***RBS PPI Claim Long fight but, WON***

[alanalana]

Hello all again,

 

second letter from FOS.

 

Your complaint about The Royal Bank of Scotland Pic

Thank you for sending us details of your complaint.

It would appear that The Royal Bank of Scotland Pic have not yet issued their final response on your complaint even though they have had the required eight weeks in which to do so.

 

It may be possible for the firm to issue their final response shortly; we have therefore contacted The Royal Bank of Scotland Pic and requested that they issue their final response letter within the next 14 days.

We will contact you again upon receipt of the final response from The Royal Bank of Scotland Pic or when the 14 day time limit has expired.

 

This is fine, but my complaint with the FOS is for the RBS not complying with the Data Protection Act 1998 in complying with my SAR.

 

My letters asking for refund of mis-sold PPI have only been posted in the first week of June:rolleyes:

 

Maybe the FOS letter will be met with a "we better get a move on" ,

or we still have time to respond hopefully the first option.

 

I have started to love confusion:eek:

 

Yours in reclaiming

aa:wink:

[alanalana]

Hello all,

Letter removed as I was jumping ahead of myself not allowing the statutory time for a response.

 

Amended figures will be posted after the 8 week period

 

aa

Edited June 15, 2008 by alanalana

[alanalana]

Hello all,

 

I have spoken today to the Information Commissioners Office with reference to my complaint. Gave the complaint reference number and asked about the progress.

I was informed that my complaint submitted in May First letter submitted in Mar 08 (Actually letter 3 was posted in April and there have been regular updates since) means I have not yet been allocated a case worker and the Information Commissioners Office are currently responding to complaints from February 2008 I was informed I should be allocated a case officer within the next few weeks.

 

However do not stop making complaints to the Information Commissioners Office. They are a regulatory authority and can take action against the non compliance with the Data Protection Act 1998.

 

keep up with the complaints they all count.

 

I will keep you posted on any changes

 

aa

Edited June 19, 2008 by alanalana

[angry cat]

I made a FULL SAR to RBS on 10 February 2008, to date I have been supplied with nothing.

 

I complained to the ICO 25 March 2008 and this was their astonishing reply:

 

 

"Thank you for your correspondence dated 25/03/2008 to the ICO about unfair penalty charges and your subject access request to the Royal Bank of Scotland for information held as part of bank account statements.

 

Is a subject access request necessary in order to reclaim anu unfair penalty charges?

 

No. Information from credit card/bank statements should not be needed in order to reclaim any unfair penalty charges from a financial institution.

 

Following an OFT ruling about 'unfair penalty charges' relating to credit card accounts, the number of individuals making subject access requests under the DPA for information held as part of credit card statements has increased significantly. Although the OFT ruling only relates to credit card accounts anumber of individuals are also making subject access requests for information relating to other financial services before attempting to reclaim any penalty charges associated with them. Many financial institutions are struggling to respond to these subject access requests within the 40 calender days permitted. We are aware of this and are monitoring the situation closely.

 

What's the best way to reclaim penalty charges?

 

The FOS is the most appropriate organisation to assist you when seeking to settle disputes about unfair penalty charges with RBS. The FOS can be contacted on 0845 080 1800.

Complaints about unfair penalty charges fall outside the remit of the ICO. This is why we are unable to directly assist you in seeking repayment of these charges.

 

What will the ICO now do with your complaint about failed SAR?

We acknowledge that in pursuing the unfair penalty charges a valid SAR was made to RBS and although the information requested may not be needed to recover any unfair penalty charges, financial institutions are still required to provide it.

 

From all the information that you have provided to us it seems unlikely that RBS have complied and their obligations under the DPA on this accasion as they have failed to provide you with the information to which you are entitled.

 

We will therefore be writing to RBS with the details of this complaint. We will ask them to ensure that they provide you with the information you are entitled to as a matter of priority. Furthermore, we will ask them to take any steps necessary to ensure their future compliance with the DPA.

 

We recommend that you contact the FOS to begin the process of reclaiming unfair penalty charges...

they then bang on about the FOS and that I will receive my information in "due course"

 

David Simmons - Customer Service Officer - ICO.

 

I am astonished, nowhere did I ever mention naything about penalty charges!

 

Mr. Simmons hasn't done very much piority investigating, as I am still waiting for the information that I am legally entitled to...

