tifo and bigpockets (website)

[tifo]

I bought a PC from bigpockets which was advertised in AS NEW condition and RETAIL BOXED. However, i've just received the PC today and it is in USED condition with scratches to the casing front and side and is BROWN BOXED, i.e. just plonked in a brown box with bubble wrap around it. The accessories are also in USED condition, i.e. keyboard, mouse, speakers.

 

Advice on what i can do, if they insist i send the item back at my own cost and blah blah etc. I'm not prepared to spend the money sending it back when it is entirely their fault.

 

I was thinking of asking the bank for a refund, though i paid by Debit card.

 

I bought the PC as a present for my child at the weekend and now that is spoilt because i can't give him this.

[buzby]

It remains your responsibility to return the goods, they may refund the carriage cost but whilst it sits in your house, the clock is ticking and your in danger of being stuck with it. However it gets back, make sure that it is signed for on return as there is no way you could prove (to your CC company, for example) that the goods went back.

[tifo]

they've offered to collect and refund PC cost, but not the delivery charge.

 

why should i end up losing £12 for their fault when i'll be back to square one but out of pocket?

[buzby]

Because on a point of principle, you'll be left with a PC you don't want and no refund. By all means stick your heels in, but they're not obliged to refund your delivery costs. The decision will be yours.

[tifo]

i disagree.

 

the fault is theirs. They've described an item incorrectly and it has been bought on the presumption that the info was correct. This is against trade descriptions. Therefore they are obliged to refund my full costs, including delivery.

 

Imagine them sending a 100 of these out every week and refunding people but keeping the delivery charge of £12. That's an income of £1200 on a cost of about £400, meaning £800 profit by describing something wrongly.

[Meldrew2]

Simplest answer - return the PC and get your refund.

 

Then, and only then, chase the £12. That way you've already got most of the money and you can go buy another elsewhere.

 

Send a LBA - and issue court proceedings if necessary - under SOGA which makes collection of faulty / incorrect / wrongly described goods the responsibility of the seller. By having refunded you, the seller has admitted that the goods were wrong.

 

Make enough of a nuisance of yourself and the seller will send you the £12 just to get rid of you - they certainly won't waste a day at court defending a claim of £12....

[tifo]

good advice ...

 

but can you understand what i mean? why should i be out of pocket for £12 when the fault is entirely theirs?

 

they've broken the law, not me.

 

i've asked them to replace with a similar spec machine from another manufacturer which is some £20 more but i don't want to pay the extra because of their breach of trade descriptions etc and they have confirmed those are as described, i.e. AS NEW and Retail Boxed. Lets see what they say. As yet, no reply.

[Bookworm]

Forget the box for a sec, as even though it may be misdescribed, it makes little difference to the quality of the PC and I don't know that you'd be able to win a case based on that.

 

Can you explain to me what you understand by "as new" and "second-hand"? Because my understanding of "as new" is that it is NOT new, and if it's not new, then it's likely to be second-hand (or ex-display, but that's something you're going to have difficulties proving, and as BP is an online store, I don't know how you're going to show this).

[tifo]

AS NEW to me means it is not BRAND NEW but looks like it.

 

RETAIL BOXED to me means a BRANDED cardboard box with the correct packaging etc. and not a BROWN BOX with bubble wrap it. Stating one and sending the other is misleading.

 

It might not make any difference to the quality of the PC but it makes a big difference to how it looks. Because it was a present for someone, it does matter to me how it looks.

[Meldrew2]

good advice ...

 

but can you understand what i mean? why should i be out of pocket for £12 when the fault is entirely theirs?

 

I'm not suggesting you be £12 out of pocket. Do you really want a computer from that dealer after the way they've looked after you?

 

My suggestion was: Return the computer, get a refund, buy a computer elsewhere - and then go get your £12 back.

[Conniff]

Can you explain to me what you understand by "as new" and "second-hand"? Because my understanding of "as new" is that it is NOT new, and if it's not new, then it's likely to be second-hand (or ex-display, but that's something you're going to have difficulties proving, and as BP is an online store, I don't know how you're going to show this).

 

The website describes their product:

 

Product Conditions

New

Items will be new and will have the Original Manufacturers full warranty.

As New

Items will be in as new condition, but may have been returned to the Original Manufacturer as a failed or incorrect delivery. These items would then be fully tested and reboxed if needed by the Manufacturer and sold "As New" with the Original Manufacturers full warranty or covered by Bigpockets warranty which will be stated in the product description.

Refurbished

Items will be used but will have been professionally refurbished to the Manufacturers standard. They will be warranted for typically between 3-6 Months.

