Yetti Vs HSBC

[Yetti]

Hi All

 

I'm beginning to get worried so I thought that I'd sign up fr some moral support - and advice.

 

I have, to date, followed the procedure for reclaiming my bank charges ( just short of 2k - all for breaching my overdraft, usually by less the £100 ):

 

1) Send polite letter

2) Threaten court action

3) Initiate court action....

 

....wait.

 

But yesterday I got a letter stating that HSBC's representative has filed an acknowledgement..... and I'm getting jittery.

 

I'm thinking that I need to get ready for court action : what do I need to do - is it just better to get a no-win, no-fee solicitor, and get peace of mind, or is my case a dead cert??

 

One detail that worries me with regard to consistency is that, when I wrote to the bank, I offered a settlement of charges + 4% interest. But for the MCOL form I calculated 8%....... after I read the fine print - is my previous offer binding?

 

Finally, I'd really appreciate anyone who has been to court getting in touch, so that I know what to expect. How scary is it without a solicitor?

 

Thanks

Yetti ( aka Tom )

[lateralus]

hi tom, welcome to the forum.

 

i'll start by trying to explain where the court claim goes -

when you file your mcol - they "serve" or "issue" the claim - usually 5 days after you have filed it.

then dg solicitors have 14 days to acknowledge that it has been sent to them (so this is where you are and it's perfectly in line with everyone else)

now dg have an additional 14 days in which to file their defence - and they will take the full amount of time.

so, you filed on xx/xx/07 - they will file their defence about 33 days later.

at that point - mcol will then transfer you to your local county court. notification of this will come with a copy of dg's defence and it could take a couple of weeks after the time is up. (you can try pressing the judgment button on mcol at around 30 days - but it will probably say - no, you can't do it yet - then after a couple of days - it will say you can't proceed further on mcol - that means they have defended).

 

so, you are right on schedule.

hsbc may (or may not) have looked at your claim before you filed - but now it's dg who does the business.

so, it's what you put on your mcol that is important - and that will have been a request for the 8% interest. make sure your schedule of charges (your breakdown, your spreadsheet) is in line with your mcol. -

it should have all the charges that you are reclaiming listed - oldest first - and each showing a date charged, the name of the charge as it appears on your statements and an amount. if you have done the spreadsheet - it will also show a running total of your 8%.

at the bottom - you will have a charges amount and an interest amount.

total them - and that is what you are claiming. and now your court claiming fee will be added on there as well.

 

making sure your schedule of charges is all ok,

you should send 2 copies of your schedule to the court and 1 to dg - both with your claim reference number on them to be attached to your claim.

 

this is from getting mcol right:

After You Have Issued Your Claim

Your POC's state that you will be supplying a schedule of charges, but MCOL does not allow you to attach it to your claim at the time of filing.

So, once you have filed your claim, you need to send 2 copies of your schedule of charges, clearly marked with your claim no. + a brief covering letter asking for them to be filed with your claim to:

 

 

Quote:

The Court Manager,

Money Claim Online

Northampton County Court

21-27 St. Katharine's Street

Northampton

NN1 2LH

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

(Your Name) –v- (Bank)

Claim No: ********

Date Issued: xx/xx/xx

 

Please find enclosed a schedule of penalty charges taken from me by the defendant, along with interest claimed at the annual rate of 8% pursuant to section 69 of the County Court Act. The interest in addition to the amount in charges equates to the total amount of my claim, namely £(AMOUNT).

 

I respectfully request that the enclosed schedule should be attached to the particulars of my claim.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

 

 

Wait until you receive the Notice of Acknowledgement (not the Notice of Issue) from the court and then send a copy to the bank’s solicitors, since they are the ones who will now be dealing with your claim. Their name and address will be on page 2.

 

 

Quote:

Dear Sir,

 

(Your Name) -v- (Bank)

Claim No: ********

Date Issued: xx/xx/xx

 

Please find enclosed a copy of my schedule of charges relating to the above claim.

 

(If, and only if, you are claiming overdraft interest on your penalties, also include this paragraph)

 

 

I understand you have a policy of initially rejecting claims for overdraft interest. However, should this be the case after you have reviewed my claim, you should be aware that my claim for overdraft interest has been meticulously calculated and double checked. It only ever relates to the cumulative charges within the overdrawn balance of the account at the point that the overdraft interest was debited

 

If it is that in your view the interest is not claimable, I am prepared to discuss this with yourseves and the judge in court.

