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    • further polished WS using above suggestions and also included couple of more modifications highlighted in orange are those ok to include?   Background   1.1  The Defendant received the Parking Charge Notice (PCN) on the 06th of January 2020 following the vehicle being parked at Arla Old Dairy, South Ruislip on the 05th of December 2019.   Unfair PCN   2.1  On 19th December 2023 the Defendant sent the Claimant's solicitors a CPR request.  As shown in Exhibit 1 (pages 7-13) sent by the solicitors the signage displayed in their evidence clearly shows a £60.00 parking charge notice (which will be reduced to £30 if paid within 14 days of issue).  2.2  Yet the PCN sent by the Claimant is for a £100.00 parking charge notice (reduced to £60 if paid within 30 days of issue).   2.3        The Claimant relies on signage to create a contract.  It is unlawful for the Claimant to write that the charge is £60 on their signs and then send demands for £100.    2.4        The unlawful £100 charge is also the basis for the Claimant's Particulars of Claim.  No Locus Standi  3.1  I do not believe a contract with the landowner, that is provided following the defendant’s CPR request, gives MET Parking Services a right to bring claims in their own name. Definition of “Relevant contract” from the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4,  2 [1] means a contract Including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the relevant land between the driver and a person who is-   (a) the owner or occupier of the land; or   (b) Authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on the land. According to https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44   For a contract to be valid, it requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses must confirm those signatures.   3.2  The Defendant requested to see such a contract in the CPR request.  The fact that no contract has been produced with the witness signatures present means the contract has not been validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between MET Parking Services and the motorist. Even if “Parking in Electric Bay” could form a contract (which it cannot), it is immaterial. There is no valid contract.  Illegal Conduct – No Contract Formed   4.1 At the time of writing, the Claimant has failed to provide the following, in response to the CPR request from myself.   4.2        The legal contract between the Claimant and the landowner (which in this case is Standard Life Investments UK) to provide evidence that there is an agreement in place with landowner with the necessary authority to issue parking charge notices and to pursue payment by means of litigation.   4.3 Proof of planning permission granted for signage etc under the Town and country Planning Act 1990. Lack of planning permission is a criminal offence under this Act and no contract can be formed where criminality is involved.   4.4        I also do not believe the claimant possesses these documents.   No Keeper Liability   5.1        The defendant was not the driver at the time and date mentioned in the PCN and the claimant has not established keeper liability under schedule 4 of the PoFA 2012. In this matter, the defendant puts it to the claimant to produce strict proof as to who was driving at the time.   5.2 The claimant in their Notice To Keeper also failed to comply with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 section 9[2][f] while mentioning “the right to recover from the keeper so much of that parking charge as remains unpaid” where they did not include statement “(if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met)”.     5.3         The claimant did not mention parking period, times on the photographs are separate from the PCN and in any case are that arrival and departure times not the parking period since their times include driving to and from the parking space as a minimum and can include extra time to allow pedestrians and other vehicles to pass in front.    Protection of Freedoms Act 2012   The notice must -   (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;  22. In the persuasive judgement K4GF167G - Premier Park Ltd v Mr Mathur - Horsham County Court – 5 January 2024 it was on this very point that the judge dismissed this claim.  5.4  A the PCN does not comply with the Act the Defendant as keeper is not liable.  No Breach of Contract   6.1       No breach of contract occurred because the PCN and contract provided as part of the defendant’s CPR request shows different post code, PCN shows HA4 0EY while contract shows HA4 0FY. According to PCN defendant parked on HA4 0EY which does not appear to be subject to the postcode covered by the contract.  6.2         The entrance sign does not mention anything about there being other terms inside the car park so does not offer a contract which makes it only an offer to treat,  Interest  7.1  It is unreasonable for the Claimant to delay litigation for  Double Recovery   7.2  The claim is littered with made-up charges.  7.3  As noted above, the Claimant's signs state a £60 charge yet their PCN is for £100.  7.4  As well as the £100 parking charge, the Claimant seeks recovery of an additional £70.  This is simply a poor attempt to circumvent the legal costs cap at small claims.  7.5 Since 2019, many County Courts have considered claims in excess of £100 to be an abuse of process leading to them being struck out ab initio. An example, in the Caernarfon Court in VCS v Davies, case No. FTQZ4W28 on 4th September 2019, District Judge Jones-Evans stated “Upon it being recorded that District Judge Jones- Evans has over a very significant period of time warned advocates (...) in many cases of this nature before this court that their claim for £60 is unenforceable in law and is an abuse of process and is nothing more than a poor attempt to go behind the decision of the Supreme Court v Beavis which inter alia decided that a figure of £160 as a global sum claimed in this case would be a penalty and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss and therefore unenforceable in law and if the practice continued, he would treat all cases as a claim for £160 and therefore a penalty and unenforceable in law it is hereby declared (…) the claim is struck out and declared to be wholly without merit and an abuse of process.”  7.6 In Claim Nos. F0DP806M and F0DP201T, District Judge Taylor echoed earlier General Judgment or Orders of District Judge Grand, stating ''It is ordered that the claim is struck out as an abuse of process. The claim contains a substantial charge additional to the parking charge which it is alleged the Defendant contracted to pay. This additional charge is not recoverabl15e under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 nor with reference to the judgment in Parking Eye v Beavis. It is an abuse of process from the Claimant to issue a knowingly inflated claim for an additional sum which it is not entitled to recover. This order has been made by the court of its own initiative without a hearing pursuant to CPR Rule 3.3(4)) of the Civil Procedure Rules 1998...''  7.7 In the persuasive case of G4QZ465V - Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson – Bradford County Court -2 July 2020 (Exhibit 4) the judge had decided that Excel had won. However, due to Excel adding on the £60 the Judge dismissed the case.  7.8        The addition of costs not previously specified on signage are also in breach of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, Schedule 2, specifically paras 6, 10 and 14.   7.9        It is the Defendant’s position that the Claimant in this case has knowingly submitted inflated costs and thus the entire claim should be similarly struck out in accordance with Civil Procedure Rule 3.3(4).   In Conclusion   8.1        I invite the court to dismiss the claim.  Statement of Truth  I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.   
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Bloody 'ell - just got a call from a 'friend' at JCP to inform me of yet another doubt made against me by my last advisor! if you have been reading my posts you will know that I had a complaint against an advisor upheld and was transferred to another branch of Ingeus - all good and well, put it behind me and moved on - got a letter in from JCP today saying they are stopping my money for two weeks due to last advisor saying that I would not participate in her work programme!!!

