CapOne Case - Ive Started... CLAIM FORM NOW ISSUED By Capone ** SUCCESSFUL OUTCOME **

[seriously fed up]

First thing to do is to calm down (easy for me to say? Yes! But it is the best advice).

Second thing is that when the papers arrive you will see you have some time to enter a defence - its not like you need to have it ready by Monday. In any event, if you did calm down I would bet you sketch it out now.

Thirdly, might the extra £500 be court costs etc? They will have to produce a breakdown - or if they dont make sure they are required to do so to prevent any tendence to think of a number and double it

To answer some of your questions in 149

 

• yes a counter claim can indeed be part of your defence, though it wouldnt be a reason for not paying
  
• you must mention the validity of the CCA - I think this is the main plank of your defence. Think about it, if this case does get to court - and dont assume it will since if you put in a strong enough defence they might well want to withdraw - then its possible the court will determine that the agreement cant be enforced (and remember the burden of proof is on them to show that it is enforceable at least on the balance of probabilities) BUT that your counter claim has merit, so this COULD end up with them having to pay you.
  
• I would deal with the unlawful charges as part of your defence of their claim - you are just stretching it all out otherwise.
  
• Wait for the papers to arrive to see exactly what their action is based on as only then can we be sure what we are trying to repel.
  
• make much of them signing your mum up for PPI in her situation - that is taking advantage and demonstrates the kind of people that she was dealing with
  
• Your point about the T&Cs not being the orginal ones made me smile because just this morning I got a letter from Crapquest alleging an account they bought from Crapone is enforceable on the basis of a reconstituted agreement. I referred to them Harrison v Link (and in particular the reference to "would have variety" in the final judgement) as well as Mitchell v Bank of Scotland. I also told them that they could forget about a sworn statement from some pimply youth who might well attest the proper procedures were in place etc but who couldnt possibly have been there. Again, the onus of proof is on them - they will need to be pushed on this, but essentially where you are trying to get them to is having to prove that there was an agreement compliant with the CCA s 61 1a. I would have a small wager with you there is no such thing.
  
• I wouldnt bother about sigs nonsense, unless you are going to be looking to get docs from them and if they play silly buggers then get the court to make an order.
  
• as for your final thought, what I would suggest we are going for here is to have the account declared unenforceable, but that your counterclaim is well made. The problem is that I reckon if it looks like going that way, they will try to withdraw.
  

Hope that helps.

[mrbrooks]

Hi Seriously fed up, thanks for the reply I very much appreciate it...

 

Calming down, haha, yeah just needed to let it sink in i spose, i knew it was inevitable in the end...going to court I mean...

 

I will post up as soon as I have the letter from the court, in the meantime I am just thinking about the best way to attack this whole thing...

 

My initial thought is just to state the CCA is invalid and that's why we haven't paid thus far, then argue that the outstanding balance is incorrect due to unlawful charges, and then say I am not prepared to pay until the PPI is resolved and hope one or two items stick...

 

Anyway, will post ASAP once the letter in question arrives...

 

mrbrooks

[seriously fed up]

Re this "My initial thought is just to state the CCA is invalid and that's why we haven't paid thus far, then argue that the outstanding balance is incorrect due to unlawful charges, and then say I am not prepared to pay until the PPI is resolved and hope one or two items stick..."

 

1. by all means - indeed you must - point to the invalidity of the agreement, but dont connect it to not paying. I dont think a court would (or could) approve. Remember that you are in a court of law and not a court of morals. The argument can always be made that the money was borrowed so should be paid back - that is a moral argument. Your argument is technical - the document they got you to sign is defective in certain ways and the court is simply not able to issue an enforcement order. Dont go anywhere near the moral route - and if that makes you feel uncomfortabl, ask yourself this question - if your bank (or any other financial instituation) could avoid paying you money due on a legal technicality, would they still pay? No, I dont think they would either. Just ask anyone who is trying to screw PPI out of them.
   
2. point to the fact that what they claim is owed is wrong as it all adds to the impression that their case is not well founded, carefully researched and basically just wrong. I'm not sure of the balance, but set what you do owe (dont just take their word for it) against the PPI and the illegal charges and see how it balances out. Fwiw, Crapone owe me more in illegal fees than I ever owed on the card. However, I am going to have to see how two cases go up here on the use of Prescription & Limitation Act (same as the Limitations Act) to see whether I can still make a claim. I suspect that if you can show that your claims re PPI and charges are well founded and that either, once these are taken into account you dont owe them that much or better still they owe you, they will withdraw their case. IF they do, then at that point you put into court your papers reclaiming what they owe you - but that is for later
   

When you are able, get the papers they serve on you up here and we can have a look at them.

