Ihateinjustice v Civil Enforcement.... Bailiffs.

[ihateinjustice]

I am another unfortunate victim of Civil Enforcement/newlyn and have been in touch with my MP and followed lots of cases each time more horrified than the last that this is allowed to go on. I have taken advice and wrote to Newlyn pointing out breach of contract etc and sat tight thinking they cannot touch me then I came accross the following l and my heart just stopped!

 

To whom it may concern,

 

I would like to know where or whom I should complain to about a recent visit from Newlyn Bailiffs sent by a local authority for outstanding parking fines on my cousins motor vehicle, a 2002 Toyota Celica.

 

The vehicle was apparently photographed with two wheels on the curb on two occasions, parking fines where dispatched to my cousins previous address as he had not changed the V5 DVLA vehicle registration document advising the change of address ( he has taken out a log book loan with a broker and had not finished repaying so the V5 was not in his possession to send to the DVLA to advise this change).

 

On Saturday 4th April 2009, a Bailiff vehicle with Automatic Number Plate Recognition cameras identified the Toyota as being a vehicle with outstanding parking fines.

 

The Bailiffs clamped the car around 6AM in the morning.

 

My cousin discovered the clamp around 11AM apon leaving his new address, two Bailiffs were standing by the vehicle, when asked why they had clamped the car they explained there was a Warrant Of Execution for two unpaid penalty charges, £155 for each PCN totalling £310 from Bromley Council, plus £690 Bailiffs charges, my cousin called me for help in settling this financial matter.

 

Apon my arrival my cousin advised me the Bailiffs had called a tow truck to take the car away as he could not come up with the money immediately,

 

From the Bailiffs I requested that they provide documentation showing the warrant they were executing and for them to show some identification. They took my cousin over to their van and opened a laptop computer and showed him two Warrant Of Execution documents, he requested a printout so the Bailiff went away for a period and came back with this, they also showed him their ID's.

 

I offerred to pay the £310 for the unpaid penalty charges on my credit card and this was promptly refused as they demanded £1000 or the car would be taken, I explained to them that I would not be willing to put that amount on my card and that taking the car would not be an option if they refused my offer of payment, their response was to call the Police on a pretext that there was about to be a breach of the peace. I recognized this as a intimidating tactic and suggested that they do call the Police as their charges were grossly exuberant and it appeared they were piggy backing the justice system to extort money for their own a personal gain or for others.

 

Two Police officers arrived promptly and later a tow truck, my cousins girlfriend sat in his Toyota vehicle while he ran around trying to contact the local authority to verify the unpaid penalty claims made by the two Bailiffs, as he had no previous knowledge of fines being levied against the vehicle. This took some time to get through to anyone so the Bailiffs started started knocking on his front door demanding that he come out.

 

After an hour of pleading for the Bailiff to accept my offer of £310 another Police Officer arrived (I am not sure why there was a need for three police officers as there was no raised voices or gestures being offered to the two Bailiffs). Two hours passed and a further two police officers arrived, now a total of five police officers. The Bailiffs still being unable to tow the vehicle as the young lady was still sat inside with the doors locked were no becoming angry and calling me an idiot as I was telling them their actions were unprofessional. The police officers were now fed up at being called to this dispute and getting deperate to go, telling us "the car now belong to the court as there was a Warrant of Executon", I told them respectively that they were wrong. In fact one said to my cousin, "can't you see that you have got five police officers here when that could be doing something more important", I asked the officer "why is there five of you here", he turned to me but could not provide an answer.

 

The Bailiff asked the tow truck driver for help in opening up the car door, he refused and said he was only there to tow the car and is not getting involved.

 

One of the Bailiffs (Mr Gideon Grundeling) then went to his van and came back with a car jack, he went away again and came back with a wheel brace and immediately started smashing at the drivers window, the first three blows echoed the street, the fourth blow shattered the drivers car door window showering the visibly shaken lady in shards of glass. The Bailiff entered the Toyota from the drivers side, reached over and opened the passengers door, one of the five police officers who stood by watching the Bailiffs unlawful actions approached the youg lady still sitting in the car and said she would be arrested for obstruction if she did not leave the vehicle, so she did.

 

The tow truck which had already lowered its spectacle lifts behind the wheels of the Toyota very quickly lifted the car and drove away, followed by the Bailiffs in their van and three police cars, leaving us with no notice that the car had been seized. The young lady was not cut by the flying glass luckily, but she was clearly shaken by the experience. The police who (apparently) have a duty of care to us citizens showed none, I hate to think what could have happened if the wheel brace flew out of his hand into the car.

