council tax summons to court without warning

[outlawla]

At least you attended. If the other 1,173 summonsed for today's hearing bothered to turn up and appear before the bench the whole system would grind to a halt.

 

The shocking thing is (not counting today's liability costs), since May this year Nottingham City Council has raised £1,160,820 through court costs.

Edited October 11, 2013 by outlawla

[noddy997]

That link doesnt work. Ah if you told me first I could've taken that with me.

 

There was only 3 of us and many others "sorted it" outside. Many didnt turn up so were dealt without their presence.

 

Funny you mention others Outlawla, I tried talking to one chap he refused to let anything out, tried again after the hearing and he said "I dont want to talk about" - what the idiots dont understand I am in the same place. Of course we will be bullied if we dont unite.

 

 

CB - I am used to it total unfair nonsense system - talk about democracy. UK allied with US talk about democracies in other countries but this is not democracy especially were common sense lacks and you penalise your citizens. I am trying to work my way in to relocating to the Middle East purely because of no nonsense tax. The BBC yet publish on "why do so many Brits chose a life abroad?" - well they dont want to be ripped off. I have read somewhere if your a US citizen and have financial interests aboard you have to pay taxes for this in the US as well as the other country - what kind of utter nonsense democracy in the West do we live in?!

 

 

Oh, I was first up btw, but the chap who went up last seen that we got a good kicking and questionned the judge on why do us innocent folk always be mistreated whilst local authorities get favoured. Again the judge muttered the same nonsense "the authority operated accordingly".

 

I really should have prosectued this council for causing distress as 3 years ago they sent a bill on my late father's name for council tax on a property that he never owned or had any interest in whatsoever. The council said to me "you will have to prove that your father didnt own it" - again how in earth are you supposed to do that? Someone who had exactly the same name as my father owned the property and yet the council are incompetent fools to even see this.

Edited October 10, 2013 by noddy997

[outlawla]

The first link worked didn't it?

 

Here's the second one again:

 

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/178709/response/438749/attach/3/2842%20Customer%20Response.doc

 

As far as I know, they only responded to the Freedom of Information request this afternoon.

[noddy997]

Cheers

[citizenB]

You need to call the council and ask for confirmation of the amount of EACH Liability Order.

 

Next, the Local Government Ombudsman made it very clear indeed that a bailiff cannot charge mutilple charges for enforcing more than one Liability Order."levy" upon a car outside.

 

It is so important that you WRITE to the bailiff company with a sensible repayment proposal. You must NOT make a payment arrangement over the phone.

 

noddy, you asked what happens next regarding your LO - I have brought this over from another thread. Although as you now have a court order, I don't know if things will be different !

[noddy997]

noddy, you asked what happens next regarding your LO - I have brought this over from another thread. Although as you now have a court order, I don't know if things will be different !

 

 

Thankyou CB.

 

The judge said "the liability order will be granted" - is it not the same thing?

 

When the council chap who left after the hearing abruptly told me "the court will send out the liability to order and from there you can make payment arrangements etc".

 

Am kind of confused.

[ploddertom]

Thankyou CB.

 

The judge said "the liability order will be granted" - is it not the same thing?

 

When the council chap who left after the hearing abruptly told me "the court will send out the liability to order and from there you can make payment arrangements etc".

 

Am kind of confused.

 

You should receive notification that a Liability Order has been granted against you. It is then up to you to make an arrangement, however if you don't - and you get no warning - they will probably send it to the Bailiffs for enforcement.

[outlawla]

If Nottingham City Council are going to resort to bailiffs, (who incidentally there is no legal obligation to deal with), you can monitor the council's compliance with the law.

 

Under the provision of regulation 7 of the Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) (Amendment) Regulations 1998 the council must give 14 days written notice of a bailiff visit.

 

Information preliminary to distress

 

7. (1) In regulation 45(1) (distress)(1), for the words from “the authority” to “may” there is substituted “the authority which applied for the order may, subject to regulation 45A,”.

