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    • We need to see the actual document from the IAS where it is written - "The Operator's evidence shows no payment for the Appellant's vehicle, or anything similar. It does show two payments for the same registration in quick succession. I would take a reasonable guess, based on the circumstances described, that the person paying has paid for the registration of the person they assisted again." You can't just type it up yourself. At the hearing in July or August or whenever the judge will have two Witness Statements. One from Bank's director says you never made a second appeal. You say you did make a second appeal and the IAS concluded that payment was made. The judge will immediately twig that either you or the director is lying.  But who? Fail to show the documentation form the IAS and instead just produce something you've typed yourself will make it look like you just made up the appeal and you are lying and you will lose the case. Please let us see what the IAS adjudicator sent.
    • I used to have a retail outlet in London selling my husband's photography.  We also had a co-op with staff so they weren't directly employed by me, but I paid for the other overheads etc.  When my husband died, I carried on as usual for a while but then I became ill and moved quite far away so logistically was becoming very difficult.  I came to an arrangement (verbal) with one of the guys I trusted, that I would send him the images to print and sell as normal, and I wouldn't take any money, as a short term solution until I got back on my feet and worked out the best way to do things. He would pay all the  rent, insurance etc... Over a year later, not able to give things away for free anymore,  I drew up a contract as a wholesale agreement, so I would get everything printed and sent to him and I would invoice his for what he ordered. I noticed form the beginning that he wasn't ordering enough or frequently enough to be making any money, and was suspicious he was doing his own orders on the sly and ordering just enough from me to keep my happy.  I checked with my printer, which I've been with for 20 years, and he sad he wasn't getting orders for my images from anyone else. I emailed a few other printers to ask them to keep a look out for some images but I soon realised this would be impossible to police.  The only option really would be to buy a print from him and check the stamp on the back of it.  I finally managed to get hold of on the prints on sale, and sure enough, he did not order it through me.   In the contract he signed in 2022 it explicitly states that he must destroy all files I had previously sent him etc etc so e is in breach of that.  When I drew up the contract, I was careful to make sure it was legally binding, but before I let rip at him, I need to know where I stand.  The contract is here: PARTIES This WHOLESALE AGREEMENT (“Agreement”) is made effective as of 30th June, 2022, by and between ############################## The Supplier and the Client, collectively referred to as the "Parties," hereby agree to the following terms: TERMS AND CONDITIONS SALES OF GOODS The Supplier agrees to provide the following goods to the Client (“Goods”): Description of Goods ################################# Doc ID: 3d54c1d336d8780243801e0e068ebd33114b088b BOTH PARTIES AGREE: The Client purchases the Goods through the Supplier directly, and agrees to delete/destroy any previously held digital images (Goods) owned by the Supplier, and agrees not to use any such files for monetary gain, outside of this agreement, either directly or through a third party from immediate effect of this agreement. The Client purchases the other materials necessary for resale of the Goods independently of this agreement. The Client shall have exclusive rights for resale of Goods at ###########, and also with permission, as a retailer of the Goods elsewhere, provided that there is no conflict of interest between the Supplier and the Client. The Client is free to decide their own retail prices, for the Goods. The Supplier shall use #####  to provide the printed Goods on Fujifilm Crystal Archive paper, with Lustre finish, and will not use any other Printer unless #### cease to trade, without prior approval from the Client. The Supplier shall not impose restrictions on size or frequency of orders made by the Client. The prices provided by the Supplier shall not increase for a minimum of 3 years, unless the prices of the raw materials rise, in which case the client will be informed immediately. Any discounts/promotional prices of raw materials shall be passed on to the Client by the Supplier, and the invoice will show adjustments for this, as well as credit for return postage of any damaged goods. This agreement can be terminated by the Client without notice; the Supplier must give notice of no less than 90 days, unless the terms of the agreement are breached, in which case, the agreement can be terminated with immediate effect. PAYMENT Orders must be paid for upon receipt of invoice, via Bank transfer: ######### Doc ID: 3d54c1d336d8780243801e0e068ebd33114b088b DELIVERY AND INSPECTIONS All orders received by 12.00am (midnight) shall be processed by the Supplier the following working day and delivery of order shall arrive in accordance with the Royal Mail schedule, or DPD, should express delivery be requested. The Client shall be liable for the delivery charge which shall be added to the invoice. The Goods will be delivered to the address specified by the Client. The Client shall be provided with order tracking, and should any problems arise with the ordering system or the couriers (Royal Mail, DPD), the Client shall be informed without delay of any such issues. The Client will inspect the Goods and report any defects or damage to the Goods in transit as soon as possible upon receipt of Goods, and will retain damaged Goods for return to Supplier for refund/replacement. GENERAL PROVISIONS CONFIDENTIALITY The prices of the Goods and other information contained in this Agreement is confidential and will not be disclosed by either party unless with prior written consent of the other party. INDEMNIFICATION The Client indemnifies the Supplier from any claims, liabilities, and expenses made by any third party vendors or customers of the Client. GOVERNING LAW This Agreement will be governed by and construed in accordance with UK Law. ACCEPTANCE Both parties understand and accept the wholesale arrangement stipulated under this Agreement. Doc ID: 3d54c1d336d8780243801e0e068ebd33114b088b IN WITNESS WHEREOF, each of the Parties has executed this Wholesale Agreement as of the day and year set forth above.   Signed by us both electronically.   I haven't broached any of this yet, and I am looking for some advice about what action to take.  The main issue I've got is that he has still go those images.  If I terminate the contract, I will need to know that he no longer has those images and I can't think of a bulletproof way to do this. I'm thinking I might tell him I will continue with the contract but ask for a  sum in damages and say that if I find out he's still doing it down the line I will terminate the contract and sue him for damages. The damages side of things I'm not sure how it would work as he is self employed, and I'm positive he doesn't declare all of his earnings to HMRC, in order to find out how much I have lost, would the court demand to go through his tax self assessments?  I'm not sure how to proceed with this, I don't want to lose that place as an outlet as it is in a prime spot in London, which is why I let him have those images in the first place as I would have had to pull out altogether at that point.  I am regretting it somewhat now though.  Please help.
    • I cannot locate anything in my paper work that states 2 payments were made? Perhaps you could point this out? In reply from IAS it states "The ticketing data has been attached" nothing was sent to me. I made a response to the IAS all this was done online
    • Thanks again for your responses. The concern I have here, is that freeholder of the land (a company, who presumably would have been the ones to have initially instructed PPM to manage the parking here), will have proof of exactly how long the vehicle was on site for, as the driver was meeting operatives from that company on a separate matter. On this basis, if the matter was to get to court, I feel all the other technicalities about signage, size of signage/font, lack of start/finish times, will not be enough to have any case dropped? This PCN was brought up to the freeholder but they have advised that PPM will not waive this charge. 
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

