THE Election - Made your mind up yet ??

[Bookworm]

Says it all, I think:

 

General Election 2010: Gordon Brown - Flawed, failed, finished. - Telegraph

 

As for, Mad Eyed 'Balls' and Mandy!!!

Says it all? Says very little!

 

Let's see: "quite fairly, the former Tory prime minister [Major] observed that his own loss in 1997 was nothing like as severe as Brown’s."

In what world did the 1997 Labour landslide compare with the wishy-washy lack of endorsement of any party resulting in a hung parliament? La-La Land? I mean, I have seen spin, but that one takes the biscuit!!!

 

" he lashes out in all directions, now berating, now making sycophantic overtures, a desperate figure clinging by his nails to the vestiges of power. Like Lear, he demeans himself, and fails to see the truth, a truth evident to those all around him." Berating? What I saw was an invitation to talk, in far less "look at me" undignified press conference hastily put together by DC. That covers the supposed "sycophantic" approach too. Far from it, instad of throwing himself at Clegg's feet in the most humiliating manner (gawd, DC must have been CRINGING inside ), GB invited the dialogue to open.

Clinging by his nails to the vestiges of power? Errr no, actually carrying on his constitutional duty. Of course, it doesn't suit the Tories, who throw their collective dummy and stamp their feet saying "not fair, we won fair and square, he should go"... conveniently forgetting that they in fact have NOT won. To win, they needed 326 seats and they don't have them, THAT is the simple and unequivocal truth, no spin, no twisting numbers. Boy, does that stick in the collective Tory craw.

Let's face it, if Brown had quit straight away, they would by now deriling him for being a coward who deserted his post.

 

I could go on and on, but the whole of the "article" is a hatchet job, where even the reluctant concessions to the good work GB actually carried on, somehow perversely turned into "yeah but no but yeah but no..." , quickly brushed aside as his "seething resentments" are being whipped into a TV soap-like frenzy. Shakesperean tragedy my *rse, it's more like an episode of Eastenders on acid, and written with about as much subtlety.

[babybear39]

I am ashamed. I am deeply ashamed...

 

I once was a journalism student, but no more...

 

Why? You might well ask...

 

Ever since my spell in hospital I have been feeling uneasy about my vocation. The calling was pure, it was right. I'm not a bad worsmith even if I say so myself. But my eyes have been opened and I finally admit that the majority of journalists (I use that term losely) are nothing but a bunch of self serving vultures.

 

Now which way do I turn?

 

Citizen journalism is the 'new media', long may it live

Edited May 8, 2010 by babybear39
typo lol

[angry cat]

Fine, clearly the last few posts have been made by members who favour the Labour Party; everyone has the right to voice their opinion.

 

However, the following cannot be dismissed:

Mr Brown is personally responsible for a series of mistakes that have shattered the economy.

They include selling Britain's gold reserves at a record low, raiding pensions for up to £150billion, making catastrophic tax credit errors, racking up over £1trillion in debt, and giving up our EU rebate.

In total, the blunders added up to a total loss of £1,287billion.

 

Not forgetting of course, the shambolic manner in which the Banks were allowed to ride roughod over the so called Regulators; FSA.

They failed to Regulate thus the country was brought to it's knees.

 

Robert Peston's blog is quite informative for some who may not know!

[babybear39]

Is it? Really? I shall have a look when I'm not waiting for the icebergs to melt

[Conniff]

and that if he does it, it will be the last time they will ever vote LD.

 

 

No one votes LD now, they came out of the election with less seats than they went into it with.

 

I think the LD will come to an agreement as it will be the only chance they have of having their say. They will never get into power of their own right as long as their backsides look downwards.

[babybear39]

Ooh! Look! There's a Tory PM! Nah, it's another bloody ash cloud

[determindator]

I am impressed with the debates on Facebook by the Young People engaging in this election. There are thoughts of what they see is how 'The Old School' which is a reference to ways we are governed, do not reflect the times we live in (not a reference to the old boys network Lol). They talk about new ideas.

 

Young blues have been enlightened by some history by young reds. Things they were not aware of. May knowledge spread by these discussions whoever you vote for as I believe the more information you analyse you are in a better position to make your choice, not left to newspapers alone.

[angry cat]

No one votes LD now, they came out of the election with less seats than they went into it with.

 

I think the LD will come to an agreement as it will be the only chance they have of having their say. They will never get into power of their own right...

 

Agree!

 

And the (some of the) people who did vote for them, must be regreting their action, just as those in 1974.