 

Further, I know of another party who has now been waitng 7 months!

 

Pull your finger out ICO, RBS are riding roughshod over consumers and their rights; do the job that you are paid to do.

 

alananana, I hope that you find the above of interest.

 

AC

[alanalana]

Hello angrycat,

 

What will the Information Commissioners Office now do with your complaint about failed S.A.R - (Subject Access Request)?

We acknowledge that in pursuing the unfair penalty charges a valid S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) was made to RBS and although the information requested may not be needed to recover any unfair penalty charges, financial institutions are still required to provide it.

 

Yes If they took the £10 fee and did not provide it, could they be guilty of something?

 

From all the information that you have provided to us it seems unlikely that RBS have complied and their obligations under the Data Protection Act on this accasion as they have failed to provide you with the information to which you are entitled.

 

I am still in the queue. Astounding to see that response. I have requested ICO to slap an enforcement order on RBS for failing to provide the required data.

 

The whole PPI issue will be a long and hard fight but £1.4billion of mis-sold policies is worth a good fight from all those on the receiving end of shoddy practices.

 

aa

[alanalana]

Hello BRW, HHNF and all posters on this forum,

 

Re my post 47 (complaint) this is the response from the OFT:

 

OFFICE OF FAIRTRADING

Mr xxx

Address

 

Tele No(020) 7211 8000

Our ref Epic/Enq/L/34746 Fax(020) 7211 8877

 

Date 24 June 2008 [email protected]

 

Dear Mr xxx

 

Consumer Credit Act 1974 (the Act)

Complaint Against: The Royal Bank Scotland Plc

Licence No: 176720

 

Thank you for your letter received on 02 May 2008. I sincerely apologise for the delay in responding.

 

I am very sorry to hear about the difficulties you have been experiencing however, the OFT has no authority to become involved in disputes between consumers and traders and so we cannot offer you any direct help with the complaint or advise you directly in this matter. Our role is to protect the collective interests of consumers.(more complaints to the regulatory bodies required)

 

The Consumer Credit Act 1974 (the Act) established a licensing system to protect the interests of consumers in the credit area. If a business wishes to undertake the collection of debts that arise from consumer credit agreements then the Act states that they are required to hold a consumer credit licence; this is issued by the OFT.

 

The above trader holds a consumer credit licence. Under the Act, the OFT has a duty to consider the fitness of all traders who hold consumer credit licences. In considering fitness we take into account whether a business has engaged in improper business practices. (Does this include mis-selling of PPI?) Where we receive complaints about the business practices of licensees, we investigate them and where appropriate we take enforcement action; that action depends on the evidence and circumstances. Action the OFT can take includes revoking, refusing or suspending a licence; or placing conduct requirements on the licence of the company or business in question (failure to comply with a conduct requirement can result in a financial penalty being levied).

 

The OFT has issued guidance to consumer credit licence holders engaged in the debt collection industry. The guidance is intended to ensure that debt collectors treat debtors fairly. Non-compliance with this guidance will call into question the fitness of licence holders and applicants. You can view our guidance at: http://www.oft.gov.uk/advice and resources/resource base/legal/cca/debt-collection

 

As you are aware, the general effects of sections 77-79 requires the creditor/owner (in the case of a hire agreement) under an agreement for (fixed-sum credit, running account credit and hire agreement) to provide the debtor/hirer with a copy of the executed agreement and a statement of account on request. If a creditor/owner fails to comply with a valid request within a period of 12 days (not including the date of receipt of the request) he may not enforce the agreement at all.

 

This prevents enforcement with or without a court order. If a default lasts for a month (for example a calendar month) it constitutes an offence. We understand your concerns in this matter but please do remember however that once the creditor/owner complies with the request albeit out of time, he may once again enforce the agreement.

 

For your information, a 'true copy' of an agreement principally consists of the terms and conditions of the agreement and the statutory content of the agreement. The name, address and signature of the debtor do not have to be provided. Additionally, the creditor must supply the total sum paid under the agreement by the debtor; the total sum which has become payable under the agreement but remains unpaid; and the total sum which is to become payable under the agreement by the debtor (the latter

two must include the various amounts comprised in that total sum and the date when each is/was due). However, the copy must be a copy. It need not be exact on immaterial points, but it cannot be a conjectured reconstruction. If the trader has no original copy, the trader will have difficulty showing that he has complied with the regulation by supplying a 'true copy', since nobody would know what was in the original. When the trader comes to enforce the debt in court, he needs to have a signed copy of the agreement in order to enforce. As the law stands currently he

cannot otherwise.