I left this advisor on the 15 Sept, went through their complaints procedure and my complaint was upheld, met with the regional manager a couple of weeks ago who advised that said advisor was no longer 'doing that job' and offered me a place within another branch. Now little advisor raised a doubt beginning of this month!!! the little [edit] is no longer an advisor and I am no longer with the farce of a branch! This is further evidence of her malicious intent towards me!!!

Worth making another complaint? God knows what she is going to do next!

Needless to say JCP is taking my side in all of this and have overturned their decision and no sanctions will apply - but I am getting sick of this!!!!!!!!!!

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:) yay, I signed off and sent a letter to withdraw consent =) they still have my employer details tho :( , its only a temp contract so... could they make any payment out of it ? Also i m thinking about getting a case examiner from the DWP, since one of there advisers is absolutely shocking and i m worried about people. :(
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Had the appointment at Ingueus today at 4pm. Always feel anxious and physically ill going into this building. Not so much the way I've been treated (so far),but the fact that I know the WP will not do anything for me! Have been put on a program called ''Personal Routeways''. Supposedly a tailored solution. Anyone heard of it? The woman I saw also said she'd never had anyone on this prog wanting to go self employed such as myself.

Interestingly, she said I needn't bother signing an agreement that allowed Ingeus to contact a new employer. I wonder why? ;-)

 

You might want consider withdrawing your Data Protection consent

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Found a full-time job, the work programme didn't help at all. I've rescinded all permission for them to contact my employer. Though I asked JCP if they would inform them, and had 2 advisors tell me that it was the provider's legal right to know, and the only thing I could do is not to tell JCP the employer details. Not true I'm sure - though will be writing in block capitals in my booklet that they are not to inform the WP of anything other than the fact I am working.

 

They lied to you. They have no legal right to know. They worried they wont get their money. Make sure you withdraw consent with both the provider AND JCP........otherwise the provider will ask JCP to get the info they need.

 

Nimitz

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Bloody 'ell - just got a call from a 'friend' at JCP to inform me of yet another doubt made against me by my last advisor! if you have been reading my posts you will know that I had a complaint against an advisor upheld and was transferred to another branch of Ingeus - all good and well, put it behind me and moved on - got a letter in from JCP today saying they are stopping my money for two weeks due to last advisor saying that I would not participate in her work programme!!!

 

I left this advisor on the 15 Sept, went through their complaints procedure and my complaint was upheld, met with the regional manager a couple of weeks ago who advised that said advisor was no longer 'doing that job' and offered me a place within another branch. Now little advisor raised a doubt beginning of this month!!! the little [edit] is no longer an advisor and I am no longer with the farce of a branch! This is further evidence of her malicious intent towards me!!!

Worth making another complaint? God knows what she is going to do next!

