G24/BW ANPR PCN Claimform - Everyman, Southgate street, Winchester, SO23 9EG ***Claim Discontinued***

[Hector0393]

Which Court have you received the claim from ?

1. MCOL Northampton N1 ?

If possible please scan redact and upload a full page copy of page 1 of the claim form. (not the response page or AOS)

Name of the Claimant :           G24 Ltd

Claimants Solicitors:  BW Legal

 

Date of issue – 06 July 2023

 

Date for AOS - 25th July 2023

Date to submit Defence -8th August 2023

What is the claim for –

1.The claim is for the sum of £174.52 being due from the defendant in respect of a parking charge notice for a contractual breach which occurred on 08/07/2022 in the private car park/land at EVeryman Southgate street Winchester, SO23 9EG in relation a (vehicle and reg details)

2.The PCN was issued as the driver failed to comply with the terms and conditions as displayed.

3.Despite demands the charge remains unpaid.

4.The claim also includes the statutory interest pursuant to section 69 of the County courts act 1984 at a rate of 8% per annum (a daily rate of £0.04 from 08/07/2022 to 05/07/2023 being an amount of £14.52.

5.The claim also includes the £60.00 recovery costs as set out in the terms and conditions and in the ATA AoS code of practice

 

What is the value of the claim? 174.52

Amount Claimed 

court fees £35.00

legal rep fees £50.00

Total Amount  £259.52

Have you moved since the issuance of the PCN? (y/N - if Y state Date too) N

Did you receive a letter of Claim With A reply Pack wanting I&E etc about 1mth before the claimform? Y/N + date and did you reply? N

 

court paper.pdf

[honeybee13]

Hello, welcome to CAG.

Thank you for the information on the claimform, that's really useful.

Could we also have the details requested on the other forum sticky please? This will give us more complete picture.

Best, HB

 

[Hector0393]

Sorry, didn't see that....

Give me 5.....

 

[Hector0393]

1 Date of the infringement 08/07/2022

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] 13/07/2022

[scan up BOTH SIDES as ONE PDF- follow the upload guide] please LEAVE IN LOCATION AND ALL DATES/TIMES/£'s

3 Date received not sure only a couple of days though

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?] not sure

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? yes

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal] n

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up n/a

7 Who is the parking company? G24 Ltd

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Everyman, Southgate street, Winchester, SO23 9EG

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under.

can't remember

There are two official bodies, the BPA and the IAS. If you are unsure,

please check HERE

final notice reverse.pdf

Sorry, seem to have lost the original notice, but have the final one

 

quick note... yes it does mention pof act

 

appeals with the IAS

[lookinforinfo]

I take it that the car park was for something like Permit Holders only or Staff members only. as there appears that you were not supposed to park there. The Final Notice you posted is no use as it is the original notice that must comply with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 which governs private parking.

if you haven't kept the original PCN please send off an SAR so that we can see what they have and why they think they have a case. Quite often they don't. Already they have overcharged you by about £70 which is par for the course for them . Totally unlawful.

Well done for not appealing. You have more chance of being made a Dame of the British Empire than  getting the IAS to cancel your ticket.

 

[dx100uk]

pop up on the MCOL website detailed on the claimform

.

register as an individual on the Gov't Gateway Site
Go to HMRC's login page.

Click the GREEN sign in button.
Click “Create sign in details”
Enter your email address where asked.
You will now be emailed a confirmation code. ...

You will now be issued with a User ID for your government gateway account.
 note down your details inc the long gateway number given, you might need it later.
 

then log in to the MCOL Website

.

select respond to a claim and select the start AOS box.

.

then using the details required from the claimform

.

defend all

leave jurisdiction unticked.

click thru to the end

confirm and exit MCOL.

.

get a CPR 31:14 request running to the solicitors

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?486334-CPR-31.14-Request-to-use-on-receipt-of-a-PPC-(-Private-Land-Parking-Court-Claim

type your name ONLY

no need to sign anything

.

you DO NOT await the return of paperwork.

you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 from the date on the claimform.

………….
 

[Hector0393]

The car park is a cinema car park, but the cinema only opens in the evening..... There was 1 other car in there during the drivers visit.

 

I have now found the original PCN. It was lost in the mountain of crap that they sent me over the year

 

Thank you for your advice so far......

