ESA Knockback

[Charlie996]

I am so sorry but the fight has gone out of me now. The way I was spoken to left me desperately upset yesterday.

 

It was because nothing had happened for so long and at the insistence of the Applied Psychological practitioner that I see on a weekly basis that I made the call.

 

Truth is I hardly go out at all now and only really to the many medical appointments I have to attend. My diabetic control is also now extremely poor as all the worry not only financial is dragging me down so fast.

 

I went with my Wife to CAB but had an extreme anxiety attack on the way and sorry but I just could not face going in.

 

I feel really dreadful and will try to get some help today if I can.. Once again I have had no sleep and am sat here in tears. There is only so much anyone can take ..

 

I was going to try and post up the letters that the Consultant and the GP and the Applied Psychological practitioner have written so you can see exactly where I am medically at this time.. But I'm confused and struggling with the computer ..

 

I really do appreciate the offer and support and the offer of writing more letters but DWP just loose them anyway. I sent every single item by first class recorded delivery but what was the point ? They say they don't have them ............

 

Thanks.

[estellyn]

I am so sorry but the fight has gone out of me now. The way I was spoken to left me desperately upset yesterday.

 

It was because nothing had happened for so long and at the insistence of the Applied Psychological practitioner that I see on a weekly basis that I made the call.

 

Truth is I hardly go out at all now and only really to the many medical appointments I have to attend. My diabetic control is also now extremely poor as all the worry not only financial is dragging me down so fast.

 

I went with my Wife to CAB but had an extreme anxiety attack on the way and sorry but I just could not face going in.

 

I feel really dreadful and will try to get some help today if I can.. Once again I have had no sleep and am sat here in tears. There is only so much anyone can take ..

 

I was going to try and post up the letters that the Consultant and the GP and the Applied Psychological practitioner have written so you can see exactly where I am medically at this time.. But I'm confused and struggling with the computer ..

 

I really do appreciate the offer and support and the offer of writing more letters but DWP just loose them anyway. I sent every single item by first class recorded delivery but what was the point ? They say they don't have them ............

 

Thanks.

 

Please just get some help with your mental health issues urgently, charlie, the rest can wait - your health and wellbeing is the most important thing.

[Charlie996]

Please just get some help with your mental health issues urgently, charlie, the rest can wait - your health and wellbeing is the most important thing.

 

Thank you !!

 

I have again been to the hospital after a night with no sleep. They wanted me to stay in for a couple of days but whilst I really do appreciate all the help they are giving me I just dont want to end up staying in there...

Things have been really getting on top of me just lately as one of my best friends died suddenly from a heart attack and another equally close mate is in the final stages of terminal cancer...

 

In many ways I feel so guilty worrying about my bag when Peter has died and Noddy ( Marks nickname) is suffering so badly..

 

But I am struggling now and the financial worry is just adding to everything else..

 

We do have a small amount of savings remaining but these are tied up and cant be released without huge penalty's. But it looks like those penalty's will have to be taken as the debts are rising with very little income.

 

I will say though the biggest thing that gets me down apart from the money is the way and manner with which I have been treated ! I am truly sorry to go on but I could never speak to anyone in the way I was spoken to yesterday...

 

So I am getting help. Help without which I genuinely think I would be unable to go on... Honestly I have never felt so low and depressed...

 

My Wife has typed the above for me....

 

Thank you so much for your kind words and advice.

 

Charlie.

[Charlie996]

This is still going on....

 

I spoke to a person from DWP today who informs me that they still have not got to the stage where they look at the evidence sent in which includes all the letters from the Doctors who are treating me and the letter of appeal Estellyn helped me with...

 

They are currently looking at appeals made in June of this year so it will be another 3 months before they even look at my case and decide whether to reverse the decision or send the matter to appeal tribunal.

 

I had to see the Consultant late last week who was so furious at the way I am being treated he actually phoned DWP to demand an explanation as to what exactly is going on and how a person can be treated in such a manner.. All they did was give him an address to write to..

 

DWP have so many appeals going on they simply cannot cope with them.. Lady on the phone told me they have drafted in personal from other departments yet still they are so far behind..

