Desperate For Help: Sigma Court Part Payment For Costs Claim Form Received

[calamoli]

:sad:Hello to all,

 

I am very badly in need of some good advice & help regarding a court claim form from "Sigma", in the sum of £364.99 & received last friday.This is supposedly for "part only of monies due" & is made up of fee's & costs.

 

I did post last friday on another very similar thread, but i'm gutted to have got no response. I'm desperate for help, so i've started my own in the hope that more members will see it. I'm going to cut & paste some of that post here, as I don't know how to provide a link for it - apologies for my lack of PC skills.

 

I will however, try to post a photobucket link here, which shows the claim form. This belongs to the member pabrmu & I hope he/she will forgive my using it & I only do so because it is identical to mine.

 

http://i343.photobucket.com/albums/o473/pabrmu/SigmaPOC.png

 

The account connected to this, was an HSBC credit card that my Hubby was given approx 25 years ago, by what was then Midland Bank. It has been in dispute since 2008, using your great letter templates, after a SAR gave us only a small amount of more recent statements & a CCA request yielded 2 photocopies of an ancient, damaged Midland Bank pamphlet & a modern HSBC CCA, with nothing pertaining to my Hubby whatsoever on any of the paperwork. What we were sent was way outside the time frame for compliance too.

 

Despite HSBC being well aware of our dispute, the matter yo yo'ed back & forth between them & various DCA's for a long time, before a lull & now this bombshell. I'm finding it very hard to cope with this, Hubby works abroad, I have major health problems & i'm home alone with 3 kids. Feeling hopeless & helpless & don't want to go any further down that road, cos it leads to a very dark place.

 

I'll be eternally grateful for some good advice, or for the best placed member/s being alerted to my plight. I'd also love to join forces with anyone who is in the same situation with this company.

 

Thank you very much for your time.

CM

[AndyOrch]

Hello Calamoli

 

I'm sorry you have not had a response but it is usually the case until you start your own thread.

 

Heres a thread identical to your predicament (Same Claimant/Part Monies ) http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?349072-HSBC-DCA-has-issued-summons-for-interest-on-default-notice

 

Regards

 

Andy

[knet2020]

Strange, I got the same (on the same day too). I have already started to look at the options and advice here, don't worry from what I have seen, there is a lot of help and support. It's suprising that they seem to have struck en-masse but I will try to help and offer guidance as I find it to.

 

I suggest the 1st thing we do is discover the 'legal' option they are taking, it seems very odd (I am not a lawyer and I know the law is scary but soe coon principles seem to apply).

 

From your post an my position the 1st thing we need to have clarified is why only claim 'part monies due'?

This seems to suggest they will either pursue further action (more court) or use court procedure to compel further information (I'll come back to that). So 1st off DONT worry, it's a process that you have to go through and will require you to complete various steps but it's not worth you getting into a 'dark place'

 

Step 1 is to look at the response pack ...normally these things go through Northampton which is an online system.. make sure to acknowledge the claim in the time frame ... this is the acknowledgement of service (I said I will defend claim in full and ask for 28 days)

 

Step 2 write to the claimaint (note this is likely the address for sending documents and payents and will be different) as you have been sent a CCA use the info in forum/showthread.php?159445 send via recorded delivery (cant post links yet)

 

Any probs post here I'll keep an eye here and post you as I get further with my own defence

 

 

[calamoli]

Hello,

 

apologies for my delay in posting - I had to drop everything & drive 300 miles to be with a friend who received some very bad news & only got back last night. Very bad timing with regard to this matter, as I now only have a couple of days left to do this 'acknowledgement of service' & have no clue what I'm doing.

 

Thank you Andy for the link you supplied, I'm going to start reading now & I really do appreciate it.

 

And to Knet2020, I was so happy to read your post. It will be awesome to be in contact with someone going through the same, though you obviously know much more than I do, so I doubt you'll feel the same about me! You are right, I shouldn't let it get to me but it's hard sometimes to keep positive when you feel scared and alone - so please don't give up on me.

 

Have you made any progress, since your post? I'm going to make a start on the thread link Andy supplied, as 1st I urgently need to get this acknowledgement off. Am I supposed to use the form to do this, or write a seperate letter? If so, is there a template for it? At least when that's done, i'll have a bit of breathing space to try & get my head round the rest.

 

I really hope you see this in time & I will be checking in regularly from now on, so please keep in touch.

[AndyOrch]

All can be done on line MCOL follow the instructions on the summons.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[calamoli]

Update:

 

Just wanted to let you know that after looking at the claim form in more detail (I hadn't when I posted earlier & was in a panic timewise) I have now answered my own question re the 'acknowledgement of service' & I have just submitted my intention to defend the whole claim online. This also means that it was done within the 14 day deadline. Phew!

 

Now I have a little time to start working on the defence & I could really use some good advice for that one. Obviously, this will have to be more specific & geared to individual circumstances. I'll keep studying.

