Cabot Claimform - Barclaycard 'debt' ***WON ON APPEAL ***

[stebiz]

Okay this is long so I'll try and keep it clear

 

Had a credit card with barclaycard in the 1990's. It was defaulted in 2001. Sold on to Cabot 2004.

 

I made some small payments to Cabot in 2004 (under a large amount of pressure I must add). Out of all the card companies and debt collectors I have dealt with these were the worst.

 

After a lot of sleepless nights I kept stressing to them that this debts was in dispute. They wouldn't listen. In the end I asked for a copy of my CCA and they sent a microfiche which was not signed by Barclaycard and was inelligable. I refused to pay anymore.

 

In Jan 2006 I sent a letter to Cabot by recorded delivery requesting they take it to court. No further correspondence would be entered into. Throughout 2006 I received numerous phonecalls. Late on in 2006 these calls increased to one a night. As they increased so did my stress. In the end my wife was hysterical about them. She was scared so much I rang the police and put in a formal complaint. They still proceded. I rang the police again and they said that it was not harrassment. They were allowed to ring. In order for it to be classed as harrassment I would need to see a solicitor and seek legal action (and a possible injunction). What a waste of time and energy??? I received more calls. My last call with them I flipped and I have not heard from them now for 4 months.

 

However I note from my Credit File the amount is going up. Is it wise to innitiate proceedings?? or to let sleeping dogs lie. I am not looking to obtain any finance and I already have a CCJ from 2003 anyway.

 

Regards

Stebiz

[tbern123]

I am sure these people get a kick out of bring misery to people's lives.

 

The only way you can deal with this people is to take the bull, by the horns, I am afraid.

 

First we will deal with the phone call.

 

Send this email to [email protected] and [email protected]

 

 

 

Mr Ken Maynard

Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd

10 Kings Hill Avenue

Kings Hill

West Malling

Kent

ME19 4LT

 

Dear Mr Maynard

 

 

Your Ref:

 

 

Further to the numerous telephone calls I have received from representatives of your company. I would like to take this opportunity to request that all attempts to contact me, via telephone stop. Please accept this letter as confirmation that any future telephone calls will be recorded.

Cabots' behaviour constitutes harassment; I require all communications in writing for possible future Court use. Do not telephone me again - remove any telephone numbers you hold for me from your systems.

 

Your telephone calls are in breach of the Office of Fair Trading guidelines. If you continue with them after the receipt of this email an official complaint, together with a log recording the times and frequency of the calls will be passed both to that office and to the Trading Standards office.

 

This type of debt collection method is contrary to the 'Administration of Justice Act 1970' in that it is intended to cause alarm and distress to the recipient. Your methods will not be tolerated.

 

Take further note that continued telephone calls after the receipt of a request not to call may constitute a criminal offence under Section 127 of the Communications Act 2003.

I would like to take this opportunity to thank you for your time and assistance in relation to this matter.

 

 

 

Regards

 

 

 

[tbern123]

I would give them a couple of days, then start putting the pressure onto them.

 

As the credit agreement is not signed, you need to send a second email explaining to them that as a result of it not being signed, it is not enforceable without a court order.

 

If your agreement looks like this one, they will not be able to get a court order, as it does not contain the prescribed terms:

[tbern123]

They will hum and are a bit...

 

Then you will remind that legal precedence has been set and you should refer them to

 

Dimond v Lovell (1999 3WLR561; 3AER1)

 

Lord Hoffman, stated:

 

My Lords,

 

c) order of the court

65 (1) provides that an improperly executed agreement shall be enforcable only 'on an order of the court'

 

Lord Hobhouse of Woodborough stated:

 

My Lords,

 

'The consequence of the failure to comply with the statutory requirements is clearly spelt out in the statue. The contract cannot be legally enforced against the debtor.

 

Another good case to remind them of is:

 

Wilson & Others V Secretary of State for Trade and Industry (Appellant)

 

29. The court's powers under section 127(1) are subject to significant qualification in two types of cases. The first type is where section 61(1)(a), regarding signing of agreements, is not complied with, in such cases the court 'shall not make' an enforcement order.

[stebiz]

Thanks for the reply. Much appreciated. I have a copy of the agreement which is a microfiche and is so bad it is hard to believe. You can hardly read anything. It was dated 1995.

 

I will send the letter, adapted slightly, because I had said previously that I would onl;y deal with them through the courts.

 

Stebiz

[tbern123]

Tell them that in no uncertain terms, that they must remove the default from your credit file.

 

This is what, I had to do.. It took a few months, but common sense won in the end and they removed the default from my credit file

[louiboy]

Cabot pulled a similar stunt on me. Telephone harassment without good cause. I sent a SAR request for the account, obtained from Cabot enough evidence/ information to have Kent police start an investigation. I now have enough details and a crime number to start civil proceedings.

 

Papers to the court in the morning. They ignored my final opportunity to settle out of court.

 

Heres my thread. My little friends

[tbern123]

However I note from my Credit File the amount is going up. Is it wise to innitiate proceedings?? or to let sleeping dogs lie. I am not looking to obtain any finance and I already have a CCJ from 2003 anyway.

 

Regards

Stebiz

 

 

Sorry, I missed this bit... Is the CCJ from this debt ?

[stebiz]

Thanks for those case studies. I will adapt a letter now and post later. I also need to look at how to get my default removed.

 

Regards

Stebiz

[stebiz]

Sorry, I missed this bit... Is the CCJ from this debt ?

 

No. Something totally different from years ago. Another company.

