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    • I understand confusion with this thread.  I tried to keep threads separate because there have been so many angles.    But a team member merged them all.  This is why it's hard to keep track. This forum exists to help little people fight injustice - however big or small.  Im here to try get a decent resolution. Not to give in to the ' big boys'. My "matter' became complicated 'matters' simply because a lender refused to sell a property. What can I say?  I'll try in a nutshell to give an overview: There's a long lease property. I originally bought it short lease with a s.146 on it from original freeholder.  I had no concerns. So lender should have been able to sell a well-maintained lovely long lease property.  The property was great. The issue is not the property.  Economy, sdlt increases, elections, brexit, covid, interest hikes etc didn't help.  The issue is simple - the lender wanted to keep it.    Before repo I offered to clear my loan.  I was a bit short and lender refused.  They said (recorded) they thought the property was worth much more and they were happy to keep accruing interest (in their benefit) until it reached a point where they felt they could repo and still easily quickly sell to get their £s back.  This was a mistake.  The market was (and is) tough.   2y later the lender ceo bid the same sum to buy the property for himself. He'd rejected higher offers in the intervening period whilst accruing interest. I had the property under offer to a fantastic niche buyer but lender rushed to repo and buyer got spooked and walked.  It had taken a long time to find such a lucrative buyer.  A sale which would have resulted in £s and another asset for me. Post repo lender had 1 offer immediately.  But dragged out the process for >1y - allegedly trying to get other offers. But disclosure shows there was only one valid buyer. Lender appointed receiver (after 4 months) - simply to try acquire the freehold.  He used his powers as receiver to use me, as leaseholder, to serve notice on freeholders.  Legally that failed. Meanwhile lender failed to secure property - and squatters got in (3 times).  And they failed to maintain it.  So freeholders served a dilapidations notice (external) - on me as leaseholder (cc-ed to lender).   (That's how it works legally) I don't own the freehold.  But I am a trustee and have to do right by the freeholders.  This is where matters got/ get complicated.  And probably lose most caggers.   Lawyers got involved for the freeholders to firstly void the receiver enfranchisement notice. Secondly, to serve the dilapidations notice.  The lack of maintenance was in breach of lease and had to be served to protect fh asset. The lender did no repairs. They said a buyer would undertake them. Which was probably correct. If they had sold. After 1y lender finally agreed to sell to the 1st offeror and contracts went with lawyers.  Within 1 month lender reneged.  Lender tried to suggest buyer walked. Evidence shows he/ his lawyers continued trying to exchange (cash) for 4 months.  Evidence shows lender and receiver strategy had been to renege and for ceo to take control.   I still think that's their plan. Lender then stupidly chose to pretty much bulldoze the property.  Other stuff was going on in the background. After repo I was in touch by phone and email and lender knew post got to me.   Despite this, after about 10 months (before and then during covid), they deliberately sent SDs and eventually a B petition to an incorrect address and an obscure small court.  They never served me properly.  (In hindsight I understand they hoped to get a backdoor B - so they could keep the property that way.)  Eventually the random court told them to email me by way of service.  At this point their ruse to make me B failed.  I got a lawyer (friend paid). The B petition was struck out. They’d failed to include the property as an asset. They were in breach of insolvency rules. Simultaneously the receiver again appointed lawyers to act on my behalf as leaseholder. This time to serve notice on the freeholders for a lease extension.  He had hoped to try and vary the strict lease. Evidence shows the already long length of lease wasn't an issue.  The lender obviously hoped to get round their lack of permission to do works (which they were already doing) by hoping to remove the strict clauses that prevent leaseholder doing alterations.   The extension created a new legal angle for me to deal with.  I had to act as trustee for freeholders against me as leaseholder/ the receiver.  Inconsistencies and incompetence by receiver lawyers dragged this out 3y.  It still isn't properly resolved.  Meanwhile - going back to the the works the lender undertook. The works were consciously in breach of lease.  The lender hadn't remedied the breaches listed in the dilapidations notice.  They destroyed the property.  The trustees compiled all evidence.  The freeholders lawyers then served a forfeiture notice. This notice started a different legal battle. I was acting for the freeholders against what the lender had done on my behalf as leaseholder.  This legal battle took 3y to resolve. The simple exit would have been for lender to sell. A simple agreement to remedy the breaches and recompense the freeholders in compensation - and there's have been clean title to sell.  That option was proposed to them.   This happened by way of mediation for all parties 2y ago.  A resolution option was put forward and in principle agreed.  But immediately after the lender lawyers failed to engage.  A hard lesson to learn - mediation cannot be referred to in court. It's considered w/o prejudice. The steps they took have made no difference to their ability to sell the property.  Almost 3y since they finished works they still haven't sold. ** ** I followed up some leads myself.  A qualified cash buyer offered me a substantial sum.  The lender and receiver both refused it.   I found another offer in disclosure.  6 months later someone had apparently offered a substantial sum via an agent.  The receiver again rejected it.  The problem of course was that the agent had inflated the market price to get the business. But no-one was or is ever going to offer their list price.  Yet the receiver wanted/wants to hold out for the list price.  Which means 1y later not only has it not sold - disclosure shows few viewings and zero interest.  It's transparently over-priced.  And tarnished. For those asking why I don't give up - I couldn't/ can't.  Firstly I have fiduciary duties as a trustee. Secondly, legal advice indicates I (as leaseholder) could succeed with a large compensation claim v the lender.  Also - I started a claim v my old lawyer and the firm immediately reimbursed some £s. That was encouraging.  And a sign to continue.  So I'm going for compensation.  I had finance in place (via friend) to do a deal and take the property back off the lender - and that lawyer messed up bad.   He should have done a deal.  Instead further years have been wasted.   Maybe I only get back my lost savings - but that will be a result.   If I can add some kind of complaint/ claim v the receiver's conscious impropriety I will do so.   I have been left with nothing - so fighting for something is worth it. The lender wants to talk re a form of settlement.  Similar to my proposal 2y ago.  I have a pretty clear idea of what that means to me.  This is exactly why I do not give up.  And why I continue to ask for snippets of advice/ pointers on cag.  
    • It was all my own work based on my previous emails to P2G which Bank has seen.
    • I was referring to #415 where you wrote "I was forced to try to sell - and couldn't." . And nearer the start in #79 .. "I couldn't sell.  I had an incredibly valuable asset. Huge equity.  But the interest accrued / the property market suffered and I couldn't find a buyer even at a level just to clear the debt." In #194 you said you'd tried to sell for four years.  The reason for these points is that a lot of the claims against for example your surveyor, solicitor, broker, the lender and now the receiver are mainly founded in a belief that they should have been able to do something but did not. Things that might seem self evident to you but not necessarily to others. Pressing these claims may well need a bit more hard evidence, rather than an appeal to common sense. Can you show evidence of similar properties, with similar freehold issues, selling readily? And solid reasons why the lender should have been able to sell when you couldn't.
    • You can use a family's address.   The only caveat is for the final hearing you'd need to be there in person   HOWEVER i'd expect them to pay if its only £200 because costs of attending will be higher than that
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Hi everyone I came accros this site yesterday and think a lot of good advice is given, so I wondered what peoples thoughts on my situation are. In May 2010 my wife and I signed onto a debt mangement plan with best solution, a month later my wife and I seperated and are now divorced.