 

Andy, I've now read through the link that you posted & have to say the defence letter that you supplied is mind blowingly awesome! Unfortunately though, our circumstances are not really the same, so I'm trying to figure out which ponts to use & how to word it so it sounds like I know what I'm talking about, as much as possible anyway. I'm presuming that the fact HSBC messed us about & were very late in 'supplying' the CCA & SAR, could be one point. Then, the fact that the credit card account was opened in the mid 80's & their response to our CCA request was a photocopy of an old Midland Bank leaflet, (which as well as no signiture, had no personal details on it at all, as it wasn't even a form). They also enclosed a more up to date blank 'sample' HSBC CCA, which of course came many, many years after the account. Their SAR respose was approx 2 years of the most recent statements & nothing else. Then there's the fact that although the account has been in dispute since 2008, it has been passed to & fro many different DCA's, all of which returned the account to HSBC each time we made them aware of the dispute. Until Sigma of course, who seem to have bulldozed in & are carrying on regardless of the law it seems.a

 

So I would really appreciate any feedback from you wise ones, on the use of these points raised, as we attempt to prepare our defence.

 

Thank you for your time It really is greatly appreciated.

CM.

[Shotters]

Calamoli...

 

Great to see someone with the same problem...

 

I have a claim agains me from Sigma for HSBC stuff and also for the same amount. So I would love to know how you got on?

 

Shotters

[sillygirl1]

Quite easy this one

 

Simple defence should sink them at the start

 

I xxx am a litigant in person and this claim, given the constraints of the bulk system, is frivlous and without merit.

 

It is claiming part monies and costs with no indication of the further monies and costs allegedly owed. No account details are given and no indication is given as to the actual status of the account, therefore it is a split claim and as such should be dismissed without allowing the claimant to amend or re-enter a further or future claim.

 

If you are short of time you could enter that, other people will be along soon and give more info, but remember this is a long weekend here and some people may be away.

[Shotters]

Awesome Silly Girl...

 

That is a great tip.

 

No worries about people being away I have moe then enough to get on with and people should be out enjoying the Jubilee - at least while the weather is good.

 

CPR 31.14 will go on Weds first thing and with today and tomorrow I have stacks of time to make sure I am all over it.

 

Fascinating to see so many people dealing with identical cases with the same Claimant....

 

Happy Jubilee!!!

 

Shotters

[sillygirl1]

My advice is not to leave it to the last day to enter your defence, it has been known for this to be ignored by Northampton... you really need to get the defence in a couple of days before the deadline to throw the other side into panic mode! Count the bank holidays just in case as the court system is in chaos over the 'number of days' issue, some don't count weekends, others do.

 

I suspect some bright young spark in the company is trying to make their mark, think they have 'discovered' a loophole but the loophole is clear, you CANNOT split claims.

 

For a fuller defence check on the Bryan Carter threads on this site, he pulls a similar trick and usually discontinues when made to work for his ill-gotten gains. He goes for costs then goes for the claim again which is not allowed by CPR rules.

[Shotters]

Silly girl that is awesome advice I will chase up Bryan Carter threads now...

 

I mostly replied to you on my own thread as I don't wish to hiack someone elses....

 

But great advice all the same!

[calamoli]

Hello again,

 

I am back to ask for your help & advice following recent events that have complicated my situation regarding this post & left me distraught & terrified.

 

I have been through some devastating personal issues recently & that's why I have not been here in a while. However, I did take your previous advice to ensure my defence was completed & posted in reasonable time. Due to events I faced at the time, I stupidly put the envelope into a post box that evening, rather than using Recorded Delivery the next morning. I recently returned & was horrified to discover that the court had no record of my defence & therefore had ruled against us.

 

I am sickened & devastated by my own stupidity, in ignoring one of the golden rules of CAG & I know that there was no way this would have been the outcome had the paperwork been submitted correctly. They, as well as HSBC have no paperwork at all regarding the account, which was opened with Midland Bank over 25 years ago, as stated in my original message. Additionally, the account has been in dispute since May 2009 & should never have been passed on to a third party, although HSBC have contstantly handed it out to one DCA after another, despite being fully aware of this.

 

.As this first claim was just for the DCA's 'costs' they are now obviously going to submit another one for the full amount & I have no idea what to do next. My distress over this, along with chronic health problems, mean that I am not coping at all well with the situation. I feel defeated & lost, to the point where I don't think I can face going on & that everyone would be better off if I ended it. I've let myself, my family & even you guys down by not doing things properly & I have no idea what to do to try & sort it out now. I'm also furious with myself.

 

Please: is there anyone that can help me rectify this huge blooper? I know I don't deserve it after being such an idiot, but I just wasn't thinking straight at a very bad time & I can only say how sorry I am. I have most certainly learnt a very big lesson from it, for what that's worth.

 

I'd be so grateful to hear from anyone who can advise me or may have been through/heard of a similar situation. Or if not, would anyone be kind enough to bring my plea to the attention of any member that you feel may be able to help me with this mess, as a matter of urgency.

 

I will be checking back frequently today, in the hope that someone will take pity on me. I honestly feel like i'm about to lose the plot completely, so this is my last hope.