One thing I should add, is that while I am happy to help you with the overall structure of your case, English process and procedure is something that I really know nothing about - never come up against it - so it would be better if you got someone else who has appropriate expertise, either as well as/ instead of.

[mrbrooks]

Hi Seriously fed up, thanks again for the reply, yes I agree re the moral angle, I will just try to keep it 'technical' after all this is what they use to deny us things like unlawful charges, deny responsibility for PPI etc...

 

Anyway, the papers have arrived this morning, I will scan them and post them ASAP.

 

RE: English process and procedure is something that I really know nothing about - never come up against it - so it would be better if you got someone else who has appropriate expertise, either as well as/ instead of. ... I would def appreciate some more input from folks if they have the time...this is the crunch and I really need to get this right and really need some sound voicing out here as I am of course a little worried about it but am also very much prepared to fight and take our chances in court...

 

back soon...

 

mrbrooks

[mrbrooks]

Hi all, just a quick post (yeah i know i post some epics), I have received the letters from the Northampton County Court Bulk Centre re our case...please see below...will post with some questions and thoughts a little later...In the meantime, if any one has anything to throw into the mix then please feel free...

 

Papers (front page): [ATTACH]39330[/ATTACH]

 

mrbrooks

[mrbrooks]

Hi all, I've read a few things here and there, seem to be getting a little confused, but I'm sure it will sink in. I have a couple of initial questions to get me started here before we get into the nitty gritty...please forgive me if some of this stuff sounds a little potty or simple but I just need to get some stuff clear in my mind...

 

First should I be putting this post in a different thread/forum? I don't want to be posting in here if this is not the most suitable place for where this case is headed?

 

Please see below for questions:

• The 'Day of service' is taken as 5 days after the issue date (8th November), I assume this means our date of service is the 13th November, which means we have until the 27th to respond in some form or another?
  
• Do I respond now/ASAP with the request for another 14 days to prepare our defence?
  
• Can we respond on-line? Can we file our defence/counter-claim on-line?
  
  I have just been on-line and created my Govt Gateway account and logged into MCOL, so this is a plus one, I realise now we can deal with this on-line for the most part...

[*]If we choose to make a counter-claim as part of our defence, I assume we will have to pay for this counter-claim?

[*]Will we have to go to Northampton in person to defend this? I assume so but just wanted to check.

 

That will do for now, I do of course have more questions, but im trying to keep it to small bytes...

 

mrbrooks

Edited November 14, 2012 by mrbrooks
New Info

[mrbrooks]

Hi Guys/Gals, any thoughts on the above??? Could really do with some input, please...

 

mrbrooks

[ken100464]

Mr Brooks

 

Have been following your thread and sorry its gone this way.

 

I would ask the site team to transfer you to the legal area you may get more attention there. Hit your report post button to get the site teams attention and get your thread moved.

 

Sorry I cant help with your questions as beyond me.

 

Good luck

[mrbrooks]

Hi Ken, thanks for the post, to be perfectly honest, the input has been dwindling for a few weeks now, but I was afraid it was just me being a bit paranoid or something, and I did not want to rock the boat because I know many people here give their advice and time for free and out of the goodness of their hearts, but saying all that, I have to be honest here when I say, I'm feeling just a little abandoned and getting more confused and less confident with all that I have read.

 

I have posted many questions in the last 8 weeks or so that seemed important to me at the time but many have pretty much gone unanswered, why I do not know, I accept there are many reasons of course and it could simply be a technical glitch (i did notice a few weeks back that there a few little technical issues and just figured it would all pick back up but it seems to just have gotten worse with regards to responses, Seriously fed up being the shining light of the last couple of weeks).

 

I will try your suggestion in the hope I can attract some input, I have already used 3 days since my Day of service now and have made no progress in what direction to move...I do not blame any one for this of course but am slowly getting more worried about what I have done, what I should do and how to best deal with it all...

 

mrbrooks

[citizenB]

Responding to S.O.S.