 

2022-07-13 CPCN incident on 2022-07-08.pdf

[Nicky Boy]

Guys,

The "Final Notice" at post 4 still has the PCN number showing...

[FTMDave]

We've seen this before.

Presumably the fleecers will say there is a period of the day, when the cinema is closed, when no parking at all is allowed.

The most important thing now is to follow dx100uk's advice three posts up and start the process of defending the claim.

Come back when that is done and we can move on to other bits & pieces.

[FTMDave]

So, presuming you've done AOS and CPR ...

... is this place local to you?  Can you easily go back and take photos of the signage?

Often the signage is pants, and a good way to trip up the fleecers, especially in these cases where it's a car park but then suddenly it isn't a car park any more for certain chunks of the day.

[lookinforinfo]

They keep referring to there being a contractual parking charge. This is strange because the time you were there you were not allowed to park. As it is therefore a prohibitory sign no contract can be formed with you.  So you did not breach their contract that they have with some other drivers. Admittedly you may be described as a trespasser but only the land owner can sue for that, not the lesser human beings  at G24.

On top of that under the protection of Freedoms Act 2012 they have not issued it in accordance of the Act. Under Schedule 4 S9[2][a](2) "The notice must—(a)specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;"

There is no Period of Parking mentioned on the PCN. There are the times of entering and leaving the car park but they are on photographs not the PCN itself. In any event there is no way that a car being driven from the entrance to a parking spot then later driving from the parking spot to the exit could be described as being  part of a parking period.

Further, in Schedule 4 S9[f] states at the last part "the creditor will (if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid;"

G24 totally missed out the words in brackets which is contrary to S9[2].

As a result you as the keeper are not liable for the debt. Only the driver is now liable and as just about everybody who has a valid motor policy is allowed to drive your car good luck with them convincing a Judge who was driving if you don't tell them. Courts do not accept the rogues premise that the keeper and the driver are the same person. Their needs to be more definite proof.

 

[Hector0393]

Hi, yes done AOS and CPR. I also went back to the site today and took photos of the signage

Thank you for your advice so far..... pictures to follow

How do I upload pictures? sorry not the most computer savvy

[honeybee13]

If you click on the word upload in your post or mine, you go to a new page with instructions to follow.

HB

[Hector0393]

Parking signs.pdf

[FTMDave]

What utter rubbish signage (which is good news for you).

The entrance sign says the T&Cs are inside the car park.

Once there it's CUSTOMER PARKING ONLY - how do they know you weren't a customer?  Customer of who?

Nothing about a period of the day in which no parking is allowed.

I see in electronic-microscope viewable small print there's some rubbish about inputting your reg inside the cinema.

[lookinforinfo]

It is a cinema car park Dave and as the cinema wasn't open there could be no customers.

The charge is definitely a penalty since there was no legitimate interest involved since there was no need to keep the car park clear for patrons of the cinema. I am not saying that there may not be a charge for entering the car park at the wrong time but no way can £100 can be justified .  You could also accept that you were trespassing and only the land owner can do that .

[Hector0393]

This came today.... They seem to think they can just issue me with a CCJ.... I know they can't without a court appearance.... Are they really that arrogant??

 

BW legal response.pdf

Edited August 8, 2023 by Hector0393
left information in

[Nicky Boy]

More stupidity than arrogance.

(They're too stupid to do arrogant.)

[nightnajjers]

Seems to be a popular trait lately,  This is what they sent me on the letter of claim.

" if, on expiry of this letter, your case proceeds to a County Court claim without further notice, you will incur additional costs and fees that would increase the balance"

 

[Hector0393]

Is there a time limit for all this?

Once the court papers were sent out and I acknowledged them, I would have thought that there was a time frame for them to either arrange a court date or cancel the whole proceedure.

[Nicky Boy]

When is your defence filing date?

And what does it say on mcol?

[dx100uk]

defence was due over 6weeks ago

i hope you did file a defence?

dx

 

[Nicky Boy]

The pdf in post 17 looks ominous dx...

[FTMDave]

On 09/07/2023 at 17:07, Hector0393 said:

Date to submit Defence -8th August 2023

On 10/07/2023 at 03:48, dx100uk said:

you DO NOT await the return of paperwork.

you MUST file a defence regardless by day 33 from the date on the claimform.

And?

[Nicky Boy]

WHAT DOES MCOL SAY????