have missed court that I was summoned to

[misscoleman]

Hi,

 

 

In may 2013 I got on a bus where I swiped my oyster card but somehow lost it on the bus, when the inspector came over to me I went to retrieve the oyster card from my bag but couldn't find it.

 

I got off at the stop that I needed with the ticket inspector. I still couldn't find the oyster card in my bag and figured I must of dropped it on the floor. If the inspector wasn't so in my face and didn't distract me I may of found it on the floor/seat in time to show it to him before I got off.

 

Anyway, the inspector took my details, and because I didn't want to have to pay an extortionate fine I gave him my old address, which was a bit silly because obviously they have tracked me down.

 

So, thus far, letters have been sent to my old address including a summon to court. Obviously I didn't get these letters and now the fine has piled up to almost £500.

 

The court hearing was heard without me being present.

 

I have a few questions, I am grateful for any advice/help.

 

1. If I said that the person given the fine on the bus wasn't me, will they be able to prove otherwise?

 

2. I have actually been staying a few doors up from my old address, and was at the time of the fine, i.e. I was staying at number 1 and my old address was number 7. - My question here is as follows.. If I say to the court that actually when I wrote my details down I wrote number 1 which is where I was staying and that it is not my fault that they have seen this as number 7, which is my coincidently my old address, will they accept this? -bearing in mind I have no utility bills in the current address (number one)

 

Again, any help is appreciated.

 

Thanks for reading.

[dx100uk]

hi mc

welcome to cag.

 

sadly we are not here to assist people in the ways you require.

 

whatever you want to call it that would be wrong.

 

sorry

 

so how have they tracked you now, via bailiffs?

 

did you ever do anything about this

 

as surely they should be able to see on the swipe of your card on the system?

did you look online at the card useage?

 

dx

[misscoleman]

No I never had the oyster registered and I got off the bus at my stop as I was on my way to see a patient (I am a therapist) so was in a rush,

 

I just gave him my details and rushed off.

 

I didn't know about the court dates or even the first fine until the latest letter.

[misscoleman]

hi mc

welcome to cag.

 

sadly we are not here to assist people in the ways you require.

 

whatever you want to call it that would be wrong.

 

sorry

 

so how have they tracked you now, via bailiffs?

 

did you ever do anything about this

 

as surely they should be able to see on the swipe of your card on the system?

did you look online at the card useage?

 

dx

 

Also, can't members of the public assist me in which way they wish?

[marmaris30]

You have asked for advice and I don't see why you shouldn't get it. My advice is that you get in touch with the court immediately with a proposal as to how you intend to pay the fine and associated charges.

 

Nobody should expect to be treated kindly if they give false details in an effort to evade responsibility for something, and nobody here would ever advise dishonesty as a reasonable course of action. Had you given correct details, you would had an opportunity to put your case. At worst, you'd only have had to pay a small fine compared to the monkey you've racked up. Unfortunately you've learned this the hard way but nevertheless it's an education.

 

With respect to your two questions, neither idea is at all advisable:

1) If you claimed the person fined wasn't you and they could prove it was (e.g. CCTV) then you could find yourself on a charge of perjury.

2) This is called clutching at straws.

[misscoleman]

You have asked for advice and I don't see why you shouldn't get it. My advice is that you get in touch with the court immediately with a proposal as to how you intend to pay the fine and associated charges.

 

Nobody should expect to be treated kindly if they give false details in an effort to evade responsibility for something, and nobody here would ever advise dishonesty as a reasonable course of action. Had you given correct details, you would had an opportunity to put your case. At worst, you'd only have had to pay a small fine compared to the monkey you've racked up. Unfortunately you've learned this the hard way but nevertheless it's an education.

 

With respect to your two questions, neither idea is at all advisable:

1) If you claimed the person fined wasn't you and they could prove it was (e.g. CCTV) then you could find yourself on a charge of perjury.

2) This is called clutching at straws.

 

I came on here for advise not to be lectured,

I was in a panic as I was working voluntary and hadn't been able to find a job in my profession since leaving Uni, not that it's any of your business.

 

How much time do you have on your hands?

 

Since you just spent the majority of the time it took you to write that trying to make me feel bad about my situation.

 

Please don't act as if you would never lie about something if you didn't have the means to pay a fine,

 

I was honest when I asked this question so I don't need people like you judging, get off your high horse.

[renegadeimp]

If you lie to a court and you are found out. Then its perjury which has a very harsh penalty attached. This can mean a huge fine or even prison.

 

You are on the wrong site if you are considering lying to the court.

[dx100uk]

now now gentleman.

