Claim Stayed – Due to Unenforceable CCA Test Cases.

[oilyrag]

removed

Edited January 27, 2010 by oilyrag
advised

[paulwlton]

Todays Financial Times.

 

FT.com / UK - Banks face loans write-off after ruling

[humbleman]

The OFT and Judge Waksman have backed lenders’ right to provide an accurate copy, rather than the original agreement, and to change the terms of a loan provided they keep customers informed.

 

Same thing as recreating

[angry cat]

The OFT and Judge Waksman have backed lenders’ right to provide an accurate copy, rather than the original agreement, and to change the terms of a loan provided they keep customers informed.

 

Same thing as recreating

 

...An accurate copy!!!

[peugeotphil]

hi anyone any advice 10 yrs ago i took out a bussiness development loan to buy some land paid half and borrowed half,over the next few years i finished my bussiness and was sent to debt recovery i paid of my origanail loan but the bank kept interest on two accounts that were overdrawn through charges , they treatened court and everyting over 10 years and then i sent them cca letter sayin i had no agreement for overdraft so i should not been charged interest they demanded £25000 said they settle for bit less however since asking for cca agrement they rang didnt write and women was bit snotty i said am going to court give me my deeds she said think about it will ring you weds this never happened its now 1 year and they have had no response or given me a copy of an aggrement what can i do the suddunly stopped all contact all she said on phone was they didnt want to take me to court for 10 years they threatened to what would advise be to get me deeds of them like i said no reponse to my cca letter been a year since any contact cheers

[humbleman]

...An accurate copy!!!

 

an accurate copy, rather than the original agreement

[Baggio]

an accurate copy, rather than the original agreement

 

they will be asked to prove how they account this accuracy... and if they have been caught out in the past "forging" agreements... etc etc

 

a decent barrister would rip them a new one in court.

[humbleman]

they will be asked to prove how they account this accuracy... and if they have been caught out in the past "forging" agreements... etc etc

 

a decent barrister would rip them a new one in court.

 

Do you know of one?

[Baggio]

Do you know of one?

 

there are a few around, i note one of the site team on your thread passed you information about one he reccomended... did you make any progress with that lead?

[Ruprecht]

they will be asked to prove how they account this accuracy... and if they have been caught out in the past "forging" agreements... etc etc

 

a decent barrister would rip them a new one in court.

 

I consider myself more than competent and I have a degree in law. I have studied the CCA for years. I also have the shameful past of working for a credit card company for 10 years - so I know a little bit of what goes on behind closed doors. (I even got to deal with my own letters requesting a credit limit increase on my own account - fun)

 

From past experience I would never in a million years act as LiP against the banks. Not just from the view of law but from the threat to the other side of having to pay a pros costs, that representation brings. Being taken seriously at a trial also helps. Not that is gets to trial most of the time if you have proper representation.

[Baggio]

I consider myself more than competent and I have a degree in law. I have studied the CCA for years. I also have the shameful past of working for a credit card company for 10 years - so I know a little bit of what goes on behind closed doors. (I even got to deal with my own letters requesting a credit limit increase on my own account - fun)

 

From past experience I would never in a million years act as LiP against the banks. Not just from the view of law but from the threat to the other side of having to pay a pros costs, that representation brings. Being taken seriously at a trial also helps. Not that is gets to trial most of the time if you have proper representation.

 

could not agree with you more.

[andrew1]

hi anyone any advice 10 yrs ago i took out a bussiness development loan to buy some land paid half and borrowed half,over the next few years i finished my bussiness and was sent to debt recovery i paid of my origanail loan but the bank kept interest on two accounts that were overdrawn through charges , they treatened court and everyting over 10 years and then i sent them cca letter sayin i had no agreement for overdraft so i should not been charged interest they demanded £25000 said they settle for bit less however since asking for cca agrement they rang didnt write and women was bit snotty i said am going to court give me my deeds she said think about it will ring you weds this never happened its now 1 year and they have had no response or given me a copy of an aggrement what can i do the suddunly stopped all contact all she said on phone was they didnt want to take me to court for 10 years they threatened to what would advise be to get me deeds of them like i said no reponse to my cca letter been a year since any contact cheers

 

I suggest you start a new thread on this under the appropriate bank heading as you'll get lost on this thread which has it's own topic...

[humbleman]

there are a few around, i note one of the site team on your thread passed you information about one he reccomended... did you make any progress with that lead?

 

I have, he is not Direct Access

[Baggio]

I have, he is not Direct Access

 

i will PM you sometime tommorow and give you my thoughts.

[humbleman]

i will PM you sometime tommorow and give you my thoughts.

 

Appreciate

[DT&FE]

Folks

 

Am I right in thinking that a 'true copy' must be just that i.e. a photocopy of the SIGNED original agreement?

