5 CCJ's+restriction k's - been paying 2 after order of sale attempts . **RESOLVED £52K saved - NONE PAID but on-going**

[gtn]

Hello,

 

Yes that's correct. The first CCJ was late 2007 and the second was early 2008. Both CCJ's were removed from the register and our credit files in 2013/2014. I understand they stay on file for 6 years.

 

Both CCJ's obtained a charging order in court and then went for an order for sale, which was unsuccessful. The debts were sold by the original creditors to different DCA's. The original debts were unsecured credit card balances. We started making monthly payments around 2016. 

 

Am I correct in my understanding from what I read so far:

1. The CCJ's are no longer valid as they have expired
2. There is no longer a CCJ to enforce
3. The charging orders (restriction k's) are no longer applicable be cause we sold/moved home
4. There is very little the DCA's can do except harass and threaten us
5. I guess these are not time barred as we have been making payments

 

Ta

[dx100uk]

53 minutes ago, gtn said:

I'll need to reassure my wife who is fearful of door stepping and/or further recovery actions.

 

Any advice on potential follow up from the DCA's and how to manage it greatly appreciated.

 

a DCA is NOT A BAILIFF

and have 

ZERO legal powers on ANY debt - no matter what it's type. regardless to a CCJ existing or not.

 

1. a ccj does not expire.

2. there is.

3. never were .

4. most probably

5. once a court claim is issued the SB clock stops unless the claim is latterly disontinued.

 

as these CCJ's were never attained by the current DCA's debt owner, i doubt very much ANY paperwork now exists.

stop payments , if you are aware of who the current owner is AND you have moved and never informed them of your correct and current address IN WRITING do so to each one.

 

let see where they go.

 

dx

 

 

 

 

[gtn]

Thanks for clarifying and understood.

 

Why would I give them my new address in writing? Seems to be counter intuitive and inviting them to door step me.

 

I'm going to check who issued the CCJ's, as I cannot recall if it was the OC or the DCA. 

[dx100uk]

yes by royal mail just use their debt ref number.

state nothing else..other than please note my correct address as above re our mutual business.

 

you must NEVER run from debt

always inform debt owners of your correct and current address if you last used/paid a source of credit in say the last 7 years, else you risk backdoor CCJ's

 

dx

 

[gtn]

Noted. Interesting that CCJ's never expire even though they fall off the register/credit file record. These go back to 2007/2008, a life sentence in effect!

 

So the procedure for the 2 debts that I am currently paying monthly owned by DCA's that have CCJ's > 6 years old is write to them with my new address quoting my debt ref. # and nothing else. Stop paying them the monthly payments and wait to see what happens. In one instance it was the OC (HSBC) who obtained the CCJ, in the other it was the DCA (Arrow) who obtained the CCJ.

 

For the 3 other debts (HBOS, Arrow, CL Finance) where I have not written, communicated or paid anything since the CCJ's (all > 6 years old) and restrictions k's were obtained the procedure is:

1.  write to them with my new address quoting my debt ref. # and nothing else and wait to see what happens, OR
2. Continue ignoring them as they are not pursuing them (let sleeping dogs lie rather than running from debt)

 I note we have had a small number of debt collection letters/calls.

 

 

[dx100uk]

2 hours ago, dx100uk said:

yes by royal mail just use their debt ref number.

state nothing else..other than please note my correct address as above re our mutual business.

 

you must NEVER run from debt

always inform debt owners of your correct and current address if you last used/paid a source of credit in say the last 7 years, else you risk backdoor CCJ's

 

dx

 

 

[Badtimes123]

Just wow, everyday I read something on this forum that shocks me, fleecers EVERYWHERE.

 

Very pleased to see your posts go from negative to positive gtn!

 

As you've learned, CAG holds the truth, most other 'advice' places are mules and shills for the financial industry.

 

I've no doubt these remaining accounts will poof and disappear very soon if you keep coming back here and following the guidance at every juncture.

 

Everyone at CAG is an unpaid volunteer and the site doesn't generate a profit - consider donating should you ever be in a financial situation to do so without leaving yourself short, it really helps with costs of site hosting and maintenance.

 

This thread really made me smile, good luck closing out the remaining vultures and moving on with your life

 

BT

[gtn]

Badtimes 123, totally agree with you and glad the results made you smile.

 

I'm hoping that someone in a similar position as I was will be able to pickup this thread up and use my experience and apply it. Even if it's just the warning that NDL and CAB are really the smiling friend stabbing you in the back.

 

It has been a long and sometimes dark journey, more than a decade and still ongoing. The current status would not have been unachievable without the advice offered in this forum.

 

I'm not in a position to make a donation at this stage, but I soon will be and I certainly will do so. I revisited this thread so that I could update the forum and pass on the outcome to help someone else. Supporting the forum and its volunteers with a donation is a moral given.

