dukes bailiffs council tax from 2008

[westgarth]

hey clare check this f**Ker out

 

Who can sign the Walking Possession?

A walking possession agreement is usually signed by the debtor but any responsible person on the premises, including a spouse or partner, can, in most cases make the agreement, but in relation to Council Tax, a Walking Possession agreement can only be signed by the person named on the Liability Order and it must be signed at the time that the bailiff is levying, not after.

[westgarth]

my dad owes council tax from 2008 he can not remember having any letters from the above company until they sent letter saying they were going to call at the house to arrange payments. he then forgot to tell us they were calling so mum let them in on the 16/11/09 they called at 7:20am they then made a walking possession order which she signed her name is not on the liability order but they are wanting to take goods that are hers as well. i have since looked on the internet and have found some advice that says they can not take any goods as my mum had signed it and not the debtor (my dad) they have have sent no letter saying they are going to come and remove the goods but have phoned my dad saying that he has now got to pay the full 1.260.00 within 4 days which we don't have that sort of money but they will come and take the goods if the payment is not received can any one help or give me some advice as i am now very confused

 

i really hope the information i have got for you is correct

 

Who can sign the Walking Possession?

A walking possession agreement is usually signed by the debtor but any responsible person on the premises, including a spouse or partner, can, in most cases make the agreement, but in relation to Council Tax, a Walking Possession agreement can only be signed by the person named on the Liability Order and it must be signed at the time that the bailiff is levying, not after.

[westgarth]

Walking Possession,Levy,levying distress,van fees,What is a levy?,Liability Order,What is walking possession

 

off to watch footy now, hope this all helps

[ploddertom]

can anyone confirm if the text messages are legal

 

You've broken one of the Golden Rules and that is not to deal with the Bailiff by phone unless you can record the call. Therefore there is nothing stopping him returning calls or texts to you - after all he does now have a phone number. Much better dealt with by the written word - email or letter as they don't like to commit themselves.

 

In the meantime have you asked for a breakdown of charges applied - if not do so ASAP. I believe Hallowitch has given you some ammo to use re the goods they have levied upon.

 

PT

[claire52]

we did not know any of this at the time and now we do i think they can not come in and take any thing as my mum signed the walking possession order and dad was not here he also paid 450 ponds at the time on a debit card and as far as we know we have not revived a receipt but it was paid by card so have bank statements to prove payment and we would ask for a break down of costs but the said bailiff will not answer the phone they only have a mobile number as my dad works away all week and my not get his post in time to open and reply but he is saving text messages and voice mails as well. thanks for all the help on this and the time it must have took i am very grateful too you all

[ploddertom]

we did not know any of this at the time and now we do i think they can not come in and take any thing as my mum signed the walking possession order

 

As a responsible adult she can sign unfortunately.

 

and dad was not here he also paid 450 ponds at the time on a debit card and as far as we know we have not revived a receipt but it was paid by card so have bank statements to prove payment and we would ask for a break down of costs but the said bailiff will not answer the phone they only have a mobile number

 

Breakdown of charges is requested from the Bailiff Company, usually sent by email & letter as backup.

 

as my dad works away all week and my not get his post in time to open and reply but he is saving text messages and voice mails as well. thanks for all the help on this and the time it must have took i am very grateful too you all

 

PT

[ploddertom]

For a breakdown of fees use similar to this adapt & use for your own needs, you couls send email tonight/tomorrow and put letter in post on Saturday.

 

"From:

My Name

My Address

 

To:

Acme Bailiff Co

Bailiff House

 

Ref: Account No: 123456

 

Dear Sir

 

With reference to the above account. Can you please provide me with a breakdown of the charges including Computer Screenshot. This is not a Subject access request under the Data Protection Act S7 1998 so does not incur a fee of £10. I also require the name of the attending Bailiff and the name of the Court he was Certificated at. You are obliged to provide this information.

 

I require this information within 14 days.

