Cabot/Morgan Solicitors-Court Action (ex Goldfish account)

[Gallahad]

we all hope so too

G

[cymruambyth]

Waiting with baited breath.

[barns66]

I went to court,and it was a different judge that had made the order but she seemed too know what she was doing,they asked for a 8 to ten week extension and after what seemed a good dressing down to the solicitor that was there on behalf of Cabot she said that Judges where getting fed up of firms starting legal action when it was clear they did not have the paper work to back it up,which they should have had before they started proceedings,she said that the Judge ****** had given them 2 extensions already and they had not complied with either court order, anyway she allowed them the 10 weeks after solicitor told her that Goldfish had assured Cabot that they could reconstruct or what ever the name is a agreement that woulfd fulfill there obligations and furnish all the other documents that where required,can they do this.Judge made it clear that the extension was a order that if they did not produce the proper documents by the date she gave them the claim would be struck out as i understand with no further arguments or delays as the court she was sitting at where fed up with the paper work clogging up the system.I asked the solicitor to point out on te application form that had sent where it mentioned the t/c,s how the t/c.s they had sent me where linked,he pointed to the box about coming under consumer credit act saying they would be contained in there and he seemed to agree with me they where very hard to read.How can they reconstruct a agreement and how would i know that it was the one for that time.I pointed out to the solicitors the default notice and he said although the default had not been rectified he tried assure me that the Goldfish agreement had not been terminated.I am getting browned of now with all the delays.i still do not think they will produce anything as if they had the documents they would have been produced before now.Will have to wait now see what they come up with.I foumd it not as intimidating as ui thought it would be.Thank you to every body who contributed and helped me in this thread,i will keep fighting this though.

 

barns66

Edited November 2, 2010 by barns66
adding

[cymruambyth]

I think they will try and use the Carey judgement to say that the reconstructed agreement is sufficient. It isn't.

[pabrmu]

Hi Barns,

I think that that is a great result for you, even though it means more waiting.

As you and the DJ said, they have had more than enough time to come up with the docsalready, so I doubt if they will come up with them now.

Also, "reconstructed" docs will not do, so I think that you have it in the bag.

Well done, mate.

[barns66]

Hi cymruambyth + pabrmu,thanks for your comments,i will watch to see what they send and will be certain to post them on here and see what people on the forum think of them.I thought at the Judge seemed to be on the ball.If they had anything i think would have sent documents before now.

 

barns66

[the_shadow]

Whilst we know that Carey corresponds to s78 responses and not enforcement actions if it were me I'd be preparing my counter arguments to them using a reconstruction as in Carey now. At the end of the day its down to a judge on what they'll accept but yours sounds more clued up than most .

 

S.

[DonkeyB]

Good in most ways. Agree with what’s been said. Need to keep on your toes re Carey, and I’m worried that the judge did not react to them saying they could get it reconstructed. That won’t do! So swot up on Carey.

 

And ten weeks is ridiculously generous!

[Rhia]

When it comes to court action they will have to produce the original or a copy of the original. The Carey Judgement only allows them to "reconstruct" information as a temporary measure in order to provide information. You need to look Civil Evidence rules too.

I still think Goldfish debts are mostly toxic i.e. without any paperwork so even producing a Frankensteiner will be difficult.

[barns66]

Hi

Thanks for all your comments,i will look at the Carey judgement and any other documents i can find.

 

barns66

[Hadituptohere]

sorry not been around barns but well done for that day in court, as others have said thee are plenty of arguments against Carey so do read the disecting carey thread and be prepared for a lot of reading, good luck

 

Hadituptohere

[barns66]

sorry not been around barns but well done for that day in court, as others have said thee are plenty of arguments against Carey so do read the disecting carey thread and be prepared for a lot of reading, good luck

 

Hadituptohere

 

Hi Hadituptohere

Thank you for you for your imput,i will read all the articles i can find on Carey,i can't see what tey can come back with or they would have done it sometime ago.I would i am sure have given up on this without the brilliant help i have received on her,i will be sure to keep you posted on any developments,i will most likely need help when or if i hear from them.Once again thank you to everyone who as helped get this far.

barn66

[barns66]

Hi,i have been thinking about this over the last couple of days,how are Goldfish (Barclays) going to provide Cabot with anything,when they could not supply me with anything when i sent a SAR to them,another thing when Goldfish (Barclays) sold the account to Cabot,woud the account not be terminated.

