Advent Computer Training (Barclays Partner Finance)Info and discussion thread

[mantaxi]

can somebody please tell me what computeach are getting out of this. seems strange to me that they have agreed to buy advent and take on another 10000 or so students. they pay all the exam fees so if they only paid once for everybody this amounts to approx £1,500000 if exams are £150 to take. they say they have bought advent but for how much. probably peanuts just to get bpf out of a jam. are bpf now financing computeach? surely we have an option to refuse computeach and get a refund if we want to and not be forced to have the new provider. this is what happens if you buy something, find that its not what it was surposed to be take it back, get offered something similar turn it down and get your refund. i have never been told by any company that we got you this so put up with it, allways got something better or my money back. so not happy with computeach, want my money back. simples

[mantaxi]

Hi Mantaxi wondered where you'd got to your right it's a joke did you see the guy jim that posted he'd worked for Computeach and they were told to keep peeps back to make them pay more.

I have no intention of going with them and I'm in loads debt now but I can't pay for that it'd feel like I was agreeing to be mugged I think I'll be joining you all with A4ron's lawyer cos not heard from Hausfeld but I think if we have a mass group action it'll have more weight.

 

bluedo if i was you i would not pay another penny to bpf even if they took me to court, at least you would get your point across in court, and have 1000s of us behind you. have they stated that you would be breaking s75 like they did to me. even if you lost your unemployed so the judge wouldn't make you pay much back a month, then you pay one payment then no more untill they take you to court again and so on. can go on for years then if you move they will have no idea how to contact you for thier money. but i think a4rons solicitor will come up trumps.

[skyblue dave]

can somebody please tell me what computeach are getting out of this. seems strange to me that they have agreed to buy advent and take on another 10000 or so students. they pay all the exam fees so if they only paid once for everybody this amounts to approx £1,500000 if exams are £150 to take. they say they have bought advent but for how much. probably peanuts just to get bpf out of a jam. are bpf now financing computeach? surely we have an option to refuse computeach and get a refund if we want to and not be forced to have the new provider. this is what happens if you buy something, find that its not what it was surposed to be take it back, get offered something similar turn it down and get your refund. i have never been told by any company that we got you this so put up with it, allways got something better or my money back. so not happy with computeach, want my money back. simples

 

I assume BPF will have given computeach a lump sum, let's say £300 per student for argument's sake. Computeach will be working on the basis that most students won't progress very far, which is a proven fact where self-study is concerned, and, therefore, won't cost computeach much money or cause them much inconvenience. Add to that their reputation for actively DISCOURAGING students' progress and you can see how they can make their money.

 

I agree with the majority of people on this forum. There is no way I want to accept computeach as an alternative. The C.A.B. advised me that I must formally complain to BPF (Requesting refund and no further payments etc)and outline my reasons. Once they reply, or after 8 weeks of no reply, I can then refer it to the F.O. The F.O. then make a judgement. (ps If anyone wants the F.O. website, where you can download the relevant forms that need to be filled in, here it is: www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk ).

 

What I need to do it put together a comprehensive list as to why computeach are not an acceptable alternative. From what we are led to believe ,they are crap. But, let's be fair, so were Advent. I need to prove, therefore, that they are even worse than Advent. Quite a challenge. Has anyone got any tangible facts. eg They don't, apparently, offer the same hands-on approach to getting jobs for their students as Advent did.

The web design course is NOT as involved as Advent's.(I don't think it offers the Flash and Dreamweaver course). Therefore, it is not like-for-like.

Any other ideas would be welcome.

 

Good luck everyone!!

[10pack]

bluedo if i was you i would not pay another penny to bpf even if they took me to court, at least you would get your point across in court, and have 1000s of us behind you. have they stated that you would be breaking s75 like they did to me. even if you lost your unemployed so the judge wouldn't make you pay much back a month, then you pay one payment then no more untill they take you to court again and so on. can go on for years then if you move they will have no idea how to contact you for thier money. but i think a4rons solicitor will come up trumps.

 

Anything is possible.. but you need to watch you credit rating everyone needs a loan every now and then, and BPF would log you on the system as bad payers, and that will take more trouble to remove than its worth.. **** sticks specially on the carpet in your car.. damn dogs!!.

 

Also being out of work sucks in other ways.