 

Yours sincerely,

 

 

ok, i hope that answers your questions - you are right bang on target - just get those copies off.

there's plenty of time to start reading up on what happens next -

there are two aq threads in my signature - post 1 on each explains the bit after they file their defence.

no need for anyone else - no solicitors or anybody - we've all done this with the help of this site.

you have a question - ask....and we'll get an answer.

it just takes patience and a bit of following directions you get on here and you will get your money back.

keep posting and keep reading other threads.

[Yetti]

lateralus,

 

Thanks for this fantastic response - consider my confidence restored...

 

I will format and send the copies of charges-schedule immediately (at least it feels like I'm doing something)

 

Remind me when this is over, to sit and support everyone else on here however I can - the support is invaluable. vbmenu_register("postmenu_957023", true);

[lateralus]

that's the idea - i started after watching trevor mcdonald last year - did my son's hsbc claim for him and once it was over couldn't let go - and here i sit..........

[Yetti]

OK so I posted a schedule of charges to DG and the Court asking that thy be added to POC blah . .. blah ... blah

 

I guess I just wait for 28 days from notice of issue, at which point DG will provide some kind of defense........ ( or better - won't ) ??

 

What happens then: I get a court date?

[lateralus]

at the end of the 28 days - they will defend - and then in maybe 2-3 weeks after - the mcol people will send you a copy of the bank's defence and a transfer to a local court. (used to be much, much quicker - but that's the result of so many claims)

[Castlebest]

you dont know how right you are with "some kind of defence" .... you are doing fine Tom just dont expect to hear anything from DG untill they make an offer to you.

 

pete

[Yetti]

Right, so HSBC made me an offer today (without prejudice) ... and I must say, given that it is money that I had long written off, I tempted to take it. In fact HSBC have offered to repay in full all my charges, with the exception of those over 6 years ago and no interest ( and no legal fees - the MCOL money is gone ). All in all its about 2/3 of my claim....

 

So I have questions:

 

1) Can I clain for charges over 6 years old?

2) Can I counter offer ( bargain out of court ) - again without prejudice : anyone got any record of success here?

3) Does the fact that HSBC offered reduce my argument in court, that HSBC/DG have been unresponsive timewasters?

 

Anyway I have a couple of weeks to mull it over - tommorrow the time elapses for DG to file defence. I don;t suppose I can expect them to forget? Then - obviously - I won't sign.

 

What does everyone thing - is this a cop-out, or as the offer is almost reasonable : is this saving me the hassle?

 

:?:

[lateralus]

it's your decision - you must weigh it up - here are a couple of facts.

it is meant to sway you away from your court case - it is from hsbc, not dg - any truly good offer would come from dg after you have filed your claim. we have a letter you can try if you want to accept and it may get you the filing fee included. their offer letter is without prejudice which means it will never be seen by a judge - it can't.

 

if you were to hold out - and you've done everything by the cag method: my honest assessment is you would most likely get the full amount of charges (even those over 6 years, plus interest, plus fees) but it will probably take another 2-3 months.

 

so that's what you have to weigh up - whether your circumstances and your fortitude will let you hold out for the whole enchalada or whether you need to cut and run - we don't judge - it's your decision. let us know if we can help

[Yetti]

Does anyone know what the "update" time is on MCOL

 

DG's time to file a defense ran out today : and I'm still deciding whether to take the offer ( above ).

 

The website does not mention any defense filed : I' gonna wait till wednesday before ringing the court to find out.

 

If they haven't filed a defence : do I win by default??? ( Not likely methinks!)

[jowalshy]

sometimes it doesn't show up straight away on MCOL whether DG has defended. They probably defended at the last moment. have a check again tomorrow and if it still hasn't changed to "defence entered". Give them a ring and ask.

[lateralus]

check your dates too - it's actually 28 from the date served (check your issue paperwork). have you tried pressing the button

[Yetti]

Issue Date on the pdf in the MCOL site says 18.06.2006

 

4 weeks today?

 

There is a 'start' link in the judgement column??

 

Should I go for it?

[lateralus]

why not

 

it's actually better if you can get dg to to file their defence and they probably will - as the court will accept it - even if late - but pressing the button will at least get th ings moving along a bit

 

reason it is better to have them file - if they get a default judgment against them - they will try to get a stay or delay and can string it out much longer - if they are inclined to.

