Halifax - getting serious now

[kurvaface]

Nice one

[tortilla]

Hi all

 

Just had another letter threatening defaults again, but no mention of signed agreements, surprise surprise. I was just about to send them this:

 

Halifax

Retail Bank Collections

PO Box 607

Trinity Road

Halifax

 

Re: − Account/Reference Number:

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Thank you for your letter of......... 2009 (received ......../2009), the contents of which have been noted. You have failed to respond to my legal request by ignoring my letter to you of ........ 2009 (a copy of which I enclose), this alone is sufficient for this account to remain in dispute.

This means you must remove all information regarding this account from your own internal records and from my records with any credit reference agencies.

 

To register information with a credit reference agency, you must have written consent from the customer to collate and share such information. This consent is given in the form of a signed credit agreement, so until you produce such an agreement, you may not do this.

 

The requirement for consent to share data is a clear requirement of the Data Protection Act 1998. Any such attempts to share my data without my consent will be met with a complaint to the Information Commissioners Office

 

To sum up, I will not be making any further payments to you until you provide me with the document I have requested. The resolution of this situation is within your hands. Whilst you remain in default of my request, you are not permitted to take any action against this account. This includes adding further charges and passing any information to the credit reference agencies.

 

Should you not have any signed credit agreement in relation to this alleged debt, please confirm this in writing to me.

 

Should you refuse to comply, you must within 21 days provide me with a detailed breakdown of your reasoning behind continuing to process my data.

It is not sufficient to simply state that you have a ‘legal right’; you must outline your reasoning in this matter and state upon which legislation this reasoning depends.

 

Furthermore you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY action against an account whilst it remains in dispute.

 

The lack of a credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies:

• You may not demand any payment on the account, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.

• You may not add further interest or any charges to the account.

• You may not pass the account to a third party.

• You may not register any information in respect of the account with any credit reference agency.

• You may not issue a default notice related to the account.

 

I reserve the right to report your actions to any such regulatory authorities that I have an on going complaint with. You have 21 days from receiving this letter to contact me with your intentions to resolve this matter.

 

Yours faithfully,

 

Then yesterday morning this arrived:

 

http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/9329/halpark002.jpg

 

Need some help on this please guys.

 

Cheers

[kurvaface]

What a load of BS

 

"Contract between you and them"......"Terms and conditions".......

 

Ask them to provide a copy. Report them to trading standards (Or update your complaint using your existing ref number) + Let these mugs know that trading standards are in the picture.

[tortilla]

Hi all

 

It seems that they've beaten me to the crunch. I haven't had time to send the last letter or to report them anywhere, they've come up with an agreement that looks ok to me, but what do I know. Will someone check it for me please.

 

Looks like humble pie time, anyone got any good strategies for securing the smallest possible payments until I win the lottery? unfortunately that will be a long time as I don't do the lottery. Never mind eh, I hope you all have better luck than me.

 

Cheers

ImageShack Gallery

[babydoll0141917]

Hi

 

That is the CCA we are all getting..Nothing on the front on the form links anywhere to say T and C are on the reverse..Looks has tho the Terms have just been cpoied on to the back..I havent payed halifax in 16 mths ..gone through about 4 DCA and now back with haliprats and not heard a word in wks..I have a dodgy DN too maybe they know this!! No one knows if these are original CCa the only way we would beable to find out is if hali started proceding and we got them to produce the original in court,,I seriously dont think that these CCA are good enuff Also on the front of the doc it says you have received a copy of and are bound by the conditions of use..This avers to the terms being in a diff document and not on the reverse..The codes dont match there is no overleaf pls turn over ,,no page numbers that is unexceptable

Edited July 1, 2009 by babydoll0141917

[Trudy B]

What about prescribed terms like the credit limit and should it not also have been signed by the lender?

 

Did I miss those?

 

T

[middenmess]

No need for humble pie just yet I think----where are the rest of the terms like...

 

'........give you notice under condition 8.2 '

[kurvaface]

Hi again Tortilla

 

Don't give in:)

[tortilla]

hi guys thanks for dropping in

 

it's not a case of giving in, believe me it's the last thing i will do, sometimes it's very hard not to accept their logic.

 

Now do i sit tight? do i query the dodgy default? do i send them another letter saying this is not good enough for all the above, whatever they might be. The real problem is i'm not very clever, i don't really know what i'm doing, and i think they know this.

 

Cheers

[middenmess]

hi guys thanks for dropping in

 

The real problem is i'm not very clever, i don't really know what i'm doing, and i think they know this.

 

 

 

You're in excellent company,tortilla,none of us are rocket scientists--it's just a case of asking for assistance or for an explanation if you're unsure of something.

 

I consider myself to be fairly bright but as soon as I have a form to fill in,my brain turns to mush and it takes me ages to complete what would take another only a few minutes!

 

I've only been on CAG for a short time but have found everyone to be more than willing to offer help.

 

Wish CAG had been around a few years ago--might have saved me a fortune!!

[tosh1]

Tortilla

 

I am in the same position as you.