 

Yours faithfully

 

Ripped off customer"

 

PT

[claire52]

thanks for that will mail it to him tomorrow morning and then send copy in post as well in morning

[fork-it]

the postman wont be coming tomorrow Claire, happy easter

[claire52]

ok so i forgot about it being Easter i still got to work tomorrow and all weekend as well as Monday lol

[westgarth]

i really hope the information i have got for you is correct

 

Who can sign the Walking Possession?

A walking possession agreement is usually signed by the debtor but any responsible person on the premises, including a spouse or partner, can, in most cases make the agreement, but in relation to Council Tax, a Walking Possession agreement can only be signed by the person named on the Liability Order and it must be signed at the time that the bailiff is levying, not after.

 

did you not read this cos i cant see a yeeehaaaaaaa cos your mum signed the walkin order when it was your dad on the council tax ???

 

or a thank you

[welsh1]

did you not read this cos i cant see a yeeehaaaaaaa cos your mum signed the walkin order when it was your dad on the council tax ???

 

or a thank you

 

 

A walking possession is just someone signing to act as the agent for the bailiff,and agreeing to the terms laid out in it,as long as the bailiff is happy that the person signing can convey the terms and conditions to the person who's debt it is then any one can sign,but usually it is the partner if the person is not available.

[westgarth]

A walking possession is just someone signing to act as the agent for the bailiff,and agreeing to the terms laid out in it,as long as the bailiff is happy that the person signing can convey the terms and conditions to the person who's debt it is then any one can sign,but usually it is the partner if the person is not available.

 

that sort of makes things very loose , how can the baliff determine if the person signing it is capable to convey the conditions ?

 

also it totaly contradicts this extract from what appears to be legislation below regarding council tax which is what this tread is about ( I think lol )

 

Who can sign the Walking Possession?

A walking possession agreement is usually signed by the debtor but any responsible person on the premises, including a spouse or partner, can, in most cases make the agreement, but in relation to Council Tax, a Walking Possession agreement can only be signed by the person named on the Liability Order and it must be signed at the time that the bailiff is levying, not after.

[RaeUK]

westgarth, you are confusing. I note several of your links have been disallowed - I presume that you didn't really want to link to cbeebies...

You also mention non-domestic rates but this is a council tax issue. Whilst I appreciate your enthusiasm could I be so bold as to suggest you hold back and read around the site to get a feel for what goes on here? That's not meant as an insult. An alternate saying would be 'whoa! hold on tiger!'...

Just my thoughts.

Best wishes.

Rae.

[welsh1]

westgarth, you are confusing. I note several of your links have been disallowed - I presume that you didn't really want to link to cbeebies...

You also mention non-domestic rates but this is a council tax issue. Whilst I appreciate your enthusiasm could I be so bold as to suggest you hold back and read around the site to get a feel for what goes on here? That's not meant as an insult. An alternate saying would be 'whoa! hold on tiger!'...

Just my thoughts.

Best wishes.

Rae.

 

Eloquently and sensibly put Kelcou,as always:)

Well soon time to sleep,one last cup of tea i think,kettles on anyone want one,i think i have some choccy digestives somewhere.

[RaeUK]

Oh! Did someone mention choccy digestives...!

Edited April 1, 2010 by RaeUK
still leaving extra pickle for WD...

[welsh1]

Oh! Did someone mention choccy digestives...!

 

That made me laugh:D

Passes a choccy digestive through the virtual portal,enjoy.

[seanamarts]

westgarth, you are confusing. I note several of your links have been disallowed - I presume that you didn't really want to link to cbeebies...

You also mention non-domestic rates but this is a council tax issue. Whilst I appreciate your enthusiasm could I be so bold as to suggest you hold back and read around the site to get a feel for what goes on here? That's not meant as an insult. An alternate saying would be 'whoa! hold on tiger!'...

Just my thoughts.

Best wishes.

Rae.

Kel the links are barred because they are to sites that charge a fee for help with bailiff matters, They are always directed to the cbeebies,

[claire52]

ihave read all the posts i also found that the walking possession could not be signed by my mum as she is not the debtor from bailiff advice online but then some one said that she could sign it so i am not sure what to do on that one now

[westgarth]

Originally Posted by Kelcou

westgarth, you are confusing. I note several of your links have been disallowed - I presume that you didn't really want to link to cbeebies...

