Tax Credit Enquiry

[Joanne1975]

I have no idea where he is registered if anywhere

if thats the case that he cant get credit or bank account that could be the reason he's used my address as i still had him on the elec role for a while afore i eventually got round to changing it - i kinda thought stupidly that if he owns half the house then he has to be on the elec role at mine until someone told me different

 

i mean do they think i would let him take out stuff at my address and do his work stuff from my address when i knew that may affect my tax credits

ive been in tears since monday i cant sleep and and sinking further and further down the slope.. my kids are asking when dads comming to see them cos now im scared to even let him come visit his kids its such a mess

[honeybee13]

Joanne, I don't think there's anything to stop the kids' Dad visiting them, especially if he doesn't stay over.

 

HB x

[rubylee]

Joanne they can't stop him visiting the kids so i wouldn't stop him coming to see them your allowed to have visitors . I'm guessing Tax Credits are saying he is living at the property now ? not just the X amount of years . Have you had legal advise on this yet ?

 

Regards Ruby.

Edited January 13, 2011 by rubylee

[Joanne1975]

no i dont know who to go see i cant afore a lawyer i work full time and think i wont get legal aid

i know they cant stop him visiting but i dont want them thinking im lying to them so ive now told him to limit his visits

he would usually come up and see them every other night and when they have gone to bed he leaves so they are none the wiser

they think he works constantly when in reality he hasnt been working or has had very little work for the past year which is another reason why would i not just say he was with me if he was cos we would get the same tax credits anyway. my relationship with him is a mess and he had been in and out my life like a yoyo should i tell them that or will that make it look like im hiding something. the way i feel right now i just wish i had claimed nothing and stayed at home and looked after my kids instead of nursery which i would have loved to have done but couldnt afore to do. if they want all their money back they can have it but i have no money to give them can they take my house off me?

[rubylee]

I wish i could give you legal advise Joanne but i am not trained in that area i would recommend you seek legal advise . I wouldn't say anything to them until you have had legal advise cause they could use it against you . As far as the house goes i wouldn't have thought so you have young children , give CAB a call and arrange appointment with them. How many years have you been parted ?

 

Regards Ruby.

[Joanne1975]

i have called them and i have an appointment next thursday but i cant go till then without help with this i have to give the lady at hmrc what shes looking for by monday 24th so that doesnt give me much time really. he left me pregnant in 2005 and disapeared basically with the odd visit to his daughter then we tried a reconcillation at end of 2006 and as he had the right to buy i took the chance to buy the house and he stayed for a bit but again he left and i got pregnant with my second child again he wasnt there for period and turned up again when my child was born in 08 and since then it has been him comming in and out of my life but he hasnt been staying with me but has been about a lot he does stay on occasion which i did tell the lady on the phone its just a mess

[rubylee]

Joanne give a Solicitor a call most give free advise but you need one who is trained in this field so you have some idea where you stand with HMRC until you can get to CAB .I would give the lady at HMRC a call an explain you are waiting on your ex to sort out evidence if he has anything at all i know you said he has only a drivers licence , but be for you call her ask a Solicitor if you should do that to give you some breathing space be for you see CAB. You will need to be clear on how long you have claimed Tax Credits for and the dates he was living at the property .

 

 

Regards Ruby.

Edited January 13, 2011 by rubylee

[honeybee13]

CAB may well have a solicitor contact who specialises in this and should be able to put you in touch. Most lawyers will see you for a half hour 'pro bono' meeting to give you initial advice.

 

HB

[Joanne1975]

thanks for all your advice its made me slightly better and i will defo get to CAB next week

im scared they will think he has been here all the time and take me to court take my kids and i end up in jail everything running through my mind but hoping i get this sorted fast cos my life seems to be rolling by and i havent noticed what day it is, the kids are noticing and asking when dads comming to see them, they never bothered afore when they havent seen him in weeks/months now it seems like they have intuition about these things and are asking for him i get so upset every time i look t them

[rubylee]

Hi Joanne I know it must be hard for you at the moment but try and stay positive, can't your ex take the kids for the w/end ? so you can have some time to sort everything for next weeks app with CAB.

 

Regards Ruby.

