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    • That is great news. Many people would have given up and paid after losing two appeals so well done for hanging in and fighting. It has paid off and they have finally backed down before getting whipped in Court. I looked at your NTD and your NTK again to see if there was a chance of going for a breach of your GDPR. Sadly although your NTK on its own could have well deserved a claim, the NTD is good enough not to warrant a claim even though it wasn;t compliant with PoFA. As it is the first Notice that mostly accounts for  GDPR breaches there is a reasonable cause for the NTD to have been issued. However you are now freed from worries about appearing in Court and you have learnt about the dangers of parking especially where the rogues that patrol private parking spaces are concerned. Thank you for making a donation and should you fall victim in the future to the parking rogues or anything else that we protect from, you are always welcome .
    • Hi guys I'm about to submit the defence as per below     There has been no reply to our CPR 31:14 request.  Is it worth adding that I (driver, not registered keeper) didn't actually enter or park in the car park and was sat at the petrol station forecourt the entire time?  Or is that covered by the simple points?   Thanks
    • a DCA is not a bailiff and cant enforce anything, even if they've been to court who are they please? sar to the original creditor FIO isnt applicable they are not a public body. who was this query sent too all the more reason to teach her young upon how these powerless DCA's monsters  work... she must stop payments now  
    • Unsettling the applecart?,  I'm going to be direct here, I know how this works , I've been in far worse situation than your relative, and I can assure you , now that there i likely a default in her name, it makes absolutely ZERO difference if she pays or not. Denzel Washington in the Equalizer , 'My only regret is that I can't kill you twice'... It's the same with a default, they can only do it once and it stays on your credit file for 6 years if she pays or not, and as it stands right now she's flushing £180 of her hard earned money down the toilet  so that the chaps at Lowell can afford a Christmas party. As for the SAR this is everybody's legal right, originally under the Data Protection act 1998 and now under GDPR, it's her right to find out everything that the original Creditor has on her file, and by not doing it the only person she is doing a massive disservice to is her self. As the father of 2 young adults myself, they need to learn at some point.. right?
    • Thank you for your pointers - much appreciated. dx100uk - Apologies, my request wasn't for super urgent advice and I have limited online access due to my long working hours and caring obligations - the delay in my response doesn't arise in any way from disrespect or ingratitude. I will speak to her at the weekend and see if she will open up a bit more about this, and allow me to submit the subject access request you advise - the original creditor is 118 118 loans and from the letter I saw (which prompted the conversation and the information) the debt collection agency had bought the debt from 118 and were threatening enforcement which is when she has made a payment arrangement with them for an amount of £180 per month. It looks as if she queried matters at the time (so I wonder if I might with the FIO request get access to their investigation file?) - the letter they wrote said "The information that you provided has been carefully considered and reviewed. After all relevant enquiries were made it has been confirmed that there is not enough evidence present to conclusively prove that this application was fraudulent.  However, we have removed the interest as a gesture of goodwill. As a result of the findings, you will be held liable for the capital amount on the loan on the basis of the information found during the investigation and you will be pursued for repayment of the loan agreement executed on 2.11.2022 in accordance with Consumer Credit Act 1974"  The amount at that time was over £3600 in arrears, as no payments had been made on it since inception and I think she only found out about it when a default notice came in paper form. I'm a little reluctant to advise her to just stop paying, and would like to be able to form a view in relation to her position and options before unsetting the applecart - do you think this is reasonable? She is young and inexperienced with these things and getting into this situation has brought about a lot of shame regarding inability to sort things out/stand up for herself, which is one of the reasons I have only found out about this considerably later Thank you once again for your advice - it is very much appreciated.    
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Lloyds TSB Credit Card - Claim form received


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glad it made u smile micheal.

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Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

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Interesting, I was just looking at the Default Notice they supplied (that they are no longer relying on, of course - except I'll make an issue that it must be relied upon):

http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q157/mcuth/CAG/default_1.jpg

 

It was dated 1st December 2006 and required action by 12th December 2006 - i.e. 11 days later. Now, the minimum period back then was 10 days, but was that from the time of service of the DN on the debtor, or the date of the notice? If it's from time of service, how long is allowed for service?

 

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Michael

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Wasn't it 7 days, which was extended to 10 days?

 

On 19/12/06 it was extended to 14 days, I've just found a post from PT (here, replying to me :D) that says it was 7 days before then. Not sure where I've got 10 days in my head from..... would be nice if that's the case!

 

As a rule of thumb, the Court says 2 working days for service of documents by first class post.

 

Thanks - I've just seen that the enforcement notices regs say that it's the prescribed amount of time from the date of service, which is handy to know :)

 

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It would certainly be good if you could force this out into open court. It doesnt come anywhere close to being a default notice methinks.