 

barns66

Edited November 6, 2010 by barns66
adding

[DonkeyB]

No, accounts/debts can be sold and traded at any time, subject to this being in the T&Cs (which it invariably is).

[barns66]

Hi DonkeyB

Thank you for your reply,i just was a little baffled why they did not send me anything when i sent them a SAR.

 

barn66

Edited November 6, 2010 by barns66
add

[DonkeyB]

When there’s money to be made out of you, they might look harder!

[Rhia]

DonkeyB is correct accounts can be sold at any time - it's done all the time with business debts and what they call "factoring". You owe me £500 for some service or other. I am a small trader no time for sorting my invoices so I sell it on to a company who will collect it for me and take a percentage from whatever the invoice is worth. It doesn't have to be overdue or anything.

 

With the DCAs they use the Law of Property Act to assign a debt and all they need under this is to assign the amount of the actual debt. However their problems arise when we ask for the agreement as all of these debts have been signed under the protection of the Consumer Credit Act.

 

Many people won't know what we all know so they get away with it a lot. We chuck a spanner in the works by asking for the CCA.

[barns66]

Hi Rhia + DonkeyB

Thank you for your information.I will have to wait to see what Cabot come up with,if anything.Once again thank you.

 

barns66

[barns66]

Hi,just a quick up date,i received from the court this morning,General Form of Judgement or Order letter unforming what was decided when i went too court earlier this month it says CABOT FINACIAL (UK) Ist Claiment Ref Cabot finacial (uk) LTD 1st Defendant Ref my name

Before District Judge ******* sitting at ************ County Court

 

Upon hearing solicitor from the claiment and the defendant in person.

 

IT IS ORDERED THAT.

 

1. Unless by the 11th January 2011,the claimant serves and files amended particulars of claim as ordered by District Judge ******* on 16th August 2010,then the claim shall be treated as struck out.

2. Costs in the Case

 

Dated 2nd November 2010

 

Will now look forward to see what Cabot produce.

 

barns66

Edited November 25, 2010 by barns66
adding

[DonkeyB]

That is a ridiculously lenient timescale for them!

[barns66]

That is a ridiculously lenient timescale for them!

 

Hi DonkeyB

I agree the time they have been given is ridiculous.I will have to see what they come up with,they have had plenty of time to produce something. before now.

barns66

[barns66]

Hi,i received this from Morgans Solicitors yesterday morning,i have not got a scanner just now so i have typed what they sent.

 

Morgans Letter

Dear Sir or Madam

Cabot Finacial (UK) Limited v My Name

We enclose herewith a copy of Amended Partuculars of Claim by way of service upon you

 

IN THE ***************** COUNTY COURT Claim No. ********

BETWEEN

　

CABOT FINACIAL (UK) LIMITED Claiment

and

** ***************** Defendant

AMENDED PARTICULARS OF CLAIM PUSUANT TO THE ORDER OF THE COURT DATED ** August 2010

　

THE CLAIMENT

1. The Claiment and Cabot (Europe) Limited (" Cabot Europe") are and where at all material

times part of the Cabot Financial Group of Companies (" The Froup"),The principal activity

of The Group is the purchase and recovery of debt legally assigned from finacial institutions,

The claiment Company is the Company used bty the group to aquire various portfolios of debt.

At all material times,Cabot Europe administor accounts on behalf of the Claiment.The servicing

of the account and associated collection procedures are conducted by Cabot Europe.

2. For the avoidance of doubt,Cabot Financial (UK) Limite was previously knpw as Kings Hill (No.1)

Limited.Kings Hill (No.1) Limite changed its name to Cabot Financial (UK) Limited on the 15th January 2007 and attached hereto marked "SS1) is the certificate of Incorporation of change of name.

3. The Claiment is and was at all times the Assignee of te debt incurred by the Defendent on his Goldfish Credit Card Account.