 

Ok.. first of all, I have relocated you into the "legal issues" forum as you have now received a claim form.

 

There is a timeline .. 33 days from the date of issue is when you need to have submitted your defence by.. but you need to acknowledge service of the claim form as follows :

 

Issue date - 8th November + 5 days for service = 13th November + 14 days to acknowledge service = 27 November ( you can do this online) + a further 14 days to submit a defence if you are intending to enter a defence.

Which means your defence should be submitted by 11th December.

 

You need to obtain as much information as you can, using the CPR rules.

 

Do you have the following:

 

Default Notice

Notice of Assignment if this debt is no longer with Capone

Termination Notice

Letter before Action

 

On what basis are you intending to defend ?

 

Did they fully comply with your s78 request - CCA

Did they provide you with a copy of the agreement or reconstruction.

Statement of account

Terms and conditions from inception AND current.

 

I have only skimmed your thread for the moment, but did I see that there is an unresolved issue with a PPI claim ?

 

I will have a full and proper read in a while and offer some thoughts.. but I will also send out some S.O.S for you.

[ken100464]

Well there you go moved.

 

My next suggestion would be to make a brief post of where you are up to to save people having to read the entire thread.

[citizenB]

In answer to a question raised earlier.. yes - if you enter a counter claim then you will be required to pay for that part. Although if you are on certain benefits, I believe that you might be exempt.

[mrbrooks]

WOW, I am suddenly feel a WHOLE lot better and happier...

 

Ken thank you so much for posting your note, if not for you I would have still been waiting...

 

citizenB, thank you so very much for your response, I will get the answers for you ASAP, I have to go out to work tonight so it may be tomorrow, but I may be up to posting when I finish later...

 

Again thanks to ALL the caggers who have supported me and followed me this far...I spose I was feeling a little negative...

 

Thanks

 

mrbrooks

 

--EDIT--

 

As per Kens advice, I will make a brief post later to highlight where the case is at, saving folks the need of having to read through 8 pages worth of posts...

Edited November 16, 2012 by mrbrooks
Additional Info

[citizenB]

WOW, I am suddenly feel a WHOLE lot better and happier...

 

Ken thank you so much for posting your note, if not for you I would have still been waiting...

 

citizenB, thank you so very much for your response, I will get the answers for you ASAP, I have to go out to work tonight so it may be tomorrow, but I may be up to posting when I finish later...

 

Again thanks to ALL the caggers who have supported me and followed me this far...I spose I was feeling a little negative...

 

Thanks

 

mrbrooks

 

Your fan club will automatically find you as they will continue to receive updates and I have left a redirect.. so you dont need to do anything in regards to your new home.

 

Yes, please if you could do a brief summary as to how you got to this point, that would enable those looking in for the first time (in response to S.O.S) will be able to get up to speed quickly.

 

I think you are more likely to get a few responses later this evening or over the weekend.

 

[Mike_hawk]

mrbrooks

 

Timeline is correct per Cb's earlier post, if you haven't already done so I'd suggest acknowledging service now...... no point in delaying.

 

Certainly use CPR parts 18 & 31 to request documentation and information at the crux of its case, although I would think it would be sensible to call the F.O.S on Monday and advise them of the current action. It should prompt a fast tracking of your PPI complaint currently being dealt with.

 

Once you have an indication from the f.o.s of likely timing to complete its investigation you can make a decision on the best way forward. Whether that be agreeing the f.o.s decision [assuming there is one in good time] or counter claim or an offer by way of Tomlin for it to settle are options to consider.

 

For the short term you could insist on an agreed extension of 28 days for filing defence, I believe the template part 31 letters on here include same request. I think I'd be particularly insistent on this point as it would provide a filing date of 8th January 2013..... should be ample time for the fos to act.

Edited November 16, 2012 by Mike_hawk

[mrbrooks]

Hi all, sorry for not getting back to this yesterday, here is a brief run-down of the events so far. There a fair few so please accept my apologies for the looong list...