 

Letters being written and will be sent with a certificate of postage obtained.  

[gtn]

I checked the CCJ's and some are showing the OC as the claimant and some are showing the DCA/new debt owner as the claimant. What difference does this make to me, and their ability to recover the debt and enforce the CCJ's?

 

For example one credit card provider issued a default notice in 2008 and then the debt was bought by Arrow who issued a CCJ, obtained judgement, then a final charging order and attempted an order for sale. We agreed a monthly payment of £70 a month on a debt of £12K. we have paid £5K and there is still £7K to pay.

 

The debt is owned by Arrow, they have a CCJ, a payment arrangement, we get letters from their legal reps and they had a restriction on our previous home. Where does that leave me once I send the new address letter and stop paying the monthly payment? Why would they just disappear and not pursue enforcement of the CCJ and possibly obtain a charging order?

 

Apologies for the questions, just trying to understand it. Thanks in advance.

[dx100uk]

it doesn't matter who the claimant was really for a CCJ's of this age.

 

as for this arrows one, it might well be the only one to possibly keep paying on, but i'd certainly drop the OD one whereby the OC got the CCJ and a DCA bought the debt.

 

[gtn]

Thanks dx100uk, your guidance and advice is greatly appreciated.

 

Ok letters in envelopes ready to go 2nd class and I will get proof of postage.

 

My wife and I had a discussion and have decided to continue paying the two we are already paying, at least for now. We will revisit in due course once we know what follow up action comes our way. Having reviewed the files/paperwork we are still getting regular letters from 4 of these and telephone calls from 1. 

 

 

[dx100uk]

I question your wisdom on paying the od ccj esp to a debt buyer.r

 

for an od for that period i bet the original sum would have undoubtedly been 90% unlawful penalty fees that if were questioned at the time could well have been removed.

 

pers i would not be paying it, if they wish to try and enforce payment, that would give you cause to have rhe sum reinvestigated. Might pay you to sar the original creditor if you dont have every statement from day one now in preparation if the dca does try anything.

 

Dx

[gtn]

Hello CAG,

 

Ok we have received a letter to our new address. The original debt was from 2006 with Yorkshire Bank who obtained a CCJ.

 

A final charging order was dismissed and we have had periodic letters offering settlement for 75% and 70%, which we could not afford.  Looking at some of those letters, they mention the original creditor as Yorkshire Bank and their client as MCE Portfolio. The latest letter refers to Yorkshire Bank with no mention of MCE Portfolio. Cabot Financial and MCE Portfolio are part of the same group of companies. The letter is asking that we set up a repayment plan via Cabot Financial. 

 

Looking at this thread and the letters, it would appear Yorkshire Bank sold the debt to MCE Portfolio and it is very unlikely that any paperwork exits to enforce the debt, except the CCJ.

1. Am I correct that Yorkshire Bank sold the debt to MCE Portfolio?
2.  Can  MCE Portfolio and/or Cabot Financial use the CCJ from Yorkshire Bank to pursue the debt?
3. In the past we have largely ignored these letters, so what are my next steps to manage this properly?

TIA and Regards

gtn

 

[dx100uk]

1.yes

2.yes

3.let it run

 

you never did list the full debt info.

so how many CCJ's exist?
you said 2

1 od

1 hsbc CC

 

this is another

OC/claimant was YB, debt latterly sold to the cabot group.

whats the debt type?

 

 

[gtn]

Hi, and thanks for the reply.

 

5 charging orders with restriction K's, 2 of which we were, and still are paying, following an attempt to obtain an Order For Sale.

 

7 CCJ's all circa 2006 to 2008 five of which obtained a final charging order, 2 of the 5 with final charging orders went for an Order For Sale but were unsuccessful. All of the debts were in sole names and unsecured made up of 5 credit cards, 1 personal loan and 1 overdraft.

 

1. £3K HSBC with final charging order (credit card)
2. £4.8K Northern Rock with final charging order (personal loan)
3. £11.6K MBNA with final charging order (credit card)
4. £12K MBNA with final charging order (credit card)
5. £9.5K HBOS with final charging order (credit card)
6. £3.2K HBOS no charging order(bank overdraft) 
7. £7.6K Yorkshire Bank no charging order (credit card)

We moved house earlier this year and the restriction K's did not impact our move.

 

Re #5 and #7 we have received letters from both now.

 

Question: What do you mean "let it run"? Does that mean ignore the letters or reply? If I need to reply, in what way, with a SAR?

[dx100uk]

you are getting a wee bit confused here.

a rest k (which can be called a charging order) cant be obtained without a CCJ being awarded first.