 

I am being made redundant, don't feel too good and I'am starting to get chest pains, I have'nt a clue what I'm doing either and Halifax know this.

 

Halifax try and wear you down which I think they have nearly done to me. This site does help. It really does.

 

Just keep going.

 

TOSH1

[Spice57]

subbing - in the same situation

[kurvaface]

Hi Tortilla

 

PM one of the site team to have a look at those docs you've recieved. They might spot something useful.

[tortilla]

I would be very grateful if someone from the site team would kindly take a look at this thread of mine, and hopefully point me in the right direction, probably only damage limitation now, but who knows.

 

Cheers

[davey77]

Hi tosh

 

yes I have reference number from trading standards and for FSA. The FSA have told me that halifax now have 8 weeks to resolve the situation, I have told the fsa that halifax just wont sent mw a copy of the agreement. So maybe they will now?

 

Cheers

 

When you say 'FSA' do you mean FOS?

[tortilla]

Hi Davey thanks for looking in, silly me, yes I do mean FOS.

[davey77]

Well if you put your cursor over that FOS link you'll read what this site thinks and if you want to know what i think of them then here is something to read sometime:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/183738-why-does-fos-take.html

[citizenB]

Hi Tortilla,

 

The FOS will not adjudicate in matters of the CCA 1974, that is down to Trading Standards.

 

There appears to be nothing linking those two pages together. Plus, the 2nd page refers to a condition that isnt present.

 

All prescribed terms are required to be within the same document, that can be a double sided page. As advised above, there is nothingl linking those two pages.

 

All I can suggest you do is to read round other Halifax threads. Davey77 has already linked you to his. The following are pretty good reads and offer a wealth of letters you can you use as well.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/halifax-bank-bank-scotland/156429-lexis200-hbos-blair-oliver.html

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/halifax-bank-bank-scotland/160990-lexis200-bos-take-two.html

 

 

The following link will give you some idea on Default Notices.. that is a default notice issued by the company and not the default that the creditor will register with the CRAs.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-2166205.html

 

 

If you need basic template letters, you will find those in my signature.

 

Do you have many charges on this account ?

 

HTH

[tortilla]

Thank you for your interest and advice CitizenB. Here is the latest offering. I think I'll just have to take it one small step at a time. So I need to come up with a good letter for these jokers, maybe start with a "Bemused letter"

 

Thanks again.

http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/2783/halifax4.jpg

[citizenB]

Blair Oliver Scot are the inhouse solicitors for Halifax and Bank of Scotland.

 

Yes, the bemused letter sounds like a good start.

 

You might want to have a read of this thread. A succes story.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/halifax-bank-bank-scotland/208820-section-78-write-off.html

 

HTH

[tortilla]

Hi all update time

In response to letter from Blair etc. I sent them this:

 

Blair, Oliver and Scott Ltd

PO Box 66

Rosyth

Fife

KY99 2WG 14th July 2009

 

 

 

FOR YOUR INFORMATION

 

 

Dear Sir or Madam,

 

Account number:

Your Reference :

 

I must admit that I am rather bemused as to why this account has been passed to yourselves, as it is in dispute with Halifax and has been since 3rd March 2009.

 

As Halifax are in default of my Consumer Credit Act request, I now consider this account to be in SERIOUS DISPUTE.

 

As you are aware while my Consumer Credit Act request remains in default enforcement action is NOT permitted, under s127 this constitutes a complete defence at law.

 

If you choose to ignore my dispute and attempt enforcement, I will initiate legal action and file reports with the appropriate authorities, including, but not limited to, Trading Standards, Office of Fair Trading, Information Commissioners Office, Financial Ombudsman Service and possible court action.

 

Please be advised that I am only prepared to communicate with you in writing. OFT rules and regulations clearly state that you can only visit me at my home if you make an appointment, and I have no wish to make an appointment with you. There is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; the postman and people asking for directions etc (Armstrong v. Sheppard and Short Ltd [1959] 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.).

 

Therefore take note that I revoke license under Common Law for you, or your representatives, to visit me at my property and if you send “doorstep callers” to my home, you will be reported for harassment and be liable for damages for a tort of trespass. You would also be liable for conspiring in a tort of trespass by acting in defiance of my instructions and sending someone to visit me nevertheless.

 

Should it be necessary, I will obtain an injunction.

 

 

I hope that this will not be necessary and an acceptable solution can be accomplished.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

(Digital signature)

 

Then they sent me another demand for full amount plus threats of what they may do.

 

So I sent them this:

 

 

Blair, Oliver and Scott Ltd

PO Box 66

Rosyth

Fife

KY99 2WG 1st August 2009

 

 

DO NOT IGNORE THIS LETTER

 

FOR YOUR INFORMATION

 

 

Dear Sir or Madam,

COPY OF LETTER SENT TO YOU ON XXth JULY 2009, PLUS FOR YOUR INFORMATION A COPY OF THE LETTER SENT TO HALIFAX ON THE SAME DATE.

 

Account number:

Your Reference :

 

I must admit that I am rather bemused as to why this account has been passed to yourselves, as it is in dispute with Halifax and has been since XXrd March 2009.

