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    • Hi LFI, Your knowledge in this area is greater than I could possibly hope to have and as such I appreciate your feedback. In your point 1 you mention: 1] there is a real danger that some part of the appeal will point out that the person appealing [the keeper ] is also the driver. I understand the point you are making but I was referring to when the keeper is also the driver and admits it later and only in this circumstance, but I understand what you are saying. I take on board the issues you raise in point 2. Can a PPC (claimant) refer back to the case above as proof that the motorist should have appealed, like they refer back to other cases? Thanks once again for the feedback.
    • Well barristers would say that in the hope that motorists would go to them for advice -obviously paid advice.  The problem with appealing is at least twofold. 1] there is a real danger that some part of the appeal will point out that the person appealing [the keeper ] is also the driver.  And in a lot of cases the last thing the keeper wants when they are also the driver is that the parking company knows that. It makes it so much easier for them as the majority  of Judges do not accept that the keeper and the driver are the same person for obvious reasons. Often they are not the same person especially when it is a family car where the husband, wife and children are all insured to drive the same car. On top of that  just about every person who has a valid insurance policy is able to drive another person's vehicle. So there are many possibilities and it should be up to the parking company to prove it to some extent.  Most parking company's do not accept appeals under virtually any circumstances. But insist that you carry on and appeal to their so called impartial jury who are often anything but impartial. By turning down that second appeal, many motorists pay up because they don't know enough about PoFA to argue with those decisions which brings us to the second problem. 2] the major parking companies are mostly unscrupulous, lying cheating scrotes. So when you appeal and your reasons look as if they would have merit in Court, they then go about  concocting a Witness Statement to debunk that challenge. We feel that by leaving what we think are the strongest arguments to our Member's Witness Statements, it leaves insufficient time to be thwarted with their lies etc. And when the motorists defence is good enough to win, it should win regardless of when it is first produced.   
    • S13 (2)The creditor may not exercise the right under paragraph 4 to recover from the keeper any unpaid parking charges specified in the notice to keeper if, within the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which that notice was given, the creditor is given— (a)a statement signed by or on behalf of the vehicle-hire firm to the effect that at the material time the vehicle was hired to a named person under a hire agreement; (b)a copy of the hire agreement; and (c)a copy of a statement of liability signed by the hirer under that hire agreement. As  Arval has complied with the above they cannot be pursued by EC----- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- S14 [1]   the creditor may recover those charges (so far as they remain unpaid) from the hirer. (2)The conditions are that— (a)the creditor has within the relevant period given the hirer a notice in accordance with sub-paragraph (5) (a “notice to hirer”), together with a copy of the documents mentioned in paragraph 13(2) and the notice to keeper; (b)a period of 21 days beginning with the day on which the notice to hirer was given has elapsed;  As ECP did not send copies of the documents to your company and they have given 28 days instead of 21 days they have failed to comply with  the Act so you and your Company are absolved from paying. That is not to say that they won't continue asking to be paid as they do not have the faintest idea how PoFA works. 
    • Euro have got a lot wrong and have failed to comply with the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4.  According to Section 13 after ECP have written to Arval they should then send a NTH to the Hirer  which they have done.This eliminates Arval from any further pursuit by ECP. When they wrote to your company they should have sent copies of everything that they asked Arval for. This is to prove that your company agree what happened on the day of the breach. If ECP then comply with the Act they are allowed to pursue the hirer. If they fail, to comply they cannot make the hirer pay. They can pursue until they are blue in the face but the Hirer is not lawfully required to pay them and if it went to Court ECP would lose. Your company could say who was driving but the only person that can be pursued is the Hirer, there does not appear to be an extension for a driver to be pursued. Even if there was, because ECP have failed miserably to comply with the Act  they still have no chance of winning in Court. Here are the relevant Hire sections from the Act below.