 

My Debt totals 36K I currently live in rented accomadation and pay maintence for my son. my total debt originally comprised of 3 debt's with TSB, 1 Halifax and 1 with virgin. All but one of the debts(virgin) have been sold by the original companies to other debt collection agencies. My parents are wanting to help me and have manged to make approx 15k avaliable to me.

 

Due to me getting divorced and living in rented accomadtion my management plan was changed so I pay only a pound a month to each company, this has been happening for the last 18 months.

 

I was going to approach best solution and see if they could get full and final settlements with as many creditors as possible. This is were I would like people's thoughts I wouldn't say best solution have been bad, but I have had several telephone conversations with them were computers have been down, failed to respond to emails and replys to emails that have been headed up as another company no explination given when asked, and they charge a monthly fee of £65 plus an expensive set up fee in the first place.

 

They will also charge 25% of any savings made. Can I approach these companies direct in a letter seeing if they will accept a full and final payment and marking my credit file as complete. It seems that these companies purchase the debt for less than 20p in the pound so if I offer more will they accept. Best Solution will charge 25% of any savings I make for what??

 

Letters I can deal with myself. Would the company be more inclined to accept my offer direct and miss out the middle man? Would cutting the middleman out cause a problem? One of TSB debts has reccently been taken on by APEX and they have rang me every week for the last 4 weeks I have told them to contact best solution, best solution have said they will send them a letter saying all communcation should be with them.

 

Apex have also this week sent letters talking about house visits and solicitors, I believe these are scare tatics, should I wait until things have settled down for a period of time before approaching them??? I would like to use this money from my parents to it's very best use and get clousre on this chapter of my life asap. thanks for all your thoughts and ideas!!!!

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Id drop the fee paying dmp and set up your own personal or use step change

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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Id drop the fee paying dmp and set up your own personal or use step change

 

I agree entirely, you can make full and final settlement without involving a Debt Management Company, it is important to rememeber that DMP'S can be dropped at any time as any agreement with these companies is not binding in any way.

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You do need to distance yourself from the Fee paying DMP - if you need advice then you can contact either National Debtline or StepChange. They will offer you a range of options and probably help you with Full and Final Settlements if that is the way you are planning on going.

 

You do need to ensure that your offers are indeed accepted as Full and Final settlements and that the current owners of the Debts will NOT simply take your money and then sell on the balance. Be aware, this has happened.

 

Any contact with the creditors needs to be conducted in writing.

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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Full and Final settlements and that the current owners of the Debts will NOT simply take your money and then sell on the balance Thats the part I am also worried about how do I protect myself and ensure that when I hand my money accross they will process the paper work and honour their part in saying the matter is settled and finished??