 

You would think the penny would drop and they could see this ridiculous system is failing miserably !!

 

Thanks.

[fightingback99]

Sorry to hear of the trouble you're having and glad you're getting help and support from your health support team. The DWP are like a big impersonal machine. For routine simple processes it works fairly well, but as with any other large system soon as it hits any minor exception the system buckles and goes into freefall.. Shocking as it is , this is how most businesses are run in the 21st century.

 

With all the cutbacks there aren't enough staff and some of them don't have enough knowledge to give correct responses to questions. Just like any other company who use call centres and automatic computer generic printed letters, there's loads of incorrect letters and information given out. It might save the company money on staff but the results are extreme frustration to thousands of people trying to solve a problem usually not of their own making..

 

In the meantime if you possibly can, for your own sake and that of your family, try not to take any of it personally .Instead accept it as a crappy process you have to go through , which dictates the amount of time it takes to process things. If you can, try to accept that you've done as much if not more than can possibly be done and it's a waiting game now. The time will pass and you'll hopefully get the right decision at the end of it.

 

Concentrate on getting better , and look to the future when this will all be resolved and in the past.

[Charlie996]

I had a letter today which I believe is in response to the letter that I sent in regarding challenging the fact that the time on ESA was spent in the support group and therefore would not count against the 365 day period allowed..

The letter I sent was the one Estelyn kindly wrote for me..

 

It states once again that I have used up the time allowed under the 365 day rule....... They just seem not to understand their own rules ??

 

I still await whether the many doctors letters Ive sent in will mean they overturn the decision to stop the ESA altogether.

 

The medical team looking after me can simply not understand what is going on.. Niether can I ...

[estellyn]

I had a letter today which I believe is in response to the letter that I sent in regarding challenging the fact that the time on ESA was spent in the support group and therefore would not count against the 365 day period allowed..

The letter I sent was the one Estelyn kindly wrote for me..

 

It states once again that I have used up the time allowed under the 365 day rule....... They just seem not to understand their own rules ??

 

I still await whether the many doctors letters Ive sent in will mean they overturn the decision to stop the ESA altogether.

 

The medical team looking after me can simply not understand what is going on.. Niether can I ...

 

No they don't seem to understand their own rules. Send the same letter again, this time just substitute the word 'appeal' where it says reconsideration. This will mean the case will now be sent to an appeals officer who hopefully has more sense!

[Charlie996]

On the letter which is a very standard type letter it says I have the right to appeal against the decision.... So should I do that ? I wonder if all else fails that if it went before a tribunal then surely the tribunal people might just understand ?

 

Thanks !!

[Nystagmite]

I think that's your only option, tbh. They reconsider before it goes to appeal; so hopefully someone else who knows the law will look at it and it'll go in your favour.

[Charlie996]

I am still hoping that DWP will look again at the decision to stop the ESA in the first place..

 

My Consultant psychiatrist wrote another very strong letter to them after actually phoning them just before Christmas.. In addition to this they have 2 other letters written by him to look at. My GP also wrote what I would call an extremely strong letter to them demanding to know how the heck they and ATOS arrive at the decisions they do.. Also the clinical therapist has also written another letter explaining how a detrimental effect this ongoing situation is and has bee having..

 

Im ashamed to say I had an attempt at taking my own life at Christmas.. Im really struggling to cope now and this ongoing situation is just to much to bear.. When I got the letter I mentioned above it just brought back the struggle and fight I'm having to go through.

 

Im sorry to unload here but it helps somehow. And getting the kind words of support and help here means a lot....

 

Thank you all so much.

[estellyn]

On the letter which is a very standard type letter it says I have the right to appeal against the decision.... So should I do that ? I wonder if all else fails that if it went before a tribunal then surely the tribunal people might just understand ?

 

Thanks !!

 

Yes just use the same letter as before, but put 'appeal' instead of 'reconsideration'.

[estellyn]

I am still hoping that DWP will look again at the decision to stop the ESA in the first place..

 

My Consultant psychiatrist wrote another very strong letter to them after actually phoning them just before Christmas.. In addition to this they have 2 other letters written by him to look at. My GP also wrote what I would call an extremely strong letter to them demanding to know how the heck they and ATOS arrive at the decisions they do.. Also the clinical therapist has also written another letter explaining how a detrimental effect this ongoing situation is and has bee having..