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It would certainly be good if you could force this out into open court. It doesnt come anywhere close to being a default notice methinks.

 

What makes you say that, citizen?

 

Is there another page to the Default Notice?

 

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What makes you say that, citizen?

 

Is there another page to the Default Notice?

 

Yeah, there's a 2nd page:

http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q157/mcuth/CAG/default_2.jpg

 

I don't think there's too much wrong with it overall, I just had thoughts about the period of time for action that was all....

 

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Ah, the 2nd page hadnt been posted up and that was what I realised was missing.

 

However, post 325 in this thread ( I think the link will take you directly there) details not only the importance but the requirements for a default notice.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/95027-cabot-county-court-claim-17.html#post1601276

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hang on dot they have to prove certain Documents were sent to you and recieved by you.

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Ah, the 2nd page hadnt been posted up and that was what I realised was missing.

 

It'd been posted up some time ago, but for the question I was asking I didn't see a need to link to it again :D

 

However, post 325 in this thread ( I think the link will take you directly there) details not only the importance but the requirements for a default notice.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/legal-issues/95027-cabot-county-court-claim-17.html#post1601276

 

Thanks :)

 

hang on dot they have to prove certain Documents were sent to you and recieved by you.

 

Proof of sending them is one thing, but receipt I don't think they have to prove....

 

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:rolleyes:

It'd been posted up some time ago, but for the question I was asking I didn't see a need to link to it again :D

 

 

 

Thanks :)

 

 

 

Proof of sending them is one thing, but receipt I don't think they have to prove....

 

Cheers

Michael

 

 

No they only have to prove they sent it ------------unfortunately:rolleyes:

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  • 2 weeks later...

Well, I've received a letter from SC&M giving further disclosure under CPR31.11 - their legal letter guide, card carrier template, default notice template and some correspondence from PayPlan. I'll scan the template/guides when I can, but IMHO the PayPlan correspondence is just them adding stuff to the "avoiding debt on a technicality" angle (something I'm planning to address at length in my Witness Statement :D).

 

They also state that they won't be able to exchange Witness Statements by 22nd Sept (the original order said:

8. The parties shall exchange witness statements of witness of fact exhibiting any other documents which are relied upon by 4pm on the 22nd September 2008.
), and they propose a new date of 1st October - "as this extension does not effect [sic] the final hearing of this claim please confirm you will not have any objections" (appalling use of the English language!).

 

Now, in principle I have no objections as I could do with the extra time meself - just wondering whether it is the best thing to do or not....?

 

Oh yeah, and the line about not meeting the 22nd Sept deadline is just a simple "Please note we will not be able to exchange Witness Statements by the 22nd September", no reason, apology, etc.. just simply that!

 

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now me just to be awkard would tell them.

 

the extention is not acceptable and if you dont follow court orders u will consider your options regarding this.

 

without telling them you will inform the courts of there failure and you want the courts to demand they produce the docs within 7 days or the case thown/struck out of court.

OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

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It would be quicker to agree to the new directions, then fight for them to comply with the original ones.

 

If they don't comply, you'd need to apply to the Court to have the directions enforced, which would probably take longer than agreeing to the directions extensions.

 

Being reasonable is probably wise in this case, IMHO.

 

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yeah i did not say mcuth should not i just said what i would do cause i can be awkard at times.

 

it is really up to Mcuth but if he feels the time would be helpfull then that is fine but remember it has to be cleared by the courts aswell as it was a court order.

OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

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without telling them you will inform the courts of there failure and you want the courts to demand they produce the docs within 7 days or the case thown/struck out of court.

 

Well, if it was a case of requiring docs for the Defence, I might well try this avenue, though the strike out is easy for a switched-on Claimant to combat - see earlier on in this thread! In this case, it's just the Witness Statements and it isn't prejudicial to wait for them...

 

It would be quicker to agree to the new directions, then fight for them to comply with the original ones.

 

If they don't comply, you'd need to apply to the Court to have the directions enforced, which would probably take longer than agreeing to the directions extensions.

 

Being reasonable is probably wise in this case, IMHO.

 

Thanks Chris, thought as much :)

 

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Michael

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well it is really up to you as i said i just said what i would do to be awkard but if i was in a nice mood and felt like being helpfull i would do as car suggests.

 

If thought it is alright with the courts as a court order should be followed.

OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

Essex girl in pc world looking 4 curtains 4 her pc,the assistant says u dont need curtains 4 a computer!!Essex girl says,''HELLOOO!! i,ve got WINDOWS!!'.