You also mention non-domestic rates but this is a council tax issue. Whilst I appreciate your enthusiasm could I be so bold as to suggest you hold back and read around the site to get a feel for what goes on here? That's not meant as an insult. An alternate saying would be 'whoa! hold on tiger!'...

Just my thoughts.

Best wishes.

Rae.

 

Hiya Rae,

 

Clare52 has a problem and I gave her the regulation that says her mum cant sign a possession order for a council liability that is in her dads name, she has already found this out anyway but i couldnt see where anyone had backed her up with it ...... regarding the non domestic rates quote that I gave her, I am sure the same must apply to domestic rates, so that is why i pointed that out.

 

As for links that dont work, I can see why this site would block them if they are selling info, but I am not connected to the sites in any way.....

 

As for my enthusiasm , I have started 1 thread on here to put my case out there so hopefully others can learn from it and I can get feedback. idealy I would like to speak to others who have had dealings with this particular baliff ( who I have not named as yet because I am still getting info from them that I will be using ) and look towards getting something going that rebounds on the way they deal with people and make charges with intent, that dont apply.

 

The baliff who has ripped me off knows that I wont be leaving it where it is and he is starting to backtracking.

 

I am a 50 yr old semi retired business man with time on my hands, and if I can pass on any information that helps people I will ( sorry about that Rae ).

 

I have been on the receiving end of bad debt, I have had companies owe me sums of money up to £200,000 and they have gone bust. Over the past 25 years in business I bet the amount of bad debt i have written off is close to 1 million pounds. If someone genuinely cant pay a bill then they need help, advice, sympathy and a way forward etc. If someone doesnt pay a bill because they are totally avoiding it for no reason, they want dealing with properly - and in some cases I have been that person as well.

 

As far as I can see, the baliffs/sheriffs all look like they have a free hand to rip the backside out of genuine people who are already down where it is actually them who are the bad guys in most of these scenarios. If any information I can pass on, such as on this thread or the thread I started, give the genuine case a legal way of beating the baliff then I am happy.

 

As I said earlier, Clare52 has an urgent problem with a baliff threatening to take possessions because her mum signed a walking possession order where it looks like the only person who could officialy sign it is her dad so hopefully she tells them to get stuffed and that she is going report them to the correct authorities - if that is being over enthusiastic, sorry about that.

 

regards

westgarth

Edited April 2, 2010 by westgarth

[claire52]

i thank you for all the help you are giving us

 

we will in fact be telling the bailiff to get stuffed have printed all the links as well for when they turn up i have also printed off a copy fees and i am in the process of writing to them for a complete break down of costs

[hallowitch]

i wouldn't tell the bailiff to get stuffed your mother may not be on the liability order but she ifs jointly liable for the council tax

 

this situation happens all the time if you have an agreement to pay the bailiff and you miss a payment

the bailiff demands full payment then threatens to remove your goods

(and adds a van fee)

 

apart from the hover being on the liability order i don't see where the bailiff went wrong

 

I would suggest you get in touch with council ask them to instruct the bailiff to reinstate your payment plan make the council aware that its not that you don't want to pay the full amount you cant also make them aware that if the goods are removed and sold they will receive little or no money from the sale as goods levied may just cover the fees for removal and sale therefore leaving very little if anything for the the debt

[claire52]

i wouldn't tell the bailiff to get stuffed your mother may not be on the liability order but she ifs jointly liable for the council tax

 

this situation happens all the time if you have an agreement to pay the bailiff and you miss a payment

the bailiff demands full payment then threatens to remove your goods

(and adds a van fee)

 

apart from the hover being on the liability order i don't see where the bailiff went wrong

 

I would suggest you get in touch with council ask them to instruct the bailiff to reinstate your payment plan make the council aware that its not that you don't want to pay the full amount you cant also make them aware that if the goods are removed and sold they will receive little or no money from the sale as goods levied may just cover the fees for removal and sale therefore leaving very little if anything for the the debt