 

We note your concerns that in the absence of a copy of the original agreement someone's liability for a debt can only lead to further query. However in circumstances like this we would view it is as unfair practice under section 25(2) (d) of the Act and relevant to licence fitness if a trader failed to investigate and/or provide details as appropriate when a debt is queried or disputed.

 

As you are aware, the Limitation Act 1980 (the 1980 Act) sets out certain periods (referred to here as the "limitation period") after which court claims cannot be brought.

 

Different periods apply to different types of claims.

A claim for a debt is a claim based on breach of contract. The basic rule, under section 5 of the 1980 Act, is that a court claim for breach of contract cannot be brought morem than 6 years after the breach occurred. In the case of a debt, the breach is the failure to pay the debt when required. The 6 year limitation period runs from the time

payment should have been made and a court claim cannot usually be brought after

that.

It is also possible for the limitation period, in effect to be extended. Under section 29 of the 1980 Act this can happen when the debtor acknowledges his debt or makes a part payment of it. The acknowledgement or payment must be to the person to whom

the debt is owed or someone acting on his behalf. When the debtor does either of these things the 6 year limitation period may start to run afresh. This can only be the case where the acknowledgement or part payment is made within the original 6 year limitation period (and not later). The acknowledgement would need to be in writing and signed by the person making it (or someone on his behalf). It would need to amount to

an admission that the debt is owed and has not been paid.

 

If a creditor seeks payment of a debt outside the limitation period the debt does still exist legally. The creditor can still ask the debtor to pay.

What the expiry of the limitation period means is that the creditor cannot then enforce the debt through court action.

 

The OFT's Debt Collection Guidance, published in July 2003, gives the OFT's position regarding statute barred debt in England and Wales:

 

• It is unfair to pursue the debt if the debtor has heard nothing from the creditor during the relevant limitation period.

• If a creditor has been in regular contact with a debtor before the debt is statute barred, then we do not consider it unfair to continue to attempt to recover the debt.

• It is unfair to mislead debtors as to their rights and obligations, e.g. falsely stating or implying that the debt is still legally recoverable and relying on consumers not knowing the relevant legal provisions, and

• Continuing to press for payment after a debtor has stated that they will not be paying a debt because it is statute barred could amount to harassment contrary to section 40(1) of the Administration of Justice Act 1970.

 

 

I have noted the details of your complaint, and we will consider this alongside any other complaints we have received with a view to any licensing action we may decide to take. If we do take any licensing action against this trader, it is likely that we would need to disclose your identity to this trader along with details of your complaint. I should therefore be grateful if you could sign the enclosed consent form and return it

to me in the enclosed freepost envelope. Unfortunately, we cannot disclose any details about any action we may take, due to restrictions on the OFT relating to disclosure of information (Part 9 of the Enterprise Act 2002).

 

Should you require specialist, face-to-face assistance, or intervention, you may wish to seek legal advice either through a local Citizens' Advice Bureau or directly from a legal adviser.

 

The Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS) can help with most complaints about consumer-credit products and services if the consumer has failed to satisfactorily resolve the matter directly with the financial institution itself. FOS can be contacted at:

 

The Financial Ombudsman Service, South Quay Plaza, 183 Marsh Wall, London, E14 9SR;

telephone number, 0845 080 1800,

or Financial Ombudsman Service.

 

Thank you again for writing to us and bringing this matter to our attention.

 

Yours sincerely

Miss xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Enquiries and Reporting Centre

Corporate Services

 

*Permission To Disclose Complaint

Consumer Credit Act 1974 ('the Act')

Complaint Against: The Royal Bank Scotland Plc

Licence No: 176720

 

Reference: Epic/Enq/L/34746

 

* Please delete as appropriate I give/so not give* my consent for the Office of Fair Trading (OFT) to disclose details

of my complaint concerning the above trader, including my name and address details, in any further action that it may take under the Act or under any other legislation administered by the OFT. I also confirm that I have no objections/object* to the OFT using the information

provided by me in the performance of any of its functions and disclosing that information to others where legally permissible. By way of example, the OFT may disclose such information in connection with enforcement or regulatory action under its own powers or may refer the information to another government department or enforcement authority.