[Joanne1975]

the story so far

 

well so far they hav said they have made their decision and they are stopping my tax credits and i owe it all back.

they saying from what i can understand that even though my ex isnt staying with me he is stil part of the household ?

or still has a relationship with the household and contributed in a way like making kids dinners and doing the dishes i think thats what shes saying. so now they have stopped my tax credit award from april 2009 and saying i owe them everything back. i think if this is the case then i will have to find out what a joint claim with my ex would have been over the last 2 years and work out what i owe them i really dont know what now. they have said they are stopping my claim and i dont get an offset they dont need to know what i would have been getting as a joint claim as the total claim of nearly £20,000 is due back? i hve been doing some research and found this

 

they can only offset if claimants wrongly made a claim for tax credits as a single claimant or couple as the result of ‘genuine error’ – eg, a genuine misunderstanding of the rules about who constitutes a couple for tax credit purposes. It does not apply where an overpayment arises because of a failure to notify the arrival or departure of a partner i.e. a change of circumstances during an award.

 

which means i think i could have it offset as i wasnt aware that if a partner doesnt stay with you but does contribute like above then it should be a joint claim, but im going to go and speak to the CAB about this

 

has anyone have any info on this as to whether this is right - should this not be offset as i can find out what my ex salary was in the past from him and they can work out what the difference would have been but what then happens if i move on or he does - if he decided to get a new woman and house had kids and still had the same set up at my house helping with kids etc. would we still have to make a joint claim that doesnt make sense

 

Jo

[jadeybags]

Can I just say I know of someone that was taken to court for benefit fraud (I dont know which dept took her to court, DWP or tax credits) but it was said her boyfriend lived with her, & she had claimed 45,000 pounds of benefit she wasn't entitled to. The court case lasted 2 days & people in her boyfriends family stated in court that he was living with them.

I wont state weather she was guilty of the charge or not, that's not my place, but she basically got found not guilty.

It is true that they have to prove someone is living with you to get a successful conviction & I know out of 20 prosecutions last year by my council only 18 were successful. I guess she may have been one of them. But I know how stressful the whole process is by going through it myself. Not the same situation, but over payment of what I apparently wasn't entitled to by no real fault of my own, if anything it was 50/50 fault between me & local council.

I do think if you haven't done anything wrong, to take you to court they would hve to have some pretty damning evidence or it will be a win in court for you. Regardless of what your ex had registered at your address, if he wasn't actually living there & you can get faily members to state that, it will be up to the judge to decide. I would be completely gobsmacked if you are found guilty of owing 20k when you really dont! That would be shocking :o( x

[Joanne1975]

I think your right i dont think they would be able to prove he stayed with me as he doesnt

if they have been watching like big brother then they will have clear evidence that he doesnt stay here

 

but im so scared of going to court incase for some unbelieveable reason i get found guilty and end up in jail for doing nothing wrong

im petrified about going to jail and most importantly loosing my kids who would prob be put into care if that happened

 

Jo

[Joanne1975]

i think alot of people like me will take the easy option and pay them back and have nothing to do with benefits ever again

[jadeybags]

i think alot of people like me will take the easy option and pay them back and have nothing to do with benefits ever again

 

 

Yep that's me Emailed them today & said I want to stop my claim for housing benefit & council tax benefit from today. I shall be working full time & never claining off them again.

Too much grief! I'm lucky in the way that my children are 14 & 15 now so they are quite independant.

I feel for people with young children that have to claim benefits, it's awful.

[Joanne1975]

yeh its awful, they say they are making it easier for people to work but i dont see that

 

I have 2 kids one of which at school, my other one is in full time nursery which is costing £650 per month

so yes the tax credits would be very helpfull. but now after 2 years they are wanting all their money back its a nightmare

 

my son just tunred 3 so will get a so called free place in council nursery, in reality they are only giving you a free place for a half session which for anyone who works full time is useless or you can get 2 1/2 hours in a playgroup (these are the ones situated in the schools) which again is useless!!

 

so people who work fulltime have to put their children into private nurserys fulltime which are costing approx £650 per month

 

these free places are aimed at people who dont work and can nip away to pick up and collect kids anytime they like

if i worked part-time this might be perfect but surly these nurserys have to give you a place to fit round your work not tell you to fit your work around their free 2 and 1/2 hours nightmare!!