 

(2) After regulation 45 there is inserted—

“

Information preliminary to distress

 

45A. (1) No distress shall be made under these regulations unless, no less than 14 days before a visit in connection with the distress is first made to the premises where it is to be levied, the authority have sent to the debtor written notice of the matters specified in paragraph (2) below.

 

(2) The matters are—

(a) the fact that a liability order has been made against the debtor;

 

(b) the amount in respect of which the liability order was made and, where this is a different amount, the amount which remains outstanding;

 

© a warning that unless the amount specified has been paid before the expiry of 14 days beginning on the date of the sending of the notice, distress may be levied;

 

(d) notice that if distress is levied further costs will be incurred by the debtor;

 

(e) the fees prescribed in Schedule 5 to these Regulations;

 

(f) the address and telephone number at which the debtor can communicate with the authority.”

________________________________________________

 

(1) Amended by S.I. 1993/773

[outlawla]

....However, prior to this I was supposed to receive a red writing last warning letter that if I dont pay it will go to court. But I never received this.

 

I told the council this today, and they told me that they sent it in July and its on "their records".......

 

.....I never received a warning letter from the council.

 

The rude staff at the council further said "if you dont receive post you need to speak to royal mail"......

 

It would be worth finding out what the law says in regards the level of proof local authorities must (if requested) provide that reminder notices have been properly served.

 

This guidance (link) deals with serving summonses and "is not" specifically related to council tax liability order applications, however some of the requirements may "possibly" apply to serving documents in general.

"

Proof of Service

 

8. Service is normally proved by a certificate of service, which explains how and when the summons was served. The person who posts the summons, hands it over or leaves it at the appropriate address must complete the certificate of service. You should then return a copy of the original summons to the court with the certificate of service either endorsed on the back or attached. If service needs to be proved, that person will have to produce a statement and, if necessary, give evidence. It is therefore essential to keep a copy of the endorsed summons on file, with a record of when and how the endorsed copy was returned to the court.

Edited October 13, 2013 by outlawla

[noddy997]

Wow, received my bailiff warning letter today (2weeks after the hearing date).

 

Now they are not willing to accept £20 a month. It has to be paid by end of financial year, which works out at £36 a month.

 

Seriously from £7, to £20, now £36?!

 

 

Quiet ridiculous. They let it get this far purposely so they can get more out of you!

 

 

Gota go down the route of a "means enquiry form".

[noddy997]

Filled out means enquiry form, and stated I only have £25 to live on at the end of the month after the mortgage.

 

I am willing to give them the £25. Both my bank accounts I am overdrawn to the max.

 

Today they wrote to me saying they considered my offer £5-25 per month, but they cant accept it and the minimum they can take now is £44.50 per month.

 

Or it will be passed on to bailiffs. I hardly own many possessions since I live with parents.

 

What are my options here? I am not on benefits either due to falling out of the threshold. They are asking for nearly twice the £25 I have left over from monthly rental income.

[outlawla]

How much do you owe the Nottingham mafia?

 

I make it £191 (£121 council tax + £50 summons costs + £20 liability order costs)

 

Ron has recalculated the court costs and thinks that because of the massive increase in numbers incurring them since the benefit reforms they should now be:

 

• Summons costs = £26
  

• Liability order = £11
  

Here:

 

Council Tax prosecutions – pre & post benefit reforms

[noddy997]

Oh god I cant remember. I think it £44.50 x 4 = £178 and I paid £5 last month = £183.

 

They said previously they want it all by end of financial year. But previously I have been quoted £8 per month then £20 and all the other figures in another post.

 

 

What are my options here? Because I got NOTHING to live on?!

 

 

Something to note here: recently I been contacted by some agent in Birmingham asking whether I wish to sell a HMO property that I managed a long time ago for someone or let this agent let it for me. The funny thing is how does this agent know I own/manage it and how in the earth does he know it is a HMO (Housing in Multiple Occupation) - you need a licence from the Local Authority to operate a property as HMO - now to my knowledge only Nottingham City Council hold this information and NO ONE else. Does this mean they have been selling my details to third parties? Can they do this????