 

 

Signed:..........................................

 

Print name: .....................................

 

Address (Please print): .........................

 

.........................................

 

.........................................

 

.........................................

 

.........................................

 

 

Date: .........................................

Please note the OFT can only use your details in any action we may take against the above trader if you give your written permission for us to do so.

 

We cannot disclose any details about any action we may take. due to restrictions on

the OFT relating to disclosure of information (Part 9 of the Enterprise Act 2002).

 

Additional contact details.

 

In the event of the OFT needing to contact you for further information, it would be helpful if you could provide the following contact details. Please note these further details will not be disclosed to the trader.

 

Telephone number: (Home)....................(Mobile)......................

 

Preferred time of contact by telephone: ..................................

 

E-mail address: ..........................................................

 

INVESTOR IN PEOPLE

 

I believe this is probably a standard response but linked to my complaint. There is no mention of any action being taken against the bank. I have however filled out the attached sheet agreeing to the information being passed on and used elsewhere. The more complaints the sooner the FSA may decide to take appropriate action.

 

Although this is dealing with CCA1974 my main complaint so far has been the failure to supply the information required within the statute of the Data Protection Act 1998. I just made sure everyone in the UK got a copy.

 

This may help others on CAG with their claims.

 

Good luck to you all;)

 

aa:D

Edited June 26, 2008 by alanalana
text added

[banker_rhymes_with]

Hello aa!

 

Very useful. Particularly as much of the wording of the OFT response is something many of us have seen used in CAG Template Letters.

 

This shows the wording came from the OFT, so that adds a great deal of confidence to using some of these blocks of Text.

 

I am much happier now using extracts from the above, as I now know where the Text came from.

 

Cheers,

BRW

[alanalana]

Hello BRW and all reclaimers,

 

Re my post 116 and BRW assistance on post 117 for 4 claims against Direct Line Financial Services which were transferred back to the RBS group (details on earlier posts). SAR sent 7 Jan received the following today:

From another arm of the RBS empire just to throw people off track!

It appears I am now dealing with a second Regulatory Risk Office this one in Manchester. (where does this all end?)

 

Our ref: xxxxx RBS The Royal Bank of Scotland Group

Direct Line: 0161 755 7010 PPI Customer Concerns Team

Regulatory Risk

5th Floor

1 Hardman Boulevard

Manchester

M33AQ

 

Telephone: 0161 755 6890

Free Phone: 0800 015 0319

Facsimile: 0161 755 6887

Facsimile: 0161 755 6888

Web Site: RBS | The Royal Bank of Scotland | Personal, Private, Business & Corporate Banking

Opening hours: 8.00am - 5.00pm

(Monday - Friday)

 

 

XXX

AA

ADDRESS

27 June 2008

 

 

 

Dear Mr AA XX

 

Your Payment Protection Insurance policy with Direct Line

 

Thank you for letting us know about the concerns you have with your payment protection insurance policy. (4 policies actually) I am sorry to learn that you are unhappy (Unhappy does not accurately describe my sentiments at this moment in time) and can assure you that your comments are being taken very seriously.

 

To help us progress your complaint please can you confirm the specific concerns that you have about the sale of your policy, using the Questionnaire provided. Upon receipt of this information we will be able to fully investigate matters for you. I will complete their questionnaire and send it with a covering letter complete with all the information they are requesting which has already been supplied by the retail regulatory risk office in Glasgow)

 

You may still receive correspondence from your product provider (Namely Direct Line Financial Services who are no longer authorised in accordance with the FSA Register) but this will not affect the investigation in any way. Please contact them direct (Tell me how) if you have any queries specifically in relation to your policy.(policies)

 

A leaflet, 'What Happens when I make a Complaint' is enclosed for your information. This explains the procedures we follow and gives an indication as to when you will hear from us with an update. (My letter requesting refund of PPI sent on the 9th June so the clock is already ticking by three weeks and their "What happens when I make a Complaint leaflet" says they will initially respond in 4 - 1 week to go then) When we have all the information available and the investigation is complete, we will contact you with our full response.

 

We understand that you may wish to discuss matters in relation to your complaint during the course of the investigation. (they understand incorrectly)

The case officer handling your complaint is xxxxxx xxxxx, who

will be happy to deal with any questions that you may have. (Question 1 why am I dealing with two different regulatory risk offices when Direct Line and RBS are one and the same group?)