 

all 5 rest k's are now dead. gone parrot, even the fact they existed means nothing going fwd. neither does the orders for sale.

so it makes all your 7 CCJ's the same now, just outstanding CCJ's.

 

2 you are paying. which 2 from your list.

 

as for number 7 yes let it run do nowt.

 

[gtn]

Great, ok then that's all very good news. 

 

The 2 we are paying are:

• £3K HSBC (credit card) who got  the CCJ and then sold to MCE Portfolio
• £11.6K MBNA (credit card) sold to Arrow who got the CCJ

We only pay a small amount, that's all we can afford, and it will take years to clear them.

 

Advise noted, I will do nothing.

 

Is there a way to conclude these once and for all? 

[dx100uk]

only time is the ultimate healer here.

which is why i say see where each one goes, and what sort of willy waving they wish to do.

 

the bottom line is paying or not, paid or not, a CCJ is removed from public record after 6yrs regardless.

 

they cant become statute barred, however the longer one exists without payment, the more difficult it becomes to enforce it, esp after 6yrs.

 

and as most have already been enforced by useless restriction k's.......pigs might fly.

[gtn]

Ok, noted and thanks again.

[gtn]

Ok I'm now getting a couple of chasing letters from DCA's, some to my old address! These are redirected by Royal Mail to my new address.

 

Usual content:

• Contact us to set up a payment plan
• 25% settlement discount (pay 75%)
• Complete an income and expenditure form
• One of the letters refers to the charging order!  (on the previous property)

Do I need to write to the DCA and advise them of the new address?

Edited September 12, 2022 by gtn

[dx100uk]

Can't hurt, yes to all of them 

 

Dx

[gtn]

Thanks Dx. Just looking at the paperwork file and one of these DCA's seems to write once a year! 

[dx100uk]

well how are things...

 

did you stop paying everyone.

 

just as a side note as i've a little side project going on.

how much money (debt) got wiped out in total.??

[gtn]

Hello dx100uk,

 

All fine here under the current economic circumstances. Definitely more secure financially by selling and getting a cheaper property. We were only able to do that by managing, with the advice from CAG, the restriction K's.

 

I think if we haven't of sold and moved, we would have gone under by now given what has happened in relation to inflation and interest rates.

 

We carried on paying the two creditors that we had already made a payment arrangement with, although that is under review given the inflation impact on our finances. 

 

Nothing heard from any of the creditors except one who has been issuing lots of letters to our new address, making telephone calls, and sending text messages. We have ignored all of it.

 

They have sent Resolvecall to do a home visit. I answered the door and politely told their agent to leave, which he did after leaving a card, with a reference number asking me to call them. I haven't called and we are now getting text messages from them marked URGENT.

 

Is it written off?

 

If it were all written off, excluding the two we pay it would be circa £35K, which includes charges, interest, legal and court fees. That's the CCJ amounts.

 

Sorry make that £51.7K in total.

 

Here's an update on the 7 CCJ's / 5 restriction K's

1. £3K HSBC with final charging order (credit card)                                                           STILL PAYING A SMALL MONTHLY AMOUNT. RECEIVED LETTERS AND A STATMENT TO MY OLD ADDRESS, REDIRECTED BY ROYAL MAIL. NO OTHER ACTIVITY.
2. £4.8K Northern Rock with final charging order (personal loan)                                  JUST AN ANNUAL STATEMENT TO MY OLD ADDRESS REDIRECTED BY ROYAL MAIL. NO OTHER ACTIVITY.
3. £11.6K MBNA with final charging order (credit card)                                                   STILL PAYING A SMALL MONTHLY AMOUNT. OCASSIONAL LETTERS.
4. £12K MBNA with final charging order (credit card).                                                                STILL WRITING (ANNUAL LETTER) TO MY OLD ADDRESS (REDIRECTED BY ROYAL MAIL) AND REFERENCING THE FINAL CHARGING ORDER.
5. £9.5K HBOS with final charging order (credit card)                                                REGULAR LETTERS, CALLS AND TEXT MESSAGES. SENT A DCA TO DO A HOME VISIT, WHO I TOLD TO LEAVE. STILL SENDING TEXT MESSAGES.
6. £3.2K HBOS no charging order(bank overdraft)                                                                      NOTHING HEARD.
7. £7.6K Yorkshire Bank no charging order (credit card)                                                           REGULAR LETTERS VARYING FROM 1 A MONTH TO 1 EVERY 3 MONTHS TO NEW ADDRESS.
8.  

Having reread the whole thread I guess I still do nothing and see what action/follow up is taken if any.

Is that correct, especially in relation to #5?

[dx100uk]

you need to be writing to each simply informing them of your correct and current address

never run from debt.

 

as for the resolvecall visit well done.

 

dx