 

i think they probably will get in a late defence but press anyway - it makes things happen

[Yetti]

Yep

 

Defense Filed Today.

 

Right-o time to decide about that offer.....

[pinkduchess]

which way are you swaying?

[Yetti]

OK So I decided:

 

Dear Sir or Madam,

 

 

Without Prejudice

Re. Account number: xxxxxxxxx

 

 

I refer to your offer, made 10th July 2007, to repay in part the default charges applied to my account during the period between 12 Oct 2001 and 11 April 2007 (your reference xxxxxxxxxx ).

I do not accept the offer you have made and reject the reasons that you state for a reduced settlement, specifically:

Charges applied more then 6 years ago

Whilst I believe that you are legally required to keep records for only 6 years, where I have statement pre-dating this, the claim is valid. I am aware of a majority of successful claims that demonstrate this.

Interest

You will no doubt be aware that, under section 69 of the county courts act 1984, I am entitled to claim interest of 8% per annum against my claim. I believe that the application of interest was appropriate.

Legal Costs

HSBC state that the offer made was made to reduce legal and administration costs. I am sure that you will appreciate that, having initiated court proceedings, I have incurred personal costs for which your offer does not compensate.

Whilst I am confident that, were you to defend the case, the court would rule in my favour: I would be happy to accept, without prejudice, my initial claim amounting to xxxxxx. You will appreciate that in initiating court action I applied the required 8% interest and a claim for costs, a total claim of xxxxxx. Were you to settle now, you would recover xxxxxx in addition to your future legal/administration costs.

I will continue to proceed with my claim without delay. If this offer is acceptable I expect to hear from you before any court hearing date.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

YETTI

 

In addition to this DG filed a defense that I received today. Looks like a standard response on the defense form. No allocation Questionaire and a move of court to 'my local' one........

 

....... what now, do I need to contact the court to get a date.

 

When do I start 'nudging' DG????

 

Much help needed now....... c'mon

[pinkduchess]

you'll hear from your local court in approx 2 weeks.

 

you can start nudging now

 

AQ may still be required & an allocation fee may need to be paid. you could call the court to find out if this is so.

[Yetti]

Thanks PD...

 

.... I think I'll wait a week then ring the court to find out what ( if anything ) is going on.....

 

...as for DG - has anyone got anything out of them recently before the court-bundle is issued : reading up on the issue - it seems that this is the point at which they offer?

 

..... :) ....

[lateralus]

it's not just the court bundle that moves them - it's anything that is required by the court - so court wants a preliminary hearing - dg offers,

court wants paperwork - dg offers, court wants a telephone hearing - dg offers - basically any deadline the court sets which would mean dg has to attend or submit evidence about their defence - they offer.

 

we've had lots of win's this week - go on the forum and look for those with ***won*** next to them and read like the last page of each to see at what point dg caved in and offered.

[Yetti]

:o

Well would you 'adam n eve' it ... the minute I reject an offer for 2/3's my claim - the the OFT screw the whole thing up by trying to help. This is typical yetti luck : maybe I should have warned everyone:wink: . Now I'll probably have to wait another 12 months or so.

 

Anyway - my court case has, in fact, been transferred to the local court, and I'm now expected in court on the 3rd September...........

 

....sooooo.....

 

what now?

According to the document I received I'v got to have my court bundle ready in a couple of weeks before the hearing.

 

Has anyone else got any information on the current lie of the land???

I'm expecting DG to apply to put the case on hold pending the big-trial.

 

I will of course prepare the court bundle before hand... does anyone know how long it usually take DG to issue their stuff??

 

Are all the courts suspending the bank charge cases now?? Or has there been any more successfull hearing since the announcement?

 

?????????ADVICE NEEDED?????????

[lateralus]

it's very much a mixed bag - depending on which court you are with - and i don't know who's doing what - best advice is to carry on as normal until you get a stay. then try to get the stay removed.

[freakyleaky]

Once the court inform you that a stay has been applied for then you need to appeal. Application for removal of staty

 

Until then carry on as normal!

[Yetti]

BUMP!!

 

Still no stay..

 

..... court bundle has got to be in within the next couple of days...

 

I've just been duplicating my bank statements: there's an awful lot of them. Is it normal to have a court bundle the size of the Yellow Pages

 

[lateralus]

on statements, only the pages with charges on them - and yes, bundle can run to around 200-300 pages - then times 3 for the copies so, yes, it's a challenge - a big job just keep at it. get back if you can't find anythng