 

Yours sincerely

xxxxxx xxxx

Administration

 

INVESTOR IN PEOPLE

The Royal Bank of Scotland plc. Registered Office: 36 St. Andrew Square, Edinburgh EH2 2YB. Registered in Scotland No. 45551

The Royal Bank of Scotland plc ('The Bank") Is authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

 

 

The questionnaire is yet another delaying tactic for RBS to hang on to PPI money for as long as possible.

 

Time to start thinking about unfair relationship between bank and customer.

 

Keep on with the fight:D

 

aa

[alanalana]

Hello all,

 

sorry to keep posting but I am trying to keep cagers aware of the delaying tactics. (it has taken me long enough to realise but my case is a little more complex than a single loan with a single bank).

 

This is my reply to the previous post which I have commented on.

 

References:

A. My original claim for the mis-selling of PPI dated 9 June 2008. To Retail Regulatory Risk office in Edinburgh.

B. Your Reference xxxx dated 27 June 2008.

 

I write in regard to the above References A and B.

 

Firstly I do not accept that it takes you 18 days to respond to my Reference A with a standard letter (which I frankly find insulting after 5 months of waiting for information) requesting yet more information to be listed in your questionnaire.

 

In your leaflet “What happens when I make a complaint” there is the following sentence, “We will aim to complete our investigation within 4 weeks of receipt of the complaint”.

 

I am including the 18 days it has taken you to respond to my letter as part of that four weeks!

 

Your letter states “I am sorry to learn that you are unhappy and can assure you that your comments are being taken very seriously.”

 

I can assure you most sincerely that the term unhappy falls a long way short of my feelings towards the Royal Bank of Scotland Group at this moment in time.

 

If my comments were being taken seriously I believe I would have received better service than I have to date. 40 items of mail have been exchanged since 9 January 2008 and I am now being asked to complete a questionnaire.

 

I have completed the questionnaire as I have seen fit and I am enclosing details of the four accounts listed above (as supplied by the Direct Line department under my Subject Access Request (S.A.R - (Subject Access Request)) dated 9 January 2008.

 

I would point out that the last account on the list arrived without the appropriate Consumer Credit Agreement being attached.

 

You should despatch this to me as a matter of urgency as my SAR under the Statutory requirement of the Data Protection Act 1998, specifically Section 7, sub sections (1) ( c ) (i) and (ii) has still not been fully complied with. In fact the failure of the Royal Bank of Scotland Group to comply with a Legal Statute under Law is the subject of a very serious complaint to the Information Commissioners Office, Financial Ombudsman Service, Financial Services Authority, Office of Fair Trading and the British Bankers Association.

 

Your letter states “We understand that you may wish to discuss matters in relation to your complaint during the course of the investigation.”

 

You are actually being quite presumptuous with that statement, as I most certainly do not wish to discuss anything with any member of your staff and insist that all communications between us remains only in written format.

 

If I have not received a satisfactory result to this matter by 4 August 2008 (8 weeks as per your leaflet) I will put my complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service and request them to investigate my complaint as comprehensively as possible.

.

Yours faithfully,

 

 

xxx

 

Comments welcomed

 

RBS Group are playing the see how many of our offices you have to deal with game.

 

Yours in reclaiming

 

aa

[fatboydukey]

Hi aa

 

Thanks for posting your link on my thread - OMG I have just read all your posts, what a complete nightmare!

Yours is definately a thread that I will be keeping an eye on to see how things progress!!

Keep on giving them hell!!!

 

fbd

[angry cat]

Had exactly the same letter and questionairre from their Manchester dept. as shown in post 133.

 

However, cannot complete questionairre, as SAR not complied with!

 

Have been waiting for 7 months and am still waiting for SAR info; ICO investigating.

 

How can RBS expect a complainant to fill up a questionairre, when they havn't been supplied with all documents and PPI policy.

 

AC

[alanalana]

Hello angrycat,

 

I should have responded with the same but you do what you do and my response gives the general idea than I am less than well pleased:eek:

 

The ICO have my case as well, (with a reference number) it's just a long haul with them being so busy with people wanting to make claims (Hopefully thousands) (feel sorry for the ICO in a way and the FOS and FSA and OFT for having to deal with this massive ALLEGED Mis-selling of PPI to the unknowing (but not the BBA) The BBA are at least aware that I complained about one of their members.

