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    • I do disagree with you regarding one thing - we are not very good with letters or these situations and are slow on the uptake. So far you have stood up to Excel and their threats, immediately given us the information in the sticky, done loads of reading up to educate yourselves, learnt from the mistake of outing the driver so you'll know not to do so in the future, got on to the organ grinder to try to get them to call off their dogs, etc., etc.  Good grief - we wish everyone who came here would do this!!! Most people who get these invoices sadly think they have been fined and if they don't pay a drone from Ukraine will be diverted and will fall on their home (or some such vague grand apocalyptic threat) and they fold and give in.  You haven't.  Well done. Don't worry - you won't be paying a penny.  Although it will take some time to see off this vile company.
    • Spot on!  You learn quickly. Who cares if the case gets sent to debt collectors?  They have no powers.  All the effort you will have to put in will be to open envelopes - and then spend time laughing at their daft "threats".  No stress at all!
    • I did ask them why, but seems they have more spare cash than we do .. ;-( .. I doubt their bank would even support a chargeback after a year has passed. Anyway I've constructed my first DRAFT Snotty Letter .. so here goes ..   RE: PCN 4xxxxx Dear ALLIANCE PARKING Litigation Dept, Thank you for your dubious Letter Of Claim (dated 29th April 2024) of £100 for just 2 minutes of overstay. The family rolled around on the floor in amazement of the idea you actually think they’d accept this nonsense, let alone being confused over the extra unlawful £70 you had added. Shall we raise that related VAT issue with HMRC, or perhaps the custodians of the unicorn grain silos? Apart from the serious GDPR breach you’ve made with the DVLA and your complete failure in identifying the driver, we’re dumbfounded that the PCN is still not compliant with the PoFA (2012 Schedule 4 Under Section 9.2.f) even after 12 years of pathetic trial and error. We also doubt a judge would be very impressed at your bone idleness and lack of due diligence regarding the ANPR entry / exit periods compared with actual valid parking periods. Especially with no consideration of the legally allowed grace periods and the topological nature of the Cornish landscape versus a traditional multi-storey. And don’t even get us started on the invisible signage during the ultra busy bank holiday carnage, that is otherwise known as the random parking chaos in the several unmarked over-spill fields, or indeed the tedious “frustration of contract” attempting to get a data connection to Justpark.  We suggest your clients drop this extreme foolishness or get an absolute hammering in court. We are more than ready to raise the issues with a fair minded judge, who will most likely laugh your clients out in less time than it takes to capture more useless ANPR photos. We will of course be requesting “an unreasonable costs order” under CPR 27.14.2.g and put it toward future taxis to Harlyn Bay instead.  We all look forward to your clients' deafening silence. Legal Counsel on behalf of the Vehicle Keeper.  
    • Hi,t I'm not sure if I'm posting in the right subsection but General Retail appears to be the closest to it I think... About a year and a half ago I got a new phone so I listed my iPhone 10 on eBay.  The listed stated 'UK only' and 'no returns accepted'. Considering I had had the phone for about 4 years, I myself was amazed that I had kept it in such good condition all that time - apart from being slightly scuffed around the charging port there was absolutely nothing wrong with it. It had the original box, its unopened original Apple cable, plug, and earbuds, and I threw in a case for it and It had always had a screen protector on it. Someone wanted it from Armenia, and I stupidly agreed to it.  She paid and I sent it off, fully insured. Not long after she received it, she sent a message saying it 'was not as described', so I asked to see photos of whatever was the problem.  She sent two photographs of the box.  Just the box.  I said I wasn't even going to consider refunding her unless she told me what she meant by 'not as described'.  I thought, if it's been damaged in transit, then it would be covered by the insurance. Anyway, she didn't respond at all, even though I had messaged her several times, so she opened a case with eBay. I have sold a fair few things of mine on eBay in the past buy had never had had anyone come back to me asking for a refund.  I got in touch with eBay several times by phone and by email, and found out they always side with the buyer, no matter what with their 'eBay Seller Guarantee'.  She had been told she could keep the phone and told me they would recover the money from me from my account blah blah.  So I unlinked all of my cards etc and changed my bank account to one that I never use with no money in it. My account got suspended.  I continued to try to explain to eBay that I had been scammed but I got nowhere. My account was permanently inaccessible by this point. I reported the phone stolen and the IMEI blacklisted but I'm not sure if that would make any difference being in Armenia, but it was all I could think of to piss the buyer off. A couple of months later I was contacted by email by a debt recovery company (I can' remember who now), to whom I explained I will not discuss the matter with them until I had received an SAR I had requested from eBay. As I could no longer access my account, I couldn't review the communication I needed to show I was not in the wrong. The SAR was produced but I was advised that the information I was looking for would not be included but I said I wanted it anyway.  There were so many codes etc. and hoops to jump through to access it, that even after trying whilst on the phone to them, I still couldn't get into it, so I never got to see it in the end.  I think they said they would send the code by post but they never did and I forgot about it after a while. I've just come across a couple of emails from Moorgroup, asking me to phone them to discuss a private matter regarding eBay.  I haven't replied or done anything at all yet.  The amount they are trying to recover from me is £200ish from what I remember. I know it's not that much but I don't want to pay the b*astards on general principle. I've had a lot of useful advice from CAG in the past about debt collectors but it has always been about being chased by creditors, I've never been in this situation before. I don't know what power they legally have to recover the 'debt', and most importantly, I am two years into a DRO, and the last thing I want is another CCJ to shake off if I'm cutting my nose off to spite my face.   Any advice gratefully received!!
    • Hi, I have the Sims 4 on Macbook. Over the last year I have paid for multiple add on packs spending a lot of money on them. I bought them all in good faith as my Mac met all the minimum requirements to play them. I have been playing happily for about a year and bought my latest pack just over a week ago. The games were all working fine yesterday. Then suddenly today EA released a new app to launch the games and this new app requires a MAC OS that my computer cannot use. Now suddenly none of my games are accessible and I am unable to play anything. They did not warn us about this change in requirements and if I had known they would be doing this I wouldn't have bought all these add ons as they are now all totally unusable. The games themselves have not changed, only their app to launch them and I can't afford to buy a brand new mac just to play. So my question is how can they change the minimum requirements after I have paid for a game? I agreed to pay for them based on the fact my mac met their requirements and was not informed when purchasing that this would be an issue in the future. I understand new games (like Sims 5 which is to be released next year) might not be compatible but this is a 10yr old game that they have suddenly made inaccessible due to their new launch app. Does anybody know if I can do anything or anyway to get a partial refund from them? Thanks   Here are their T&C... I can't find anything in there about them being able to do this so not sure what to do https://tos.ea.com/legalapp/WEBTERMS/US/en/PC/
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
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Your parking ticket may be unlawful


