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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
    • Well the difference is that in all our other cases It was Kev who was trying to entrap the motorist so sticking two fingers up to him and daring him to try court was from a position of strength. In your case, sorry, you made a mistake so you're not in the position of strength.  I've looked on Google Maps and the signs are few & far between as per Kev's MO, but there is an entrance sign saying "Pay & Display" (and you've admitted in writing that you knew you had to pay) and the signs by the payment machines do say "Sea View Car Park" (and you've admitted in writing you paid the wrong car park ... and maybe outed yourself as the driver). Something I missed in my previous post is that the LoC is only for one ticket, not two. Sorry, but it's impossible to definitively advise what to so. Personally I'd probably gamble on Kev being a serial bottler of court and reply with a snotty letter ridiculing the signage (given you mentioned the signage in your appeal) - but it is a gamble.  
    • No! What has happened is that your pix were up-to-date: 5 hours' maximum stay and £100 PCN. The lazy solicitors have sent ancient pictures: 4 hours' maximum stay and £60 PCN. Don't let on!  Let them be hoisted by their own lazy petard in the court hearing (if they don't bottle before).
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

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      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

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Advice against the police over false evidence!!


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In 2010, my local Council issued an ASBO against me because I had a dispute with a neighbour.

 

My barrister tried but in vain to raise in Court that the Council had failed to follow its own procedures when the asbo was applied for.

 

When Council's apply for an asbo they need to meet certain criteria which they failed to do so.

 

Before an asbo is issued, you are supposed to receive a verbal warning, then a written warning, then you are asked to sign behaviour contracts; I was never sent no warnings etc etc.

 

Does this make the asbo legal?

 

The asbo has since expired without me breaching it; need I say more!!

 

However the said neighbour prior to the asbo being issued, had been arrested for death threat which she denied of course, and before then I had also suffered threats of violence, and harassment.

 

I was repeatedly refused the right to make statements, and so was my partner.

 

I have also raised concern that some of the evidence used to obtain the asbo was not 100%; the complainant had lied on at least 4 statements, had lied during their section4a interview.

 

The police dont want to know.

 

I cost me £7000 to defend this joke of an asbo and I therefore want to seek if I can sue for damages.

 

Does anyone know of any good solicitor who can do this on a no win no fee basis.

 

Thanks!!

 

:mad2:

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Does anyone know of any good solicitor who can do this on a no win no fee basis.

 

i think that would be against CAG rules to promote a individual

you would do better doing a search of the local area or local directory

 

There may be better options available to you such as

 

Formal complaint to council then on to local government ombudsmen

As the ombudsman can award compensation

 

Good luck!

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If i have helped in any way hit my star.

any advice given is based on experience and learnt from this site :-)

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Hello there.

 

I'll move your thread from the Campaigns forum to the Local Authorities one, you may have some more comments.

 

Good call about not recommending lawyers, IHB :)

 

My best, HB

 

Edit: if the forum guys feel that this thread would be better moved to the legal forum at any point, please report it via the black triangle and let the site team know it needs moving.

Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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If you disagreed with the ASBO, I suspect you should have appealed the Court's decision at the time and tried to get it overturned.

 

If you have not done that, I doubt you would have much luck trying to pursue the matter 3 years later.

 

However I am no expert on this, and you may wish to consult a solicitor, but I seriously doubt it will get you anywhere.

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TBH after all this time I would say its a non starter, a local no win no fee solicitor would only take the case if he thought there was a fair chance of winning. If you felt that strongly you should have appealed at the time.

If I have been of any help, please click on my star and let me know, thank you.

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Firstly, ignore assisted blonde, I think they get a kick out of writing people have no chance on their posts. They may feel it is helpful, but lucky7even i guess that is for you to decide not me.

 

If the council or the police did not follow procedures then you may have a case. After all, what is the point in having procedures if those responsible for looking after us choose not to follow them?

 

as for looking for a solicitor, i would start with your local CAB. In my experience they are pretty useless even on simple breach of contract matters with retailers. Start by looking for a solicitor in your local area on this website. (can't post links yet) type 'lawsociety' and 'find a solicitor' into google. there is no hard an fast rule, you will just need to call them and explain your situation, they will tell you if you have a case and £7000 should be enough for no win no fee.