 

Keep up the fight remember this is new ground in reclaiming unlike illegal bank charges.......1-0

 

could it be 2-0 on PPI it will take a while but with the FSA and Competition Commissioners provisional findings on mis-selling I believe the financial institutions must realise they are on a loser and pay up rather than hang on to profits any longer..

 

Yours a miffed PPI sucker

 

aa

[bathgatebuyer]

AA, just caught up with your post (been a bit preoccupied with mine!) and find the response you have had from the OFT to be really interesting. Perhaps a suitable time for me to start to complain in their direction too about the Halifax. Their comments about Limitations and CCAs though are really useful to me and many others - big thanks to you for typing it all in!

 

(I have visions of you sitting bashing the keyboard in anger as you retell some of the nonsense that you have been fed by your bank - I certainly do that!)

[legallyblonde25]

Hey alanalana, sorry for the delay in replying. Have you found out how much exactly you are due from RBS in total? I think it would be worthwhile you threatening to take them to court for negligent misrepresentation and asking the court to have the contract set aside as voidable. I know to most people this is a scary thought but if under the small claims/summary cause procedure the bank would normally settle on an economical basis if not to avoid the embarassment.

 

If you need a hand drafting a summons let me know

 

Kind Regards

[miss muppet]

Have been watching your thread with interest alanalana as OH is pursuing similar probs with BOS. FOS advised signing their acceptance form without any figures being mentioned as they have kindly said they'll refund PPI into the account and may raise a new loan, we haven't and are asking for a breakdown ,very interesting the point you make legallyblonde, haven't thought of that angle yet!

[Odie]

Can you not take RBS to court over failure to comply with SAR? They will probably send the docs to you quick smart and pay your court fee too. Might save a lot of waiting.

[pompeyfaith]

aa can you not claim the interest at the rate they charged you just a thought i may be wrong

[alanalana]

Hello Bathgatebuyer, legallyblonde, miss muppet, odie and pompeyfaith and thank you for the posts.

 

to legallyblonde

 

Hey alanalana, sorry for the delay in replying. Have you found out how much exactly you are due from RBS in total? I think it would be worthwhile you threatening to take them to court for negligent misrepresentation and asking the court to have the contract set aside as voidable. I know to most people this is a scary thought but if under the small claims/summary cause procedure the bank would normally settle on an economical basis if not to avoid the embarassment.

 

and odie

 

Can you not take RBS to court over failure to comply with S.A.R - (Subject Access Request)? They will probably send the docs to you quick smart and pay your court fee too. Might save a lot of waiting.

 

Firstly re SAR and court route. I have received a lot of information as requested in my SAR but some information is obviously missing and some of exceptionally poor quality ie photocopy of photocopy then faxed then photocopied and eventually sent to me, (basically got a blank sheet of paper). I do have one they sent earlier:D

 

I have complained to the ICO as you will see from my earlier posts. I requested the ICO to enforce them to send me everything requested.

The complaint is lodged and allocated a case worker and ongoing. At the same time I complained to the FOS about this and the complaint has been lodged and passed to casework support team to await allocation to adjudicator.

 

The FSA responded but cannot get involved in disputes. Pointed me to the FOS.

 

The OFT responded but cannot get involved in disputes but asked me to give approval to release the information or allow them to use it within their own right..

By way of example, the OFT may disclose such information in connection with enforcement or regulatory action under its own powers or may refer the information to another government department or enforcement authority.

 

 

The BBA responded but only to state they are a trade organisation an not a regulatory authority and cannot get involved in disputes. ( I nearly wrote a reply )

 

 

I have decided to go down the regulatory route first. If that is unsuccessful then I still have the option of court if it is required.

My main reason is that the mis-selling of PPI is a massive issue and a lot of financial organisations seem to have been guilty of mis-selling hence the fines imposed by the FSA. If more people make complaints to the regulatory authorities the sooner there may be more fines and once an institution is fined as is aptly

quoted by alanfromderby in the stickies it is game over for them

and helps even more CAGers on the reclaim route.

 

Pompeyfaith

 

aa can you not claim the interest at the rate they charged you just a thought i may be wrong

 

I could possibly do that but if I claim at the statutory rate it may be looked at more favourably should it eventually get to court. I am prepared for a long haul on this.