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Fraud on BetFair?


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Hi a friend of mine recently had his betfair account used by an unknown person. His account was totally emptied via one bet that was won in full by another player. Bet fair are refusing to help as the person that did the bet logged in first time meaning they knew the password.

 

This cannot be right that there must be a security fault somewhere, the guy in question dose not use this password for anything else and is not using a wireless network. Also the bet itself was very unlike anything he normally would do ( he is a bookie by trade so he knows his stuff i.e. takes very little risk).

Anyone in the know about where he stands on this matter ?

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Difficult - just as Chip & PIN has shifted the proof of use to consumers, BF rely on this in a similar manner. They will, however be able to trace the IP address of the user who emptied the account, I suggest he contacs BF and ask them for this and the date/time of access.

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I can comment on this because I am a heavy Betfair user and even own a horse with them :)

 

If your "friend" goes to My Account and My Security, it will show you all the IP address used (10 I believe) to log into your account.

 

The fact that the bet was placed and won wholy by another individual is irrelevant. What were the odds that the bet was matched at (while some users would not think this relevant, believe me it is.) What was the market where the bet was placed.

 

HOW did someone manage to log into his account ??

 

Section 4 of the T&Cs are as follows

 

You agree to keep your username, password and/or TAN strictly confidential and you are responsible for any misuse of your password and/or TAN. Provided that we have been correctly supplied with the account information requested, we are entitled to assume that orders and payments are made by you. You should change your password on a regular basis and never disclose it to any third party. Passwords should contain a mixture of upper and lower case letterS and numbers and/or symbols. Passwords are case sensitive and we recommend the use of passwords that combine a combination of non obvious letters and numbers in different cases. This will help to prevent the risk of unauthorised use of your account. You undertake to protect your username and password in the same way as you would in respect of your bank cards and any failure to do so shall be at your sole risk and expense.

 

How often does your friend change his password (betfair keep logs of these occasions).

 

The password now has to be both digits and letters.

 

I am not going to jump on the bandwagon just yet until the picture is filled in a little more

Whatever I post is my opinion and should be taken as such, an opinion. While it is what I believe and is offered in good faith, it should not be taken as a statement of truth

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  • 1 year later...
  • 4 weeks later...
Hi a friend of mine recently had his betfair account used by an unknown person. His account was totally emptied via one bet that was won in full by another player. Bet fair are refusing to help as the person that did the bet logged in first time meaning they knew the password.

 

This cannot be right that there must be a security fault somewhere, the guy in question dose not use this password for anything else and is not using a wireless network. Also the bet itself was very unlike anything he normally would do ( he is a bookie by trade so he knows his stuff i.e. takes very little risk).

Anyone in the know about where he stands on this matter ?