 

I have since paid the outstanding fines directly to the local authority on behalf of my cousin, but I can't stomach paying extortion money, so unfortunately they still have the car and have since added charges for the tow truck and storage, they are now asking for £1400..........help.

 

OK SO THAT WAS THE EMAIL....

 

The car is under finance with logbook loans. Logbook loans contacted me saying that the bailiffs had been in touch with them and that they invoiced them around £300 to release the car. I told them not to get involved. So i spoke to the bailiffs like a day later and then quoted me £802.93 for the release. They still havn't said anything about the repair of my vehicle yet.

 

CAN SOMEONE PLEASE HELP!!!!

 

Criminal to say the least . . .

[lamma]

VERY criminal. And totally irrelevant to PPC invoices. Nothing at all to do with the PPC game, this was related to council tickets. And the bailiff should be jailed !

[miranda_bdf]

Was about to say the same, lamma.

 

Worth a comparison...? The bailiffs started with being 'the right side of legal', referred to them as the Council had not got a reply. But the charges are unbelievable and bet you they include the cost of time spent arguing on the day with the bailiffs and a list of other things, then also storage charges to add while they hold on to the vehicle. Can challenge whether the charges are legally reasonable, can also challenge bailiff certificates...a bit more teeth than with PPC.

[ihateinjustice]

So does that mean newlyn will not send someone to my house to clamp my car???:?

[kiptower]

ihateinjustice

 

one of the mods should move your post to a new thread shortly, in the balliff section

 

I have asked the Balliff expert TomTubby to have a look @ this , as others said its criminal what the balliff did

 

Kip

[ihateinjustice]

Not only are local councils using this method for cpn's they are also using the very same method for unpaid council tax!! Seems like we are heading back to the dark ages . . .:-|

[tomtubby]

I am another unfortunate victim of Civil Enforcement/newlyn and have been in touch with my MP and followed lots of cases each time more horrified than the last that this is allowed to go on. I have taken advice and wrote to Newlyn pointing out breach of contract etc and sat tight thinking they cannot touch me then I came accross the following l and my heart just stopped!

 

To whom it may concern,

 

I would like to know where or whom I should complain to about a recent visit from Newlyn Bailiffs sent by a local authority for outstanding parking fines on my cousins motor vehicle, a 2002 Toyota Celica.

 

The vehicle was apparently photographed with two wheels on the curb on two occasions, parking fines where dispatched to my cousins previous address as he had not changed the V5 DVLA vehicle registration document advising the change of address ( he has taken out a log book loan with a broker and had not finished repaying so the V5 was not in his possession to send to the DVLA to advise this change).

 

On Saturday 4th April 2009, a Bailiff vehicle with Automatic Number Plate Recognition cameras identified the Toyota as being a vehicle with outstanding parking fines.

 

The Bailiffs clamped the car around 6AM in the morning.

 

My cousin discovered the clamp around 11AM apon leaving his new address, two Bailiffs were standing by the vehicle, when asked why they had clamped the car they explained there was a Warrant Of Execution for two unpaid penalty charges, £155 for each PCN totalling £310 from Bromley Council, plus £690 Bailiffs charges, my cousin called me for help in settling this financial matter.

 

Apon my arrival my cousin advised me the Bailiffs had called a tow truck to take the car away as he could not come up with the money immediately,

 

From the Bailiffs I requested that they provide documentation showing the warrant they were executing and for them to show some identification. They took my cousin over to their van and opened a laptop computer and showed him two Warrant Of Execution documents, he requested a printout so the Bailiff went away for a period and came back with this, they also showed him their ID's.

 

I offerred to pay the £310 for the unpaid penalty charges on my credit card and this was promptly refused as they demanded £1000 or the car would be taken, I explained to them that I would not be willing to put that amount on my card and that taking the car would not be an option if they refused my offer of payment, their response was to call the Police on a pretext that there was about to be a breach of the peace. I recognized this as a intimidating tactic and suggested that they do call the Police as their charges were grossly exuberant and it appeared they were piggy backing the justice system to extort money for their own a personal gain or for others.

 

Two Police officers arrived promptly and later a tow truck, my cousins girlfriend sat in his Toyota vehicle while he ran around trying to contact the local authority to verify the unpaid penalty claims made by the two Bailiffs, as he had no previous knowledge of fines being levied against the vehicle. This took some time to get through to anyone so the Bailiffs started started knocking on his front door demanding that he come out.

