dukes bailiffs council tax from 2008

[claire52]

my dad owes council tax from 2008 he can not remember having any letters from the above company until they sent letter saying they were going to call at the house to arrange payments. he then forgot to tell us they were calling so mum let them in on the 16/11/09 they called at 7:20am they then made a walking possession order which she signed her name is not on the liability order but they are wanting to take goods that are hers as well. i have since looked on the internet and have found some advice that says they can not take any goods as my mum had signed it and not the debtor (my dad) they have have sent no letter saying they are going to come and remove the goods but have phoned my dad saying that he has now got to pay the full 1.260.00 within 4 days which we don't have that sort of money but they will come and take the goods if the payment is not received can any one help or give me some advice as i am now very confused

[fork-it]

the council should've sent a final notice to your dad at his current address before sending bailiffs, call the council to get the case taken back with all fees removed, and if they cant then contact the local government ombudsman and make a complaint for failure to comply with CT enforcement regs. your bailiff isnt being reasonable.

[claire52]

we have been in touch with the council and they have refused to take the debt back and the bailiffs are still saying they are going to take the goods as we have been given enough time to pay the debt

[fork-it]

just tell them your father has not received a final notice, its the rules, then tell them you want to take your complaint to the ombudsman, have a flick thru the forums, the regs is something like Council Tax enforcement rules 1992 i think reg33 thereabouts try this: The Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992

[claire52]

OK will do thanks for the help will keep it updated

[hallowitch]

does your dad still have a copy of the walking possession agreement

can you list the goods levied

were your mum and dad together in 2008

 

did your mum set up a payment plan when she singed the walking possession agreement

if yes has she defaulted on payments

[claire52]

they want to take TV coffee table sideboard wall mirror microwave hoover hi-fi 2 sofas sky box and all her ornaments mum and dad have been together for 30 years but her name has never been on the tax bill and mum never made the arrangements to pay that was my dad over the phone after the walking possession order was signed but he missed one payment

[impecunious]

Well, the good news is -- from what I can see - is that the levy is unlawful because it includes an item used for cleaning your home - your hoover!! Silly bailiffs, they never learn.

 

I believe because it is unlawful, that all charges associated with the levy have to be removed.

 

I'm sure someone-else will back me up on this one!

 

The sofas too -- is that your only seating? They have to leave you enough chairs to satisfy your family's needs.

 

 

 

Impecunious!

[seanamarts]

are your parents on any benefits, have any disabilities?

Have the bailiffs set up a payment plan.. they certainly cannot take your sofas which deems the levy illegal. I would write to the council and place a formal complaint in asap.

[claire52]

i was going to use the fact i have asthma and it a hoover for pet hair and if they take it they could be damaging my health as we have 4 dogs but if you say it unlawful then we will use that instead and yes they the only seating we own

[claire52]

my mum is on disability living allowance as she only has half a thumb now

[fork-it]

she is on DLA - then read this.. and show it to mr bailiff. http://www.dca.gov.uk/enforcement/agents02.htm#part10 she could be exempt from enforcement and might be CT benefit

[claire52]

she not entitled to CT benefit as we have not had any thing done to the house and if it was not for the thumb they would not be in the mess we in now she had 12 weeks off work and have been trying to pay every one but thanks for the stuff will show it them if they try and take goods may feel the need to stuff it up there nose (only joking)

[fork-it]

be polite to the bailiff but try and capture it on your mobile and send the recording to the ombudsman if you get trouble.

[RaeUK]

Several points spring to mind, most of which have been covered.

 

1) - and this is only my opinion so better legal intellectuals can confirm / amend this statement. - I don't think it matters that the council tax bill is in one name if the couple are married. Council tax is seen as a joint debt and either partner can be pursued individiually or collectively for the full amount. Just my view that this area is a red herring. I have been known to be wrong. It was a Thursday, I believe, back in August '87 ... ( )

2) Invalid levy for the reasons stated.

3) The household contains a person with a disability.

4) The household contains a person with a serious illness. Not really stretching the point. Asthma can be a serious illness, it kills 1500 people each year in the UK. Severe stress can aggrevate the condition.

 

If you haven't already followed the link given then please do so and read the document carefully. It is clearly written and details how the bailiffs should act, what documents you should have, who may be considered vulnerable etc etc. This is the document I would qoute in order to build a case for the council to take the account back. The National Standards are the guidelines councils and bailiff companies are supposed to be following. Is there anything else in there you may think is usefull in your parents case? Remember, they apply to the household not the individual...

 

Department for Constitutional Affairs - Enforcement - National Standards for Enforcement Agents

 

 

Best wishes

Rae.

Edited March 30, 2010 by RaeUK
because a girls got to do what a girls got to do...

[claire52]

ok now the bailiff is not answering calls and has said money today or coming for goods can any one suggest what to do now as we still do not have the money

[hallowitch]

OK now the bailiff is not answering calls and has said money today or coming for goods can any one suggest what to do now as we still do not have the money

 

 

 

have you been in touch with your council or MP about this

 

 

 

The bailiff cant just turn up and remove your goods regardless of whether you are at home(don't answer the door to him if he comes back) or not

 

Forcing re-entry

The law upon the rights of bailiffs to force re-entry to premises in order to remove

goods previously seized has recently been clarified. In Khazanchi v Faircharm

Investments; McLeod v Butterwick [1998] 2 All ER 901 the Court of Appeal held that

bailiffs may only force re-entry where they are being deliberately excluded from

premises. It will thus be necessary in most cases for the bailiff to notify the debtor in

advance of the date and time of the visit in order to remove. If the debtor is then

absent from home, or refuses entry, force may be employed

[claire52]

ok here is the update

 

my dad has been told by text message in January the dates and amounts to be paid in February this was after the levy was singed but the agreement for payment has not been signed as it was texed and he has not agreed to this in writing he then had a text message saying that.

 

this is the bailiff it is removal today unless money is paid.

 

he still will not answer phone calls from my dad.

[westgarth]

the baliff cannot take exempt goods

 

such as clothing,bedding,furniture, houshold equipment and provisions as are necessary for satisfying the basic domestic needs of the debtor and his family.

[claire52]

can anyone confirm if the text messages are legal

[westgarth]

section 14 . 5 of the non domestic rating regulation states that

 

"the person levying distress on behalf of a council shall show the debtor if asked ( and your mum is not the debtor ) written authorisation from the council and shall hand to the debtor or leave at the premises a copy of this regulation and schedule 5 and a memorandum setting out the appropriate amount of the agreement entered into"

 

did the baliff do this ?

[westgarth]

can anyone confirm if the text messages are legal

 

 

i wouldnt have thought so cos you might not have received it ???

 

and in the regulations which were probably written before text messages existed doesn,t say you can do it by text

[claire52]

can you tell me where i can find the section 14 . 5 of the non domestic rating regulation

[westgarth]

can you tell me where i can find the section 14 . 5 of the non domestic rating regulation

 

have scan round here Council Tax,Liability order,attachment of earnings,vulnerable groups,forcing entry,what is peaceful entry?,Magistrate Court Liability Orders

 

its got quite a bit of info on this sitye, i will try and find the reg for you

[westgarth]

http://www.equita.co.uk/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=M-kyaBdCfC4%3D&tabid=202

 

its all here