 

I have submitted a number of cca requests and have received copies of agreements with my/our details on but nowhere does it have our signature. In fact one has had our details handwritten on the agreement with a photocopy signature for the company rep. Again nowhere does it have a 'copy' of my signature.

 

The question is does this represent a 'true copy'? Creditors are saying it does.

[paulwlton]

Folks

 

Am I right in thinking that a 'true copy' must be just that i.e. a photocopy of the SIGNED original agreement?

 

I have submitted a number of cca requests and have received copies of agreements with my/our details on but nowhere does it have our signature. In fact one has had our details handwritten on the agreement with a photocopy signature for the company rep. Again nowhere does it have a 'copy' of my signature.

 

The question is does this represent a 'true copy'? Creditors are saying it does.

 

Signatures may be omitted according to the regs.

[DT&FE]

Paulwlton

 

Thanks does this mean that such agreements are enforceable in court? I am not trying to get out of paying the debt, i just need a bit more time to get other things paid off and i will then address this, I would not like to end up with a CCJ (plus interest, fees etc.) for £670!!!!

[paulwlton]

Paulwlton

 

Thanks does this mean that such agreements are enforceable in court? I am not trying to get out of paying the debt, i just need a bit more time to get other things paid off and i will then address this, I would not like to end up with a CCJ (plus interest, fees etc.) for £670!!!!

 

Pursuant to new legislation even if the Agreements are enforceable (post them up) you can make an application for a time order (post default)....hit them before they hit you with a Judgment.

 

PW

[paulwlton]

I have a master deed of assignment showing an High Street bank offloading £9.6 million of debt at nine pence in the pound.

 

Why would a bank sell off debt at such a low rate....could it be that most of it is unenforceable.

 

PW

[stripper]

Be nice to know!

Stripper

[ruinedbynatwest]

I have a master deed of assignment showing an High Street bank offloading £9.6 million of debt at nine pence in the pound.

Why would a bank sell off debt at such a low rate....could it be that most of it is unenforceable.

PW

-----------------

Bit off thread but relevant,

We are aware that a number of DCA's have bought questionable ie possibly unenforceable CCA regulated accounts at knock down prices. Now, what we don't know is who knew what, and when, during the negotiated sale of these CCA regulated credit agreements in the regard of their unenforceability ? IE was there full disclosure ?

 

Criminal law require that both the wrongful deed (Reus Actus) and the guilty mind (mens rea) be proved to secure a proper conviction.

 

IE - We do not know whether these (alleged) debts (ie unenforceable) were sold "in good faith" ( whether the seller was transparent on the issue of enforceability) or whether there are potentially criminal fraud issues where the accounts were not sold in good faith. Also, If these accounts were sold in good faith as unenforceable, were the individual debtors subsequently notified by the DCA's that they were being chased for unenforceable accounts ?

 

These are matters that would have interested my Dear old dad when he served on the Serious Crime Squad. These are matters which interest me because HHJ Jack QC, during the Story trial,opined that "if Natwest knew it had a problem with the CCA, the last person it would tell would be you [ie me, Story]. It would hand the matter over to its lawyers to sort it out "

 

John Story

 

www.ruinedbynatwest.com

Edited January 15, 2010 by ruinedbynatwest
typos

[paulwlton]

-----------------

Bit off thread but relevant,

We am aware that a number of DCA's have bought unenforceable CCA regulated accounts at knock down prices. Now, what we don't know is who knew what, and when, during the negotiated sale of these CCA regulated credit agreements in the regard of their unenforceability ? IE was there full disclosure ?

 

IE We do not know if these (alleged) debts (ie unenforceable) were sold "in good faith" or whether there are potentially criminal fraud issues where the accounts were not sold in good faith. Also, If these accounts were sold in good faith as unenforceable, were the individual debtors subsequently notified by the DCA's that they were being chased for unenforceable accounts ?

 

These are matters that would have interested my Dear old dad when he served on the Serious Crime Squad.

 

John Story

 

www.ruinedbynatwest.com

 

Interesting comment John.

[tifo]

I have a master deed of assignment showing an High Street bank offloading £9.6 million of debt at nine pence in the pound.

 

Why would a bank sell off debt at such a low rate....could it be that most of it is unenforceable.

 

PW

 

I've known it to be 3p per 100p (3%) for some DCA's .....

 

Would be interesting to see that copy of the deed if you can put it up?

[ruinedbynatwest]

I've known it to be 3p per 100p (3%) for some DCA's .....

 

Would be interesting to see that copy of the deed if you can put it up?

 

---------------------

Careful !!!

 

I'd show it to the Police.

 

John Story

 

www.ruinedbynatwest.com