 

 

 

my dad never agreed to any payment plan as the bailiff sent him text message saying say how much will be paid and on what dates nothing has been signed

[westgarth]

i wouldn't tell the bailiff to get stuffed your mother may not be on the liability order but she ifs jointly liable for the council tax

 

this situation happens all the time if you have an agreement to pay the bailiff and you miss a payment

the bailiff demands full payment then threatens to remove your goods

(and adds a van fee)

 

apart from the hover being on the liability order i don't see where the bailiff went wrong

 

I would suggest you get in touch with council ask them to instruct the bailiff to reinstate your payment plan make the council aware that its not that you don't want to pay the full amount you cant also make them aware that if the goods are removed and sold they will receive little or no money from the sale as goods levied may just cover the fees for removal and sale therefore leaving very little if anything for the the debt

 

 

I would suggest that the person liable for council tax is the person who's name it is in. If it is in 2 names its both of them, if its in 1 name its 1 of them otherwise they both would have had a liability order. If the liability order is in your dads name the council wont speak to anyone about it other than your dad unless he gives confirmation that they can speak to whoever... The baliff is trying it on in my opinion, your dad wasnt there, the baliff had nothing to loose getting your mum to sign it, he could then use it as a weapon to scare your parents and make your dad pay ( if he owes the money he should pay by the way ) - BUT, baliffs have to comply to regulations and because most of us dont know the regs then the baliff gets away with whatever he can and his incentive is not to get the outstanding bill paid but to get his charges mounted up and his bill paid.

 

The reg I quoted regarding te non domestic rates that Rae pulled me up on is the same reg for domestic rates, check this link below section 45. (5)

The Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992

 

The baliff has to comply or else I could pop round, get your aunties dog to leave a paw mark on my walking possession order and start pestering you for payment.

 

Stay strong and let the baliff see that you know your rights.... speak to the council with your dads permission , and ask them to tell you exactly what the outstanding amount is including the baliffs charges, they have it on line.... then check the charges, the baliff should have charged for a single visit, he will probably have charged for levying and walking possession but you might want to dispute the walking possession charge, if he was allowed into your house peacefully he can levy and charge for it. If he has not had the walking possession order signed by the correct person then I dont think he has the right to enter and remove.

 

I think the charges should be around the £50 mark

[westgarth]

Hope this helps

 

Seizing or ( levying) of goods.

 

Assuming that you have let the bailiff into your home, or that he has gained entry “peacefully”, he will then be legally entitled go into any room in your home,where he will be allowed to open any doors, cupboards or drawers that he likes. He will be looking to seize (or levy) on goods, or, to put it more simply, to reserve goods that can be left on the premises on the understanding by you that he can return at a further date and to use force if need be, to remove those goods for sale in the event that you do not pay the debt owed to include his fees.

 

Unlike many European countries where a bailiff may actually put a sticker or tag on the items that he has levied (seized), the bailiff will not mark the goods in any way.

 

As the bailiff would need to gain entry into your home before seizing goods, he would much prefer to seize a car on the road or driveway, and this is the most popular item for a bailiff to include on a Walking Possession.

 

Securing of the goods (generally called impounding).

 

Having now seized the goods, the law requires that the bailiff must then secure them in some way; otherwise you can simply close the door after the bailiff has left and remove the goods to a friend or neighbors house etc. Years ago this was achieved by what is called Close Possession . Please note however that Close Possession is rare.

 

Just because a bailiff has walked around your home, made a list of goods that he has “seized”, this in it's self means very little. For the bailiff to have the right to return at a later date, break into the premises if need be, he must acquire some form of legal control over the goods. This is done by impounding. The legal term for this means that the items are now “in the custody of the law”.

 

The way that this is achieved, is by listing the relevant items that he has seized on a Walking Possession form, which you will both need to sign.

 

Contrary to belief, if you refuse to sign the Walking Possession…the bailiff can still insist that he has seized your goods….but this could be difficult to prove. If the bailiff wishes to charge a walking possession fee, there must be a signed agreement.