1st credit - statute of limitations

[floydster]

Hi would be really gratefull for some advise on my situation.

 

i have a loan of just over £4000 which i havent made any payments on for approx 6 years, i say approx as i dont have any paper work. i have moved address several times in this period and i havent heard anything from them until the other week. i think they got my address from me applying for something online which is my own fault. someone i know mentioned this statute of limitations.

how can i find out when the last time i made a payment was without admitting the debt is mine? because if it turns out to only be 5 years im then gonna get stung for £4000.

in the past if debts have caught up with me ive either ignored them or saved the envolope and waited for the next one to come throught the letter box then writen RTS not know at this address on them and sent them back. now my situation is different. i now live with my girlfriend and her 3 year old.

the loan was originally from marks & spencers financal services. the first letter i got about 10 days ago said i now owe the money to 1st credit finance so i saved it ready to do my usual sending it back but wasnt paying attention and opened the second letter. which said if i didnt contact them they would start legal proceedings and i could incur costs, could have a ccj registered against me, could have bailiff come round, could have an application put to my employer to obtain payment. which when i was telling a friend they mentioned the limitations act.

generally this wouldnt have bothered me but as i now live with my girlfriend and her little boy its not fair on her and i certainly dont want bailiffs turning up during the day when im at work and she is at home on her own.

my other concern is i have other debts that i know are only about 4 years old but they dont know where i am. im worried that if i contact 1st credit this will lead the way for the rest of my debts to catch up with me.

i know the way i have delt with things is not the best but any advise would be very gratefull.

 

thanks in advance

 

floydster

[MARTIN3030]

Welcome to the site.

There are a number of ways that you can check these things out,but unfortunately it will mean you being able to satisfy the people you are asking to supply it-that you are who you say you are and so entitled to the information.

Data controllers have the right to be satisfied that you are the person asking..and can demand that you provide evidence.

Similarly a request under the CCA act and for copies of credit files for yourself are likely to demand this proof..especially since you have been so evasive.However there are rules and guidelines in place that give you protection from any attempts to make you repay any debts or alleged debts that are not collectable.

In any requests for transaction or account information you do not by nature of that admit liability-you need to state this clearly.

If you are serious about getting a hand on things,then you should make an effort to do it by the book-I will move your thread to the debt forums.

I understand your concerns for those around you-I agree its not good to have Baliffs on the doorstep-but you have a chance to deal with things that may prevent this happening in the future.If you have concerns then get them sorted with advice from others here who can help you to do it.

[floydster]

thanks for your advise. i am serious about trying to get this sorted but at the same time i dont want the rest of my debts to catch up with me as they amount to over £10'000 and i just havent got any spare cash as im now supporting a family.

i would like to take steps to find out the length of time that has passed since i have made a payment but at the same time im scared because if it is under time limit i will then be hounded by these people and as with a lot of people my general out goings match my income. if i had any more coming out of my wages i wouldnt be able to eat. sorry if im not sounding 100% commited to this.

what should i do to start the ball rolling to get the information i require?

 

thanks

[ODC]

Just send off the Statute Barred letter. The onus of proof is on 1st Credit to prove the ALLEGED debt is not Statute Barred not up to you to prove it is.

[42man]

Chances are that if 1st Credit have 'found' you, the others will possibly be along soon....as ODC says send them the statute barred letter which is here letter 'M', send it by recorded and do NOT hand sign it...

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt-issues/20758-creditors-dcas-letter-templates.html

[floydster]

thanks guys i will do.

 

thanks again.

[sequenci]

Great advice given so far, I'll keep an eye on this one in case anything flares up.

 

Best wishes!

[floydster]

Hi,

 

I sent the letter to them on the 19/6/08 recored delivery which they received on the 20/6/08. i have received a letter today (28/6/08) LCS solicitors which says it is the legal division of 1st credit. it basically says that 1st credit have asked LCS to write to me giving me 14 days to make payment in full or they will issue proceedings against me in a county court for recovery.

 

the letter doesnt mention anything about the debt being statute barred.

 

what should i do now?

 

thanks

[Writerchris]

LCS "Solicitors" are the same lot as 1st Crappit. It's one of their standard scare tactics. As you sent the Statute Barred letter by recorded delivery I'd imagine that the alleged debt is now in dispute until they prove that it has been less than 6 years by supplying you with the relevant documentation.

I'd write to them stating that they have recieved your recorded delivery letter and that you are awaiting an appropriate answer and stressing that you do not recognise the debt and that the matter is in dispute.

 

As ever, don't sign your letters to them and stick to your guns (whilst registering correspondence and keeping a record of everything)

 

my personal experience is more with CCA's than statute barring so it would be wise to check what I'm saying with one of the brilliant forum veterans!

 

 

Good luck!

[sequenci]

Chris is correct.

 

The burden of proof lies firmly with LCS to prove that the debt isn't statute barred, you could remind them of their obligations whilst requesting a copy of their complaints procedure. As a forum, CAG are on the look out for people who are being chased by dcas for old debts, would you like to get involved with a little project that we are undertaking?