 

Trouble is that many who did vote (Election 2010) LD were not even born in 1974; let alone be aware of that consequence: Harold Wilson; roll eyes!

[angry cat]

Ooh! Look! There's a Tory PM! Nah, it's another bloody ash cloud

 

Twiddle, Twaddle!

[angry cat]

I am impressed with the debates on Facebook by the Young People engaging in this election. There are thoughts of what they see is how 'The Old School' which is a reference to ways we are governed, do not reflect the times we live in (not a reference to the old boys network Lol). They talk about new ideas.

 

Young blues have been enlightened by some history by young reds. Things they were not aware of. May knowledge spread by these discussions whoever you vote for as I believe the more information you analyse you are in a better position to make your choice, not left to newspapers alone.

 

Don't disagree, however, there was much tactical voting with Facebook members.

[Fred Bassett]

I am impressed with the debates on Facebook by the Young People engaging in this election. There are thoughts of what they see is how 'The Old School' which is a reference to ways we are governed, do not reflect the times we live in (not a reference to the old boys network Lol). They talk about new ideas.

 

Young blues have been enlightened by some history by young reds. Things they were not aware of. May knowledge spread by these discussions whoever you vote for as I believe the more information you analyse you are in a better position to make your choice, not left to newspapers alone.

 

If history teaches us one thing it is that a Labour government always ends up with the country in a bad state. We have to go through this periodically just so that the next generation realise. It took longer than usual this time, but the crash was pretty spectacular when it happened. We'll be paying for this lot for the next 20 years and it's quite possible that in 20 years we'll go through it all again.

[Bookworm]

However, the following cannot be dismissed:

Mr Brown is personally responsible for a series of mistakes that have shattered the economy.

No, Mr Brown is the one who got us OUT of the Thatcher-created recession of the 80s and took back control of the economy, leading Britain into one of its most prosperous periods. Mr Brown is the one who has done more than anyone to eradicate child poverty with the introduction of Tax Credits and minimum wages. Mr Brown is the one whose "wait and see" economic policy is supported by the IMF. Mr Brown is the one who has presided over the lowest interest rates in living history, a great boon for those trapped in the poverty borrowing vicious circle. Mr Brown is the one who was recognised as World Statesman of the Year in 2009, something which has been kept careful quiet by the Murdoch-led press...

 

Yes, it's true, he hasn't got everything right. No doubt about it. Show me one statesman who got everything right, 100% over a period of THIRTEEN years. Hell, show me a human being with such a record. Even Gandhi has been known to f*** up.

Not forgetting of course, the shambolic manner in which the Banks were allowed to ride roughod over the so called Regulators; FSA.

They failed to Regulate thus the country was brought to it's knees.

And who is the most in favour of DE-regulation? Of private enterprise? Of less state interference? Of selling public services piece by piece to the highest bidder and then let it thrash it beyond recognition as long as they can still fill their pockets? Ohhh, hang on, let me think... that wouldn't be the Tories by any chance? Why, I believe it may well be!

Robert Peston's blog is quite informative for some who may not know!

Indeed. From his most recent output (BBC - Peston's Picks): "So what would happen on markets if the Tories do end up governing as minority, with all legislation subject to cross-party negotiation and haggling?

Well, the strong probability, perhaps a racing certainty, is that investors would take fright. (...)

In those circumstances it is highly likely that sterling would fall and that the government would find it harder and more expensive to borrow.

Or to put it another way, the warning made during the election campaign by Ken Clarke, the Tory Business Secretary, that the UK could find itself again asking for financial succour from the International Monetary Fund might be prescient rather than alarmist." Hmmmm... :-|

 

Blaming GB for everything is just daft. It reminds me of a satire I read the other day: "My cat DIED while Brown was in power!!!"

[Fred Bassett]

Mr Brown is the man who lied to us about a referendum over the EU constitution.

 

Mr Brown is the man who lied to his own enquiry about defence spending.

 

Mr Brown is the man who has lied his way through the election about Tory and Lib Dem policies on tax credits.

 

Mr Brown can't be trusted with anything.

[Bookworm]

If history teaches us one thing it is that a Labour government always ends up with the country in a bad state. We have to go through this periodically just so that the next generation realise. It took longer than usual this time, but the crash was pretty spectacular when it happened. We'll be paying for this lot for the next 20 years and it's quite possible that in 20 years we'll go through it all again.

You're kidding right? Please tell me that you are saying this tongue in cheek. Please tell me that your memory is not THAT selective!