 

Im ashamed to say I had an attempt at taking my own life at Christmas.. Im really struggling to cope now and this ongoing situation is just to much to bear.. When I got the letter I mentioned above it just brought back the struggle and fight I'm having to go through.

 

Im sorry to unload here but it helps somehow. And getting the kind words of support and help here means a lot....

 

Thank you all so much.

 

I'm sorry you're struggling charlie. Send off the appeal and try to forget about it until you hear from them again.

[**Margaret**]

:Charlie996:

 

What I'm going to write has nothing to do with the GL24 form appeal form that you've already sent to Jobcentreplus. Currently it's taking up to six months for appeals officers to even look at them.

 

I'm writing about your request for a reconsideration (:estellyn:'s letter) about Jobcentreplus paying you assessment rate employment n support while you appeal the fit for work decision.

 

From reading your older threads it appears that during 2011 you got an invite to a Jobcentre for a work focused interview. Were you were in receipt of employment n support allowance with the work related activity component rather than the support group component? If you're not sure I'd respectfully suggest that you need to find out. Via your bank statements, although your bank may charge for copies. Subject access request to Jobcentreplus is free but currently taking up to sixty days. A valid reason for a late appeal but a hassle you don't need if it can be avoided.

 

Like :estellyn: I'm really sorry for the distress your claim is causing, but please don't become another ESA statistic. You can come back to us for further advice if you need to.

 

Take care, sincerely, Margaret.

[Charlie996]

To be honest I can't recall being asked to go for any interview at the job centre.. This whole thing has me completely confused and in s spin .

With the help of a neighbour I have now filled in the form GL24 and used the words from Estylins letter in the section that asks why I disagree .

I will just see what happens..

Thanks

[Nystagmite]

Hope all goes well x

[Charlie996]

:Charlie996:

 

What I'm going to write has nothing to do with the GL24 form appeal form that you've already sent to Jobcentreplus. Currently it's taking up to six months for appeals officers to even look at them.

 

I'm writing about your request for a reconsideration (:estellyn:'s letter) about Jobcentreplus paying you assessment rate employment n support while you appeal the fit for work decision.

 

From reading your older threads it appears that during 2011 you got an invite to a Jobcentre for a work focused interview. Were you were in receipt of employment n support allowance with the work related activity component rather than the support group component? If you're not sure I'd respectfully suggest that you need to find out. Via your bank statements, although your bank may charge for copies. Subject access request to Jobcentreplus is free but currently taking up to sixty days. A valid reason for a late appeal but a hassle you don't need if it can be avoided.

 

Like :estellyn: I'm really sorry for the distress your claim is causing, but please don't become another ESA statistic. You can come back to us for further advice if you need to.

 

Take care, sincerely, Margaret.

 

I have been having a think and trying hard to remember the sequence of events . I think the post you are referring to may be from a previous short stay on ESA..

 

Let me try and and explain though the dates are something I remain very confused on..

 

It was in 2007 that I suffered a fall from a roof due to a hypo attack. As a result of that fall I was unable to work for quite some period of time. I am a type 1 diabetic

 

It was not until some time in 2009 that I made a claim for ESA..Why did I not claim sooner ? Well to be honest I didn't realise I could claim and partly because I thought I would get by without doing so and all would be well..

 

After about 3 months I was kicked off the ESA benefit anyway as at an assessment I scored only a few points..

 

So with things becoming difficult I did my best and tried to return to work.. Physically I was not 100% but I felt I had to try so try I did !!

 

Unfortunately mentally I was nowhere near as strong as I thought I was.. Frankly I was terrified of even climbing a ladder never mind scaling a roof again. The fall I had was quite a big one and the injuries were quite extensive,, The biggest injury as it turned out was the sheer fear and mental damage that up to the point of breaking down I just hadn't realised had struck so deeply.

 

In reality it was against the advice of my doctors that I even tried to return to working at height !! I have been a type 1 Diabetic for 35 years.