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Step 1: Use this sample letter: http://www.nationaldebtline.co.uk/england_wales/factsheet.php?page=24_full_and_final_settlement_offers

Step 2: do not make a payment until they have replied in writing telling you that they will accept, and that they will not chase for the remainder or sell it on after you've made your payment

Step 3: make the payment

Step 4: keep that confirmation letter in a very safe place (this is your evidence that they've made a promise to you, and you have acted on their promise)

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if you are looking to F&F

 

ALWAYS go through each debt

and do the following:

 

CHeck the debt SHOWS on your CRA file.

CCA the owner of the debt, to ensure they hold the correct paperwork to even demand money from you

SAR the original creditor and check for PENALTY charges & PPI reclaiming.

 

always make it a condition that:

any F&F results in the debt being marked SETTLED , NOT partial settlement.

always ensure ALL neg data is removed as part of the F&F

 

if whom you are thinking of paying will not GUARANTEE those two things IN WRITING

before you settle,

 

you might as well BURN the money for all the good it will do.

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Just found out it will be a couple of months before the amount I was hoping would be avaliable will be,

 

at the moment it's a couple of K short. what can I do?

 

I was planning on writing to all my creditors in one go?

 

Should I still do this only offer less or write to a couple?

 

The example on the national debt shows an example of 40 in the £,

 

should I offer less to megotiate in case some people want more??

 

does negoation happen or isn't that something that really happens?

 

thanks for any thoughts

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Just found out it will be a couple of months before the ammount I was hoping would be avaliable will be, at the moment it's a couple of K short. what can I do? I was planning on writing to all my creditors in one go? Should I still do this only offer less or write to a couple? The example on the national debt shows an example of 40 in the £, should I offer less to megotiate in case some people want more?? does negoation happen or isn't that something that really happens? thanks for any thoughts

 

If you follow dx100uk's advice and check to ensure there are no default charges or PPI that you can claim - that the debt is NOT statute barred, that they are able to produce a compliant agreement - BEFORE you enter into negotiations with them then you might find yourself in a stronger bargaining position. Yes, you can offer less in order to give yourself some wiggle room if they dont accept your first offer.

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Uploading documents to CAG ** Instructions **

Looking for a draft letter? Use the CAG Library

Dealing with Customer Service Departments? - read the CAG Guide first

1: Making a PPI claim ? - Q & A's and spreadsheets for single premium policy - HERE

2: Take back control of your finances - Debt Diaries

3: Feel Bullied by Creditors or Debt Collectors? Read Here

4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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just applied for my CRA,

Apex are asking for a income and expenditure report. Should I do this, and does this have any bearing on writing a letter regarding a F & F?

 

Also I what rights do they have with this infomation?

 

I have filled these out to BS but I haven't done one in some time, and I am now wondering how offical is this what can they do with this.

 

How does it affect my current DMP?

 

thanks

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Sorry I don't understand the sentance?

 

He means if you gave the I&E to them, they couldnt try and get more out of you and would pretty much be obligated to accept the low amount.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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Sorry I don't understand the sentance?

 

That's becuase I am an idiot.

 

I was supposed to say that if the income & expenditure form shows you can only offer a little per month they may be more receptive to considering your full & final.

 

Sorry! My fault totally!

 

Seq.

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I thought that was the case just wanted to make sure. Do they have the power to check your bank account or other private details for the I&E or anything else, I didn't think about this at the time when I started and am now more aware of things. thanks

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Regarding bank statements, not even the police can see them unless you either hand them over willingly or sign a legal form authorising the bank to release the documents. Even the courts would need to make an order that demands the bank hands over the documents. Trust me, ive been there.

Any advice i give is my own and is based solely on personal experience. If in any doubt about a situation , please contact a certified legal representative or debt counsellor..

 

 

If my advice helps you, click the star icon at the bottom of my post and feel free to say thanks

:D

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I have sent off for my credit report file, and will work through that and fill out a Income and expenditure form,

shortly after that Write to my DCA's and see if they will accept a full and final.

 

But one thing I am a little confused on I started my DMP, back in May 2010.

 

Will the black marks on my credit file.

 

Is it 6 years from May 2010 or six years once everything is cleared up.

 

Also how badly will this affect trying to get a mortgage(hopefully) in the coming years?

 

thanks for all your thoughts.

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look at the debts

 

they will have a defaulted date

 

any account paid or not

will vanish from your cra file

on the defaulted dates' 6th birthday.

 

just remember if you are going to F&F

 

follow post 8

 

then ONLY pay it to the original creditor

if they show on the cra file as owning the debt.

 

if a dca owns the debt

 

then pay them.

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Looking around the web I notice that some people say start low with your full and final amount and work up.

 

The other thought is a calculation to spread your lump some accross the different debts?

 

If you are trying a full and final how do you tackle this??

 

If I say it's a one off offer how can I then go back and say oh I have an extra £200.

 

If I divide it up the same % to each debit some may want more others less.

 

How do you make the best use of the lump sum?

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i'd gather the info on all the debts first

 

keep the money as a war chest.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

Thats what I intend but when I approach them should I offer the same % of my war chest at the sametime or start low and offer incase I need more for another debt? but then how can I say this is a one off offer? I can't quite go back and say here is a little more but it's a one off offer????

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