 

Thank you very much for your time & I hope to hear from you soon.

 

Best wishes,

CM

[sillygirl1]

I am sorry to hear of your problems, what I would do is phone the court and explain what has happened, and state that you are a litigant in peson with no recourse to qualified legal help and want to put in an application for a set-aside so you can properly submit your defence.

 

You can also explain to the court that this company are abusing the court system by not sending out the correct paperwork to you at the start of the claim.

[calamoli]

Thank you very much for your response, I will certainly contact the court about the situation and set-aside. Obviously, as i have very little knowledge or experience of the matter, I can only plead with you wise and wonderful CAG members to advise me on the process, because without you i am lost.

 

In addition, could you please confirm if i would be correct in thinking that as HSBC (or Midland Bank as it was 25+ years ago, when the account was opened) could not provide a CCA at all (nor any paperwork with personal details, let alone a signature) and the fact that the account has been in dispute since 2009, they should not have passed it on to any third party? They have consistantly done so, despite my pointing this out on many occasions and I have been forced to write and argue the point with many other DCA'S prior to Sigma. They have just ignored me completely, wih it 'pinging' back and forth each time - and now this mess.

 

As Sigma have been using this strange ploy of submitting court papers for their 'costs' seperately, in the first instance and i assume now intend to do the same again for the larger balance, i am keen to put in writing, that the account is in dispute, HSBC know this and should not have passed the matter on etc. I have also read somewhere of others, in this situation (same DCA, Court and in receipt of initial 'costs' claim for the exact same amount) and i recall other experienced Caggers advising that Sigma should not be applying to a Court twice, for the same matter, i mean they are not supposed to split their payment demand up in this manner and should only be permitted to do this once, kind of like a 'double jeopardy' scenario i presume?

 

Would someone please be kind enough share their understanding of this point with me? I certainly don't want to make matters worse with incorrect comments, so this is very important. The worry that this mess is causing me is terrible - my husband is working ridiculously long hours, trying to hang on to his job and is also away lot. I am home alone with three children and serious health problems. I honestly don't think i can face another sleepless weekend with this hanging over my head, having panic attacks and palpitations, every time the doorbell rings, so i'd really like to get the letter off to them today. I know doing so would make me feel a lot more positive.

 

So given the above information, should the letter to Sigma be modified from the sandard 'account in dispute' style template that i've used previously? If you can spare a little time so that i can get this done, i'd be so grateful. I am honestly thankful every day that i found this wonderful site, you are all amazing, unselfish people and have helped restore some of my faith in human nature at a very dark, trying time.

 

I will keep this page open this afternoon, in the hope that some will be kind enough to respond. Thank you so much and very best wishes to all.

CM.

[AndyOrch]

Hi calamoli

 

Responding to your PM.

 

I cant really offer any further assistance Im afraid if you are not going to follow my guidlines (Post#2) from the outset.You didn't need to post a defence all can be done on line (Post#5) why did you post it?

They now have judgment and all you can try to do is set a side but you will need very exceptional circumstances for this to be successful, I don't think it got lost in the post will cut it to be honest and may be a waste of £80.Your option though and if you decide to try you need to download the N244 Application form.

 

I wish you well with your endeavours.

 

Regards

 

Andy

[martin g]

Hello.

 

Given that it is a split claim you have the option of paying the judgement sum and this will then stop them taking any further action against you. You are only allowed to bring a claim on the same facts once.

You have not, that I can see, given any numbers so it is hard to know if this is the right course of action for you. Bear in mind that if you pay the judgement sum within 28 days there will not be a record of a CCJ.

 

Martin g

[calamoli]

Hello and thank you for responding,

 

for what it's worth Andy, I did follow the link you kindly provided at #2 and it certainly helped me with my defence, so I am very sorry you feel that I didn't take your advice. I very much regret sending it by post and realise it was an incredibly stupid thing to do. At the time I felt it would be better to put it in writing but obviously that's come back to bite me very hard, which I know serves me right, but all I can do is try to make the best of it from this point forward. I assure you that I am very grateful for any help and advice that I get from CAG members.

 

martin g, regarding the split claim, the one in question now is the standard Sigma costs which everyone here seems to get first. I assume after this that they put in a second claim for the larger balance, which as HSBC added many charges to while ignoring our contact and requests (all done following CAG guidelines) now stands at several thousands. When you say that you are only allowed to bring a claim on the same facts once, do you mean that they should not now be able to submit a second one? If we pay the first one to get rid of the ccj, will we still be able to defend the inevitable second claim? I recall reading that they are not supposed to split it up and if that is true, why do they seem to do so with everyone?

 

I would really appreciate your input on this so I can work out what to do next. Thank you very much.

 

CM.

[calamoli]

Whoops, I also meant to ask, if I will be able to defend the second claim, could someone please point me in the direction of a suitable letter to send to Sigma regarding split claims and possibly the original dispute/ HSBC being unable to supply a CCA, something along those lines. Thank you very much.

 

CM.