Needless to say JCP is taking my side in all of this and have overturned their decision and no sanctions will apply - but I am getting sick of this!!!!!!!!!!

 

You know the old saying...."If you pay peanuts you get monkeys"..... Advisor s are under pressure- reach their targets or their fired.....their not trained, not experienced and shake with fear when you stand your ground... I know a couple of advisors and they hate their jobs, always looking to leave...............and they have no idea whats in the provider guidance.. sad isnt it.

 

Nimitz

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Hi all, spent a long time reading this forum from page 1 tonight, ah the joys of unemployment :p

 

Just received my summons to go back to Ingeus after my 18 week vacation to their subbie. I have a feeling they're going to be more rigorous this time around, but thanks to you guys i know where to come if they give me grief. Though a funny thing has been troubling me. Recently i started getting text messages to my new phone from a debt company. Thing is, Ingeus are the only people/company who have this number for me and i never give it out willynilly online or in real life, which begs the question, has someone bought my Personal Info from Ingeus? or have they sold it on and whomever bought it has sold it on again?

 

[edit] Ingeus have everything about me on their database, i want to be the WP Guinea pig, so to speak lol

 

Dont give Ingeus your number... you dont av to.....all you are obliged to give them is your address... thats all...... Never give them your email, mobile or land line.... get all communications by letter, that way there is a record ....

 

Nimitz

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The advisor can "recommend" a sanction, that's all...and they must have a good reason for doing so too... its up to DWP/JCP whether its applied or not, and you have the opportunity to state your case.. ..

 

Provider guidance quote...

 

Chapter 6. P1, P20. Raising a Compliance Doubt

 

The Labour Market Decision Maker (LMDM) is the only person legally allowed to ask a participant for a good reason and make a good reason decision. Once a compliance doubt has been raised, the participant will be asked by the LM DM to provide a ‘good reason’ reason for not complying.

 

See also Decisions, Reconsiderations and Appeals

Chapter 6. P 62, 63, 64, 65

See http://www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/wp-pg-chapter-6-22-october-2012.pdf

 

Nimitz

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You know the old saying...."If you pay peanuts you get monkeys"..... Advisor s are under pressure- reach their targets or their fired.....their not trained, not experienced and shake with fear when you stand your ground... I know a couple of advisors and they hate their jobs, always looking to leave...............and they have no idea whats in the provider guidance.. sad isnt it.

 

Nimitz

 

i know some get ex sales people to be advisers. customers on this thing are not products to be played about with. Yeh, i think its probably really stressful for them at times. i guess they probably get pressured intensely by there bosses.

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i know some get ex sales people to be advisers. customers on this thing are not products to be played about with. Yeh, i think its probably really stressful for them at times. i guess they probably get pressured intensely by there bosses.

 

As an ex-advisor myself, I can tell you most providers have a high turnover of staff. check out the Ingeus / A4E / Serco websites for vacancies...all round the country.! They dont keep staff long... My friend who still works there jokes about receiving a long service medal if you last 2 years...lol

 

Nimitz

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Allowing these pimps to authorise sanctions on clients was the worst thing you could possibly do.

 

"We are all in this together" - David Scameron :!:

The trend started with the idiocy underpinning New Labour 1997-2010, through the New Deal and Flexible New Deal, which achieved nothing other than making W2W pimps extremely rich at the expense of the taxpayer - but lets not begrudge Molly Prince of Close Protection UK her State Funding, or even Emma Harrison of A4E with her reported £8.4M Bonus and Harrisson charging A4E £20M for the use of her "Family Mansion".

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As an ex-advisor myself, I can tell you most providers have a high turnover of staff. check out the Ingeus / A4E / Serco websites for vacancies...all round the country.! They dont keep staff long... My friend who still works there jokes about receiving a long service medal if you last 2 years...lol

 

Nimitz

I suppose that, for the unskilled, a two year stint within the W2W Sector will at least allow them the confidence to step up in their job expectations.... say, working in a Call Centre.

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I suppose that, for the unskilled, a two year stint within the W2W Sector will at least allow them the confidence to step up in their job expectations.... say, working in a Call Centre.

 

Hiya Rebecca

 

Makes me wonder why every "advisor" I talk to, as never read the Provider Guidance... How do they expect to "play the game" if they don't know the rules of the game...!

 

The cherry on the cake, as they say, was my first advisor who, when asked if he had read the Guidance... replied..

"WHAT GUIDANCE".........!

 

Nimitz

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You know the old saying...."If you pay peanuts you get monkeys"..... Advisor s are under pressure- reach their targets or their fired.....their not trained, not experienced and shake with fear when you stand your ground... I know a couple of advisors and they hate their jobs, always looking to leave...............and they have no idea whats in the provider guidance.. sad isnt it.

