PCN I recieved, have I got a chance of appealing?

[green_and_mean]

I've found the new TMO the 6.30-8.30 replaced the 7-7 from the 4th Dec but that doesn't really help them as they could have just changed the top sign if the format was correct.

 

 

Original TMO

 

 

Publication Date: Thursday, 10 September 2009

Notice Code: 1501

Road Traffic Acts

THE CITY OF WESTMINSTER (PRESCRIBED ROUTES) (NO. 6) EXPERIMENTAL TRAFFIC ORDER 2009

THE CITY OF WESTMINSTER (PARKING PLACES) (NO. 24) EXPERIMENTAL TRAFFIC ORDER 2009

THE CITY OF WESTMINSTER (WAITING AND LOADING) (AMENDMENT NO. 3) EXPERIMENTAL TRAFFIC ORDER 2009

THE CITY OF WESTMINSTER (LOADING BAY) (NO. 2) EXPERIMENTAL TRAFFIC ORDER 2009

CIRCUS ROAD

1. NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN that Westminster City Council on 7th September 2009 made the above Orders under section 9 of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984, as amended.

2. The general effect of the Orders will be, on an experimental basis to:

(a) introduce a loading bay on the north-west side of Circus Road (outside Nos. 6 to 18) which will operate between 7.00 p.m. and 7.00 a.m. throughout the week. Please note that the existing pay-by-phone parking bays at this location will be unaffected and will continue to operate between 8.30 a.m. to 6.30 p.m. on Mondays to Fridays;

(b) introduce additional “pay by phone” parking bays:

• outside No. 20 Circus Road (1 bay);

• outside No. 11 Circus Road (1 bay);

• outside No. 98 Cochrane Road (1 bay); and

• outside No. 1a St. Ann’s Terrace (2 bays);

© introduce an additional residents’ parking space outside No. 2 St. Ann’s Terrace;

(d) prohibit goods vehicles, the maximum gross weight of which exceeds 7.5 tonnes from entering or proceeding in St. Ann’s Terrace (north of the service road to the rear of Nos. 2 to 18 Circus Road), except for access;

(e) make minor amendments to existing waiting restrictions to accommodate the revised parking facilities referred to above.

3. The Orders will come into force on 21st September 2009.

4. Copies of the Orders and of other documents giving more detailed particulars of the Orders can be inspected between 9 a.m. and 5 p.m. on Mondays to Fridays, until such time as the Orders ceases to have effect, at One Stop Shop, City of Westminster, 62 Victoria Street, London, SW1E 6QP.

5. The Orders provides that, subject to the provisions of section 10 of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984, the Council’s Director of Transportation for the time being, or some person authorised in that behalf by him, may, if it appears to him or that person essential:

Edited January 22, 2010 by green_and_mean

[buzby]

No - there seems to be a signage policy of consolidation these days. so whilst some plates have been added to, it disadvantages a complainant if a relevant sign was 'missing' or got whacked off be a passing ladder. The consolidation means it is all or nothing, and if a plate is missing, it will be obvious.

[green_and_mean]

No - there seems to be a signage policy of consolidation these days. so whilst some plates have been added to, it disadvantages a complainant if a relevant sign was 'missing' or got whacked off be a passing ladder. The consolidation means it is all or nothing, and if a plate is missing, it will be obvious.

 

Not the case its not 'policy' its the 'law' signs where covering the same bay or yellow line must form part of the same sign.

[buzby]

Hmm. Are you suggesting that all regulations pertaining to the strech of road a bay exists, must have a compendium sign on a single plate (for example Loading Plate, Disable Parking, Residents permit and (timed) peak bus lane?

[green_and_mean]

Hmm. Are you suggesting that all regulations pertaining to the strech of road a bay exists, must have a compendium sign on a single plate (for example Loading Plate, Disable Parking, Residents permit and (timed) peak bus lane?

 

Waiting and loading restrictions including permits etc should, bus lanes however are not since they concern road usage not waiting.