[Fred Bassett]

You're kidding right? Please tell me that you are saying this tongue in cheek. Please tell me that your memory is not THAT selective!

 

No I'm not kidding. Do you think the country is in a better financial state now than when Labour took office in 1997? I don't think this is the case and I don't believe that Gordon had nothing to do with it.

[determindator]

Bankers leave the country in a bad state. I'm repeating myself from BB's Obama thread but Mr O tried the regulation bill but the computer said 'no!'

 

Mr B tried and he advised what to do about Lehman's but the computer said 'no.'

 

 

Regulation is a worldwide consensus and until the USA sort it we have a problem.

[Fred Bassett]

Bankers leave the country in a bad state. I'm repeating myself from BB's Obama thread but Mr O tried the regulation bill but the computer said 'no!'

 

Mr B tried and he advised what to do about Lehman's but the computer said 'no.'

 

 

Regulation is a worldwide consensus and until the USA sort it we have a problem.

 

I know that Brown wasn't single-handedly responsible for it, but his ridiculous spending policies haven't helped. Mr 'Prudent' was not that prudent at all. He could well go down as the worst Chancellor and the worst PM this country has ever had.

[Bookworm]

Mr Brown is the man who lied to us about a referendum over the EU constitution.

 

Mr Brown is the man who lied to his own enquiry about defence spending.

 

Mr Brown is the man who has lied his way through the election about Tory and Lib Dem policies on tax credits.

 

Mr Brown can't be trusted with anything.

 

and Mr CallMeDave Cameron can? You really believe that? Oh my, Fred, it's getting to the point where I actually pity you if that's the case. :-|

 

Listen: I may be voting Labour, but I don't trust ANY politician. As far as I am concerned, the moment you see their lips moving, you assume they're lying. Full stop.

 

You then look at their party and their mission. You look through their manifestoes and other pledges, and you analyse what they have done in the past which is positive. THEN and only then, you make up your own mind.

 

The problem is that I can list many of GB's positive contributions to this country, and all you can do in your hatred of the man is list the negatives. Can you show me anything at ALL that DC has done? Not the promises he has made, like I said, I don't believe any of them. No, somethign concrete, something he has himself done to advance this country as a whole.

For example, I freely admit that it was a Tory who was behind the momentum passing of the Autism Bill, and I admire her for that. What motions has DC tabled which have led to something positive for the poor and downtrodden of this country, or indeed for the economy of this country?

 

All I have seen so far is a systematic attempt to smear Labour, which is very passive-aggressive and doesn't convince anyone. So convince me. Please. I like to judge a man by his good deeds, not by his weaknesses, you know, the whole pot-kettle-black thing, tit for tat, doesn't interest me.

 

I'm listening.

[pompeyfaith]

Gordon Brown or rather Labour have done many a good thing in the last 13 yrs as bookworm right points out, but yes he has also made a few bad decisions like Fred points out the biggest being the referendum on europe.

 

But that does not make him a bad Prime Minister it merely shows that like us he is human and that like his predecessors going back for as long as i can remember they have all made mistakes.

 

It does show that the current political system is tired and out of date and is in desperate need of bring it into the 21st century.

 

I am not political by any means so cannot say what changes are needed but I do know that the current system is all about greed and what is best for the party instead of what is best for the country and citizens.

 

PF

[Rooster-UK]

As someone posted earlier in the thread....

 

"Same crap.... Different nappy."

[angry cat]

Mr Brown is the man who lied to us about a referendum over the EU constitution.

 

Mr Brown is the man who lied to his own enquiry about defence spending.

 

Mr Brown is the man who has lied his way through the election about Tory and Lib Dem policies on tax credits.

 

Mr Brown can't be trusted with anything.

 

Absolutely agree!

 

Also, do not forget about how this non-elected man/party has let the troops down; disgaraceful!

 

Oh yes, and as far the golden boy; blair is concerned, (who now resembles George Hamilton III) isn't his nickname BLiar?

 

Weapons of mass distruction come to mind; illegal war(s).

 

I don't know where some of you have been for the last 13 years?

some are looking at Labour through rose tinted glasses: deluded.

[Fred Bassett]

Can you show me anything at ALL that DC has done?

 

Firstly, don't assume that I voted for Cameron. Secondly, he's been in opposition for the last 13 years, so his chances to do anything have been limited. Brown on the other hand has shown his true colours. He's a liar and can't be trusted. If there is one thing and one thing only I would give him credit for and that is the fact that he seemed to oppose scrapping our currency in favour of the Euro. Even then, I think that he knew he'd never get it past the British people.