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Thanks Seylectric, but can they claim that a contract was in place if they have posted a notice? I have looked on the net today, and it seems that they are marketing themselves to companies who have parkking problems.

 

Can we go at these companies for harassment under the Administration of Justice Act?

 

Having telephoned them, they are running scared, so obviously you guys have done the business.

 

Anyone got a template letter for private companies?

 

Many thanks JonCris

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Just a quick couple questions about a PCN.

 

If it states that:

 

"Parking Attendant 1781 has reasonable cause to beleive that a penalty charge has been incurred: Parked for longer than permitted"

 

 

Code: 30

 

Shouldnt the ticked be accompanied by a table of code, corralating the Contravaention code to a description of the contravention.

 

 

Also, when the tickets concerns a waiting period. Should it state the first time in which the car was seen and the time in which the contrvsention was beleived to have occured.

 

 

 

Also, does it definetly have to have the coulr of the car on the ticket (if it already has the reg and make?)

 

 

Also, can a PCN have "Date of notice/issue" on the ticket. Should it have one or the other, not both?

 

 

Sorry, more than just a couple.

 

 

 

Cheers,

 

James

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Hi all. A little advise if possible.

A friend of mine has had with a PCN Issued by Vincipark services UK Limited working on behalf of Bexley Council.

The notice was fixed to the windscreen with the following details:

 

PCN number: XL4002220A

Date of contravention: 28/01/07

Dat of notice: 28/01/07

Vehicle Registration: *******

Excise NUMBER: - - -

Make: VAUXHALL

Location:GROSVENOR RD, B'HEATH

Noticed at: 14:44

Issued at: 14:45

By parking attendant: BL300

Signature: ..........