 

is there anything else you haven't told us? why did your legal fees come to £7000 and still procedure wasn't followed?

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I dont advise people that they dont have a chance just for kicks, an opinion was asked for and I gave mine. My concern is what it can cost people in time, effort and money, of course the OP can and will decide for themself but there is a tendancy for a lot of people to want to sue for damages far too often. Yes of course there is law to protect any miscarriage of justice but as the OPs initial barrister struggled to get the court to say the council did not follow its own procedures after all this time I still say its a bit of a non starter.

Consult a solicitor and listen to what they say but be prepared to be told its not a case that a no win no fee solicitor may take, a solicitor that you pay will do exactly what you want them to( although they may advise you not to persue the case) and charge you royally for the priviledge.

If I have been of any help, please click on my star and let me know, thank you.

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  • 4 months later...

In July 2010, I employed a solicitor (whom I knew quite well as I worked with her before), to defend me against an ASBO application by my local authority.

 

She failed to formally write to the local authority to object to the asbo.

 

She failed to put in a defence before the trial.

 

There was no meeeting with the barrister before the trial so that I was not able to raise what questions I wanted asked of the witneeses.

 

There was very little work done on the file to justify the horrendous £7000 I was charged.

 

Also they have lost some of the paperwork I submitted as a large number of BT telephone bills were missing, and photographs wer missing.

 

Does anyone think I have a claim for professional negligence??

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Difficult to say without more information to be honest. These things get much more difficult with time. Did you receive fee narratives showing what time was spent on your file, and why has it taken 3 years to get to this point?

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In July 2010, I employed a solicitor (whom I knew quite well as I worked with her before), to defend me against an ASBO application by my local authority.

 

She failed to formally write to the local authority to object to the asbo.

 

She failed to put in a defence before the trial.

 

There was no meeeting with the barrister before the trial so that I was not able to raise what questions I wanted asked of the witneeses.

 

There was very little work done on the file to justify the horrendous £7000 I was charged.

 

Also they have lost some of the paperwork I submitted as a large number of BT telephone bills were missing, and photographs wer missing.

 

Does anyone think I have a claim for professional negligence??

 

 

What was the nature of your retainer with them?

 

You need to provide a lot more information.

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how much did you pay them or were you on legal aid.

again why have you waited 3 years.

 

They were paid £7K, and did extremely little work for the money they charged.

 

I am not legally minded and only recently realised that they were professionally negligent.

 

They have sent a copy of my file to a solicitor who will be reviewing it tomorrw; on the likelyhood of things I do have a claim due to the above reasons.

 

Apparently for professional negligent claims it can be worth up to £15K, depending on how serious the negligence was; as they failed to put in a defense I guess its quite serious.

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They were paid £7K, and did extremely little work for the money they charged.

 

I am not legally minded and only recently realised that they were professionally negligent.

 

They have sent a copy of my file to a solicitor who will be reviewing it tomorrw; on the likelyhood of things I do have a claim due to the above reasons.

 

Apparently for professional negligent claims it can be worth up to £15K, depending on how serious the negligence was; as they failed to put in a defense I guess its quite serious.

 

 

 

Did you personally pay them £7k?

 

Did you have a Defence to the ASBO?

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Did you personally pay them £7k?

 

Did you have a Defence to the ASBO?

 

I certainly did indeed have a defence against the asbo.

 

I had a 320 page diary going back from 2004 until 2010 of the neighbours behaviour, she was arrested for death threats and lied in her interview which I can prove, I had 8 character references from different people to say I wasnt a problem, I had photographs, and bt itemised fone bills to disprove a large amount of evidence in the past 6 months they claimed I was shouting abuse.

 

The solicitor failed to put this evidnce in a defense bundle before court and I lost because the Council's solicitor said they did not put in a defense!!

 

They were paid £7K by a relative and I thought they were able to do the job correctly.

 

I am having a solicitor view the file of papers to see if I have a claim and will know by end of today.

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  • 1 month later...

In 2010, In instructed a firm of solicitors to help defend me against an ASBO order (long story).