 

My claim figures are not yet finalised and of course increase as each day passes.

 

So I will keep at it and keep you posted as and when more responses are forthcoming.

 

aa

[alanalana]

Hello all,

 

This is the response to my posts 116 and 117.

 

Our ref: PPI/xx/xx/xx/xx

Direct Line: 0161 755 7010

Mr xxx

address

 

RBS

The Royal Bank of Scotland Group

PPI Customer Concerns Team

Regulatory Risk

5th Floor

1 Hardman Boulevard

Manchester

M3 3AQ

 

Telephone: 01617556890

Free Phone: 0800 015 0319

Facsimile: 0161 755 6887

Facsimile: 01617556888

Web Site: RBS | The Royal Bank of Scotland | Personal, Private, Business & Corporate Banking

Opening hours: 8.00am - 5.00pm

(Monday - Friday)

 

xx July 2008

 

Dear Mr xxx

 

Your Payment Protection Insurance Policies with Direct Line

Loan Accounts: xxx, xxx, xxx and xxx

 

You will be pleased to know that I have now finished my review into the concerns that you raised about your Payment Protection Insurance Policies. Your concerns are important to us. This is why we ensure sufficient time is taken to complete a thorough investigation of the issues that you raised.

 

Your concerns

 

You originally raised your concerns when you wrote to us on 9 June 2008. You also kindly took the time to complete and return our customer questionnaire the contents of which has also been taken into consideration when carrying out my investigation. I believe that your

concerns can be summarised as follows:

 

• You are convinced that you were mis-sold these policies for the following reasons;

• Responsibilities When Underwriting a Policy of Insurance: On each occasion, when the details of a loan were discussed our Direct Line sales advisors failed to check your personal circumstances at the time of the sale. At no time was any attempt made to ascertain if the product provided was fit for purpose, suitable for your needs of if indeed it was required at all

 

• Alternative Insurance Cover: Our sales advisors in each case failed to ask you if you had any alternative arrangements for insurance cover

• Failure to Supply Important Information with Regard to Significant Policy Exclusions: You were not informed that the PPI policies could contain certain exclusions which could affect you and your ability to claim. Additionally you were never asked if you had any pre-existing medical conditions or told that a pre-existing medical condition could invalidate your policy

 

• Widespread PPI Mis-selling: You are now aware of the widespread mis-selling of PPI by some financial institutions

 

• Wholly Inappropriate PPI Selling - Employee Bonuses: You understand that some employees are paid higher bonuses if they get prospective creditors to take out PPI loans and that this is not in the customers best interests

 

• True Nature of Single Premium PPI Not Explained: No explanation was forthcoming from any advisor on any occasion on the full extent of single premium PPI policies or the fact that they would offer little or no refund if the loan was settled early or if the insurance was cancelled. There was no explanation that the cost of the PPI premium would be added to the total cost of the credit and interest added for the full term of the agreement

 

Unfair attachment of PPI to the Accounts with no competition involvement allowed: You now believe that the single premium PPI policies attached to the loan accounts were both extremely unfair and totally unreasonable and offered you very little, if any protection value whatsoever. Also you believe that the PPI was unfairly attached as there was no opportunity for you to seek any competitive Insurance.

 

My investigation

 

It is my responsibility to review the circumstances surrounding your purchase of the policies.

This means I have examined the records available from the time of the sale as well as considering your comments. I have done this in order to check that you were made aware of how the policies worked and to confirm you were given all the information you needed to make an informed decision to proceed with them. In doing this, I have tried to reflect the approach that I believe the Financial Ombudsman Service would take if considering your concerns.

 

On this occasion I have been unable to confirm precisely what information you were given at the time you purchased the policies. In the circumstances, as a gesture of goodwill and without any admission of liability, the Bank is prepared to make you the offers detailed

below.

 

My offer - PPxx Loan Account xxx

The Bank is prepared to refund the insurance premiums that you have paid to date as a gesture of goodwill. Our calculations show, that you have paid a total of £1,257.34 for the payment protection element of your loan. This excludes the amount automatically credited to your loan account of £3,485.55 when the policy was cancelled.