Who has reason to belive that the following contravention of the parking regulations had occurred:

622

Parkeded with one or more wheels on any part of an urban road other than a carriageway (partylyon footway)

The owner of the vehicle is liable to pay the penaly charge:

 

THE LOACTION IS WRONG THOUGH THEY WERE IN OLRON CRESCENT B'HEATH WHICH IS THE NEXT ROAD.

 

This was signed with no details left blank.

As far as I know they haven't paid it yet, any advice would be fantasic.

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Hi all. A little advise if possible.

A friend of mine has had with a PCN Issued by Vincipark services UK Limited working on behalf of Bexley Council.

The notice was fixed to the windscreen with the following details:

 

PCN number: XL4002220A

Date of contravention: 28/01/07

Dat of notice: 28/01/07

Vehicle Registration: *******

Excise NUMBER: - - -

Make: VAUXHALL

Location:GROSVENOR RD, B'HEATH

Noticed at: 14:44

Issued at: 14:45

By parking attendant: BL300

Signature: ..........

Who has reason to belive that the following contravention of the parking regulations had occurred:

622

Parkeded with one or more wheels on any part of an urban road other than a carriageway (partylyon footway)

The owner of the vehicle is liable to pay the penaly charge:

 

THE LOACTION IS WRONG THOUGH THEY WERE IN OLRON CRESCENT B'HEATH WHICH IS THE NEXT ROAD.

 

This was signed with no details left blank.

As far as I know they haven't paid it yet, any advice would be fantasic.

 

Appeal informally to the effect that the contravention could not have occurred as the vehicle was parked in Olron Crescent at the time it was alleged to have been ticketed in Grosvenor Road.

 

They cannot now issue a ticket for any offence on Olron Crescent as the PCN must be affixed to the vehicle or handed to the driver

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Hi, having parked in a hopsital carpark (bay) for an outpatients appiontment useing my disabled blue badge, I returned to my car to find a warning notice on it (similar looking to a parking ticket) stateing that if I was going to use my blue badge again I can only use it in disable bays. I cannnot use it to park anywhere else I.E. on site. Therefor if the disabled bays are full (and there are only six of them) then I must purchase a parking ticket or face the usual penalty. My question is can this be enforced or is it simple another jobsworth

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I would love to know the answer to this. I was at Preston Royal hospital last week, you know how it is, huge site, not enough parking spaces, double yellow lines on every available bit of tarmac that wasn't a designated payable car parking space, and "wardens" going around the grounds ticketing those who had parked on the lines because there was simply nowhere else to go.

 

"Enforcement" was by a private company, not the same private company that Preston Council use and no obvious signage that this wasn't a council-controlled area (i.e. not falling within the realms of the 1991 Road Traffic Act.

 

Given that this is surely not private land nor police or council controlled, does the NHS hospital have the right to impose the rules that the RTA encompass and does a private company have any legal right to impose a "parking fine" upon us?

 

I didn't get a ticket personally, just as well as it's more hassle I can do without right now but I would certainly be writing to them and asking under what law or what legislation were they using to legally issue you with a parking fine.

 

Sorry, dress it up any way you like but for me a PCN is a fine whatever they may choose to call it. That's not right, no offence, and no victim = no justification whatsoever.

I only mouth my opinion, please look elsewhere for sensible advice! :)

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My gren car was incorrectly stated as 'dark' on a PCN.I appealed and they rejected saying it was difficult to correctly state the colour of the car because it was dark.Car was parked in a Controlled Parking Zone, seen at 6.45pm. The nearest sign say 'Pay as display 8.00am -6.30pm and match days'.I parked on match day.The sign does not say 'Match day 8.00am to 10pm, as replied by the council.What Act, or legislation should I quote to say ticket is invalid with incorrect colour of vehicle.They argued in the letter saying colour of vehicle does not make the ticket invalid.Help pliz

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Does anyone know what the Excise Licence number on a pcn is for. I have a parking ticket which is set out like this

 

PCN Number: xxxxxxxx Date of Notice: 03/06/06

The motor vehicle with

 