THE DEFENDANTS ACCOUNT

4. On the 4th ***** 1997,The Defendant opened a Credit CardAccount by HFC Bank Plc (on behalf of Goldfish Bank Limited

(the assignor) Account Number **** **** **** **** ("the account).The Assignor provided a copy of the Credit Agreement signed by thre Defendant,a copy of which is Attached hereti marked "SS2"

5, The last payment to the account was made to the Assignor on the ** March 2008 in the sum of ****** The Assignor has

provided Statements relating to the Defendants Account,copies of which herto marked "SS3".The last payment made to the

Assignor shown onStatement dated ** April 2008,The balance that appears on the last statement dated **May 2008.is

£******

6 The Claiment purchased the debt from the Assignor on 11th April 2008 by way of legal assignment under section 136 Law

of Property Act 1935.Attached hereto marked "SS4" is a copyof the Cabot Europe Action History which details correspondence between Cabot Europe and the Defendant, As indicated at paragraph 4 of the ActionHistory,a "MGHEL1" was created on 18th

April 2008 and send to the Defendant's last known adress,namely "my address here" shortly thereafter A "MGHEL1" refers to

a Notice of Assignment.A copy of a representation of the letter was sent to the Defendant is attached herto marked "SS5" The

balance at the date of Assignment was £*********

7.OnAssignment of a debt,the Assignor provides information rgarding regarding assigned accounts,

The information is contained ina document which refers which CABOT Europe refers to as the "Raw Data"

The Raw Data for this account is attached herto marked "SS6" and provides various information including

Claiments name and address,the date of commencement of the agreement and Agreement Numbe.

8. The Claiment as Assignee has aquirec the benifit of the contractual relationship that exsisted bewen the

Defendant and the assignor and inconsequence the right to collect the debt now vests with the claiment.

9 Following Assignment of the saiddebt,interst has been applied to this account at a rate of 12% per annum

In the sumof £*****.Accordingly,the current outstanding remains £*******.A copy of the Claiments Statement

of Account which is attached hereto marked "SS7" which shows the assigned and current balance.

10.For the sake of clarificationmCabot Europe has allocated reference number """"""" to this account.This reference

number appears on some documents and correspondece in relation to the Defendants account in this matter.

11.Despite requests made by Cabot Europe for payment of the debt,the balance of £********* remains due and owing.

　

And the claiment claims

1, the sum of £*************

2. interest subject to section 69 County Courts Act at such a rate and for such a period as the court sees fit,and..

3 Costs

The claiment believes the content of these Paticulars of Claim are true and i am duly authorised to sign this statement of Truth

Dated this day 7t January 2011

Intialed here by Morgans

Name here

Civil Litigator

MorganSolicitors

The in-house Litigation Department of Cabot Financial (Europe) Limited

 

All they seem to have changed is the account number and say in there statement that i opened the account on the 4th July 2007 but they did not send anything other than the application form,they had sent this before i signed that on on the 27th June 2007 this was a Friday and i would sayi would not have posted it before the 28th June,i can never remember signing any other form.

 

The raw data spages they sent have quite a number of things blocked out.

 

The assignment letter is the one they have sent before,says it was sent by Goldfish,i never got one from them and i would have thought the account number would have been on it.

 

Should i now wait to hear from the courts or should they have sent someting else to the court.

 

barns 66

 

　

　

　

　

　

　

Edited January 9, 2011 by barns66
adding

[Fred Bassett]

I'm following this one closely because I am nearly in the same position as Cabot. Like you, I did not receive the assignment letter - I don't believe they sent it.

 

Regards.

 

Fred

[cymruambyth]

See if you can find out anything about the views of your local court! My local court believes that on the balance of probabilities a national company like Cabot would have sent out all the correct documentation.

[Hadituptohere]

Hi barns

 

Once the court has received the new POC's from the claimant the court will probably send an order to yourself with instruction of what the court expects.

 

Theres plenty there to get our teeth into if the DJ does order a new defence from yourself....

 

Im still working of a laptop and awaitng my new pc with my old hard drive info on so I can track back what was sent regarding your thread,

Its sit on hands time and await the courts next move me thinks

 

Hadituptohere