train E Ticket refused

[bojak]

I bought an E-Ticket for new years day this year travelling from Manchester Piccadilly to Bristol Temple Meads and lost it before travelling. I was unable to print another on the 1/01 because I couldn't find an open Cyber cafe and and Manchester piccadily had no printing equipment. I had a picture of the ticket on my phone which included my order reference, bank details and seat reservation in my name. this however was not valid enough for the conductor on the train who insisted that I purchase a ticket then and there but assured me that I would be able to get a full refund. It has taken this long for Country and Western to review my situation and have not even given me are refund but train vouchers of a considerably less value than the ticket I had to purchase on the train. I would like complain about this and in particular the conductor who obviously lied to me about being able to get the refund. how would I go about this as I am not sure how Country and Western are connected to the conductor.

 

Thanks

[honeybee13]

Hello there.

 

You should get replies on the transport forum, I'll move your thread.

 

My best, HB

[MrGates]

E ticketing is simple, if you cannot show the details of the ticket, reference number etc then its treated as being not able to produce a valid ticket. A picture of a ticket cannot and will not be accepted as a ticket. Im suprised by their good will of offering you travel tickets to be honest as the conductor was quite within his rights to mae you buy a new ticket.

 

Who are country and western?

[rebel11]

Hi Bojak

 

Welcome to CAG

 

Write a Formal Letter of Complaint, mark it as such. Explain whats happened, how they have let you down (what was said to you) and what you want them to do. Send it to:-

 

Andy Cooper, Chief Executive

[email protected]

 

Some tips:- http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1242161/How--write-letter-complaint.html

[MrGates]

E-ticket / print@home: For some bookings we allow you to print your own ticket.

 

You must ensure that you print the ticket clearly on A4 paper and carry the ticket with you when you travel.

 

For identification purposes you must also carry the credit/debit card used to make the booking (If tickets have been booked for more than one passenger, all passengers should travel together and the lead passenger must carry the credit/debit card used to make the booking).

 

Tickets are non-transferable and you must ensure that no one else is able to obtain and/or print a copy of your ticket.

 

Some train operating companies apply additional restrictions to the use of e-ticket / print@home – you must note any additional restrictions notified during the booking process.

 

M-tickets / Mobile tickets: For some bookings we allow you to travel with paperless tickets delivered to your mobile phone ("M-tickets"), booked either through the Website, or via our Mobile Application.

 

When booking such tickets via the Website, you must check that your mobile phone is compatible with our tickets by downloading a test ticket where indicated prior to purchase.

 

It is your responsibility to ensure that you carry your mobile phone on the relevant journey and that your phone is charged, functional and that you are able to display the ticket for inspection when you travel.

 

Due to the wide variety of mobile phone handsets and networks we are unable to offer technical support or assistance.

 

You may incur data usage charges from your mobile phone operator for downloading a ticket. You should check with your network provider as to what charges may apply.

 

For identification purposes you must also carry the credit/debit card used to make the booking (If tickets have been booked for more than one passenger, all passengers should travel together and the lead passenger must carry the credit/debit card used to make the booking).

 

We shall not provide duplicate or replacement tickets. The ticket must be stored on your mobile phone until the date and time of travel and such safekeeping shall be your responsibility. M-Tickets are non-transferable.

 

By purchasing a M-Ticket, you agree to cooperate with the train inspector and let him/her clearly view the ticket on your mobile phone and you acknowledge that you may be requested to hand over your mobile phone voluntarily for inspection. If you do not produce your ticket or hand over your mobile phone upon a request to do so by the train inspector, the train inspector shall be entitled to consider that you are travelling without a ticket.

 

Some train operating companies apply additional restrictions to the use of M-Tickets – you must note any additional restrictions notified during the booking process.

 

The T&C's you signed upto.

[The Urbanite]

Hi Bojak

 

Welcome to CAG

 

Write a Formal Letter of Complaint, mark it as such. Explain whats happened, how they have let you down (what was said to you) and what you want them to do. Send it to:-

 

Andy Cooper, Chief Executive

[email protected]

 

Some tips:- http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1242161/How--write-letter-complaint.html

 

What's the point in writing to the CEO, when there is a Customer Relations department who have already more than fairly compensated a customer who broke the T&Cs anyway?