 

I am not legally minded, but I feel this solicitor has ripped me off.

 

They charged me an excessive bill for a whopping £7000.

 

In my eyes, they did **** all for what they charged; they failed to put in a defense before the court, they did not officially object to the asbo in writing, and they certainly did not object that the evidence was over 2 years old.

 

I wrote a letter to the senior person at the firm 2 weeks ago asking how they can justify charging me £7000 for basically doing sod all to my case.

 

The council told me I lost because there was no defense!!

 

I have not heard anything back considering it was a 2 page letter outlining why I am unhappy with how they treated me and the extorninate fees they charged for doing nothing on my case.

 

I have complained to the legal ombudsman over this matter, yet I need to give them 8 weeks; I doubt I will hear anything anyway as she has ignored the letter to date.

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Hi there,

 

You may have read my thread, if you have you will realise that I can feel your pain regarding this. I am utterly astnonshied how at how greedy and manipulative many lawyers seem to be and cant for the life of me understand how they can charge such high fees.

 

I know its frustrating but you have to give the firm 8 weeks to respond to your complaint before the Ombudsman will look it. If you are lucky the firm may offer to refund some of it.

 

Hopefully you still have copies of any letters etc they sent you. did they give you estimates for pieces of work? Did they inform you if they were going to go over these? Did the invoices list the work done? Did they actually do the work they charged you for?

 

Regarding the defence Im not clear what you mean by them not providing a defence. Did they actually not submit a thing to court regarding your defence or was the defence they submitted just not accepted by the Court. Or was no substantial defence put forward because of the particular facts of your case. What was your understanding of the defence that they would put forward? Are there a legal precedents regarding how recent evidence has to be?

 

Edit. I've just noted that you have previously posted on this and that you were going to waiting to hear from a solicitor about this in June. What were you told.

 

When was the solicitor paid? The Ombudsman have time limits regarding complaints and may have to justify why its taken you so long to complain about the matter

Edited by Blinkin73
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Hi there,

 

You may have read my thread, if you have you will realise that I can feel your pain regarding this. I am utterly astnonshied how at how greedy and manipulative many lawyers seem to be and cant for the life of me understand how they can charge such high fees.

 

I know its frustrating but you have to give the firm 8 weeks to respond to your complaint before the Ombudsman will look it. If you are lucky the firm may offer to refund some of it.

 

Hopefully you still have copies of any letters etc they sent you. did they give you estimates for pieces of work? Did they inform you if they were going to go over these? Did the invoices list the work done? Did they actually do the work they charged you for?

 

Regarding the defence Im not clear what you mean by them not providing a defence. Did they actually not submit a thing to court regarding your defence or was the defence they submitted just not accepted by the Court. Or was no substantial defence put forward because of the particular facts of your case. What was your understanding of the defence that they would put forward? Are there a legal precedents regarding how recent evidence has to be?

 

Edit. I've just noted that you have previously posted on this and that you were going to waiting to hear from a solicitor about this in June. What were you told.

 

When was the solicitor paid? The Ombudsman have time limits regarding complaints and may have to justify why its taken you so long to complain about the matter

 

I thought I had paid the solicitor to do a job and they ultimately failed.

 

I have sent a lengthy letter of complaint 2 weeks ago to the firm, but as of yet they have ignored my letter.

 

There was no paper defense bundle put in place before the court; I had a 350 page diary of the neighbours behaviour, BT itemised fone bills which cleared me of key dates and times I was alleged to have shouted abuse, and photographic evidence.

 

The solicitor I employed did not submit all this evidence BEFORE going to court and have in fact lost some of the paperwork provided.

 

In my letter to the senior partner of the firm, I raised around 9 issues of contempt and I asked for a refund of the £7K that was paid.

 

There was an invoice, but there was no itemised invoice to show what was worked done. I know for a fact that little work was done on the file.

 

There was no justification of where £7K fees came from, only a invoice. I need to wait until mid September for a full and final response from the solicitors but I know the letter will be ignored.

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If you are worried about the letter being ignored, write another short letter to them asking them to confirm receipt of your original letter and when they expect to respond.

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