 

As Halifax are in default of my Consumer Credit Act request, I now consider this account to be in SERIOUS DISPUTE.

 

As you are aware while my Consumer Credit Act request remains in default enforcement action is NOT permitted, under s127 this constitutes a complete defence at law.

 

If you choose to ignore my dispute and attempt enforcement, I will initiate legal action and file reports with the appropriate authorities, including, but not limited to, Trading Standards, Office of Fair Trading, Information Commissioners Office, Financial Ombudsman Service and possible court action.

 

Please be advised that I am only prepared to communicate with you in writing. OFT rules and regulations clearly state that you can only visit me at my home if you make an appointment, and I have no wish to make an appointment with you. There is only an implied license under English Common Law for people to be able to visit me on my property without express permission; the postman and people asking for directions etc (Armstrong v. Sheppard and Short Ltd [1959] 2 Q.B. per Lord Evershed M.R.).

 

Therefore take note that I revoke license under Common Law for you, or your representatives, to visit me at my property and if you send “doorstep callers” to my home, you will be reported for harassment and be liable for damages for a tort of trespass. You would also be liable for conspiring in a tort of trespass by acting in defiance of my instructions and sending someone to visit me nevertheless.

 

Should it be necessary, I will obtain an injunction.

 

 

I hope that this will not be necessary and an acceptable solution can be accomplished.

 

I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.

 

I look forward to hearing from you in writing.

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

(Digital signature)

 

Plus this:

 

Halifax Retail Bank Collections

PO Box 607

Trinity Road

Halifax 14th July 2009

HX1 2UJ

 

 

Re: − Account/Reference Number:

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

Please accept my apologies, I am afraid I’m confused, I hope you can explain.

 

You wrote to me on Xrd April 2009 informing me that you had terminated my agreement. In my understanding to terminate something means to bring an end to it, you have decided that you don’t wish to be part of any alleged agreement that may have once existed between us. Logic and common sense tell me that if this is your chosen decision it is also your choice to not benefit from any terms or conditions that said agreement may have contained.

 

Then on Xst May 2009 you sent me what appeared to be a standard monthly statement, included in that statement was itemised a “goodwill” payment of £X.00 from me. This statement is identical to my eyes to one that you would send to someone you had an agreement with. How can this be if you have terminated said alleged agreement?

 

Then on Xst June 2009 you sent me another statement adding more interest and other fees, just as if you had not terminated the alleged agreement, more confusion.

 

Then on Xst July 2009 you sent me a copy of a document you claim is an agreement between you and I. You are fully aware of what an enforceable agreement must contain, I wouldn’t presume to tell you. That being the case you are fully aware of the status of this document. This all of course being hypothetical as you have voluntarily terminated the alleged agreement so therefore you cannot expect to enforce or benefit from something that does not in effect exist.

 

Also on Xst July 2009 you send me yet again a statement containing more charges. You still seem to want to benefit from an agreement you have terminated, even more confusion.

 

Now it seems you have passed the alleged account to a debt collecting agency called Blair Oliver and Scott. Can you wonder at my confusion?

 

It would be nice to receive some explanations, but I suspect as with all things you either can’t or don’t want to explain you will ignore this letter, or simply claim you “have a legal right”.

 

 

As I see it the position is as follows:

• You have terminated the alleged agreement; therefore from that moment you have no right to add charges of any kind to the alleged debt.
  
• You have passed the alleged debt to a debt collecting agency to act on your behalf in the future.
  

Yours faithfully,

 

 

(Digital signature)

 

Now I have received a letter from Blair etc. thanking me for "payment towards my debt" ?????????? CONFUSION what payment? Also giving me 7 days (that have run out) to pay balance or they WILL start court action. Is this still bluff or what?

 

HELP PLEASE

 

 

 

 

 

[davey77]

BOS never reply to anything.. never did to me and i haven't found anyone who has had a personal response from them

 

If you haven't sent a payment and they are thanking you for one anyway i would imagine it means they are using that method now in an attempt to reset the statue barred clock (as there is some indications that it 'may' be changed from 6 years to 3 next year.)

 

I would, as a way of covering yourself, tell them that A. you have sent no payment (and do not acknowledge any debt to their company) and B. their refusal to communicate with you in a professional manner means no further responses will be forth coming. Their behaviour will be reported to TS and the OFT and that anything further sent will be read, filed for evidence and forwarded to the appropriate regulatory bodies but not responded to etc

 

That's the way i would play it anyway.

[citizenB]

Excellent advice, davey.

 

I think Blair Oliver and Halifax arent making any attempt at all in customising their templated letters.

 

IMHO, I suspect that the reference to the payment is an underhand tactic (as if they used any other kind) in order to goad the OP into telephoning.

[tortilla]

Thanks guys I'll get to work on some suitable reply to them soon as, I'll post it for any comments and suggestions.

 

Cheers

[pford]

If you haven't sent a payment and they are thanking you for one anyway i would imagine it means they are using that method now in an attempt to reset the statue barred clock (as there is some indications that it 'may' be changed from 6 years to 3 next year.)

 

can you expand on this where you might have heard it might changing to 3 years?