 

After an hour of pleading for the Bailiff to accept my offer of £310 another Police Officer arrived (I am not sure why there was a need for three police officers as there was no raised voices or gestures being offered to the two Bailiffs). Two hours passed and a further two police officers arrived, now a total of five police officers. The Bailiffs still being unable to tow the vehicle as the young lady was still sat inside with the doors locked were no becoming angry and calling me an idiot as I was telling them their actions were unprofessional. The police officers were now fed up at being called to this dispute and getting deperate to go, telling us "the car now belong to the court as there was a Warrant of Executon", I told them respectively that they were wrong. In fact one said to my cousin, "can't you see that you have got five police officers here when that could be doing something more important", I asked the officer "why is there five of you here", he turned to me but could not provide an answer.

 

The Bailiff asked the tow truck driver for help in opening up the car door, he refused and said he was only there to tow the car and is not getting involved.

 

One of the Bailiffs (Mr Gideon Grundeling) then went to his van and came back with a car jack, he went away again and came back with a wheel brace and immediately started smashing at the drivers window, the first three blows echoed the street, the fourth blow shattered the drivers car door window showering the visibly shaken lady in shards of glass. The Bailiff entered the Toyota from the drivers side, reached over and opened the passengers door, one of the five police officers who stood by watching the Bailiffs unlawful actions approached the youg lady still sitting in the car and said she would be arrested for obstruction if she did not leave the vehicle, so she did.

 

The tow truck which had already lowered its spectacle lifts behind the wheels of the Toyota very quickly lifted the car and drove away, followed by the Bailiffs in their van and three police cars, leaving us with no notice that the car had been seized. The young lady was not cut by the flying glass luckily, but she was clearly shaken by the experience. The police who (apparently) have a duty of care to us citizens showed none, I hate to think what could have happened if the wheel brace flew out of his hand into the car.

 

I have since paid the outstanding fines directly to the local authority on behalf of my cousin, but I can't stomach paying extortion money, so unfortunately they still have the car and have since added charges for the tow truck and storage, they are now asking for £1400..........help.

 

OK SO THAT WAS THE EMAIL....

 

The car is under finance with logbook loans. Logbook loans contacted me saying that the bailiffs had been in touch with them and that they invoiced them around £300 to release the car. I told them not to get involved. So i spoke to the bailiffs like a day later and then quoted me £802.93 for the release. They still havn't said anything about the repair of my vehicle yet.

 

CAN SOMEONE PLEASE HELP!!!!

 

Criminal to say the least . . .

 

This is dreadful.

 

In the first instance can you contactthe Traffic Enforcement Centre on 01604 619450 and ask them to confirm to you the name and address on the Warrant of Executions. You will need the PCN numbers from Bromley before making the call.

 

From what you have posted, it is clear that all documentation had been sent to the wrong address and you will no doubt receive confirmation of this from TEC.

 

If correct, then you will need to complete an Out of Time Statutory Declaration IMMEDIATELY. TEC will e-mail a copy to you.

 

Can you post back when you have received confirmation.

 

PS: The local authority (Bromley) are wholly responsible for "all acts and ommissions" of their agents (bailiffs) and it is the council who will have to be responsible for the damage to the vehicle.

 

Have you made a formal complaint to both Bromley and Newlyn Collections?

 

PS: You need to be aware that many bailiff companies read posts on here so be cautious of what you are writing and it is best to remove the name of the bailiff !! (( edit button )

[Nulla Bona]

You really need to seek some legal advice. However, the Bailiffs were within their rights to take the vehicle.

[tomtubby]

When did this incident happen?

 

Is the car still impounded?

[miranda_bdf]

Have done some digging - this incident is kenze's and appears on thread entitled Newlyn Smashed Up Car Window While My Girlfriend Was In It After Refusing Part Payment Of £1000 In Police Presence !

Is there any point in continuing with this thread, as ihateinjustice seems to have simply quoted the case as an example?

ihateinjustice, it might help to know that Newlyns have a number of clients and much depends on what role they are carrying out. In this case they are operating in an enforcement role for the local authority. This has different powers attached as against carrying out debt collection on parking invoices for CEL. Hope this helps.

[535boy]

a very old thread still, i don't believe that the police never did anything when gideon was breaking the glass as when a vehicle is clamped it becomes the property of Northampton county court and thus according to you the bailiff was committing criminal damage.Secondly why is a bailiff a bastard when all he ask for is the fees,if your cousin had changed the address on time he would have recievd the letters and sorted it one way or the other with the bailiff before the vehicle got clamped.

gone are the days when bailiff used to be a essex gangster,now with companies like JBW in the market a bailiff is more of a salesperson then a rude boy and his task is to collect monies owed to debtor is most friendly and professional way.a BAILIFF works by the book on the instruction of the courts.

pay your fines and if you cant pay them then call the bailiff company before the vehicle is clamped and sort some kind of arrangement,a bailiff doesn't like the shouting and the swearing at them as at the end of the day he is just doing his job.