Registration Number:xxxxxxx Excise Licence Number: 0547169800

Make:xxxxxxxx Expiry Date: 31/05/2006

Colour: xxxxxxxxxxx

Was seen at location: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

From: To: at 10:29 on 03/06/06

 

By Parking Attendant No: EN633 Signature:

Who believed that the following contravention was being committed

 

Parked with one or more wheels on any part of an urban road other then a carriageway (footway parking)

 

Code: 62

 

Expiry time on pay and display ticket (If Applicable):

A penalty charge of £80 is now payable and must be paid before the end of the period of 28 days beginning with the date of this notice. If it is paid before the end of the period of 14 days beginning with the date of this noticethe amount payable is reduced to £40.00

 

I have no idea what the Excise Licence Number is but it expired prior to the date of the ticket being issued.

 

Is this ticket valid and enforcable

Adles

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My green car was incorrectly stated as 'dark' on a PCN.I appealed and they rejected saying it was difficult to correctly state the colour of the car because it was dark.Car was parked in a Controlled Parking Zone, seen at 6.45pm. The nearest sign say 'Pay as display 8.00am -6.30pm and match days'.I parked on match day.The sign does not say 'Match day 8.00am to 10pm, as replied by the council.What Act, or legislation should I quote to say ticket is invalid with incorrect colour of vehicle.They argued in the letter saying colour of vehicle does not make the ticket invalid.Help pliz

 

Jachu, ready your posting makes me very angry because I realise that I too would fallen foul by this poor signage. I wonder just how many motorists even know what a "match day" is in relation to parking rules. It took me two decades of motoring to come across the term two years ago and I promtly fell foul of it because the signage is not self explanatory. The fine cost me £50.00 because at the time I was not yet angry enough to appeal every ticket.

 

Since 2005/6 I appeal ALL tickets. I, like many morists think that enforcent is now so overzealous that we must oppose the system (it's all abput money). I don't get many tickets because I respect RT rules (most are there for good reason) and so far I have won all appeals :-)

 

The absence of the timed restriction for "match day" if unfair bordering on entrapment. I would fight this ticket on this basis.

 

By going to a personal appeal hearing you might even find out that the adjudicator is well aware of poor signage and they may have made many recommendations for this to be improved - just to be completely ignored by the local council. And believe me, adjudicators are very unhappy because councils ignore recommendations notoriously. To my surprise I have won an appeal against TFL on this basis (driving through what appears to be just a bus stop at then of a bus lane). The adjudicator was fully aware of the lack of signage at the point where I contravened the bus lane rules.

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It's my understanding that the colour is only given for guidance and is not compulsory, indeed a lot of parking tickets don't indicate a colour, so forget that one.

 

As for the signage, take your case to NPAS together with a photograph of the signage and fight it on the basis that the sign indicated you were allowed to park on match days regardless of the time and you were!

 

If you were only supposed to park around the time of the event the sign is unclear, that's a good enough basis to fight.

 

Don't worry about the rejection, everything is rejeted by the council first time because they know most people wil pay up rather than fight; most people don't even know about NPAS, it's never been mentioned in any of the literature I have received from the council, so presumably people are expected to find out for themselves. don't expect them to play fair, after all it's your money that they're after so they won't give in just like that. NPAS on the other hand have to abide by the law and generally do so whereas the councils just flaunt it knowing most people will give in and pay up.

 

Disgusting I know but that's what we're up against. No justification for an £80 or even £40 penalty anyway just for parking your car, what makes it OK at certain times and wrong at other times? Complete farce.

I only mouth my opinion, please look elsewhere for sensible advice! :)

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Jachu, ready your posting makes me very angry because I realise that I too would fallen foul by this poor signage. I wonder just how many motorists even know what a "match day" is in relation to parking rules. It took me two decades of motoring to come across the term two years ago and I promtly fell foul of it because the signage is not self explanatory. The fine cost me £50.00 because at the time I was not yet angry enough to appeal every ticket.

 

Since 2005/6 I appeal ALL tickets. I, like many morists think that enforcent is now so overzealous that we must oppose the system (it's all abput money). I don't get many tickets because I respect RT rules (most are there for good reason) and so far I have won all appeals :-)

 

The absence of the timed restriction for "match day" if unfair bordering on entrapment. I would fight this ticket on this basis.