 

Talking of negative, I watched a lot of the election campaign and Cameron and Clegg were the ones putting across positive ideas. It was Brown who ran the negative campaign with his incessant lies about tax credits and levels of immigration.

 

Now let's just assume that Cameron becomes Prime Minister and lasts a whole term - unlikely though that is.

 

Personally, I would be just as critical of him as I am of Brown if he behaves in the same manner. Be honest, it doesn't really matter what opposition leaders say - it is only what the government does that affects us all.

 

We all vote for the parties who we think will do the best by us as individuals/families. For me that is not Labour. I didn't like John Major, but compared to Brown he was a man of great political integrity (even if he couldn't keep it in his trousers).

 

If Brown and Labour are the answer, it must have been a really stupid question. Don't try and patronise me with statements like "I feel sorry ..". The country is in a mess. Brown is the Prime Minister. He gets most of the blame in my view, whether you like it or not.

[Bookworm]

No, some of use are looking at the last 13 years as the hell of a damn sight better than the catastrophic years before that. Some of us don't suffer from selective memories, which magically erase anything which happened before 1997

 

Still, as I said: convince me. You're still resorting to the smear campaign instead of selling me the good points of DC. I'm listening.

[determindator]

I heard Mr Cameron said if he didn't get an outright majority he would stand down as an MP, that being the case he didn't. So ch ch ch changes come to mind. I know this has been posted before but for an encore...........

 

 

YouTube - Blair and Cameron - changes !!

[Bookworm]

Firstly, don't assume that I voted for Cameron.

I do no such thing. Indeed, if I were to wonder (which I didn't), I would have thought that DC's policies would be far too mild for you, if anything I'd guess UKIP or BNP. But like I said, I don't know and I don't care.

Secondly, he's been in opposition for the last 13 years, so his chances to do anything have been limited.

I refer you to my previous post about the Autism bill and the TORY MP responsible for it. Not being in government is no excuse for inaction. From that feeble response, I presume you can not point to anything?

Brown on the other hand has shown his true colours. He's a liar and can't be trusted. If there is one thing and one thing only I would give him credit for and that is the fact that he seemed to oppose scrapping our currency in favour of the Euro. Even then, I think that he knew he'd never get it past the British people.

Here we go again, can't show anything good for the other chap, so let's go back to the pointing out the negatives oin the other chap.

Talking of negative, I watched a lot of the election campaign and Cameron and Clegg were the ones putting across positive ideas. It was Brown who ran the negative campaign with his incessant lies about tax credits and levels of immigration.

Yeah, yeah... and where I live, it was the Tories which ran the stories that Labour was going to close our A&E even though it was proven to them time and again that there was no truth in the assertion... And so on and so forth.

Now let's just assume that Cameron becomes Prime Minister and lasts a whole term - unlikely though that is.

Let's.

Personally, I would be just as critical of him as I am of Brown if he behaves in the same manner. Be honest, it doesn't really matter what opposition leaders say - it is only what the government does that affects us all.

I disagree. There are plenty of times where the opposition launched somethign and got it passed regardless of what the govt wanted, even garnering votes from the main party or alternatively stopping the worst excesses of a govt project by being the opposition (the clue is in the name)

 

We all vote for the parties who we think will do the best by us as individuals/families. For me that is not Labour. I didn't like John Major, but compared to Brown he was a man of great political integrity (even if he couldn't keep it in his trousers).

As someone who has been lifted out of poverty by Labour, and before downtrodden to the ground by the Tories, I feel exactly the opposite. As for the integrity of Major, let's not even go there, because that's a whole new debate which could go on for a very long time. Thatcher without the balls sums it up IMO.

If Brown and Labour are the answer, it must have been a really stupid question.

well, the question was: Who do you trust to fix Britain from the wreckage left by the Tories? and the answer, OVERWHELMINGLY, was Labour. and it worked until the USA's brand of liberalism so loved and imitated by the Tories wrecked not just Britain's economy, but the world's. You can blame Brown all you like, and you obviously do, but that's just jumping on a bandwagon with no wheels.

Don't try and patronise me with statements like "I feel sorry ..".

I'm not if I mean it sincerely. And I do.

The country is in a mess. Brown is the Prime Minister. He gets most of the blame in my view, whether you like it or not.

How convenient. Of course, it's easy for those who didn't have to deal with the most global crisis and make the decisions to sneer and say: "That's not how you do it". Personally, as a non-economist, I think I'll trust the IMF's opinion ahead of yours. ;-)