Problems with the world today

[tobyjugg2]

It feels like more and more people are needing top ups from the government in order to make ends meet. How did we get to such a sorry state..

 

Its a vicious circle.

 

If state pays top-ups, employers can pay less and make more profit

 

If state doesn't pay top-ups, employers pay less and we all go back to victorian times before even properly leaving them behind

 

If the state demands a minimum wage, then proxy slavery is abolished and there are less jobs for unskilled or those services cost more

 

There are possible benefits in that a subsidy by the government would be cheaper than paying unemployment benefit, but it gets to be such a tangled web that policy and planning based on such is almost impossible.

 

Note that really wealthy countries (where everyone is considered wealthier than average) a cup of coffee or a sandwich from a 'bar' costs more than here and taxes are higher, but the society is often envied.

Now I think that is the way to go.

 

 

Blame the Tories? No

Blame Labour for not dealing with it in a more socially acceptable way when they could and should have done.

They would have lost the election following, but would have done the right thing for those people who would kick them out for it.

[Conniff]

I know you will find fault with what I say, it seems to be a pastime to do so, but the problem today is it's a 'now' world. We have to have things today.

It's not necessarily that people can't make ends meet. Look at the amount of food thrown away in this country, enough to make a few of these African countries we see on the telly adverts obese.

 

Our mums and dads didn't throw it away, they used every ounce of food, boiling up the chicken bones, adding dumplings, lentils and veg and making a hearty stew which not only did the family enjoy, but was nutricious.

 

None of that appears to be happening any longer, if there isn't the money to buy Kentucky there are complaints that the kids have to go hungry instead of cooking up a meal from what they have.

 

We made do with a radio until such time, maybe years, that there was enough savings to buy a tv. Now not only are we demanding a tv, we are demanding the latest model even if there is nothing wrong with our present one.

 

You can see where I'm going with this so I will say no more and though you might pick it to bits, you all know that I am right.

[tobyjugg2]

I know you will find fault with what I say, it seems to be a pastime to do so, but the problem today is it's a 'now' world. We have to have things today.

It's not necessarily that people can't make ends meet. Look at the amount of food thrown away in this country, enough to make a few of these African countries we see on the telly adverts obese.

 

Our mums and dads didn't throw it away, they used every ounce of food, boiling up the chicken bones, adding dumplings, lentils and veg and making a hearty stew which not only did the family enjoy, but was nutricious.

 

None of that appears to be happening any longer, if there isn't the money to buy Kentucky there are complaints that the kids have to go hungry instead of cooking up a meal from what they have.

 

We made do with a radio until such time, maybe years, that there was enough savings to buy a tv. Now not only are we demanding a tv, we are demanding the latest model even if there is nothing wrong with our present one.

 

You can see where I'm going with this so I will say no more and though you might pick it to bits, you all know that I am right.

 

Not sure what this has to do except indirectly with the topic,

but +1

[SabreSheep]

Now as someone that is normally on the other side of the fence to Coniff

 

I know you will find fault with what I say, it seems to be a pastime to do so, but the problem today is it's a 'now' world. We have to have things today.

It's not necessarily that people can't make ends meet. Look at the amount of food thrown away in this country, enough to make a few of these African countries we see on the telly adverts obese.

 

Agreed - Although it is good to see more initiatives like this starting up http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/business/tesco-give-unsold-food-homeless-5819240

 

Our mums and dads didn't throw it away, they used every ounce of food, boiling up the chicken bones, adding dumplings, lentils and veg and making a hearty stew which not only did the family enjoy, but was nutritious.

 

None of that appears to be happening any longer, if there isn't the money to buy Kentucky there are complaints that the kids have to go hungry instead of cooking up a meal from what they have.

 

2 words - BAD EDUCATION - Kids at school used to eb taught how to cook and these skills passed to their children. This has stopped. Also lack of Financial Education as well.

 

 

We made do with a radio until such time, maybe years, that there was enough savings to buy a tv. Now not only are we demanding a tv, we are demanding the latest model even if there is nothing wrong with our present one.

Global rise in consumerism powered by a global desire to enslave everyone into debt. Offer cheap credit, enslave a population. To do that you need to drive the "Now Idealogy" Welcome to Capitalism

 

However this is only part of the problem.. Especially in this country there has been a growing level of inequality that has forced people to use credit to survive. one such area - Rental expenses and the proportion of an average persons salary has massively increased along with energy and other utilities. People have given up saving as now a days most people do not have the spare cash to put aside.

You can see where I'm going with this so I will say no more and though you might pick it to bits, you all know that I am right.

 

Ironically you do identify legitimate issues. Its just the bigger picture in my opinion is more in depth and broader.

[Conniff]

I doubt CAG database is big enough to hold all the ins and outs.

[Conniff]

Now as someone that is normally on the other side of the fence to Coniff.

 

I don't really see how you can be on the other side of the fence as I'm not really on either side, I take my cue from what happens on the day. I don't have a hard and fast line and that's it no matter what.

[tobyjugg2]

2 words - BAD EDUCATION - Kids at school used to eb taught how to cook and these skills passed to their children. This has stopped. Also lack of Financial Education as well.

 

Only partly, and smaller partly at that in my opinion.