 

Stebiz

[stebiz]

I am going to be extremely careful what I say here because the counsel for the claimant, said prior to the hearing 'did I get my information from CAG'.

 

But here it goes. Facts only.

 

I had a credit card with Barclaycard in 1995. I ran into difficulties and I ended up defaulting on it in 2001. I believe a lot of the sum of approx £6,000 was charges. Barclaycard sell debt on to Cabot. Cabot pursue debt and made many many phone calls. Eventually they issue a summons. Today was the hearing.

 

I had asked and still not received a full breakdown of the £6,000. They have since added £5,000 approx and including their charges I was given a judgement of £12,000.

 

The elderly Judge did not seem interested that they had not provided a breakdown or in fact a consumer credit agreement. Just a very very bad copy of a microfiche. No prescribed terms or anything. What they did provide was an A4 sheet of conditions that would have been given out in 1994.

 

I asked the judge for the right to appeal. He said no. I rang Trading Standards, and as it has already gone to court I must see a Solicitor??

 

Here is a copy of the microfiche

http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/stebiz/BARCLAYCARD.jpg

 

 

Help. Help. I feel so depressed at the moment.

 

 

Stebiz

Edited September 30, 2009 by stebiz

[cadencealex]

Oh no Stebiz... that sounds awful.. why are the banks getting away with this?!

 

Try not to feel depressed, keep going

 

Perhaps a big complaint to the OFT?

[Ypnos]

Can the judge ignore the laws relating to CCA? They bascially didn't supply any proof of debt and the bits that they did supply were illegible (big question mark over admissible)...

 

I'm sorry I don't know enough to help, but common sense is ringing alarm bells and tells me that there's something very wrong here. Maybe take it to European courts? I'm sure help will be here soon, chap, don't dispair.

[fedup74]

How can they get away with that:mad: Did you get a CCJ then with a reasonable affordable monthly amount?

[FANTASY CHARGES]

here is a scan of barclays application form

where the claimant discontinued

 

which appears much better than yours

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-1221605.html

 

one funny thing look at the dimensions of the {YOUR }barclaycard application in your court case ..... how on earth did they get into an a4 size piece of paper ????

[cadencealex]

I just spoke to the Information Commissioners line and she said that CCAs do not matter to them..

[fedup74]

They bloo*y well should do. The more legal minded people will have some advice but I would think you should go for a set aside

[stebiz]

Thanks for all your comments and wishes.

 

To be honest I am utterly gutted. When the Judge said I was totally gobsmacked. I'd given case law and also the relevant sections of the acts. I'd won 4 cases on the same or similar argument, but this was the biggest. Just when I thought I'd finally got my credit file back to normal after about 10 years.

 

I really feel like doing something silly at the moment. I won't so don't worry. Brother is coming around soon to have a chat and a drink of tea. I really feel cheated by the legal system.

 

Stebiz

[Monty2007]

I just spoke to the Information Commissioners line and she said that CCAs do not matter to them..

 

I would expect that to be the case, the Consumer Credit Act and its operation as a piece of legislation does not come under their remit. The FSA have stated their position with regards to consumer credit agreements and they can only be enforced in court.

 

Sadly there is substantial inconsistency with respect to judges not wanting to look at the Act and the SI and other judgements. The situation was slightly clouded by the Rankies case but this is a red herring.

 

The ICO have a duty to uphold the Data Protection Act, see

 

What the ICO covers - The Data Protection Act, privacy online - ICO

 

Quote: "From data protection and electronic communications to freedom of information and environmental regulations - the ICO is the UK's independent public body set up to protect personal information and promote public access to official information".

[Monty2007]

Thanks for all your comments and wishes.

 

To be honest I am utterly gutted. When the Judge said I was untterly gobsmacked. I'd given case law and also the relevant sections of the acts. I'd won 4 cases on the same or similar argument, but this was the biggest. Just when I thought I'd finally got my credit file back to normal after about 10 years.

 

I really feel like doing something silly at the moment. I won't so don't worry. Brother is coming around soon to have a chat and a drink of tea. I really feel cheated by the legal system.

 

Stebiz

 

Dear Stebiz

 

Sorry to hear your news, it is a terrible result. Did the judge give any basis for his decision, how did he address your defence and the arguments and case laws?

[stebiz]

The case law and acts were not commented on once. No argument was entered into and I felt I was just talking to myself.

 

To rub salt into the wound a representative from Cabot attended and presented a bill for an overnight hotel stop and train fair of £400. This was granted too. Don't forget we were in a small claims court here?

 

Stebiz

Edited September 30, 2009 by stebiz

[fedup74]

So even though he seen the statement from 8 years ago with a balance of £6k he allowed judgement for £12k:mad: Something has to be done.

[stebiz]

Yes he allowed interested to be added along with about £2000 in fees.

 

I'm really fuming.

 

Stebiz

[lisaf]

Absolutely shocking! Good luck with the fight Stebiz

[Vulture_Bank]

The judge said that he accepted it was a fiche copy of an application form. He also said that as there was a statement from 8 years ago (the last time) I used the account with a balance of 6kish on it, he was happy with that.

The case law and acts were not commented on once. No argument was entered into and I felt I was just talking to myself.

 

To rub salt into the wound a representative from Cabot attended and presented a bill for an overnight hotel stop and train fair of £400. This was granted too. Don't forget we were in a small claims court here?

 

Stebiz

 

how did this get into small claims court when the amount is clearly over £5,000?

no need to say in open forum