 

Nimitz

 

So if they don't meet targets they're fired? And if a client refuses to tell them the employer details they get in to trouble? When I fumed at my advisor for contacting my employer and she said in an e-mail 'we made a very brief call to verify you started work which has now been made, they will not be contacted again' is that lies or what? Did she do this so she wouldn't get in to trouble?

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So if they don't meet targets they're fired? And if a client refuses to tell them the employer details they get in to trouble? When I fumed at my advisor for contacting my employer and she said in an e-mail 'we made a very brief call to verify you started work which has now been made, they will not be contacted again' is that lies or what? Did she do this so she wouldn't get in to trouble?

The W2W Pimp, from recollection, will only be able to claim £215 for every 4 weeks for a maximum of 2 years where the candidate is i) in a job, or ii) registers a business and becomes self employed. My belief is that, every 4 weeks, an employer will be harrassed by a Clerk representing the W2W Pimp to confirm the employment status of the candidate.

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The W2W Pimp, from recollection, will only be able to claim £215 for every 4 weeks where the candidate is i) in a job, or ii) registers a business and becomes self employed. My belief is that, every 4 weeks, an employer will be harrassed by a Clerk representing the W2W Pimp to confirm the employment status of the candidate.

 

I know but is that why the advisor was lying to me?because if she failed to get the payment off the job I have the advisor will get pressured or harassed

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Hi all,

Has anyone got any Info on Fork lift courses run by "The Retail Academy" in Liverpool?

I have been offered "Fork lift training" By Ingeus, But, AFTER agreeing (and the initial "mandatory" appointment being made) I was informed that I first had to do a four week Retail course.

Before I could attend unfortunately, I had an accident resulting in me being on ESA for a few months.

I'm now back with Ingeus and waiting to be put on this course, BUT a friend is in the final week of it and informs me NO Fork Lift training is available due to "lack of funding".

I was originally offered this back in early Summer, was there funding then or is this another lie by Ingeus ?, Has anyone done this course AND the fork lift training?.

If the training "offered" (mandated) is not actually available then surely this is fraud, and one that we could possibly prove. :madgrin:

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Hi all,

Has anyone got any Info on Fork lift courses run by "The Retail Academy" in Liverpool?

I have been offered "Fork lift training" By Ingeus, But, AFTER agreeing (and the initial "mandatory" appointment being made) I was informed that I first had to do a four week Retail course.

Before I could attend unfortunately, I had an accident resulting in me being on ESA for a few months.

I'm now back with Ingeus and waiting to be put on this course, BUT a friend is in the final week of it and informs me NO Fork Lift training is available due to "lack of funding".

I was originally offered this back in early Summer, was there funding then or is this another lie by Ingeus ?, Has anyone done this course AND the fork lift training?.

If the training "offered" (mandated) is not actually available then surely this is fraud, and one that we could possibly prove. :madgrin:

 

I attended the liverpool branch, is it the city centre branch? If yes who's your advisor?

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So if they don't meet targets they're fired? And if a client refuses to tell them the employer details they get in to trouble? When I fumed at my advisor for contacting my employer and she said in an e-mail 'we made a very brief call to verify you started work which has now been made, they will not be contacted again' is that lies or what? Did she do this so she wouldn't get in to trouble?

 

I read elsewhere a review on what it's like to work for ingeus. They said something about having to get through 30 clients a day and do all the paperwork involved.

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Hi all,

Has anyone got any Info on Fork lift courses run by "The Retail Academy" in Liverpool?

I have been offered "Fork lift training" By Ingeus, But, AFTER agreeing (and the initial "mandatory" appointment being made) I was informed that I first had to do a four week Retail course.

Before I could attend unfortunately, I had an accident resulting in me being on ESA for a few months.

I'm now back with Ingeus and waiting to be put on this course, BUT a friend is in the final week of it and informs me NO Fork Lift training is available due to "lack of funding".

I was originally offered this back in early Summer, was there funding then or is this another lie by Ingeus ?, Has anyone done this course AND the fork lift training?.

If the training "offered" (mandated) is not actually available then surely this is fraud, and one that we could possibly prove. :madgrin:

 

They tried to get me to do a course in retail, even though that wasn't my first choice of work agreed by the JC. If they MANDATE you to any course offered and you don't attend, the pimps won't hesitate to recommend a sanction.

 

And if you're being offered a fork lift course, why must you do a course in retail first? I don't see how they're related, sounds like a quick expense claim to me.

 

As far as I'm aware, ingeus claim back the expenses of the course from DWP. It's clever how they do it, as far as DWP are concerned these 4 week courses will help us back in to work. But we really know that's not the case.

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