 

So I started back at work anyway. I just could not face not working. The feeling of being at home doing nothing was just destroying my confidence..

 

Only a few days in I had what I can only describe as a huge break down. I was sent home and was told to seek medical advice,

 

This therefore was an entirely separate ESA claim. At the start of the claim I was placed in the WRAG group but was told by a neighbour ( The same person who is still helping me today) to ask to be placed in the "Support" group as I simply could not face going into the job centre or facing anyone for that matter such was my condition. DWP immediately placed me into the support group without the need to go to appeal..

 

I sincerely apologise if this information is to late and should have been given before..

 

My wife has typed this up today with the help of said neighbour. It has taken all day to try and unravel what happened and when it happened ..

 

Again today I have been here in tears as I really dont know what to do.. There really is only so much I can take. I feel truly desperate and again I have to visit the doctors in the morning as I have to phone them when things get rough.

 

This post has been typed by my Wife with the help of our very kind neighbour..

 

I genuinely thank you all for the help and I hope I have not given wrong information..

 

Thanks

[estellyn]

I have been having a think and trying hard to remember the sequence of events . I think the post you are referring to may be from a previous short stay on ESA..

 

Let me try and and explain though the dates are something I remain very confused on..

 

It was in 2007 that I suffered a fall from a roof due to a hypo attack. As a result of that fall I was unable to work for quite some period of time. I am a type 1 diabetic

 

It was not until some time in 2009 that I made a claim for ESA..Why did I not claim sooner ? Well to be honest I didn't realise I could claim and partly because I thought I would get by without doing so and all would be well..

 

After about 3 months I was kicked off the ESA benefit anyway as at an assessment I scored only a few points..

 

So with things becoming difficult I did my best and tried to return to work.. Physically I was not 100% but I felt I had to try so try I did !!

 

Unfortunately mentally I was nowhere near as strong as I thought I was.. Frankly I was terrified of even climbing a ladder never mind scaling a roof again. The fall I had was quite a big one and the injuries were quite extensive,, The biggest injury as it turned out was the sheer fear and mental damage that up to the point of breaking down I just hadn't realised had struck so deeply.

 

In reality it was against the advice of my doctors that I even tried to return to working at height !! I have been a type 1 Diabetic for 35 years.

 

So I started back at work anyway. I just could not face not working. The feeling of being at home doing nothing was just destroying my confidence..

 

Only a few days in I had what I can only describe as a huge break down. I was sent home and was told to seek medical advice,

 

This therefore was an entirely separate ESA claim. At the start of the claim I was placed in the WRAG group but was told by a neighbour ( The same person who is still helping me today) to ask to be placed in the "Support" group as I simply could not face going into the job centre or facing anyone for that matter such was my condition. DWP immediately placed me into the support group without the need to go to appeal..

 

I sincerely apologise if this information is to late and should have been given before..

 

My wife has typed this up today with the help of said neighbour. It has taken all day to try and unravel what happened and when it happened ..

 

Again today I have been here in tears as I really dont know what to do.. There really is only so much I can take. I feel truly desperate and again I have to visit the doctors in the morning as I have to phone them when things get rough.

 

This post has been typed by my Wife with the help of our very kind neighbour..

 

I genuinely thank you all for the help and I hope I have not given wrong information..

 

Thanks

 

If you challenged the decision on the first claim and were placed in the support group, then any previous time in the wrag would become 'support group'. So unless you had any other claim, what you've mentioned should not count towards any time in wrag. So then you had a second period of claim and were put back into the support group until recent recents? Have I got that right?

[Charlie996]

If you challenged the decision on the first claim and were placed in the support group, then any previous time in the wrag would become 'support group'. So unless you had any other claim, what you've mentioned should not count towards any time in wrag. So then you had a second period of claim and were put back into the support group until recent recents? Have I got that right?

 

My first claim which was made very late due to the reasons above was I believe in the WRAG group.I then as above tried to return to work.

 

After a short while I suffered the mental break down and again had to claim .. At first I was placed in the WRAG group but this was changed to the support group after I explained to my neighbour that I could not face going into the job centre. Sorry I just could not deal with people and still cant to be honest.. The only place I can talk is either at the doctors or here !