[ODC]

What about sending them this

 

Dear LCS aka 1st Credit Legal Department

 

Quite frankly I am shocked though not surprised that a firm of Solicitors working for a Debt Collection Agency are totally unaware of S5 of the Limitation Act 1980. I have made my position clear.

 

If you do not understand the implications then I suggest

 

1. Contact your local Citizens Advice Bureau

 

2. Contact a Reputable firm of solicitors.

 

If you have internet access there is an excellent site where you will get all the help you need www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk

 

This letter is valid even if not read by you!!!

 

yours etc

[sequenci]

lol @ odc, harsh but true.

[babybear39]

Love it ODC :D

[floydster]

hi guys thanks for all your responses. sequenci yes id be intrested in getting involved in your project the more help i get to help get these people off my back the better.

 

in the letter they have sent it says, "please note that we are not instructed to enter into corresponence with you regarding this matter prior to the issue of legal proceedings. all payment and communication should be made direct to our clients" so im guessing i shouldnt reply to them but send a letter to first credit. i'll put a letter together and put in on here for u guys to check over if thats ok as im new to this or do u think ODC's letter is what i should send.

thanks again for all your advise

Edited June 30, 2008 by floydster

[floydster]

ok this is what i was going to send. is there anything i have missed that i should put or anything i shouldnt?

 

Dear Sir,

Further to the letter I have received from LSC your legal department I would like to point out that I’m am still awaiting an answer to the letter I sent regarding this “alleged” debt dated 19th June which you received on the 20th June as it was sent recorded delivery which would mean the “alleged” debt is in dispute.

Please kindly refrain from sending me threatening solicitors letters and actually reply to the letter I sent dated the 19th June which have enclosed a copy of as I get the feeling you probably didn’t even read it.

Can you also send me a copy of your complaints procedure as I wish to make an official complaint about the way you are dealing with this along with the way you are harassing me without actually answering my original letter.

I look forward to hearing from you.

[ScarletPimpernel]

I have invoked Worst Cretin's complaint procedure; predictably, it is a waste of time - they failed to send me a copy of their complaint procedure, and their final response did not address any of the points raised in my complaint.

 

Therefore, I'd suggest a shorter letter:

 

Dear Clowns

 

I refer to your letter - on your faux solicitor letterhead - dated xxxx.

 

Until I have your response to my letter of 18 June 2008, I am not in a position to correspond further.

 

In the meantime, I am of the view that your activity is in breach of the Office of Fair Trading Guidance on Debt Collection, and the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008. Please send me a copy of your complaint procedure without delay.

 

Yours etc.

[PGH7447]

subscribing

[floydster]

Thanks ScarletPimernel. letter is done and will be sent 1st class redorded delivery tomorrow.

will post back as soon as i get a reply.

[floydster]

Hi,

 

i received the compaints procedure this morning but still nothing about weather the debt is statute barred. What should i do now with regards to the complaint as I'm not sure what rules they have broken.

 

 

Thanks

[ODC]

The OFT Guidelines make it very clear about what DCAs can do with regard to Statute Barred Debt.

 

Statute barred debt

2.13 This guidance applies to the pursuit of debt regardless of its age. We will be

carrying out further work on this aspect of debt recovery including analysis of

relevant legislation and practice throughout the UK.

2.14 In the past we have dealt with a number of statute barred debt cases governed by

the Limitation Act 1980, which applies to England and Wales. Based on that

experience our position with regard to England and Wales remains:

a. we accept legally the debt exists

b. it is the methods by which the debt is collected that can be

unfair as follows:

• it is unfair to pursue the debt if the debtor has heard nothing from

the creditor during the relevant limitation period

• if a creditor has been in regular contact with a debtor before the debt

is statute barred, then we do not consider it unfair to continue to

attempt to recover the debt

• it is unfair to mislead debtors as to their rights and obligations, for

example, falsely stating or implying that the debt is still legally

recoverable and relying on consumers not knowing the relevant legal

provisions, and

• continuing to press for payment after a debtor has stated that they

will not be paying a debt because it is statute barred could amount to

harassment contrary to section 40 (1) of the Administration of

Justice Act 1970.

 

 

The new Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 could also be used

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/faqs-please-read-these/146460-consumer-protection-unfair-trading.html

[letitbeme]

Hi, They will not admit that the debt is statute barred. They have to prove that it is not.

[ODC]

The burden of proof is on them. There is a Stated Case which makes this point.

[rory32]

As previous posters have stated once a limitation argument has been raised, the burden of proof is on the creditor to prove that the debt isn't statute barred.

 

London Congregation Union Inc v Harriss and Harriss [1988] 1 All ER 15, CA at 13.3)

[floydster]

so if they cant prove the debt isnt barred will they inform me or will they just stop contacting me. also does anyone know how statute barred debts affect your credit rating? will the debt remain on my credit file as an unsatisfied debt forever?

[babybear39]

If it's stat. barred it's already dropped off your credit file or will do after 6 years since the last default

Edited July 5, 2008 by babybear39
forgot something