners, they won't accept a cancellation ....

RMW

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  • 2 months later...

So this went to the Ombudsman Service who supported EE in that doing a credit check when the account was opened means it must have been genuine, and telling me the phone is being used proves that it's Mum's partner using it and setting debt collectors on him when they know he's now in a Care Home and haven't even bothered to tell us how much is outstanding is perfectly reasonable.

 

It's the sort of logic I expect for a certain 'independent' appeals service for private parking charges, and so I'm giving the 'final' decision the same respect I'd accord the IAS.

RMW

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  • 1 month later...

To recap, EE know that their account holder lacks capacity and (presumably!) know there is an outstanding complaint with the Ombudsman Service.

 

They've instructed third party debt collectors to write to the account holder direct.

 

Whilst I'm sure it's simple incompetence, this is so wrong on so many grounds.

RMW

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is it possible to get from them the geographical data for the phone when it is in use? technically this is a piece of cake but is it data that the customer is entitled to ask for i wonder?

If it is the EE will have a lot of explaining to do and may well drop the matter pronto rather than explain why they are chasing this person when it is patenty obvious not his phone use etc.

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  • 2 weeks later...

You really couldn't make this up.

 

Complained to EE that they are writing direct when there's an outstanding Ombudsman complaint. They've said they can't comment as the complaint it with the Ombudsman ....

RMW

"If you want my parking space, please take my disability" Common car park sign in France.

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They won't deal with any additional issues now as they're simply reviewing their decision and dealing with my complaint about their service.

 

It's tempting to just withdraw the complaint and let EE get on with making fools of themselves, I have better things to do atm

RMW

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Another fairly distressed call from Mum this morning, two more letters from the debt collector still addressed to her partner still demanding payment but with no documentation etc. They'd have had my 'bog off' letter at least two weeks before these letters are dated and my Mum is now terrified a bailiff is going to come and take her car and no amount of reassurance that they can't and won't (it's motablity anyway) have made any difference.

 

I seem to remember from my early years on CAG that Christmas is prime time for hassling people like this. How do you add Twitter links part way through a thread? I think everyone should see what EE and Moorcroft are doing to vulnerable people.

RMW

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  • 3 months later...

Thread title updated.

 

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  • AndyOrch changed the title to Disputed EE account ***Resolved***
34 minutes ago, honeybee13 said:

Well done, RMW. :) How did you get them to back down?

 

HB

Basically by being stubborn and just refusing to pay without documentation.

RMW

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