 

 

 

Main Points:

• Nov/Dec 1999: My mom signed up for a CapOne card, via mailshot letter, she was at the time in hospital and being diagnosed with breast cancer, she signed up for PPI (though she clearly did not really understand what this was at the time and why it was important to know)
  
• Late 2010: Requested PPI stopped, as payments were getting silly and they had hiked the interest rates
  
• 2011: Another interest rate hike (cant remember the exact % or timing of the top of my head)
  
• Sept 2011: We called and informed CapOne we could not pay the full amount, they sent out a self help pack, it did not arrive, we paid £50 as we stated we would
  
• Oct: 2011: We called informed CapOne the self help pack had not arrived, so they sent another one out and agreed to stop calling for another 1-2 weeks, paid another £50
  
• Nov 2011: They cut off on-line access to account, made no payments from this point forward, I wrote to CapOne re the lack of ability to secure message them or see the account or any statements
  
• Nov 2011: Joined CAG, advised to make SAR, which arrived in late Dec 2011
  
• Nov 2011-Jan/Feb 2012: Received in the region of 100+ calls, wrote to them using the telephone harrasment letter, they responded with a letter saying she had given her permission so they would continue, I reported them to the ICO who agreed we had no ground to retract her permission! But they did not call after this
  
• Feb 2012: CapOne defaulted her for £5070.19
  
• Feb 2012: First letter from CapQuest, wrote back informing them we will not deal with them, we are dealing with CapOne directly
  
• Mar/Apr 2012: Wrote to them again, requesting access to statements, they responded with 'I have no permission/authority to deal with the matter on behalf of' my mom, I responded with a copy of documents from the SAR showing clearly in 3 separate places my name, and my agreed authority.
  
• Mar 2012: Just waiting for more nonsense to arrive
  
• Apr 2012: First letter from Freddy Int demanding payment, responded with a letter asking them not to contact us as they have no authority in the matter and we are dealing with CapOne direct, they responded with a letter agreeing that the account was not 'assigned' and they agreed to remove her telephone contact details from their database
  
• Apr 2012: Reported/Complained to the FOS re the unfair treatment in relation to cutting off the online access some 3 months before being defaulted and the lack of forthcoming statements in lieu of her not being able to access them on-line. The FOS agreed with us after the girl looking into our complaint realised CapOne was actually trying to pull the wool over her eyes and almost succeed, the Statements up to May 2012 arrived a couple of weeks later.
  
• May 2012: Another letter from Freddy Int
  
• Jun 2012:Another letter from Freddy, ignored it
  
• May/Jun 2012: Made a request for refund of PPI, using the FOSrunningPPI sheet to calculate the amount (came to around £12K)
  
• Jul 2012: Made a request for refund of unlawful charges, using the CIS sheet to calulate the amount, around £700, CapOne responded with the standard 'our charges are fair and legal'
  
• Letter from Bryan Carter, threatening court action, I responded with 'in regards to your scaremongering of taking us to court, as far as I am aware we have no obligation to discuss the matter with you in any form'
  
• Jul 2012: £100 awarded to my mom by the FOS for the unfair treatment by CapOne re the on-line statements thing. They attempted to use it as a set off, but I told adjudicator we agreed to no such thing, she did not like this either, so she contacted them and a cheque arrived a week later
  
• Aug 2012: Passed the PPI request ot the FOS for Adjudication
  
• Sep 2012: Received 'Final Response' from CapOne (some 13 weeks after my initial request) regarding PPI, claiming they had no responsibility to 'check' the insurance was suitable stating 'there was no requirement to complete a demands and needs
  statement.' and she could always contact AXA to see if they would backdate any payments she felt entitled to
  
• Oct 2012: Letter from Bryan Carter demanding payment within 7 days, letter arrived 3 days before the 7 days was due to expire, the letter is here > [ATTACH]39395[/ATTACH]
• Nov 2012: Another letter from Bryan Carter, stating they are now going to issue proceedings > [ATTACH]39396[/ATTACH]
• Nov 2012: Claim Now Issued, arrived 12th Nov 2012, here it is > [ATTACH]39399[/ATTACH]

Ok so there it is in brief, there have been other issues such as CapOne now claiming the signature they have is not 'valid' so they have refused to answer any more questions on this basis. We have had numerous issues with my writing letters on her behalf, and I have pulled them up on it on a number of times, the last time I requested compensation for the unnecessary effort and they issued her a £50.00 cheque.

 

We have not paid anything since Nov/Dec 2011, partly because blank refused to even acknowledge we made an valid offer and partly cos I think they are @ssholes (I know this does not remove the fact we technically owe them something) and also because I decided we shouldn't pay until the unlawful charges have been resolved and also the PPI, I know they are separate issues technically, but the fact is until it is all settled no one is able to say categorically who owes who how much.