Used

Items will be used, but will have been thoroughly cleaned and tested by ourselves. They may have minor cosmetic scuffs or marks but will be in full working order, Used Items typically carry a 30 or 90 Day Return to Base Warranty from ourselves.

 

The used are described as having 'cosmetic scuffs or marks' but no mention in 'as new'.

 

This is not being returned under the distance selling regs so there should be no deduction for delivery.

 

It does say, however, reboxed and not retail boxed.

[tifo]

It does say, however, reboxed and not retail boxed.

 

The item description stated 'Retail boxed' in my case and 'As New'.

 

I seem to have got something they state as 'used' in the above description .....

 

However, the way i see it, they offered to sell an item in AS NEW condition and RETAIL BOXED, i accepted that offer and when the payment was taken by them, it becomes a binding contract on them to send me what they offered. That's what i'm going to hold them to, even if they now have to send me another PC which they sell for more money.

 

They're a big company, i'm sure they know what they sell ....

[tifo]

have a look here BigPockets.co.uk :: PC Iqon Quintal 2020VX PC Retail Boxed - Dual Core 2.8Ghz - 1Gb - 500GB - Vista £164.99

 

It states 'AS NEW' and 'RETAIL BOXED' ....

[sduffield]

Please document any scratches, broken items, etc and take photographs. Let the company pick up the item (signed for on collection and delivery) and wait for the refund.

 

Then, and only then, request the refund of the original delivery charge by way of a letter sent by Recorded Delivery. Include copies of all documentation, photos, as well as a printed copy of their definitions of "As New", "New", "Used" etc.

 

It may take a while (and several letters), but you will get there in the end.

[tifo]

they've offered to refund the PC cost and delivery charge.

 

i'm asking for an exchange PC which costs £25 more than what i paid for mine but they are not willing to exchange.

 

i've asked them to think about it. At the moment i'm not asking for an 'incovenience' payment as the PC i bought was meant to be a present for someone, but being misled about the condition meant i could not give it. Then there is the chasing i've been doing with them for a few days.

 

There's £25 they're saving here. I'm asking for an exchange. They will refund me £12 in delivery charges, maybe spend £5 in collecting the item and i may ask for around £50 as compensation for the inconvenience. That's a cost to them of £67.

 

They could exchange and accept the £25 loss in PC price and think they have saved £42 in delivery, collection and compensation costs. I don't know why they still insist on refunding. The maths don't add up.

[tifo]

OK, got my PC cost + delivery charge refunded.

 

How do i now ask for compensation as the PC they sold was not described accurately and it has been an inconvenience so how much should i ask for?

 

Does anyone know the relevant legislation/regulations to quote?

[Conniff]

I don't think there are regulations to ask for compensation only for refunds.

Any compensation would have to be goodwill gesture unless you had such a compelling case and were actually out of pocket that you could take it to court.

 

I think if you ask for compensation your will not receive a reply.

[buzby]

You would have to show actual loss, and be able to prove it. Even then, if the loss is imagined than real, any litigation you take to assert your position could be lost with the chances of paying the other sides costs.

[tifo]

hmmm ok, i'll send them a letter, lets see what they say.

 

i was asking more for Sales of Goods Act, Trade Descriptions Act etc. statements.

 

The loss was that i paid for a PC which was described differently to what was sent. They then admitted they never had any as described anyway. The PC was for a present, that means because of their mistake i couldn't fulfill its use as a gift.

 

Then they arranged a collection time without asking me. Because i had to be out from home at 2.00pm on that day and the collection would be done between 1.30pm and 3.30pm, i had to drive to another town to drop off the package otherwise it would not have been collected. This cost me time and fuel and was an inconvenience.

[Bookworm]

The loss was that i paid for a PC which was described differently to what was sent.

That's not a loss, that's an inconvenience.

 

Then they arranged a collection time without asking me. Because i had to be out from home at 2.00pm on that day and the collection would be done between 1.30pm and 3.30pm, i had to drive to another town to drop off the package otherwise it would not have been collected. This cost me time and fuel and was an inconvenience

You could have contacted them and told them this wasn't a convenient time. I'm sorry, I usually am all out for consumers to stand up for their rights but in this instance, I fail to see how you could show any actual loss.

 

You've been disappointed and inconvenienced but whether that entitles you to anything, I would really doubt.

[ForestChav]

What exactly do you want compensation for? They've refunded your money and costs to return the item to them, that's all you're entitled to.

 

By rescinding the contract and returning your funds they have done all they need to under relevant laws.

 

You're clutching at straws expecting them to pay you for them sending you an "As New" PC, which to me doesn't imply new anyway. If it was, they would surely simply say New.

 

As for the collection arrangements surely you could have arranged a time with them which was convenient? It's hardly their fault if you can't be in when you agree.