    • Thank-you FTMDave for your feedback. May I take this opportunity to say that after reading numerous threads to which you are a contributor, I have great admiration for you. You really do go above and beyond in your efforts to help other people. The time you put in to help, in particular with witness statements is incredible. I am also impressed by the way in which you will defer to others with more experience should there be a particular point that you are not 100% clear on and return with answers or advice that you have sought. I wish I had the ability to help others as you do. There is another forum expert that I must also thank for his time and patience answering my questions and allowing me to come to a “penny drops” moment on one particular issue. I believe he has helped me immensely to understand and to strengthen my own case. I shall not mention who it is here at the moment just in case he would rather I didn't but I greatly appreciate the time he took working through that issue with me. I spent 20+ years of working in an industry that rules and regulations had to be strictly adhered to, indeed, exams had to be taken in order that one had to become qualified in those rules and regulations in order to carry out the duties of the post. In a way, such things as PoFA 2012 are rules and regulations that are not completely alien to me. It has been very enjoyable for me to learn these regulations and the law surrounding them. I wish I had found this forum years ago. I admit that perhaps I had been too keen to express my opinions given that I am still in the learning process. After a suitable period in this industry I became Qualified to teach the rules and regulations and I always said to those I taught that there is no such thing as a stupid question. If opinions, theories and observations are put forward, discussion can take place and as long as the result is that the student is able to clearly see where they went wrong and got to that moment where the penny drops then that is a valuable learning experience. No matter how experienced one is, there is always something to learn and if I did not know the answer to a question, I would say, I don't know the answer to that question but I will go and find out what the answer is. In any posts I have made, I have stated, “unless I am wrong” or “as far as I can see” awaiting a response telling me what I got wrong, if it was wrong. If I am wrong I am only too happy to admit it and take it as a valuable learning experience. I take the point that perhaps I should not post on other peoples threads and I shall refrain from doing so going forward. 🤐 As alluded to, circumstances can change, FTMDave made the following point that it had been boasted that no Caggers, over two years, who had sent a PPC the wrong registration snotty letter, had even been taken to court, let alone lost a court hearing .... but now they have. I too used the word "seemed" because it is true, we haven't had all the details. After perusing this forum I believe certain advice changed here after the Beavis case, I could be wrong but that is what I seem to remember reading. Could it be that after winning the above case in question, a claimant could refer back to this case and claim that a defendant had not made use of the appeal process, therefore allowing the claimant to win? Again, in this instance only, I do not know what is to be gained by not making an appeal or concealing the identity of the driver, especially if it is later admitted that the defendant was the driver and was the one to input the incorrect VRN in error. So far no one has educated me as to the reason why. But, of course, when making an appeal, it should be worded carefully so that an error in the appeal process cannot be referred back to. I thought long and hard about whether or not to post here but I wanted to bring up this point for discussion. Yes, I admit I have limited knowledge, but does that mean I should have kept silent? After I posted that I moved away from this forum slightly to find other avenues to increase my knowledge. I bought a law book and am now following certain lawyers on Youtube in the hope of arming myself with enough ammunition to use in my own case. In one video titled “7 Reasons You Will LOSE Your Court Case (and how to avoid them)” by Black Belt Barrister I believe he makes my point by saying the following, and I quote: “If you ignore the complaint in the first instance and it does eventually end up in court then it's going to look bad that you didn't co-operate in the first place. The court is not going to look kindly on you simply ignoring the company and not, let's say, availing yourself of any kind of appeal opportunities, particularly if we are talking about parking charge notices and things like that.” This point makes me think that, it is not such a bizarre judgement in the end. Only in the case of having proof of payment and inputting an incorrect VRN .... could it be worthwhile making a carefully worded appeal in the first instance? .... If the appeal fails, depending on the reason, surely this could only help if it went to court? As always, any feedback gratefully received.
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    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
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      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