 

I fully expected them to issue proceedings so have been waiting until it happened, I had posted a few thoughts and question throughout the thread but I reckon now its prolly best we take it from here and any questions any one has, I will answer straight from here rather than forcing folks to look back (unless they want to), If any one want to see any letters/docs then please let me know and I will post them up...

 

I have signed up for MCOL and will do the acknowledgement today.

 

Ok thats it for now, I got to go do some work, will check in later/tomorrow...

 

Thanks again to everyone, and Im ready and willing to get this case defended with the help of all the CAG folks...

 

mrbrooks

Edited November 17, 2012 by mrbrooks

[dx100uk]

i've taken the ccj down as the barcode is showing

 

IMHO the ppi and the penalty charges spreadsheets/reclaim far exceed the claim

 

if it were me i'd be firing those off to carter saying: wanna continue?

 

 

dx

[Mike_hawk]

mrbrooks

 

I note the 'final response' from Cap1 stated that PPI was removed in November 2004, which is correct ...... that or your post above re: 2010?

 

Something else to consider which may put it on the backfoot, it invited you to pass to the F.O.S for mediation, it's not unlawful but it is bad form to file a claim during agreed mediation.... the other side may even find itself estopped from any activity until the complaint is resolved.

 

I still believe that the most suitable short term action on your part would be to contact the ombudsman and ask it to progress its enquiries as a matter of urgency.

 

Merger doctrine would seem a viable reason for complaint to BC to pass to Cap1, reference to Andrews v SBJ may make it baulk at the prospect of continuing the case

 

http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Ch/2010/2875.html

[mrbrooks]

Hi Mike, the PPI was cancelled in 2010, the 2004 date is incorrect, I have statements showing the payments being applied to the account. How they made this mistake is beyond me, but this is just another 'little' issue I have had with them, amongst, spelling both mine and my moms name wrong, other letters refering to me as her husband, claiming they do not about my given authority, taking weeks to respond to a request and when the response appears it says, yet again, authority or we dont like the signature, lying to the FOS, she even stayed with my brother for a month or two, and whilst she was there, she must have bought something or done something with her bank or card and somehow, they got his number (which is XD) and called her up...

 

They have been nothing short of awkward...

 

DX100 I have replaced the CCJ with one where the bar-code redacted

 

mrbrooks

 

-EDIT-

Anyway folks I gotta go do some work now, so will pop back later to respond to any questions...thanks

Edited November 17, 2012 by mrbrooks
MORE

[Mike_hawk]

It's usual for financial institutions to mislead and dare I say lie through their backteeth, been there many times myself........ the odd thing is as soon as its counsel is sat in front of a judge it suddenly wants to come clean

 

Get the part 31 request in the post to BC..... insist on the 28 day extension, if it fails to respond bug the s**t out of it until it does. If/ When you have its written agreement you'll need to file a copy with the court.

 

Chase the Ombudsman

 

And finally draft a letter to BC inviting its client to withdraw the case..... if you need a hand with something suitable I'll try to draft something for you.

[mrbrooks]

Hi everyone, Ive got today, no work till tomorra , to get something started. so have a couple of Qs.

 

Mike, thanks for the posts, I have downloaded the case files you posted, had a read, I'm assuming the gist of the case/post is (in layman's terms) that while the FOS are still adjudicating the case for us re PPI, and CapOne are fully aware of this fact, they (CapOne) may run the risk of being slapped on the wrist by the court because they are actively attempting to circumvent the FOS whilst they are making their investigations and judgements about the case...And the FOS are considered to be an authority by the court... (Please correct me where I have missed the point)...

 

So my question regard the Merger Doctrine and the case in question, is, how do I use this to attempt to persuade BC/CapOne to desist? Who would I write to? What would I say? etc...

 

Next, Part 31??? What is it? What do I say? Do? (Again apologies for my ignorance here)...Re - draft of letter to withdraw, YES please, any draft letters would be a huge help and something of immense value to both myself and other CAG members who find themselves in a similar position as myself and my mom.

 

Regards AOS, should I do this now using MCOL? Or Do I wait to see if I get any responses from BC/CapOne to my letters re part 31 and the merger doctrine thing?

 

I have more questions but I reckon this will do for this post...