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I know what you mean GM - I don't feel like being particularly helpful, but at the end of the day I don't think being obstructive would get me anywhere....

 

Ok, this is the stuff I said I'd scan in.

 

1. Letter guide (umm, ignore the scanned staples!):

http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q157/mcuth/CAG/080919_LTSB_letter_guide.jpg

 

2. Card carrier template:

http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q157/mcuth/CAG/080919_LTSB_cardcarrierp1.jpg

http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q157/mcuth/CAG/080919_LTSB_cardcarrierp2.jpg

 

3. Default notice template:

http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q157/mcuth/CAG/080919_LTSB_defaultp1.jpg

http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q157/mcuth/CAG/080919_LTSB_defaultp2.jpg

 

Interesting - note how the default notice template is substantially different to the actual default notice that they've previously submitted to Court (that they're no longer relying on, strangely enough...:D), below:

 

http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q157/mcuth/CAG/default_1.jpg

http://s135.photobucket.com/albums/q157/mcuth/CAG/default_2.jpg

 

That's going to be a good one for them to get out of!

 

Cheers

Michael

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:D I like the discrepancies between their template and the actual Default notice. I can well see why they wont want to rely on the original, however, you will be pointing these discrepancies out in court wont you. Apart from anything else it shows how they would have tried to manipulate things had you said you didnt receive one.

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1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

4: BCOBS and Unfair Treatment - Common Examples of Banks Behaving Badly

5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

PLEASE DO NOT ASK ME TO GIVE ADVICE BY PM - IF YOU PROVIDE A LINK TO YOUR THREAD THEN I WILL BE HAPPY TO OFFER ADVICE THERE:D

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:D I like the discrepancies between their template and the actual Default notice. I can well see why they wont want to rely on the original, however, you will be pointing these discrepancies out in court wont you.

 

I think it would be substantially negligent of me not to point them out to the Court :D I think they may well have been too keen to withdraw their reliance on the orignal one (detailed here). Shame that they'll be wanting to rely on this default notice template as "an example" of the type of default notice that they sent out and it is different to the one previously submitted. I think I'll be going through both DNs and comparing to the regs...

 

Apart from anything else it shows how they would have tried to manipulate things had you said you didnt receive one.

 

Well, as yet, I haven't actually admitted or denied receiving a Default Notice ;) It is also another string to the bow of how LTSB's evidence has been flawed in this case since their first submission....

 

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Michael

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:)

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4: Staying Calm About Debt  Read Here

5: Forum rules - These have been updated - Please Read

BCOBS

1: How can BCOBS protect you from your Banks unfair treatment

2: Does your Bank play fair - You can force your Bank to play Fair with you

3: Banking Conduct of Business Regulations - The Hidden Rules

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5: Fair Treatment for Credit Card Holders and Borrowers - COBS

Advice & opinions given by citizenb are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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I know mcuth and in the end you need to remember that they have been ordered by the courts to produce the info i wounder if they will be asking courts permission to file late as my courts have always told me that the courts need to be asked.

OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

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I know mcuth and in the end you need to remember that they have been ordered by the courts to produce the info i wounder if they will be asking courts permission to file late as my courts have always told me that the courts need to be asked.

 

Yeah, but the info to be produced is a Witness Statement, not "normal" docs per se - so I don't think the strictness of the timescale really needs to be enforced. They probably do need the Court's permission, but it'll just be easier for them to present it as an agreement anyway...

 

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Michael

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  • 1 month later...

Small update for you - we've exchanged witness statements (I was late with mine and SC&M made an application to get an unless order - I complied with that order) and SC&M are putting together the trial bundle.

 

While putting together my witness statement, not only did I add in the detail on the differences between the DN template and the actual DN, but I came across a nice little find on my Experian CRF - turns out that LTSB reported the default date as 4 months after what they say is the date of the DN, and indeed the amount of the Default is incorrectly reported too. I think that could be potentially explosive for them in court :D

 

Anyway, on the same day I received the draft trial bundle, I received a WP offer from SC&M - they say their client is open to settlement negotiations and opened the bidding as follows: A repayment plan for the original amount of the claim (not less the penalty charges) or a lump sum of £2.5k - in both options, no fees/costs are to be included and will not be pursued. I've rejected this offer as unacceptable and countered with the following: £1k lump sum paid to me, along with all LTSB CRA data removed as compensation for their incorrect default procedures & reporting; balance to be written off with no further liability on either side; case to be discontinued with both parties bearing own costs :D

 

So, waiting to hear back from SC&M, but at the moment we're ready for the trial on 28th November - scheduled to last 1 whole day :eek:

 

Cheers

Michael

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