 

By going to a personal appeal hearing you might even find out that the adjudicator is well aware of poor signage and they may have made many recommendations for this to be improved - just to be completely ignored by the local council. And believe me, adjudicators are very unhappy because councils ignore recommendations notoriously. To my surprise I have won an appeal against TFL on this basis (driving through what appears to be just a bus stop at then of a bus lane). The adjudicator was fully aware of the lack of signage at the point where I contravened the bus lane rules.

 

Thanks Kbh.The council's letter states that the regulations says they should only display information about the times and dates of match days at the entrance to the Controlled Parking Zones only.Council states that the regulations does not state that they should display more information once they are inside the CPZs, thats why there was a pay and display time from 08.00 am to 6.30pm monday to saturday 'and match days'.Problem is that these big CPZ signs at the entrance are perhaps half a mile or more.They are the signs with more parking information, like match days 8am to 10pm.But these smaller signs with 'and match days' are closer to parking bays but they have limited information(no time limits after 6.30pm yet they are more convenient to motorists).

When council say regulations, they are referring to the Department for Transport(Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2002), is that right.If right, then this Department for Transport informed councils not to display match days parking enforcement times along with the Park and display signage.So does that means we have to appeal to the DfT for these signage to be changed.Council is arguing saying I should have seen the Controlled Parking Zones time at the entrance to the CPZ, but I did not see this sign.I toured the site again and noted there is a CPZ sign at the corner but its on one side.The road is branching from a dual carriageway.A rough reading of 2002 regulations talk about direction 8(4), which confused me.

Do I have any chance of winning or I should pay discounted £30

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The whole issue of parking fines disgusts me, not just because of lack of signage or whatever but the whole overzealous pursuit of our money when in most cases absolutely no harm is being done to anyone, thuse there is no reason to fine anyone in the first place regardless of correct signage or not.

 

Why have my local council put double yellow lines in a smal cul-de-sac with no houses? Why in a lay-by which serves no other purpose (disused former bus stop, lines renewed since it ceased to be used as a bus stop).

 

Weren't parking restrictions brought in to prevent motorists causing an obstuction or to prevent parking where there is a safety hazard? Where's the bloody hazard parking in a disused lay-by or cul-de-sac? Where's the actual victim, the "crime" that warrants a "fine" if you overstay a parking meter by a few minutes? There isn't one!

 

It needs to stop, there has to be a MAJOR review but of course because of the value to local councils it just gets worse.

 

In the meantime, KEEP FIGHTING!

I only mouth my opinion, please look elsewhere for sensible advice! :)

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"Do I have any chance of winning or I should pay discounted £30"

 

From reading the details cleary this is a difficult case. But as I understand the current system of fine discounting, the amount of the fine will be determined on when you appeal. So, if you start to appeal in the discounted period it will be the discounted amount and the end of the appeal. If you appeal later it will be the full amount. Could more knowlegeable forum member please add clarity by confirming or denying this.

 

It irks me that so many motorists do not appeal for fear that they will have to pay the full amount of the fine. It strikes me that this kind of intimidation works all to well against motorists :-(

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My gren car was incorrectly stated as 'dark' on a PCN.I appealed and they rejected saying it was difficult to correctly state the colour of the car because it was dark.Car was parked in a Controlled Parking Zone, seen at 6.45pm. The nearest sign say 'Pay as display 8.00am -6.30pm and match days'.I parked on match day.The sign does not say 'Match day 8.00am to 10pm, as replied by the council.What Act, or legislation should I quote to say ticket is invalid with incorrect colour of vehicle.They argued in the letter saying colour of vehicle does not make the ticket invalid.Help pliz

 

Why dont you ask to see the Traffic regulation order that refers to this area. I did the same with a PCN and found it to be completely wrong in almost all aspects. They are generally available online if not a FIA request to the council will get them for you.

7 actions in progress

 

amount refunded so far £6500

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P.S.

Are there any guidelines on how to word my appeal letter?

 

Try this.