 

This would be an excercise in wasting time IMO!

[Old-CodJA]

I bought an E-Ticket for new years day this year travelling from Manchester Piccadilly to Bristol Temple Meads and lost it before travelling. I was unable to print another on the 1/01 because I couldn't find an open Cyber cafe and and Manchester piccadily had no printing equipment. I had a picture of the ticket on my phone which included my order reference, bank details and seat reservation in my name. this however was not valid enough for the conductor on the train who insisted that I purchase a ticket then and there but assured me that I would be able to get a full refund. It has taken this long for Country and Western to review my situation and have not even given me are refund but train vouchers of a considerably less value than the ticket I had to purchase on the train. I would like complain about this and in particular the conductor who obviously lied to me about being able to get the refund. how would I go about this as I am not sure how Country and Western are connected to the conductor. Thanks

 

 

I'm a bit confused by this one. Just who you mean by Country and Western I'm not sure, but I guess you mean either Cross Country, or First Great Western train operating company.

 

Pictures of tickets are never acceptable. This is to prevent the obvious attempt to 'fiddle' where one person uses the ticket and another says 'I've lost my ticket, but I've got a photo of it.'

 

I have to say that the terms & conditions for E-tickets are very clear. If you fail to comply in any material way, you are treated as having no ticket and a full single fare becomes due.

 

Most substantially reduced fare, booked in advance tickets are restricted to travel on a particular train with free seat reservation and have no refund value. That is again a part of the terms & conditions accepted at the time of purchase. If you have been given vouchers in compensation, it seems that the TOC has been more generous than is sometimes the case.

 

The reason that you have received less than you paid for a replacement single ticket on train may be that they have refunded the amount of the ticket you lost as a gesture of goodwill. The single charged on train under the rules will be the full walk-up fare

 

If you lost it, they were not obliged to give you anything.

[rebel11]

'this however was not valid enough for the conductor on the train who insisted that I purchase a ticket then and there but assured me that I would be able to get a full refund.'

 

Well, if you think it's acceptable for representatives of the company to provide consumers with the wrong information then clearly consumers should just accept it and do nothing. It's all well and good saying to the consumer, 'it says it in the Terms and Conditions' but how comes the representative from CrossCountryTrains was clueless regarding the 'Terms and Conditions'.

 

What's the point in writing to the CEO, when there is a Customer Relations department who have already more than fairly compensated a customer who broke the T&Cs anyway?

 

This would be an excercise in wasting time IMO!

[Old-CodJA]

 

As always, we only have the OPs version of what was said.

 

Sorry rebel, I agree with you from the journey details it seems likely that it was CrossCountry, but the OP doesn't even seem to be sure about that so why would you be so sure that the inspector said anything of the sort?.

[rebel11]

That goes for virtually every single person that visits this site, we have to go by the information they provide. I don't think the OP spends a lot of time studying which train company operates which routes.

 

As always, we only have the OPs version of what was said. I agree with you, it seems likely that it was CrossCountry but the OP doesn't even seem to be sure about that.

[Old-CodJA]

That goes for virtually every single person that visits this site, we have to go by the information they provide. I don't think the OP spends a lot of time studying which train company operates which routes.

 

I agree, we have to go by what is posted. That doesn't automatically make it true in every case.

 

Surely the OP knows who issued the vouchers and if more travellers did check whose services they were using and what the tickets were valid for, many issues about whether tickets are valid or not would be resolved

 

None of us would expect to use an EasyJet ticket and if there was a problem be refunded the British Airways fare would we?

[rebel11]

When people come to this site they get all sorts of things wrong, especially names, a genuine error on the name, easily done.

 

I'm not sure where the following is going, but I'll leave it with you, 'None of us would expect to use an EasyJet ticket and if there was a problem be refunded the British Airways fare would we?'

 

 

I agree, we have to go by what is posted. That doesn't automatically make it true in every case.

 

Surely the OP knows who issued the vouchers and if more travellers did check whose services they were using and what the tickets were valid for, many issues about whether tickets are valid or not would be resolved

 

None of us would expect to use an EasyJet ticket and if there was a problem be refunded the British Airways fare would we?

[RPI]

It must be Crosscountry as FGW only do E-tickets on some Oxford-London tickets, as for not knowing who the TOC was, surely the fact that they have had letters from the TOC which were no doubt on headed paper should explain that!