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Social Media & Employment Guidelines


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We are, unsurprisingly as their usage getting a lot of employment problems regarding social media such as Facebook, so I was wondering if we could maybe put together a little stickied guide on the do's and don'ts?

 

My thoughts, based on how I use FB for example would be:

 

Put your Privacy Settings on Maximum.

 

That includes setting it so that your profile does not display in searched by your name or email address.

 

No matter how well you feel you get on, no matter how long you have worked alongside people, do not add them to your Facebook friends list. Especially don't add Managers :-D

 

Don't add the company you are currently working for to your profile, just in case that gives them a way to get even a glimpse of your profile.

 

I have created an album with several screenshots to show what maximum privacy settings look like

 

http://s107.photobucket.com/albums/m309/prw2005/Facebook%20Screenshots/

 

Just to add, this is what my Profile looks like to a non friend - as you can see, my wall, interests, photo's, everything is blank, not even my friends list appears, there is literally nothing to identify who I am, especially as I have an extremely common name, and don't use my middle name on FB :-D

 

Basically all anyone who is not on my friends list can discern (and remember my profile has been set so I do not show up in name OR email addresses) so they wont even find the profile anyway, is that I am Male! Thats it. Thats all your employer should see too.

 

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Sound advice, unfortunately by the time people get to here its sometimes too late!

I am not a legal professional or adviser, I am however a Law Student and very well versed areas of Employment Law. Anything I write here is purely from my own experiences! If I help, then click the star to add to my reputation :)

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Also, don't make wall posts about work, ever. Just. Don't. Do. It. You might think it's funny at the time, but when someone has screen-capped it and sent it to the MD, the amusement wears off pretty quickly.

 

Before you post anything, think about how it "sounds" in type versus how it sounds when you say it out loud. When you're using social media, the person on the receiving end doesn't have the benefit of your facial expression, body language or tone of voice. What might be funny and lighthearted in person can seem distinctly different when it's in writing.

 

Most of all, remember once you've put something on a SM profile, it can be recoverable even if you delete it, not least because some people will quite happily screen cap and save questionable postings (and believe me, this does happen). There is very little chance of denying or mitigating down something that you've put in writing!

 

In 20 years of working life, I have never known any one factor to generate as many warnings, grievances, disciplinary meetings and actual sackings as social media.

"Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me". Martin Niemöller

 

"A vital ingredient of success is not knowing that what you're attempting can't be done. A person ignorant of the possibility of failure can be a half-brick in the path of the bicycle of history". - Terry Pratchett

 

If I've been helpful, please click my star. :oops:

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Good resource.Will make this a stickie.

Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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Oh yes...I know this might seem obvious, but if you DO decide to add work colleagues, don't go within 10 feet of a keyboard if you've had a couple of drinks. I've seen this cause a variety of trouble from a message intended for a spouse being sent to the wrong person (!), to allegations of alcoholism. :|

"Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me". Martin Niemöller

 

"A vital ingredient of success is not knowing that what you're attempting can't be done. A person ignorant of the possibility of failure can be a half-brick in the path of the bicycle of history". - Terry Pratchett

 

If I've been helpful, please click my star. :oops:

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  • 2 months later...

This sound really wise on the one hand, however I am wondering whether it makes any sense at all to be on there then, if no one can find me etc.

 

Would it not be just easier to not have a profile at all?

 

I also have a question.

 

My employer asked a few of us to become community managers and so I now have two profiles, both with the same photos, one is my own and the other is an upgraded account that is paid for by the company.

 

My job with relation to this was to collect contacts that are relevant to my job and the business.

 

I have now handed in my notice and would like them to remove that profile as I will not be working there any longer.

 

Does anyone know what are the legal requirements for them to remove my profile and stop using my name and photo please?

 

As far as I am aware the company does not have a social media policy for employees, as such so it was dealt with on a more ad hoc basis.

 

Any advice would be much appreciated.

 

Thank you.

 

Mariann

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Hello,this should be relatively straightforward.

Simply advise them that you remove all permissions and will rely on the Data Protection Act for their compliance.

You can do this by writing a formal letter,or else serving them a section 10 notice under the DPA.

There is a template of this in the CAG library.

Have a happy and prosperous 2013 by avoiiding Payday loans. If you are sent a private message directing you for advice or support with your issues to another website,this is your choice.Before you decide,consider the users here who have already offered help and support.

Advice offered by Martin3030 is not supported by any legal training or qualification.Members are advised to use the services of fully insured legal professionals when needed.

 

 

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  • 1 month later...

Hi All

 

Can't find the letter in the library and the company I used to work for is still using my name and photo.

