Asbestos

[Sparks_]

I am looking for some advice on behalf of my daughter.

 

When she went to work today she and other employees have been informed half of the building where she works has been condemned due to asbestos being in the air, but they have been told where my daughter works in the building that it is safe as the levels are only low,

is there an actual safe level of asbestos or are they putting my daughters and others health at risk?

[ericsbrother]

yes, there are TLV's and OEL's for asbestos, it is somehting like 5 particles per cc of air at the source

but this is probably clashing with the overall exposure limit, which I dont know.

 

 

Problem is that asbestosis only kicks in after about 20 years after the exposure and that there are many envoronmental and other contributing factors

 

 

for example, if a peson is a smoker and is exposed to asbestos for any appreciable length of time then the chances of getting mersothelioma, lung cancer or asbestosis is close to 100%.

 

 

Trouble again is that the people measured in this way live on top of old asbestos mines or in localities were fibrous pyriboles outcrop at the surface such as in parts of Turkey, Canada etc.

 

so safe level?

she should ask what the measured readings are and ask who did the sampling and do they still have the micoscope slides of the particles extracted from the collecting filters so she can ask for an independent opinion if necessary

[Sparks_]

Unfortunately, management is absent today! No one is giving out information or advice. All they know is half of the building they work in has been sealed off due to asbestos

[honeybee13]

Have the HSE been involved, Sparks?

 

HB

[honeybee13]

The HSE have a lot of information on their website, here's a link to one of their pages.

 

http://www.hse.gov.uk/asbestos/faq.htm

 

HB

[Sparks_]

My daughters knows nothing else, no info has been given out, just a message that was informally passed around.

[mariner51]

Union involvement?

[steampowered]

The NHS website says 'you would need prolonged exposure to asbestos fibres, usually over many years, before you develop asbestosis.' (http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Asbestosis/Pages/Introduction.aspx)

 

It doesn't sound like there is a need for immediate panic but obviously this should be dealt with over the long term.

[sangie5952]

I have some experience of dealing with similar situations

- albeit a long time ago now, nothing much has changed.

 

There are different types of asbestos - it isn't just one thing.

If I recall correctly, there are several types, and whilst all are dangerous, there are varying degrees.

 

So really, her first step (assuming she has no union to do it) is to ask what type of asbestos is identified and the specific risk factors associated with it.

The employer should be issuing guidance and advising staff on what, if anything, they need to do.

 

"It's only low" isn't an adequate answer - how do they know that, what is the best way of reducing any risk, and what not to do are all things the employer should be managing.

 

For example, in the case I dealt with exactly the same thing was said (i.e. not a lot) and it turned out that the levels of asbestos in the air were low - unfortunately, the same couldn't be said for the levels of asbestos in the ground, and as a result the whole site was contaminated.

 

Brown asbestos is critically unsafe - at any level of concentration.

Blue never breaks down ever when it enters the body. And I forget the rest!!!

 

But in her shoes, whilst I would not be unduly panicking,

I do think that I would be insisting on a much better amount of information.

[Sparks_]

Thanks I have passed your information to her, plus the links given in the other posts

[ericsbrother]

the particularly nasty type is chrysotile or blue asbestos, because of its common colour.

There were different TLV's in the UK for blue and other asbestos but that was back in the 1980's when I was working in a building that was having its asbestos stripped and as said, the amount per litre of air/day etc has largely been replaced with an overall exposure level but even that doesnt tell the full story.

 

 

2 of my ex colleagues died of mesothelioma,

one was a smoker for 25 years after his exposure when he worked in a power station (died 40 years after working there)

and the other a non smoker with asthma who had a single exposure to a cloud of asbestos dust plus probable low dose exposures during his career as a designer of heating systems that required site visits.

 

Sangie is right about the blue asbestos never breaking down in the body,

it does its damage because of the size of the fibres and their aspect ratio-length to width- getting them deep into the lings where the bodys immume system tries to fight them but the phages that attack foreign material like bacteria, bits of organic debris and even ordinary dust acb break them down and you then get clusters of these phages being attacked by other immune response proteins and cells such as T cells

 

 

eventually this fight to the death first clogs the lungs (so you can see the shadows on x-rays) and eventually all of that irritaion causes the ever renewing cells to change and you get cancer.

 

Identification of the fibres is usually done with a polarising microscope, the fibres have very distinct axial extinction so easy to tell from fibre glass, carpet fibres etc. They are then counted and the density per volume of air calculated..

 

 

The company doing this is usually separate from the contractors stripping the building so they have no interest in the results one way or another.

 

I would reiterate that despite the Govt putting numbers to exposure levels, like radon there is no safe level because of both the nature of the material and other factors that can play a part a couple of which already mentioned.

[Sparks_]

Latest update

They are having a meeting after work(now)

One lady sent home as she is pregnant

And the asbestos is in the roofing material

[Ganymede]

What kind of job is it?

 

How long has she worked there for?

 

If it's just casual employment then just get a new job. Otherwise maybe time for some annual leave to consider her options.

[Sparks_]

What kind of job is it?

 

How long has she worked there for?

 

If it's just casual employment then just get a new job. Otherwise maybe time for some annual leave to consider her options.

 

General admin type job

 

worked for over 3 years now for them

 

And all leave has been booked up as she has just joined the TA and needed time off for selection and stuff

 

Oh and the meeting I mentioned on the 18th was for managers only, up to today no information at at all has been passed to any of the workers

[ericsbrother]

Ok, is it associated with ceiling tiles? They were common in the 1960's and early 70's. Paper with mixed fibres and then skimmed with cement or plaster with asbestos or glass fibres.

 

Often the best thing to do with these tiles is to leave them alone if the paint is covering the tiles and they are generally sound. Of course what happens is peopel want to run computer cables through them and that creates a potential hazard.

 

She may be able to put in a FOI request for the results of the air quality tests if the governors are not forthcoming with clear information, they cant refuse. ultimately as the levels set as being "safe" are flawed the results may well be meaningless as far as they go but what should be evident is how well the dust is being controlled. so that lead to a question, what does she want out of this? It is normal for her to be offered a chest X-ray and then follow up monitoring at various times in the future.

 

Beware of a one off offer of compensation that does away with any legal responsibility for the exposure and future effects. If it were me I would be happy with the monitoring and appearing in some paperwok somewhere so if there is a problem in the future it cant be denied and proceedings dragged out.

Edited September 21, 2017 by honeybee13
Paras

[Sparks_]

She went into work today as overtime, only to be told 15 mins later that they all had to go home as they wanted to do an asbestos survey in that area of the building!

[ericsbrother]

I would presume that this survey would involve poking the offending material to take small samples and to use a portable air quality machine to take samples. It shouldnt necessitate people being sent home but under the circumstance she should be paid if the o/t was prearranged