[Old-CodJA]

I agree RPI, but my point about the lack of confirmation wasn't so much about which TOC it was on, it's pretty clear to us 'in the trade' that it must have been XC, the point was meant to illustrate the fact that we are expected to believe as 'gospel' the OPs recollection of the actual words used by an inspector, but the OP cannot even recall which train company they were on.

 

As always, only one side of a story. I shall leave it at that.

[bojak]

Thank you all for your advice and my apologies.

 

It was not Country and Western but CrossCountry that I purchased the E-ticket from. I was aware when buying the ticket that I was required to bring the E-ticket print out for the journey. and telephoned the company on the 01/01 hours before my train when I went to a friends to print the ticket. We unfortunately had technical problems with his printer, and so I contacted the CrossCoutry help line who stated that I would need the print out. i then proceeded to try and find a Cyber Cafe (not an easy task on the 01/01) and there was no equipment to print with at the train station. I understand the contractual agreement with the original purchase.

 

my initial confusion between CrossCountry and the conductor was their connection, as the conductor said that I would need to get my refund through them but advised me I would be able to get a refund on the ticket (wit

Edited February 1, 2012 by bojak

[honeybee13]

Hello again, we thought we'd lost you .

 

When did you purchase/reserve the ticket please?

 

My best, HB

[bojak]

First time here I wasn't expecting any quick responses to be honest and I thought I would get email alerts, sorry. I bought my ticket on the 15th December.

 

Thanks

[honeybee13]

Hello again.

 

If you want email alerts, you need to look in User CP at the top of the screen and adjust your settings.

 

HB

[bojak]

Out of curiosity! if I had video footage of the the conductor lying about the ticket refund without his knowledge and not advising him that I was recording and then putting that video on Youtube would I be breaking any laws?

 

Thanks

[Justice_]

Out of curiosity! if I had video footage of the the conductor lying about the ticket refund without his knowledge and not advising him that I was recording and then putting that video on Youtube would I be breaking any laws?

 

Thanks

No, it is a public place so there is no expectation of privacy.

[SRPO]

No, it is a public place so there is no expectation of privacy.

 

im not sure thats strictly true, the law is very grey in this area & a test case needs bringing to clarify it.

[honeybee13]

Out of curiosity! if I had video footage of the the conductor lying about the ticket refund without his knowledge and not advising him that I was recording and then putting that video on Youtube would I be breaking any laws?

 

Thanks

 

I agree with SRPO, you need to be careful if the RPI didn't know you were filming. If you tell me whether you actually have the footage, I can ask the site team if it's OK to put it on youtube in the light of a potential court case.

 

There's still the possible issue that you had 2 weeks to print the e-ticket but left it until the last minute.

 

My best, HB

[Old-CodJA]

With regard to any 'print at home' tickets, where they are available, it is always the travellers' responsibility to print these on 'clean white paper' as specified in the terms & conditions of issue and use. Reference to printer problems not being the responsibility of the rail company is made in the conditions of issue. These terms are accepted by the person booking the ticket and there are other specific conditions that must be observed too.

 

If any traveller does not comply with these terms, the rules make clear that they will be 'treated as if no ticket is held'.

 

There is a commonly held belief amongst some travellers that, if you do not print off the ticket, but travel and just show the booking reference, you can apply for a refund on the 'unused' ticket, because it wasn't printed and hasn't been stamped. This is not true because all these tickets are reduced fare & train specific and the terms make clear they have no refund value, but it doesn't stop some unscrupulous people trying it.

 

These tickets also usually require the traveller to show a form of identity and the card that the booking was made with in order to prevent second prints, or photocopies being used by other people to avoid a fare. Where that is attempted and detected there will be a prosecution for fare evasion.

[sailor sam]

No, it is a public place so there is no expectation of privacy.

 

The railway (or any part of it) is not a public place as far as I know.

 

Please Note

 

The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

 

I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

 

Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.

 

[SirHumpy]

For future reference - theres a printer in the Virgin lounge - ask nicely and they usually will help.

 

Also we have printed these off for people in Boots before, but as we are restricted to the websites we can visit you would have to be able to email the ticket to a member of staff with an email address.