At the same time advent went bust my car insurance renewal was due, the broker phoned me and came out with the usual speil about times are hard for insurance companies blah blah blah.. his quote was a £100 more than the year before.. car is older.. I am older.. he did not care, but when he asked about how many miles I thought I would be doing I told him in the past 6 months about 300 miles because I was made redundant.. ooh he said well in that case your premium will be more!.

I said What!! Why??.. he said when you are at work your car is in the car park so even though you maybe travelling about 13k a year its not on the road most of the day, now you are at home you have access to your car all day so potential for a lot more use, I did point out about where would I be getting the money to be paying for petrol for my marathon 24/7 trips around the country but he countered by suggesting that I sorn my car that way I did not need to insure it.. I put the phone down.

[10pack]

can somebody please tell me what computeach are getting out of this. seems strange to me that they have agreed to buy advent and take on another 10000 or so students. they pay all the exam fees so if they only paid once for everybody this amounts to approx £1,500000 if exams are £150 to take. they say they have bought advent but for how much. probably peanuts just to get bpf out of a jam. are bpf now financing computeach? surely we have an option to refuse computeach and get a refund if we want to and not be forced to have the new provider. this is what happens if you buy something, find that its not what it was surposed to be take it back, get offered something similar turn it down and get your refund. i have never been told by any company that we got you this so put up with it, allways got something better or my money back. so not happy with computeach, want my money back. simples

 

Have computeach brought advent? did not know this when did this happen?

[Boosh]

Just remembered a couple of things that the Advent sales rep told me before I accepted.

1. I am at a better advantage of being accepted for the course because I am female

2. I would get my travelling expenses paid to and from Kidderminster inc accommodation

 

When I booked for my first workshop I sent them an email asking them what I need to do to get my expenses paid, it was the I found out it was a lie, but Advent did refund me 50% of my accommdoation, another reson for being mis-sold the course in the first place

[sparkynot]

That is brilliant news turbo.

 

UPDATE: It appears one of the Access to trade guys has had their agreement cancelled according to the FB group.

hi all , have just found this site. i am in the same boat , only made 2payments have not yet started electricians course. have stopped payments have no intention of letting a bank choose a training course for me.where did you get the news that access2trade student has escaped this situation? We are all at different stages of our training.but I for one am going to dig my heels in. regards . sparky NOT

[Mustard2243]

There is a group on Facebook called advent scammed us.

[sparkynot]

thanks.will go look.

[10pack]

Hi Guys

Anyone got an idea of how many students advent had?

 

The guy I spoke to at barclays a few months back mentioned that they had over 6,000 students with loans in the same boat as me.. would these all be with advent and the access to trade group??

 

And those just mentioned on facebook, are some of you also posting here?? would like to get some idea of the size of all of this

[10pack]

also check out this forum there are training companies offering free workshop days to ex-advent students on first come basis.. it goes to show that not all the training companies are run by money grabbers

 

Advent Training - Page 3 - CertForums

[Bluedo]

Barclays tops financial complaints table | Money | guardian.co.uk

A little bedtime read

 

Mantaxi

My parents went guarantor they trusted me and tried to help me get a secure job Ha!!

I work but have been laid off since Christmas.I'd run away do a bunk but they'd be left with the hassle it's a bloody nightmare.

Skybluedave's right we need concrete reasons to refuse Computeach

1 They're situated too far away 2 Their course work is out of date need to validate that. 3They have a bad reputation 4 They've already been investigated by the OFT, 5 We have no guarantee that they will not collapse like Advent did. We have no longer confidence in distance learning.

Please add to the list see what we can come up with

[Bluedo]

hi all , have just found this site. i am in the same boat , only made 2payments have not yet started electricians course. have stopped payments have no intention of letting a bank choose a training course for me.where did you get the news that access2trade student has escaped this situation? We are all at different stages of our training.but I for one am going to dig my heels in. regards . sparky NOT

 

Hi sparkynot welcome

Who is your finance with it's just that if it's Hitachi they've been getting refund offers or are you like us and with Barclays Partner Finance/Clydesdale. or Anglo capital who were Advent's own co. ?

 

Boosh they were a bunch of porky pie'ers but all these wee pieces can be put together if it comes to that.

[Fuzzbutt]

Well, lookee what I googled up, a current Facebook group in the process of taking legal action against Computeach. Some of the complaints are identical to the ones we have with Advent. And BPF think they are doing us some favour? Jokers!