2 of us have just been cleaned out for over 10000 ten thousand euro.A bet placed on ireland v georgia on 6 sept 2008. somehow they had passwords log in details and cedit card incl cv2 numbers.the money taken from credit cards will be refunded but the ballance of over 3000 that was in our betfair account is gone .Betfair refuse to refund even thouge they concede in an email that unauthorised was gained to both our accounts.Is this part of a wider [problem].DONT LEAVE MONEY IN BETFAIR ACCOUNTS !!!!!!!!!!!!!

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I use Avast anti virus and every time I opened Betfair Poker, It told me not to trust the site as they have had they're security license revoked. It has been sorted now but that's not the point. Clearly they had a security problem in the first place to have had they're license revoked, and if that is the case you should be able to gain some sort of compensation.

 

Unfortunately, companies like Betfarce.com think they are like the Government. Do what ever they want with the publics personal information and get away with it. You are talking about a lot of money. There are probably thousands of Betfix customers who have lost smaller amounts in similar ways but say nothing because it is only a small amount.

 

If I was you, I would use a free 30mins-1hour consultation with a solicitor. Maybe just a solicitors letter would let them know you mean business and they may do something for you. It's worth a try for the amount of money you are talking about. I am sure these companies have to have some sort of Public Liability Insurance.

 

 

If all else fails, kick them where it hurts and SOD'EM;)

 

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  • 3 months later...

Yes, Betfair can do as it pleases with your money and your credit card company cannot do anything to help you. This is the response I got back from VISA: “Because gambling transactions give credits without an actual charge first, we do not have a debit on the VISA to chargeback. As you don’t have any proof from the merchant that you were to receive a credit, we are unable to initiate a dispute.”

 

Truth Exposed Blog: Betfair fraud scams and/or system problems

Edited by Betfair Exposed
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  • 3 months later...

I have had a similar experience with Betfair. Someone hacked into my account in Nov 2008 and tried to withdraw my funds via a credit card that THEY had added to my account. This attempt failed but they proceeded to ' lose ' almost £1k of my funds ( leaving me with £44) ..why ? who knows !

Betfair say I am liable. I cannot prove that I did not log on that day or that I did not give my password to an associate . However, I can prove that the credit card is NOT mine. To my amazement Betfair have stated that they cannot give me the details of the credit card on MY account. I advised the police and made a statement . Betfair said I would need to get the police to submit a data request form before they provided the card information. The police duly provided this form ( twice as Betfair lost the 1st one). After 2 weeks the police chased for a response from Betfair to be told that Betfair would now require a Court Production Order ( a court warrant effectively ) KNOWING that no police force would be able to provide one as court judges will not grant such warrants unless the fraud amount is significant ( tens of thousands in reality). So, while Betfair have remained within the law ( just ) they are effectively causing police obstruction.

Then of course, independent adjudicators like IBAS will not help if there is a police investigation. This [problem] is almost fullproof as most police forces will say " this is not a police matter " or words to that effect and even when the police force smells a rat ( e.g. a crime has been committed ) they are asked to provide a document that they simply cannot and as I have said above, all the independent arbitrators are frightened off by the police investigation. There is lots more to this particualr story if anyone is interested but my advice is not to deal with Betfair and if you must DO NOT LEAVE FUNDS on your account. My belief is that many punters have experienced this problem but either the police or others say " tough "

and no one is able to help EVEN when it is clear that a criminal offence has occurred. It MAY be that current or ex Betfair employees are conducting this [problem] or they may be in cohoots with very able criminals.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Hmm

But surely you as the account holder can make a subject access request and be told the credit card number ?

 

This kinda links to the recent posts about Paypal I have made where I point out the perils of leaving money in these accounts and /or having a card/bank account linked permanently.

 

Wheres most banks have quite a complicated/secure procedure to access your money, sites like Paypal, betting sites etc generally just need one password, once you are in you may have access to quite large amounts of money, plus unlike banks you appear to have very little comeback.

 

Passwords can easily by hacked by simply watching you login/using keylogging software, etc. My bank also uses the drop down box method which adds a higher level of security.

 

Andy

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  • 2 years later...

I have just won 1700 dollars on Betfair poker playing the 3/6 dollar satkes, however Betfair seems to have wiped my betting history and is telling me that I have placed no bets in the last 90 days. They are trying to tell me that I have been playing for play money, which is ridiculous as they do not even offer a 3/6 dollar play money table. Also I had definitely lost money, as I made a second deposit of 150 pounds after losing my first 50 and the software telling me that I needed to deposit more cash.

 

Does anyone have any advice on the matter?? I can prove my deposits, but without my betting history, am I screwed??

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  • 2 months later...

Betfair Ltd (BETFA43417)

Waterfront, Hammersmith Embankment

Winslow Road

London, London, W6 9HP

 

It's moved to Gib now:

 

TSE (Gibraltar) LP is licensed by the Gibraltar Licensing Authority (GLA) and regulated by the Gibraltar Regulatory Authority (GRA) under the Gambling Act 2005. RGL No.049. Address: Units 2/4 and 2/5 Waterport Place, Gibraltar.

Edited by Conniff
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