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    • Well we can't predict what the judge will believe. PE will say that they responded in the deadline and you will say they don't. Nobody can tell what a random DJ will decide. However if you go for an OOC settlement you should still be able to get some money
    • What do you guys think the chances are for her?   She followed the law, they didnt, then they engage in deception, would the judge take kindly to being lied to by these clowns? If we have a case then we should proceed and not allow these blatant dishonest cheaters to succeed 
    • I have looked at the car park and it is quite clearly marked that it is  pay to park  and advising that there are cameras installed so kind of difficult to dispute that. On the other hand it doesn't appear to state at the entrance what the charge is for breaching their rules. However they do have a load of writing in the two notices under the entrance sign which it would help if you could photograph legible copies of them. Also legible photos of the signs inside the car park as well as legible photos of the payment signs. I say legible because the wording of their signs is very important as to whether they have formed a contract with motorists. For example the entrance sign itself doe not offer a contract because it states the T&Cs are inside the car park. But the the two signs below may change that situation which is why we would like to see them. I have looked at their Notice to Keeper which is pretty close to what it should say apart from one item. Under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4 Section 9 [2]a] the PCN should specify the period of parking. It doesn't. It does show the ANPR times but that includes driving from the entrance to the parking spot and then from the parking place to the exit. I know that this is a small car park but the Act is quite clear that the parking period must be specified. That failure means that the keeper is no longer responsible for the charge, only the driver is now liable to pay. Should this ever go to Court , Judges do not accept that the driver and the keeper are the same person so ECP will have their work cut out deciding who was driving. As long as they do not know, it will be difficult for them to win in Court which is one reason why we advise not to appeal since the appeal can lead to them finding out at times that the driver  and the keeper were the same person. You will get loads of threats from ECP and their sixth rate debt collectors and solicitors. They will also keep quoting ever higher amounts owed. Do not worry, the maximum. they can charge is the amount on the sign. Anything over that is unlawful. You can safely ignore the drivel from the Drips but come back to us should you receive a Letter of Claim. That will be the Snotty letter time.
    • please stop using @username - sends unnecessary alerts to people. everyone that's posted on your thread inc you gets an automatic email alert when someone else posts.  
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Re: How to defend against a liability order for council tax?


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I have a similar problem. In my case, the property is a self contained flat which I rented out to the same person for 3+ years. The tenancy agreement definitely stated that it is the tenant's responsibility to pay the council tax. Anyway, out of the blue a while ago, I received a bailiff letter claiming that I owed 3 years worth of council tax at the property and that they would be seeking a liability order against me. The arrears amount to around 5K. I rushed home and emailed the bailiff (Rundles) the 3x signed and witnessed tenancy agreements and informed them that the same tenant was still resident at the property. A week or so later, Rundles emailed me back stating that they would be taking their enquiries elsewhere and that I would receive no further letters or demands from them.

 

 

Another 2 months passed and I received a letter from the Council stating that they had got a liability order against me for the arrears. Thinking that this was all a terrible misunderstanding, I copy the Council my correspondence with Rundles and also provide them with emails I sent to all the utility companies when the tenant first moved in; a confirmation email from the Deposit Protection Service confirming receipt of the tenant's deposit; a copy of 2x third party credit reference reports that I performed on the tenant during his tenancy and a number of other documents to prove that the tenant was resident at the property and indeed still there. Imagine my horror when the Council wrote back to me stating that Rundles had no business telling me that I was not liable. As far as the Council were concerned (and despite all the evidence I'd sent them) they still deemed me as liable for the arrears.

 

 

Anyway a few months later I went to Valuation Tribunal to appeal the liability order. The Valuation Tribunal judged against me. The reason for this is that the Council lied through their teeth - claiming that I had never informed them of the start of the tenancy 3.5 years prior; that when I did inform them of the tenancy, I told them 'retrospectively' - another lie because the tenant was still there; that they could not find any trace of such a person existing - even though they had referred to the electoral register, Google and Facebook - more lies as the tenant has a prolific internet footprint and can be found with just a few clicks.

 

 

Roll forward to last week. I received a notification from the Council that unless I pay the full arrears and costs within the next 14 days, they will apply for an arrest warrant against me. I have taken legal advice throughout this whole nightmare and the consensus seems to be that my only recourse is to go to High Court to get the liability decision reviewed. The costs I have been quoted for doing this range from 10-12K. What is worse, I am told that even if I win, the High Court is unlikely to order the council to pay my costs. Is this true? If it is true, it seems that there is no justice in the world ....

 

 

You might be wondering how 3 years of arrears mounted up without me knowing? Well, that's because the Council 'forgot' that I had informed them about the tenant moving in so they did a land registry search to find the registered owner (ME) and then started billing me BUT at the wrong address. At the Valuation Tribunal hearing, the Council confessed to having billed me at the wrong address for 3 years and then when they were fed up of not getting any response they started (for the first time) to bill the tenanted property. I found the bill in the course of a routine inspection of the tenanted property...

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MP involvement for sure and independent legal advice.

We could do with some help from you.

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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Yes. M P involved and a complaint to the Local Government Ombudsman as a matter of urgency. You don't have to go the court route, given the cost issues. If you can get the LGO involved they may be able to get the council to put on hold any actions, until they have reviewed.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

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