 

Legal Action against computeach | Facebook

[Bluedo]

Well, lookee what I googled up, a current Facebook group in the process of taking legal action against Computeach. Some of the complaints are identical to the ones we have with Advent. And BPF think they are doing us some favour? Jokers!

 

Legal Action against computeach | Facebook

 

Oh!! well done!! Fuzzbutt good googling. couldn't get better evidence We should support them if we find out anything

[citizenB]

On the subject of litigation-I should add that a high proportion of cases are actually settled out of Court-some being done after sending a letter before action,others after acknowledgement of claim is filed but before they have to file a defence.Barclays and others are used to being threatened with legal action,but they know only a small proportion of those will actually be prepared to follow it through.

If it does become clear that the small claims is appropriate then we will assist those wishing to go down that route,with info and draft up some stuff to get you on your way.

 

 

I have been asked to pop in to offer advice or obtain it for the thread. If someone could type up a summary of the situation please. Meanwhile, I will flag the thread for site team assistance.

 

[MARTIN3030]

Yes agreed -I have been away and so am not fully up to speed with recent developements.Given the size of the threads and associated ones -I think it would be a good idea to start a new thread where anyone who has had threats because they have either stopped payments,or else fell behingd with them,can post.

This way we can deal with the response more effectively.

I will start the thread in the main forum here.

[Fuzzbutt]

I have been asked to pop in to offer advice or obtain it for the thread. If someone could type up a summary of the situation please. Meanwhile, I will flag the thread for site team assistance.

 

 

Many thanks for your welcome help, CitizenB and Martin.

 

Here's a snapshot summary of where this is at (others feel free to add anything I've missed)....

 

After Advent went insolvent, many of us wrote to Barclays Partner Finance asking for course fees to be refunded due to Breach of Contract (S75 of Consumer Credit Act) and Frustrated Contract (Law Reform 1943).

 

Barclays continued to insist we would be offered another course provider, despite the vast majority just asking them for a refund and nothing more to do with any IT distance learning.

 

Comparing our stories, we discover that Advent appear to have been mis-selling their courses with false promises of job placement, timescales, etc plus poor support anyway so figure we had a good case for mis-selling in any case.

 

Just over 7 weeks from Advent's collapse Barclays now write to tell us they have a new training provider -Computeach. Many here are not happy with this.

 

Some of us have already sent copies of our contracts with both Barclays and Advent, along with copies of letters we've had from BPF customer service dept, to various solicitors in the hope we can be represented as a group.

 

Many of us have already lodged a complaint with the Financial Ombudsman and have taken advice from our local trading standards, who generally seem to think we've got a case for S75 Breach in contract as BPF have taken so long to find another trainer (near 8 weeks) and the contract was with Advent, no one else, so Barclays have no legal ground to force this new trainer on us.

 

I am still waiting to hear back from a solicitor to firm this up, but some people are apparently getting refunds from Hitachi now, who they paid for their Advent courses with.

 

I've got electronic copies of all contracts and Barclays letters to me to date, if that would be helpful.

 

Thanks again.

[cjclegg]

Thanks for the link Fuzzbutt, reading the stories on this group is giving is some real ammunition to dispute Computeach as our new provider. What we all need to be asking when the letters arrive are 1, What is the pass rate required in Mock exams to be put forward for the final exam, 2, If we fail the exam will Computeach pay for us to re-sit the exam as Advent guaranteed, 3, Do they provide a dedicated team to help find it's syudents work as Advent boasted, 4, Will the course be up to date with current certifications as we are now in the now about MCSE becoming redundant this July, 5, What will be the time limit on our course as many Computeach students have been asked for further money to continue their course after a specific time limit has elapsed and finally, why should we even entertain such a company which has got such a reputation that their students and ex-students are taking legal action against them while they are still trading. It is our right to refuse and I implore each and every one of you to do so... This company is far worse than Advent and that is saying something, if anyone would like to add to my list then please do so. All the info in this post is taken from the first page only of the link Fuzzbutt has posted, if we keep digging BPF will not have a leg to stand on.

 

Regards,

 

CJ.

[Fuzzbutt]

Absolutely, I looked at Computeach website and, while they do offer CV writing and preparation for interview support they don't seem to have the dedicated recruitment team Advent salesmen promised many at interview.

The other stuff might be worth phoning them about as there's nothing much on the website (I can't spot it anyway) about timescales and deadlines to pass or else you get charged again.