 

Dear Sirs,

 

I am seeking the restitution of £XXX paid by mistake on xx/xx/xx by me. The mistake was induced by your actions where you placed on my car on xx/xx/xx a notice demanding this sum, the notice purporting to be a Penalty Charge Notice issued under the Road Traffic Act 1991. I attach a copy of this notice. This notice is actually not a Penalty Charge Notice as it does not conform to the requirements of the regulations in that it does not specify a date of XXXXXXXXX Since the notice is invalid it is a nullity, void ab initio with no legal force, non compliant and the demand for payment made by yoursleves on the notice is invalid. At the time I was not aware of this and was induced by its purported official character to make the payment to you for which I am now seeking restitution.

 

I now have the benefit of the ruling by Mr Justice Jackson of 02/08/06 in Barnet v Parking Adjudicator [2006] EWHC 2357 (Admin) which now provides a definitive ruling on the requirements of a Penalty Charge Notice and the effects of a notice which fails to conform to the regulations. At para. 36 he states 'It seems to me that section 66 requires two dates to be stated on a PCN. These are the date of the contravention and the date of the notice' and at para. 41 'The 1991 Act creates a scheme for the civil enforcement of parking control. Under this scheme, motorists become liable to pay financial penalties when certain specified statutory conditions are met. If the statutory conditions are not met, then the financial liability does not arise.' also on the PCN the Colour of the vehicle is worded as YELLOW when it is in fact Green, the colour of the vehicle can be verified by the relevant vehicle documents of which I hold and these can be confirmed by DVLA Swansea, another problem with the PCN which invalidates it on it's own is that the Parking Attendant has not validated the PCN by signing or initialing it, there is nothing there. the PCN is non compliant so does not conform to the 1991 Road Traffic Act 1991

 

The full transcript is availiable at

 

London Borough of Barnet Council, R (on the application of) v The Parking Adjudicator [2006] EWHC 2357 (Admin) (02 August 2006)

 

If the amount for which I am seeking restitution is paid within 14 days of the date of receipt of this letter I am prepared to accept, without prejudice to my rights, restitution of the GBP XXXX alone without interest or costs. Take notice however that if this sum is not paid and I am required to take further action I will seek restitution of the sum plus interest from the date I made the payment plus costs, including those I have incurred to date.

 

Yours Faithfully

 

 

XXXXXXXXXX

 

I was issued a pcn a while back and asked for advice on this forum, as the ticket didnt have a date of issue, didnt state colour of vehicle and didnt have a signiture from the traffic attendant. I was advised to appeal and i used used the above letter ( with a few minor changes) to appeal the ticket.

 

Today i recieved a letter from TRETHOWANS solicitors saying that i should pay the £80 within 14 days or court proceedings will be issued against me. Along with a warning that i will have to pay interest, court fees and costs. There is no referance to the letter which i sent them.

 

What do i do now ?

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[quote name=

I was issued a pcn a while back and asked for advice on this forum, as the ticket didnt have a date of issue, didnt state colour of vehicle and didnt have a signiture from the traffic attendant. I was advised to appeal and i used used the above letter ( with a few minor changes) to appeal the ticket.

 

Today i recieved a letter from TRETHOWANS solicitors saying that i should pay the £80 within 14 days or court proceedings will be issued against me. Along with a warning that i will have to pay interest, court fees and costs. There is no referance to the letter which i sent them.

 

What do i do now ?[/quote]

 

 

I had a CHARGE NOTICE in 2003 for overstaying in a supermarket car park. Duly ignored it to be followed by a threatening letter from TRETHOWANS. I then looked up the "Voluntary Code of Practice for Private Car Parking Enforcement" on the DVLA web site.

 

I realised that the self adhesive plastic envelope used to stick the charge notice on my windscreen did contravene the law because it said "WARNING IT IS AN OFFENCE FOR ANY PERSON OTHER THAN THE DRIVER TO REMOVE THIS NOTICE"

This is clearly not true as they have no legal powers of enforcement. This is a civil matter. However impersonating a legal authority is an imprisonable offence. I wrote a stern letter to that effect and never heard from them again.

 

I think you need to go back over the original details to pick holes. IMHO the Trethowans solicitors letter is just standard intimidation to bully you into paying up. Even if I were not to find any holes in their case I would be inclined to just ignore them. They might not even bother to take you to court.