[brassnecked]

a very old thread still, i don't believe that the police never did anything when gideon was breaking the glass as when a vehicle is clamped it becomes the property of Northampton county court and thus according to you the bailiff was committing criminal damage.Secondly why is a bailiff a bastard when all he ask for is the fees,if your cousin had changed the address on time he would have recievd the letters and sorted it one way or the other with the bailiff before the vehicle got clamped.

gone are the days when bailiff used to be a essex gangster,now with companies like JBW in the market a bailiff is more of a salesperson then a rude boy and his task is to collect monies owed to debtor is most friendly and professional way.a BAILIFF works by the book on the instruction of the courts.

pay your fines and if you cant pay them then call the bailiff company before the vehicle is clamped and sort some kind of arrangement,a bailiff doesn't like the shouting and the swearing at them as at the end of the day he is just doing his job.

 

 

If only this were true, and bailiffs didn't load fees wrongfully, such as charging an attendance to remove for pushing a letter through etc.

 

they should be sent through a timewarp back to 1211 AD imho

 

We will have to agree to disagree perhaps a billy goat gruff will be along soon

[535boy]

the fees of bailiff are set by the council they are collecting for and are authorized by the court,by not pay fines in first place then shouting in the end when a car gets clamped.even from recieving the first letter the car is not clamped the second day so why not call the bailiff and sort the debt rather than wait for the clamp.

[brassnecked]

the fees of bailiff are set by the council they are collecting for and are authorized by the court,by not pay fines in first place then shouting in the end when a car gets clamped.even from recieving the first letter the car is not clamped the second day so why not call the bailiff and sort the debt rather than wait for the clamp.

 

What should I do if i am parked by an address and on the phone in my motor when a bailiff tries to levy my motor for a debt at the address he's attending that I happen to be parked outside then?

[hallowitch]

the fees of bailiff are set by the council they are collecting for and are authorised by the court,

 

No they are set by legislation it has nothing to do with the council or the court if its council tax or PCN

 

the only thing the local authority may have an input with is the attendance to remove fee (after a valid levy) where they may cap the fee a bailiff in there employment can charge and even then it can subject to a detailed assessment in court

 

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1988/2050/contents/made

 

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1992/613/regulation/34/made

 

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2003/1857/contents/made

[535boy]

What should I do if i am parked by an address and on the phone in my motor when a bailiff tries to levy my motor for a debt at the address he's attending that I happen to be parked outside then?

seems like you have had quiet a bad experience with a micky moss bailiff.how can a bailiff levy on a vehicle that doesnt belong to a debtor,he can only levy on the vehicle if the DVLA comes positive in the debtor name and the dvla report doesn't come overnight,a bailiff might commit a mistake ..... if he does he can loose his license..or making the company lose the contract cause of his actions..no matter how small or big the debt is surely the council is a phone call away and there to help.

[ploddertom]

seems like you have had quiet a bad experience with a micky moss bailiff.how can a bailiff levy on a vehicle that doesnt belong to a debtor,he can only levy on the vehicle if the DVLA comes positive in the debtor name and the dvla report doesn't come overnight,a bailiff might commit a mistake ..... if he does he can loose his license..or making the company lose the contract cause of his actions..no matter how small or big the debt is surely the council is a phone call away and there to help.

 

Seems like you need to do some more reading of some the tricks these "gentlemen" get up to.

 

PT

[brassnecked]

Seems like you need to do some more reading of some the tricks these "gentlemen" get up to.

 

PT

 

PT I suspect there are defenders of Ogremor who reside under bridges on here looking for three billy goats gruff, or they are naive enough to think all bailiffs act according to the law.

[ploddertom]

Must have been the one in the 3.30 that was wearing blinkers methinks.

[tomtubby]

535 boy.

 

Can I just correct some points that you have raised in two of your posts: The first one is as follows:

"the fees of bailiff are set by the council they are collecting for and are authorized by the court,

This is NOT true. The fees are nothing at all to do with the council. For the collection of road traffic debts, the fees are statutory fees as laid down by Parliament ( and at this present, being ignored by many bailiff companies!!)

 

Your second error is this one:

"When a vehicle is clamped it becomes the property of Northampton County Court".

This is complete nonsense. All that NCC do is register the debt the unpaid parking ticket and provide the AUTHORITY for the local council to issue a warrant. The local authority have to pay a fee of £7 to NCC for each warrant requested.

.