LTSB Court claim - help please

[remus]

Hi all,

My Judge has allocated the claim to small claims and as LTSB have indicated mediation, I have received mediation directions.

Can anyone point me to a thread that explains what I can expect with mediation, and what would be my way forward.

[remus]

Hi, any ideas re my last post? anyone?

[joan_of_arc]

Outside my experience Remus, but I'm sure someone on here knows about it. Might I suggest you start a new thread asking for help?

[remus]

Thanks for the thought Joan, I'll just try bumping for the moment.

[Castlebest]

Hiya Janet yes I do know a little about mediation (but only what I have read, nothing hands on ) so first the basics. apologies if you already know this stuff .

 

I've always held that Mediation is of little use in bank claim cases because its designed around the principle that the mediator will find some common ground between the two parties and get you both to agree. In a bank claim there is normally no middle ground, one party is right and one is wrong although this will depend on the circumstances surrounding your staff unsecured loan, only you will know this for sure.

 

The Courts love mediation because it gets you off their back but it is expensive, you will have to pay half the costs of mediation at least win or loose.

 

I suspect Lloyd's have chosen this route because they think it will be easier than standing in front of a Judge to plead their case, I also suspect they will still have a trained barrister to put their case before the mediator. The basic rules are the same as they would be for a court hearing, both sides submit their claim and defence then you run through it and explain it in front of the mediator.

 

All I can suggest is be very sure of the basis of your defence and speak up (respectfully) if anything is said you don't agree with. If Lloyd's pull anything out of the old magicians hat that you have never seen before ask for an adjournment to consider the new evidence and run back here with it .

 

Good luck

 

pete

[remus]

Thanks for responding Pete,

It will be interesting to see how they can show the documents that I have requested, and not received, over the phone:rolleyes:

 

LTSB are trying to a get ccj, no doubt hoping for a charging order to follow, as I am paying a nominal amount.

 

I think as the Judge has indicated small claims, costs are not involved, but I will double check:eek:

 

Also will enquire if I get bamboozled, I can adjourn and recoup.

[remus]

If I was to receive a letter which states term of agreement unavailable, could that mean they have no agreement?

[42man]

Have you ever seen the agreement ? I'd avoid a Tomlin order as it is a permanent binding order....bear in mind the various pieces of paperwork that you COULD potentially argue on was the default notice compliant ? any notice of assignment (did 1st Credit chase this up on behalf of Lloyds ?), was there any PPI added ?

[remus]

thanks for your reply,

 

I have had no paperwork from LTSB, so I have no idea about anything!

 

I feel that I may be putting myself on the wrong side of the judge if I do not agree to the tomlin order.

[remus]

I requested cca from 1st credit, and that never appeared.

 

No ppi.

 

When I said about the paperwork, I was told that that wasn't relevant at this time.

Edited May 5, 2009 by remus

[42man]

So you're going to allow them a Tomlin order when they have supplied ZERO in answer to your CPR ?....i'd be raising that in the mediation....

[42man]

Jeez the first thing i'd be saying to the judge is that they are in default of my request for a copy of my agreement !!! and they have not complied with the Civil Procedure Rules....i'd be asking the judge for a Tomlin order that if they can't provide your agreement and all compliant paperwork as requested in the CPR, then they should never be allowed to bring action against you ever !!!!

 

Consumer Credit (Prescribed Periods for Giving Information) Regulations

1983 (SI 1983/1569)

 

2 Prescribed period

The period of 12 working days is hereby prescribed for the purposes of each provision of the Act specified in Column 1

of the Schedule to these Regulations relating to the duty indicated in Column 2 in relation to regulated agreements

 

 

SCHEDULE

SECTIONS OF THE ACT IN RESPECT OF WHICH A PERIOD OF 12 WORKING DAYS IS PRESCRIBED RELATING TO DUTIES IN

RELATION TO REGULATED AGREEMENTS

Regulation 2

Section of the

Act

Duty

(1) (2)

77(1) Duty to give information to debtor under fixed-sum credit agreement.

78(1) Duty to give information to debtor under running-account credit agreement.

79(1) Duty to give information to hirer under consumer hire agreement.

 

and section 78 for running credit

 

 

78.

Duty to give information to debtor under running-account credit agreement.

— (1) The creditor under a regulated agreement for running-account credit, within the prescribed period after receiving a request in writing to that effect from the debtor and payment of a fee of [F1 £1], shall give the debtor a copy of the executed agreement (if any) and of any other document referred to in it, together with a statement signed by or on behalf of the creditor showing, according to the information to which it is practicable for him to refer,—

(a)

the state of the account, and

 

(b)

the amount, if any currently payable under the agreement by the debtor to the creditor, and

 

©

the amounts and due dates of any payments which, if the debtor does not draw further on the account, will later become payable under the agreement by the debtor to the creditor.