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Try this.

 

Dear Sirs,

 

I am seeking the restitution of £XXX paid by mistake on xx/xx/xx by me. The mistake was induced by your actions where you placed on my car on xx/xx/xx a notice demanding this sum, the notice purporting to be a Penalty Charge Notice issued under the Road Traffic Act 1991. I attach a copy of this notice. This notice is actually not a Penalty Charge Notice as it does not conform to the requirements of the regulations in that it does not specify a date of XXXXXXXXX Since the notice is invalid it is a nullity, void ab initio with no legal force, non compliant and the demand for payment made by yoursleves on the notice is invalid. At the time I was not aware of this and was induced by its purported official character to make the payment to you for which I am now seeking restitution.

 

I now have the benefit of the ruling by Mr Justice Jackson of 02/08/06 in Barnet v Parking Adjudicator [2006] EWHC 2357 (Admin) which now provides a definitive ruling on the requirements of a Penalty Charge Notice and the effects of a notice which fails to conform to the regulations. At para. 36 he states 'It seems to me that section 66 requires two dates to be stated on a PCN. These are the date of the contravention and the date of the notice' and at para. 41 'The 1991 Act creates a scheme for the civil enforcement of parking control. Under this scheme, motorists become liable to pay financial penalties when certain specified statutory conditions are met. If the statutory conditions are not met, then the financial liability does not arise.' also on the PCN the Colour of the vehicle is worded as YELLOW when it is in fact Green, the colour of the vehicle can be verified by the relevant vehicle documents of which I hold and these can be confirmed by DVLA Swansea, another problem with the PCN which invalidates it on it's own is that the Parking Attendant has not validated the PCN by signing or initialing it, there is nothing there. the PCN is non compliant so does not conform to the 1991 Road Traffic Act 1991

 

The full transcript is availiable at

 

London Borough of Barnet Council, R (on the application of) v The Parking Adjudicator [2006] EWHC 2357 (Admin) (02 August 2006)

 

If the amount for which I am seeking restitution is paid within 14 days of the date of receipt of this letter I am prepared to accept, without prejudice to my rights, restitution of the GBP XXXX alone without interest or costs. Take notice however that if this sum is not paid and I am required to take further action I will seek restitution of the sum plus interest from the date I made the payment plus costs, including those I have incurred to date.

 

Yours Faithfully

 

 

XXXXXXXXXX

 

I was issued a pcn a while back and asked for advice on this forum, as the ticket didnt have a date of issue, didnt state colour of vehicle and didnt have a signiture from the traffic attendant. I was advised to appeal and i used used the above letter ( with a few minor changes) to appeal the ticket.

 

Today i recieved a letter from TRETHOWANS solicitors saying that i should pay the £80 within 14 days or court proceedings will be issued against me. Along with a warning that i will have to pay interest, court fees and costs. There is no referance to the letter which i sent them.

 

What do i do now ?

 

Dude

 

You have confussed me completely.

 

If you have received a PCN issued under the 1991 RTA by a council or its representatives ( NCP) then there is a set down way to appeal which is clearly outlined on the ticket and this forum.

 

If it is a PCN issued by a private company then there is lots of advice on this forum regarding how to deal with it but in summary dont pay it and set the company to prove that you parked it there.

 

If it is a Parking ticket issued by a Police officer of Traffic warden under the 1984 RTA it is different again and you need to do some research.

 

Im not sure why you have sent a letter seeking restitution on a PCN that you appear not to have paid. I am also unsure as to why you have received a solicitors letter threatening court action unless this is a ticket issued for parking on private land.

 

You need to clarify these few points and if possible scan the ticket on here so that you can receive the correct advice

7 actions in progress

 

amount refunded so far £6500

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Hi, I have put up a new thread for this but should of put it here.

 

Hi,

 

I went to look at a flat that I'm buying and next to it is a larger car park owned by a casino. I parked there (1 of 2 cars in the whole carpark) only for a few minute while I went into the flat to take some measurements.

 

I came out to find a ticket on the car, the ticket has been issued by "Security International Group" and the box ticked says "Your vehicle was not displaying a valid car parking permit/ticket all permits must be authorised by S.I.G.