 

After writing to DWP I was placed in the support group and that is where I have been until the recent decision..

.

Sorry I do realise how confusing this is !!

[**Margaret**]

:Morning Charlie996:

 

Praps, possibly, you're feeling a bit better this morning Hope you are

 

There's nothing to apologise for, I was just casting around to see if we'd missed anything. Employment n support allowance has to be the most complex benefit in history!!

 

As for what to do?

 

If you're as sure as you can be that your most recent claim was spent entirely in the support group and there were more than twelve weeks between your most recent claim and the previous one, absolutely nothing!! Except to post the latest GL24 (possibly by recorded delivery if you want to make sure Jobcentreplus've received it) and wait!! Eventually, an appeals officer will have to respond to you with detailed reasons (somewhat more than you've had your 365 days) for not paying your claim.

 

In the meantime, know this is easier said that done, try to focus on getting better. Seem to remember you've a daughter who needs Dad to walk her up the aisle.

 

Best wishes, Margaret.

 

Tis now afternooon. Margaret was never destined to be a lark.

[Nystagmite]

I have nothing useful to add; but your neighbour sounds wonderful.

[estellyn]

My first claim which was made very late due to the reasons above was I believe in the WRAG group.I then as above tried to return to work.

 

After a short while I suffered the mental break down and again had to claim .. At first I was placed in the WRAG group but this was changed to the support group after I explained to my neighbour that I could not face going into the job centre. Sorry I just could not deal with people and still cant to be honest.. The only place I can talk is either at the doctors or here !

 

After writing to DWP I was placed in the support group and that is where I have been until the recent decision..

.

Sorry I do realise how confusing this is !!

 

How long was the first claim for, Charlie, and how long was the gap between the first and second claim, roughly, if you can remember?

[Charlie996]

How long was the first claim for, Charlie, and how long was the gap between the first and second claim, roughly, if you can remember?

 

I cant remember how long the claim was for but it was not for very long.. We that is the wife and I have been trying to sort out dates and things but it seem I have been a little remiss in not keeping the documentation..

 

My neighbour as one of you rightly point out has been wonderful and has helped me and the wife massively..

 

At no point has DWP pointed out why they refuse to pay the basic rate. They simply say that the 365 day period has been used up. Perhaps it would help if they actually supplied the information in something other than a standardised letter !

 

Thank you all again !!

[estellyn]

I cant remember how long the claim was for but it was not for very long.. We that is the wife and I have been trying to sort out dates and things but it seem I have been a little remiss in not keeping the documentation..

 

My neighbour as one of you rightly point out has been wonderful and has helped me and the wife massively..

 

At no point has DWP pointed out why they refuse to pay the basic rate. They simply say that the 365 day period has been used up. Perhaps it would help if they actually supplied the information in something other than a standardised letter !

 

Thank you all again !!

 

do you think the first claim was more or less than a year?

[Charlie996]

do you think the first claim was more or less than a year?

 

I'm sure it was in 2009.. I had the fall in 2007 but even though I could not and did not work I never made a claim..

 

The claim I made in 2009 was the first time I had ever made a claim in my life.. I think I was on ESA for a few months and they kicked me off for scoring if I remember correctly 6 points ?? Not sure to be honest.. I'm on quite some concoction of tablets at the moment and my memory is terrible !

 

I cant remember how long it was between the first and second claim .. Likely around 4 or 5 months.. As I said above I went back to work to soon.. The doctors now say that I failed to recognise the mental illness that came as a result of fall which caused the physical damage but also the mental strain that followed..

 

Before the fall I worked hard all my life. I started as an apprentice at the age of 15.. I worked and learnt my trade for 6 years before starting a small business which I ran for 32 years up to the time I had the accident.. During those years I paid just under 300K in direct taxes which did not include NI contributions, I know these figures because my accountant informed me of them when the business was wound up in late 2008..

You would hope DWP would recognise that I worked hard and contributed into the system and did my bit... This upsets me greatly ! Sorry Im ranting now ........

 

Thanks

[Nystagmite]

They don't care about how much tax and NI you paid as such.

 

You might be able to request a sar and find out how long you were on which rate for.