 

 

(2) If the creditor possesses insufficient information to enable him to ascertain the amounts and dates mentioned in subsection (1)©, he shall be taken to comply with that paragraph if his statement under subsection (1) gives the basis on which, under the regulated agreement, they would fall to be ascertained.

 

(3) Subsection (1) does not apply to—

(a)

an agreement under which no sum is, or will or may become, payable by the debtor, or

 

(b)

a request made less than one month after a previous request under that subsection relating to the same agreement was complied with.

 

 

(4) Where running-account credit is provided under a regulated agreement, the creditor shall give the debtor statements in the prescribed form, and with the prescribed contents—

(a)

showing according to the information to which it is practicable for him to refer, the state of the account at regular intervals of not more than twelve months, and

 

(b)

where the agreement provides, in relation to specified periods, for the making of payments by the debtor, or the charging against him of interest or any other sum, showing according to the information to which it is practicable for him to refer the state of the account at the end of each of those periods during which there is any movement in the account.

 

 

(5) A statement under subsection (4) shall be given within the prescribed period after the end of the period to which the statement relates.

 

(6) If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

(a)

he is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement

 

 

(7) This section does not apply to a non-commercial agreement, and subsections (4) and (5) do not apply to a small agreement

[42man]

Who told you the paperwork wasn't relevant at the time ?

[42man]

Did you ever see a default notice as required under the Consumer Credit Act ?

[42man]

Do you still have the default notice ?

[remus]

Just going through the paperwork, I know I have a termination letter/enforcement ,I didn't keep the envelope, (pre CAG days), but I did write on it received 4 days after the date they expected me to remedy it by.

 

PS thanks you made me laugh, feeling well wrung at the moment.

Edited June 13, 2009 by remus
wrong letter

[Having_A_Knightmare]

Remus

 

Have you had your mediation yet.

 

Might be able to give you some pointers...

 

 

 

HAK

[remus]

Hi HAK,

 

Not yet, so any pointers would be great.

 

I am concerned about tomlin orders, as I have been reading other threads, and I'm not sure if they are the best way forward.

 

Any thoughts anyone?

[remus]

Hi all, mediation not right for my circumstances.

 

Judge has struck out my defence, and wants a full defence. (help please).

 

He has requested LTSB furnish default notice and agreement.

 

They have no default notice, and are asking for this to be taken into account. Also I had no lba, I can not make head nor tail of the figures, and there is no reference at all to the dca.

 

requested ca from daca twice, never received them, but dca responded with "we are waiting from our client", was the account in dispute prior to litigation?

 

any thoughts?

Edited June 13, 2009 by remus
add

[remus]

Hi all,

 

question, if the poc refers to the default issued, should the default amount be the same as the claim? or is this why the have conveniently lost it?

[remus]

Hi all, the judge has allowed non production of the default, they just have to produce the agreement.

 

I believe I now have to get a full defence in.

 

My defence is that the poc states I have not been paying, I have.

 

The amount they are claiming is about £400 more than the default.

 

I never had a lba.

 

they assumed the judge had rubber stamped the claim when they first put in the claim.

 

Any help would be really appreciated.

[underdog13]

Hi Remus, I'm no expert, but surely if they haven't provided the agreement in response to a s77/78 request, they they are in default and therefore not entitled to enforce this account?

 

Furthermore, why the hell is that judge allowing them to ignore s87 and 88?

 

Is there any way you can get a solicitor onto this travesty of proceedings? Most legal firms will give a free 30 minutes consultation initially.

[remus]

I hear what you are saying underdog, 42Man has the same thoughts, and I have been taking the advice:)

 

My initial defence was a short one, saying their poc was embarrassing etc, to buy some time, as they were going for a rubber stamped CCJ, which they thought they had as per my post 13!

 

Now that I have to do a full defence, I can bring in all the paperwork for the Judge, and hopefully show abuse of process, as I have payed them regularly, and they had no cause to bring this to court.

 

The Judge has said nothing about transferring it to fast/multi (yet).

 

Anywho, any help with the defence, or pointers to more threads would be appreciated.

Edited June 22, 2009 by remus
add

[Dorabell]

hi subbing with interest good luck:)

[underdog13]

 

Anywho, any help with the defence, or pointers to more threads would be appreciated.

 

Maybe have a read through MBNA successes to start with?