 

1: I am a member of the casino

2: The reg they put on the ticket has the last didgit as a "O" when mine is a "C".

 

The fine is £120 or £60 if I pay within 14 days.

 

If they have got the reg wrong then they won't be able to get my address however, I don't know if they have done this on purpose and still have my actual reg (maybe photo) and are hoping I don't do anything so they get the £120.

 

Can anyone help. I'll post up pics of ticket if needed.

 

Thanks

 

Martin

 

I have noticed reading this that the envelope used to stick to the screen said the norm "offence to remove" there is also no sig on the ticket.

Shall I wait to see if anthing happens first.

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Hi Martin,

You should ask the club to waive the ticket. I am sure they can. It's a goodwill issue.

Bear in mind that they cannot fine you. They have no authority and they will have a difficulty to enforce this if they can't even get the reg right.

So, I would just wait and see if they send you a solicitors letter. But this will probably go to some other unsuspecting motorist who's the got the reg on your ticket.

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Hi All,

 

I have learnt a lot from this thread, but the most concerning is the ease at which people can get your address and other personal details from the DVLA.

 

Does anybody know what you have to do to satisfy the DVLA that it is safe for them to provide peoples personal information to an organisation / person? Is this a chargeable service? Are they acting within current legislation?

 

Is this not simply dangerous, that somebody can get your address from a registration. What about the recent scams where the thieves take your car with the keys in it - the insurance are refusing to pay out as you left the keys in - and they can get your address from your reg when your house key is on the same keyring!!

 

What about road rage - somebody outside of authority could get your address.

 

Does anybody know what the criteria is for people allowed access to this information?

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You have to provide "reasonable cause" to DVLA before they will give out the details of the registered keeper. However, their intepretation of that is variable. Their understanding of the Data Protection Act is also at odds with most.

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You need to clarify these few points and if possible scan the ticket on here so that you can receive the correct advice

 

Sorry for the confusion, as i said i did make a few changes to draft that xipetotec46 kindly posted.

 

Here is a copy of what i sent them,

 

Dear Sirs,

 

CP PLUS LTD placed a £80 Penalty Charge Notice on my Vehicle on 29/12/06 demanding this sum, the notice purporting to be a Penalty Charge Notice issued under the Road Traffic Act 1991. This notice is actually not a Penalty Charge Notice as it does not conform to the requirements of the regulations in that it does not specify an issue date of 29/12/06. Since the notice is invalid it is a nullity, void ab initio with no legal force, non compliant and the demand for payment made by yoursleves on the notice is invalid. At the time I was not aware of this and was induced by its purported official character to make the payment, thankfully i didn`t.

 

I now have the benefit of the ruling by Mr Justice Jackson of 02/08/06 in Barnet v Parking Adjudicator [2006] EWHC 2357 (Admin) which now provides a definitive ruling on the requirements of a Penalty Charge Notice and the effects of a notice which fails to conform to the regulations. At para. 36 he states 'It seems to me that section 66 requires two dates to be stated on a PCN. These are the date of the contravention and the date of the notice' and at para. 41 'The 1991 Act creates a scheme for the civil enforcement of parking control. Under this scheme, motorists become liable to pay financial penalties when certain specified statutory conditions are met. If the statutory conditions are not met, then the financial liability does not arise.' also on the PCN the Colour of the vehicle is not disclosed, the colour of the vehicle can be verified by the relevant vehicle documents of which I hold and these can be confirmed by DVLA Swansea, another problem with the PCN which invalidates it on it's own is that the Parking Attendant has not validated the PCN by signing or initialing it, there is nothing there. the PCN is non compliant so does not conform to the 1991 Road Traffic Act 1991

 

The full transcript is availiable at

 

London Borough of Barnet Council, R (on the application of) v The Parking Adjudicator [2006] EWHC 2357 (Admin) (02 August 2006)

 

I have enlcosed the in question Penalty Cahrge Notice, however the document has been photocopied.

 

Yours Faithfully

 

The ticket was issed to me for parking on a service station by the private company CP PLUS LTD. I sent the letter to the address supplied on the ticket for paying the fine. There was no other address supplied for an appeal. Maybe it didnt get to them, shall i send a copy of the above letter to the solicitors?

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