 

mrbrooks

[Mike_hawk]

Hi everyone, Ive got today, no work till tomorra , to get something started. so have a couple of Qs.

 

Mike, thanks for the posts, I have downloaded the case files you posted, had a read, I'm assuming the gist of the case/post is (in layman's terms) that while the FOS are still adjudicating the case for us re PPI, and CapOne are fully aware of this fact, they (CapOne) may run the risk of being slapped on the wrist by the court because they are actively attempting to circumvent the FOS whilst they are making their investigations and judgements about the case...And the FOS are considered to be an authority by the court... (Please correct me where I have missed the point)...

 

Its correct to a point, in effect the court can't/won't interfere with an F.O.S decision, yours hasn't been decided yet but its a very persuasive argument if the parties have already agreed the competency of the f.o.s in the matter.

 

So my question regard the Merger Doctrine and the case in question, is, how do I use this to attempt to persuade BC/CapOne to desist? Who would I write to? What would I say? etc...

 

Give me 10 mins and I'll have a think

 

Next, Part 31??? What is it? What do I say? Do? (Again apologies for my ignorance here)...Re - draft of letter to withdraw, YES please, any draft letters would be a huge help and something of immense value to both myself and other CAG members who find themselves in a similar position as myself and my mom.

 

Part 31 thread is here..... http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?159445-Getting-Them-To-Reveal-Their-Vitals.-Using-CPR-31.14-to-Your-Advantage

You can request copies of any documentation referred to in the particulars of claim. I thought there was a part 15 extension request tagged to the bottom of the template but can't see it, assume it was a later addition...... I'll post an additional paragraph for you later today

 

Regards AOS, should I do this now using MCOL? Or Do I wait to see if I get any responses from BC/CapOne to my letters re part 31 and the merger doctrine thing?

 

If your intention is to defend then you may as well acknowledge now, MCOL is fine for AOS and defence [assuming you can limit it to 8050 characters]

 

I have more questions but I reckon this will do for this post...

 

mrbrooks

 

Back soon, my turn to cook the roast and I forgot the gravy so got to nip out for half hour

[mrbrooks]

Hi citizenB, a few answers in rsponse to your Qs from post 160...

 

Do you have the following:

 

Default Notice - Yes, Somewhere, I will try to find it today and post it up ASAP

Notice of Assignment if this debt is no longer with Capone - Debt is still held by CapOne

Termination Notice - Again, I probably have this somewhere, I will have a dig about today to try to find it and post it up

letter before action - As Above, I think the LBA is the one from BC, I will look through paperwork, again I can post it up if you need a look

 

On what basis are you intending to defend ? - Well Im not entirely sure, I figure the unlawful charges is fairly strong, the PPI claim is a large amount but am not sure how strong the case is, and I did wonder if the CCA was enforceable as they clearly sent a reconstituted version. I am sure there are other things I can argue but have no knowledge of such things so am hoping some of the more experienced CAG members have something to throw in, as Mike_hawk as suggested already (and I intend to use if possible)

 

Did they fully comply with your s78 request - CCA - I assume so, I have a copy of the recon agreement from both a CCA request and SAR from NOV/DEC 2011,. I can post up their response letters if you need a look

 

Statement of account - I have statements upto May 2012, and what is showing on the claim form from BC and the court

 

Terms and conditions from inception AND current. - NO, the TnCs they provided appear not be from 1999 but are more current, I have no way to confirm this though, but Im sure they dont say 1999 on them, I will check, again I can post these if you or any other member require them for perusal.

 

Hope that helps, let me know if you (or any other members) require more info, im about most of the day today so can hopefully get some speedy responses in you need them...

 

mrbrooks

[mrbrooks]

OK, Im at MCOL about to start AOS, do I put my moms details in, as she is the defendant? Is there a place I can indicate that I want the correspondence to come to me or at least show I am involved??? Just want to check before I go filling it out...and make a mistake...

 

mrbrooks

[Mike_hawk]

Don't believe there is a field on MCOL to change service address post registration, enter your mums details for now if you need to amend later you can always draft something to the other side and copy to the court.

 

Don't very often use it but would imagine it would require manual intervention from the helpdesk to amend now.

 

I assume if it does progress to trial you'll want to assist as a Mackenzie friend so you could leave the change until a later date when the case is transferred.