Kids were taught and exampled the method and the simple rightness and normality of this sort of practice and many other good and right practices by their parents

[Consumer dude]

It's not just individuals that throw food away, don't supermarkets do it all the time ?

[Conniff]

It's not just individuals that throw food away, don't supermarkets do it all the time ?

 

When it's reached the best before or sell by, they have no choice. They do it with stuff reaching that date and still a few days on it, usually because a new palet of goods have arrived and if it's put on the shelves no one will buy the older stuff so either unattractive shelves with a few items on or a stacked shelf that draws attention.

[SabreSheep]

It's not just individuals that throw food away, don't supermarkets do it all the time ?

 

 

See the link in my post #4

[unclebulgaria67]

The £30 billion + in unpaid corporation taxes would make a massive difference. Could you imagine the choices a government would have if they received the full amount of tax that should be due. They could reduce personal tax rates, build more social housing, subsidise a better public transport system etc.

 

I am pro EU, but under EU rules companies can export UK profits to their businesses elsewhere within the EU, so they can pay less tax. I note that this is one EU rule that Cameron does not want to renegotiate, as he believes in tax competition. But this means UK Treasury does not receive the full taxes companies should pay on UK profits. Some of the profits made in the EU, end up being invested away in tax havens. There is an estimated $40 trillion held in tax havens globally, owned by companies and very rich people.

 

Current capitalism does not work, because much of it is being done in a way that is not really helpful to nation states. The Tories in particular are servants of private equity investors and large corporations, in the same way as Tony Blair was. Whether this is structly necessary or whether nation states can avoid being in hock to private investors, is a question people should ask.

[Conniff]

Costa is probably the best example of that. They buy coffee at a price, sell it and make a profit and then pay taxes on that profit, but the way they got around it was to set up a seperate company in another country to buy the coffee at the price offered and then that seperate company which is still part of costa sells it to the shops as such an inflated price that the shops don't make a profit so don't pay any taxes.

Costa itself makes huge profits from it's offshoot company and sees off the treasury.

[unclebulgaria67]

Costa is probably the best example of that. They buy coffee at a price, sell it and make a profit and then pay taxes on that profit, but the way they got around it was to set up a seperate company in another country to buy the coffee at the price offered and then that seperate company which is still part of costa sells it to the shops as such an inflated price that the shops don't make a profit so don't pay any taxes.

Costa itself makes huge profits from it's offshoot company and sees off the treasury.

 

All sorts of dodges are done.

 

I heard of a business that was due to be sold, investing in Belgium, so the Directors could save paying milllions in capital gains tax. They had to live in Belgium for a period, so that they could comply with tax residency rules. Accountants around the country are advising their clients how to dodge tax on a daily basis.

 

Look at London, where huge sums of money are being paid to buy property, much of which is not viewed before buying. How much if this is done via an investment company with a registered address in IOM, channel islands, Luxemborg etc.

 

Locally a developer using a trust based in Jersey moved the profits back to Jersey, presumably in a way that reduced taxes that would be due. I can remember a programme that looked at just how much UK business is done via nearby tax havens, when the business only had a brass plate in say Jersey.

[Conniff]

I don't as much put the blame on the companies or the accountants, but on the law makers who have known of these dodges since Queen Victoria and have done nothing but talk about them.

 

But having said that, it can't be that easy to just close a loop-hole without the risk of upsetting big business so much that they pull out and move abroad which kinda defeats the object or makes it worse as there are also more people out of work.

[unclebulgaria67]

I don't as much put the blame on the companies or the accountants, but on the law makers who have known of these dodges since Queen Victoria and have done nothing but talk about them.

 

But having said that, it can't be that easy to just close a loop-hole without the risk of upsetting big business so much that they pull out and move abroad which kinda defeats the object or makes it worse as there are also more people out of work.

 

It is a judgement call, as to how far you go in pursuing taxes from businesses and wealthy. Yes you don't want them to leave the country taking their money with them. But it has to be a fair situation. I

[tobyjugg2]

It is a judgement call, as to how far you go in pursuing taxes from businesses and wealthy. Yes you don't want them to leave the country taking their money with them. But it has to be a fair situation. I

 

Why not?

They aren't paying their way, they are effectively being subsidised.

Get rid of them and something will jump in to fill the gap - hopefully better for the country if they know they wont get away with crap..

[unclebulgaria67]

Why not?

They aren't paying their way, they are effectively being subsidised.

Get rid of them and something will jump in to fill the gap - hopefully better for the country if they know they wont get away with crap..

 

Yes they are in many ways. Another biggie is tax credits which is to make up for lower wages.

 

Someone described London as the tax avoidance capital of the world due to very loose tax rules. You can live in the London area, claim non dom status, enjoy the top private schools, enjoy the theatres/sports, better security than most places, invest in UK assets via variious offshore schemes and manage to pay very little tax on earnings as overseas earnings is not taxed.

[estellyn]

Why not?

They aren't paying their way, they are effectively being subsidised.

Get rid of them and something will jump in to fill the gap - hopefully better for the country if they know they wont get away with crap..

 

Yes, I believe most of these threats to be empty, and those that are not - if it's an area money can be made in, then another (tax paying) company will fill the gap.

[determindator]

They paved paradise and put up a parking lot