Some of the A+ exams were going to be outdated in July as I had this email from Avent back in Oct...

"We notice from our records that you have attended a workshop for A+ but have not yet requested a mock exam. The current 220-601 and 220-602 exams are retiring on the above date and we encourage you to complete both exams by this date – which is more than achievable.

 

A very large majority of our students complete the second A+ exam (PC Technician) within 8 weeks of passing the first A+ exam. Therefore we strongly urge and encourage you to think about actively finishing the A+ Essentials by at least March 2010 – we know this seems like ample time but the sooner you complete this, the better as you do not want to run out of time."

 

So there's one that might be defunct for a start.....

[citizenB]

Can those of you who want to take legal action with CAG assistance, please identify yourselves

 

Those of you who have made complaints to Trading Standards/OFT/Consumer Direct, can you let us know what responses you received.

 

If any of you have received communication from DCAs, can you let us know.

 

Thanks

[cjclegg]

Absolutely, I looked at Computeach website and, while they do offer CV writing and preparation for interview support they don't seem to have the dedicated recruitment team Advent salesmen promised many at interview.

The other stuff might be worth phoning them about as there's nothing much on the website (I can't spot it anyway) about timescales and deadlines to pass or else you get charged again.

Some of the A+ exams were going to be outdated in July as I had this email from Avent back in Oct...

"We notice from our records that you have attended a workshop for A+ but have not yet requested a mock exam. The current 220-601 and 220-602 exams are retiring on the above date and we encourage you to complete both exams by this date – which is more than achievable.

 

A very large majority of our students complete the second A+ exam (PC Technician) within 8 weeks of passing the first A+ exam. Therefore we strongly urge and encourage you to think about actively finishing the A+ Essentials by at least March 2010 – we know this seems like ample time but the sooner you complete this, the better as you do not want to run out of time."

 

So there's one that might be defunct for a start.....

 

I understand where you are coming from Fuzzbutt, but essentially we have had our course stopped for 2 months now, which has to count for something with regards to the issue brought up above.... How can we complete part of a course with no provider, no exams and course material?

Again we are at the mercy of others...

[cjclegg]

Fuzzbutt, has your complaint with the FO reached 8 weeks yet? Or for that matter has anyone else's??? If so what is the outcome so far?

[MARTIN3030]

Thanks for updates.

As I understand it we have a number of different scenarios,Those who paid in full,those who took out agreements.

Then there are 3 different finance providers.

The issues are whether there is recourse for those with current agreements to have them rescinded and have all payments refunded,whether there is recourse for those who have paid in full to have their fees refunded,and whether in all cases there is recourse that allows rejection of alternative training provisions.

 

So basically,there is no one fits all course of action-and needs to be dealt with as the situation demands.

 

It is interesting to note that Hitachi have been making refunds-do we know on what basis they have felt obligated to do so ?

 

We need absolute clarification that Section 75 has been said to be an option-its no good to say "there MAY be recourse under that "

 

Our experience of Barclays is that they will only sit up and take notice when a summons lands on their desks at Churchill Place.

Its clear that a County Court Claim is going to have to be initiated for some.

We need to establish clear rights of action under CPR and draft POCS that address the issues.

Its likely that would need to include the CCA and other stats.

Its also worth considering an application for an injunction to prevent those being pressed for payments in the interim period,from being hassled further.

[skyblue dave]

Many thanks for your welcome help, CitizenB and Martin.

 

Here's a snapshot summary of where this is at (others feel free to add anything I've missed)....

 

After Advent went insolvent, many of us wrote to Barclays Partner Finance asking for course fees to be refunded due to Breach of Contract (S75 of Consumer Credit Act) and Frustrated Contract (Law Reform 1943).

 

Barclays continued to insist we would be offered another course provider, despite the vast majority just asking them for a refund and nothing more to do with any IT distance learning.

 

Comparing our stories, we discover that Advent appear to have been mis-selling their courses with false promises of job placement, timescales, etc plus poor support anyway so figure we had a good case for mis-selling in any case.

 

Just over 7 weeks from Advent's collapse Barclays now write to tell us they have a new training provider -Computeach. Many here are not happy with this.

 

 

What did the letter say? ie What are you being told is the next stage? Do you contactcomputeach directly to let them know where you are with your course ? etc etc I have not yet had my letter.