[buzby]

Ah tks.

[djsyxx]

Hey guys latest update. I sent what you told me to write from G&M in responding to the NTO and have had a reply back.

 

Looks like I will have to represent myself in front of the parking adjudicators.

 

Here's the reply.

 

Thank you for the representation made on reciept of the NTO regarding the PCN what was issued by a CEO for an alleged parking contravention.

 

I have considered all the information you have provided but I am unable to cancel the PCN. This letter is therefore a formal Notice of Rejection to your representations.

 

The PCN was issued as the CEO believed the vehicle to be parked in a dual use bay at a time when only loading is permitted.

 

I have rejected your representation because it is based on the issue of signage and road marking, which I can confirm are compliant in the dual use bay on Circus Road.

 

Because this is a dual use bay there is no requirement for the legend "LOADING ONLY" to be painted on the road. All instructions for the different uses of the bay are clearly stated on the sign on the pavement. For the same reason a yellow line is not required in this bay.

 

I can confirm that the hours of operation for all Pay by Phone bays are indicated by the CPZ hours for that particular area. Just as parking on a single yellow line is permitted outside controlled hours, parking in a pay by phone bay free of charge is permitted. In the instance of this dual use bay the CPZ hours are 8.30am to 6.30pm Monday to Saturday. Outside of these hours the loading only sign comes into effect.

 

Terms and conditions of the pay by phone system are made available to users at the time of registration and it is not therefore necessary to have the hours of operation on the signage. Users are expected to familiarise themselves with these conditions of use as they will be held liable for any PCN's incurred due to unfamiliarity.

 

The dual use of the bay is clearly indicated by two different time plates placed next to each other. While it may be common practice to place restrictions on one time plate it is by no means a requirement.

 

Parking information signs displayed in the City of Westminster comply with the guidelines set down by the Department for Transport. I can see that we have failed to provide you with a copy of the DFT approval for use of the pay by phone signage without hours of operation, in a bay that is not "at any time." I must inform you should you wish to recieve this from us you would have to make a freedom of information request to us either by e-mail or letter. A quicker way of recieving the information might be to contact the DFT directly. Please accept my apologies for not explaining this in our last letter.

 

Your representation states that a Notice of Rejection was not sent to you following your original challenge (Informal Representation) against the PCN. Please note that at this first stage of challenging a PCN we will only reply with a letter informing you of the outcome. If you are not satisfied then the next stage is to make a Formal Representation. This is what we consider your latest correspondence, as it was recieved after the statutory 28 days from when the PCN was issued. This letter is your Notice of Rejection, as stated above.

 

You must now either pay the PCN or appeal the Council's decision to the Parking and Traffic Appeals Service before the end period of 28 days beginning with the date of service of this notice.

 

G&M what you think of their response?

Edited February 6, 2010 by djsyxx

[lamma]

I can guess but will wait for G&M to fire the salvo. Typical Westminster. I predict you will not have to attend adjudication.

[crem]

I can guess but will wait for G&M to fire the salvo. Typical Westminster. I predict you will not have to attend adjudication.

 

Not sure if we'll get a reply from G&M to this as he was put "on moderation" on Thursday with many of his latest posts being blocked or deleted.

 

I don't recall him doing or saying anything on Thursday that was that bad (well nothing beyond the normal G&M type responses that we have come to know and love ) and his feeling at the time was he'd had enough and was giving up on CAG.

 

I think not having his input, particularly on council PCNs, will be a loss so I hope he plans to come back after he cools off over the moderation thingy, but I notice he hasn't been signed back in since I spoke to him on Thursday night.

[djsyxx]

Ok, um outta interest have you or anyone got an email for him?

[crem]

Sorry, I haven't. Someone else may have.

[Bernie_the_Bolt]

Seems a bit harsh on G&M, I always valued his input even if I didn't always agree with everything.

 

Mind you the mods havent always got thing right to my way of thinking.

 

Let's hope it all blows over.