 

Could someone tell me which letter to send please

 

Many thanks,

 

Mariann

 

Hello,this should be relatively straightforward.

Simply advise them that you remove all permissions and will rely on the Data Protection Act for their compliance.

You can do this by writing a formal letter,or else serving them a section 10 notice under the DPA.

There is a template of this in the CAG library.

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  • 3 months later...

A word of warning, my facebook privacy settings were set to private. I worked for a well known charitable advice agency, and after 7 months was pulled into a disciplinary, and shown a snapshot of my wall, where there was an article on the BBC posted about the lifting of regulations for EU nationals from certain countries allowing them to have access to public funds. I must have liked it on the BBC page, and it showed up on my wall that morning along with the comments left on the BBC website from others. The correct procedure was not followed with the meeting, ie I was just told to bob in for a chat a few seconds before, was not warned beforehand etc. I didnt even have my glasses so couldnt see the article properly. I have done employment law at Uni, and knew that this was wrong. I denied having any racist feelings, but the HR accused me as such. Made me make a statement where I denied putting it on my wall, and when I told her my wall was private anyway she showed me on her wall how she had accessed the information, A snapshot appears when you access through a mutual friend! This was a clear invasion of my privacy and I have made numerous complaints to the head of the charity itself, as my work record was more than impeccable. We were facing redundancies next month, and I believe it was a ploy to get rid of me with no notice.

 

I submitted evidence that facebook can post on your behalf, when you like an article, and also that the privacy settings were set to private, but I was told by my boss, I had to resign or face a second interview the next day where the likelihood was that I would be fired for gross misconduct for being racist. All totally wrong from an organisation that advises others every day on employment rights!

 

I couldnt afford to have this on my record as I am newly qualified,and have just spend years getting my law degree after my divorce. I did not want to jeopardise my work record, and after getting upset resigned. I did not sign the letter, and my immediate bosses told me their hands were tied by the HR dept, who they outsource to. I have retained a good reference.

 

I am currently trying to get some pro bono assistance to help me take this further, as I hadnt been there 2 years I have no claim in the Emp Tribunal, unless they will bend and allow it under the Equality Act, however I possibly do have one against the government because they failed to give me adequate protection against freedom of expressing my political views in an ET court after a recent ruling said that article 11 covers freedom of political expression as well as religious. Just need help as its out of my league as an advisor..

So be careful what you put on your wall and NEVER trust work colleagues as they may be your friends, but when push comes to shove and they are faced with them or us situation in redundancy they may choose to cover their own backs and stab you in yours!

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There is more than one FB privacy setting and it sounds like yours is set to "friends of friends."

Never assume anyone on the internet is who they say they are. Only rely on advice from insured professionals you have paid for!

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It says only friends on the privacy settings, Ive since checked it again, its definately friends. Yet the print out says 2 mutual friends, on the side and it gives a snapshot of the last few posts and details of me, that should have been private. Just want to warn others to be careful, apparently its the biggest area of reasons for misconduct at the moment, and with the new employment laws last year, anyone with less than 2 years service from April 12 cannot raise a claim in the Employment Tribunals, unless its covered under special circs..

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There is no such thing as privacy - anywhere - on the internet. You must always consider that ANYTHING, even if made behind the mask of a privacy setting on Facebook, can potentially be seen by anybody. A 'friend' can easily re-post something that you have written, or systems to provide privacy can break down or otherwise be breached. If the employer becomes aware of it, then they can act. It's not always fair, but is a fact of life today that one should always consider whether anything written on a page, blog, forum etc could be seen as detrimental to an employer, colleague or organisation, or call into question one's personal integrity.

 

Having said that - I think your employer grossly over reacted!

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  • 9 months later...

just a little update on this, tribunal has been set for a 3 day hearing against CAB my previous employer. It turned out to be a ruse to stop me becoming employment rep, they dug around and "discovered" a news article they didnt like. It is also a breach of your political expression if the comment is political in anyway and it happens after June this year. We have a good strong case, so if anyone does have this happen dont give up and fight them if you can..

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