 

so long & short is i have had no option but to put kids in childcare and claim tax credits to help with the nursery fees

 

they ought to give free childcare for all working parents then we wouldnt have to claim tax credits

obtain your P60 get a free entitlement notice take it to nursery of choice bobs your uncle.

the childcare would be responsible for claiming the money back from the government

[jadeybags]

I'm still struggling to see why you should have been claiming as a couple if you dont live together & he just comes to see the kids & does a bit of cooking & washing up?

Is it really that bad? I just thank the lord that I dont have a boyfriend & have no intention of getting one anytime soon.

Benefits are a total head fffff' & I think the only answer is to get an extremely well paid job, have an exremely well off partner/husband, & never claim any benefits.

Then of course the tax man takes a lot of it anyway, so it's a loose loose situation!

It's all making me really mad at the moment, which is why I keep coming on here because I see all these people that are just trying to live, everything is getting so expensive yet our incomes aren't going up. And people that make mistakes are bunched in with people that commit full on benefit fraud & I have seen atleast one that blatently did it, got found not guilty in court.

Have to stop getting myself would up by it all at the moment, I have enough to worry about now I have cancelled housing & council tax benefit.

Just taken out a 3k top up loan, I already had a loan I started a year ago, I still owed 3k on it, they have topped up another 3k & only about 40 quid a month more repayments.

I have done this to pay off the 1200 over payment & 400 I now owe council tax. The rest will have to be my fall back if my car breaks down or dog has to go to the vet. After paying my rent, bills, petrol etc we will be living on 150 a week, that's to by food & clothes.

Kids dad will have to help out with uniforms. He wont like that.

And if tax credits say that's wrong they can kiss my *?!

And you wouldn't go to prison even by some bizarre chance they find you guilty, single mum with young children I would eat my hat & yours! Can you imagine the scandal in the papers, that judge would be lynched!

x

[ptol]

well so far they hav said they have made their decision and they are stopping my tax credits and i owe it all back.

they saying from what i can understand that even though my ex isnt staying with me he is stil part of the household ?

 

Hi Jo,

 

Have they actually acknowledged in writing that they accept your ex no longer lives with you?

 

If so then its good evidence for an appeal, based on them interpreting the law wrongly. The advise for your situation is clear on the government website (see here for the section) Since you have split up with your partner you should make a single claim, not a joint claim.

 

As you have children together, and co-own the house it is right and proper that he should contribute to the child and house costs. Whilst my view is that its unwise to have your ex seeing the children at your house (for reasons not associated to tax credits / benefit), it falls well short of living together as though you are married, or any of the other scenarios on the tax credit website where they say a joint claim would be appropriate.

 

Ironically, finding a "partner" to make a joint claim with right now (yeah I know life doesn't work that way) would actually prevent them from clawing the money back, as their rules prevent them from clawing back a single claim overpayment from a joint claim payments.

[Joanne1975]

Hi sorry i never seen this post earlier.

thanks for that info. thats very interesting

 

they have sent a letter stating that they believe my ex "is part of your household for tax credit purposes"

so does that mean they think he stays here or that even though he doesnt stay here we should still be a joint claim?

 

They are saying because

he is on the house docs

house insurance

we have joint account this is only the mortgage account

he is on my car insurance he picks up the kids

we eat together sometimes

we socialise at weekends with kids

we have gone on holiday with kids in the past

he makes dinner sometimes in my house

he does some household chores like the dishes or runs the hoover over

he gives me £200 per month towards mortgage this being his half

 

but he still doesnt stay here

still doesnt pay bills

 

is this right should we be a joint claim??

 

Jo

[ptol]

Here's what i would have said in response to these issues.

They are saying because

 

he is on the house docs

he gives me £200 per month towards mortgage this being his half

house insurance

we have joint account this is only the mortgage account

You are jointly responsible for the mortgage.

You bought the house jointly, and since the split are unable to afford to buy his half from him. As it is half his house, it is right and proper that he pays his share of the house ownership costs such as mortgage and buildings insurance. What you are seeing is evidence that in the past we did live together as though we were married, and because of the house, there are some ongoing financial responsibilities that we still have together.