 

I think the op is well aware of the consequences

 

actually I think marmaris30 was sort of agreeing with you.

 

what you can actually do to minimise the damage done needs the transport experts.

 

so you've not got the card anymore?

 

dx

[marmaris30]

My apologies for any offence caused, albeit inadvertently, but my advice stands that honesty is the best way out of this situation, and I doubt anyone else will advise you differently. That is my final contribution to this thread.

[cazzajay]

I don't understand... you were unable to produce an Oyster card when asked, then gave a false address, didn't attend court and now you plan on committing perjury to get out of the verdict given in your absence?

 

My opinion not a wise course of action. Suggest you seek legal advice or pay the dues.

[sailor sam]

No I never had the oyster registered and I got off the bus at my stop as I was on my way to see a patient (I am a therapist) so was in a rush,

 

I just gave him my details and rushed off.

 

I didn't know about the court dates or even the first fine until the latest letter.

 

Can you expand on the high-lighted bit? So if your oyster wasn't 'registered', what happens when you swipe it? Does it 'pay' for the journey taken or not?

[BazzaS]

Can you expand on the high-lighted bit? So if your oyster wasn't 'registered', what happens when you swipe it? Does it 'pay' for the journey taken or not?

 

Sam, think of the Oyster card as a wallet.

Think of the registering of the card as putting your name and mobile number in the wallet.

 

Registered? It can be returned to you if lost and journeys looked up online. Unregistered : if lost, it is gone.

 

Looking at the other aspects on the thread :

Should the OP be allowed to seek advice? Of course!

Should the OP and others be surprised if advice that might be construed as conspiracy to pervert the course of justice is actively discouraged - No way.

 

I'm not going to take a moral judgement, since the OP has already said they aren't interested in that, but a practical one:

If appearing in court for fare evasion it may cause you some woes, but NOTHING compared to being caught for perjury / attempting to pervert the course of justice, while involving others in a conspiracy to pervert the course of justice (which is what your post could be interpreted as asking) : Could be long sentences, all round.

 

http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/s_to_u/sentencing_manual/perverting_the_course_of_justice/

Minor initial offence, but attempting to conceal evidence, and involving others increasing the scale of the offence.

Edited November 7, 2013 by BazzaS

[Old-CodJA]

Also, can't members of the public assist me in which way they wish?

 

Yes of course. All users of this and other forums are free to assist others in any way they wish, but I am sure you will understand it is not the purpose of this or any other forum to assist users in being deceitful

 

It appears that because you know about this the Court have already tracked you down through their enforcement processes, unless of course you have heard about it from another source and are still trying to hide from the consequences of your actions.

 

Adding further untruths is ultimately likely to result in a much more serious penalty and unless you are happy to stand in Court and be cross-examined very firmly by a prosecutor who is determined to unmask your evasiveness, please pay-up, learn from the experience and move on seems the general consensus of opinion.

 

The suggestion that you have been given to pay-up is the least painful option so far as I can see. Please take that as good advice from those who have tried to help you.

 

Like others on here I have nothing personal to gain from making that suggestion (or any other) and as you came asking, no-one was or is obliged to reply, but people do so freely and with honestly held intentions to help others.

 

In many other threads we sometimes see people react because they don't read what they were hoping to read, but it would be totally wrong for any of us to say, 'yes, get on with it, add a few more untruths, they'll never find out!'

 

By all means feel free to chastise me for my comments too, but this is meant to help you. If they have traced you once they will do again.

 

At the end of the day you are free to do as you choose.

Edited November 8, 2013 by Old-CodJA

[timbo58]

Catch 22 with using this forum part if you wish to have advice -it is (mostly) used regularly by those who have worked in RPI type enforcement or very similar hence & will give you proper advice based on their experience and knowledge.

 

Because of this it is likely you will not receive advice on loopholes or avoidance I am afraid, even if there were any for your situation.

 

If you visit other forums you may gain a more sympathetic ear but it is unlikely you will get proper advice based on such experience or knowledge.

 

It depends on whether you wish an accurate assessment of your situation or an anecdotal sympathetic based response?

The former gives you the chance to understand how serious or not the situation is, the latter will not help at all but might make you feel better temporarily.

[ashmk]

You could try to lie your way out of it and it might just work but if it does not they will come down on you like a ton of bricks.

 

Only you can decide how you want to tackle it.

 

If it were me I would contact the court and make an arrangement to pay. The total cost will only keep going up and one way or another, they will get that money from you.

[Consumer dude]

If the OP was on the bus then the odds are he had paid the fare. He was a bit silly though if he had given a wrong address..