 

he is on my car insurance he picks up the kids

we eat together sometimes

we socialise at weekends with kids

we have gone on holiday with kids in the past.

he makes dinner sometimes in my house

he does some household chores like the dishes or runs the hoover over

As part of our previous relationship, we had children together. I appreciate that some of the arrangements are not entirely appropriate, but separating your lives when you have a house and children together and are trying to maintain a civil and cooperative approach to minimise the disruption and disturbance to the children is not straight forward,

 

The fact remains we, as a couple are over. We are slowly unpicking our joint responsibilities and rearranging our lives into two separate families. We have already separated our living and our living costs, and so It is entirely inappropriate for us to make a joint claim.

 

------

 

As a separate note, you really do need to normalise your relationship with your ex to just a co owner of your house and the parent of your children. That means that when he has access to the children, it is away from your house, and you are not present, and he uses transport that he is responsible for. If need be, blame the Tax Credits investigation as the reason for these changes that you need to introduce.

[wiganfem]

hi

 

today i have had a letter pretty much the same, but saying that their information indicates another adult living at my address and it indicates im living as part of a couple. I really dont know what information they have and where from and they have given me until tomorrow 19th to contact them. I got the letter today the 18th though dated 9th. I feel sick!!! i am seperated from my husband but we are good friends just cant live together, he comes here regular to see our daughter and only lives across the road with his parents. If he does ever stay over to help out with her, its in the spare room ie during time when hes off work to take her to school. He is not on my electoral role and is on his mums. I have my account he has his. My son registered his business here before he left i october to get married, could that be it? i really am worried sick, its making me ill and i work in civil service so im scared to death of losing my job as i hear hmrc are guilty until you prove innocent, please advise

[lubobab]

can i just ask when this enquiry started? its only because i'm having one done and i've heard nothing apart from them asking for a copy of my childcare contract.

[hatesdwp]

Hi Yes i am having child care check to they have asked me for my childcare contracts and any reciepts from 2009 to 2010 I have everything from September 2009 but i sacked my childminder in the september and we fell out as she was trying to charge me through the tits for my son being disabled and putting up her charges by the second. I called the TC and told them of the situation gave them a complete breakdown of the charges and the information for my current provider. I asked TC to ask HER for the information as i wasnt aware i had to keep contracts from two years ago!!! as it was i sw her the day after the letter on sky news talking about how she was a pillar of the comminty and cliaming tc when i know for a fact she was diddling her tax return and not declaring all the money she was getting and she was living with a man for a year and never told them!!

Im pretty much at her mercy now if she doesnt cough it up or she lies (which she will) then i'll get the overpayment rubbish and as for my bank statements they can go fly...what i do with my money is not thier concern!! its like being audited and told your a cheat when your not!!

[hatesdwp]

there must be so many peope in this postion at the moment i personally think the drive is to get back as much money as they can as who keeps the paper work two years later and unless you have a magic wand then how are you supposed to provide it!! ive been EXTREMLY helpfull and nice to them to be honest and given them as much as i can, i fugure if they can see im trying and not being defensive or difficult they may perhaps leave me alone...i think the child care drive thing is the new "lets get the money back" from all the working parents who might have overclaimed...i understand the ones who are blantantly screwing the system but what about those of us who are honest...as for the first comment with the lady with finanaces tied up with the hubby i still use a joint account with my ex because i couldnt get a bank account, so if they saw that id have the same rubish although id have him sign a legal doc signed up by a solicitor to say he no longer lives with me.

[jadeybags]

It has definitely definitely got worse ten fold, & it'll be because they want to stamp out benefit fraud, & also because they want to get as much money back as they can now the country is in a mess. Both reasons I can understand.

What I dont like is the way people seem to be treated all the same, fraudster/mistake maker, both treated the same way. Even when initially any investigator could see where an innocent mistake MAY have happened, & where a blatant fraud has been commited, before they even call the person in for the interview. Well they should be able to anyway!

I think if progress these days does deter a lot more fraud, then it's a good thing, hopefully one day it'll be rare anyone tries fraud, as they'll know they're very unlikely to get away with it.

Then just maybe people that make genuine mistakes will be treated better than they are at the moment.