 

Therefore the payment due is £1,257.34

 

My offer - PPxx Loan Account xxx

The Bank is prepared to refund the insurance premiums that you have paid to date as a gesture of goodwill. Our calculations show, that you have paid a total of £511.56 for the payment protection element of your loan. This excludes the amount automatically credited to your loan account of £2,122.13 when the policy was cancelled.

 

Therefore the payment due is £511.56

 

My offer - PPxx Loan Account xxx

The Bank is prepared to refund the insurance premiums that you have paid to date as a gesture of goodwill. Our calculations show, that you have paid a total of £430.05 for the payment protection element of your loan. This excludes the amount automatically credited to your loan account of £786.31 when the policy was cancelled.

 

Therefore the payment due is £430.05

2

My offer-PPxx

The Bank is prepared to refund the insurance premiums that you have paid to date as a gesture of goodwill. Our calculations show, that you have paid a total of £481.66 for the payment protection element of your loan. This excludes the amount automatically credited to your loan account of £371.02 when the policy was cancelled.

 

Therefore the payment due is £481.66

 

What can you do next?

 

I trust that you will find my comments helpful and that my offer fully resolves your concerns. However, if you are not satisfied, you can refer this matter to the Financial Ombudsman Service for further investigation. The services they offer are set out in the enclosed booklet

 

"Your complaint and the Ombudsman". Their contact details are as follows:

Financial Ombudsman Service

South Quay Plaza

183 Marsh Wall

London

E149SR

Tel 08450801800

E-mail: [email protected]

Website: Financial Ombudsman Service

 

Should you decide to refer your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service, (FOS) it is a requirement that you do so within six months from the date of this letter. This offer will remain available to you until the option to complain to the Financial Ombudsman Service has expired i.e. before 8 January 2009.

 

I note that you state in your letter of the xx June 2008 that accounts xxx and xxx show no detail of any rebate being paid on refinancing or settlement. Having reviewed the copy documentation that accompanied your letter this information is provided on the account statements (I have enclosed copies illustrating this) albeit in a different format than the information provided on the other two loan accounts.

 

To accept my offer, all you need to do is sign and return the declarations at the end of this letter. On receipt I will arrange for a cheque for the amounts detailed above.

 

I look forward to hearing from you but should you have any questions please do not hesitate to get in touch.

 

Yours sincerely

 

xxx

Case Officer

3

DECLARATION AND ACCEPTANCE - PPI/xx

I wish to accept the Bank's goodwill offer of £1,257.34, on the basis that such an offer is accepted in full and final settlement of all or any claims which I might have against The Royal Bank of Scotland Group or any subsidiary companies in respect of my Payment Protection policy relating to loan account xxx.

I understand that the money will be paid by cheque.

 

Signed:................................................ Date ................................

Mr xxx

 

DECLARATION AND ACCEPTANCE - PPI/xx

I wish to accept the Bank's goodwill offer of £511.56, on the basis that such an offer is accepted in full and final settlement of all or any claims which I might have against The Royal Bank of Scotland Group or any subsidiary companies in respect of my Payment Protection policy relating to loan account xxx.

I understand that the money will be paid by cheque.

 

Signed:................................................ Date ................................

Mr xxx

 

DECLARATION AND ACCEPTANCE - PPI/xx

I wish to accept the Bank's goodwill offer of £430.05, on the basis that such an offer is accepted in full and final settlement of all or any claims which I might have against The Royal Bank of Scotland Group or any subsidiary companies in respect of my Payment Protection policy relating to loan account xxx.

I understand that the money will be paid by cheque.

 

Signed:................................................ Date ................................

Mr xxx

 

DECLARATION AND ACCEPTANCE - PPI/xx

I wish to accept the Bank's goodwill offer of £481.66, on the basis that such an offer is accepted in full and final settlement of all or any claims which I might have against The Royal Bank of Scotland Group or any subsidiary companies in respect of my Payment Protection policy relating to loan account xxx.

I understand that the money will be paid by cheque.

 

Signed:. .............................................. Date ................................

Mr xxx

 

No mention here of statutory interest only repayment of the payments I made on each account until refinanced. I still await a response from RBS on three other loan accounts.

 

My intention is to wait for that response then pass all 7 ppi loan details to the FOS. I may in the meantime write and ask for the statutory 8% to be added to each of the above offers from the day after the loans started up to todays date adding 8% for each additional day before settlement through mutual agreement/FOS/Court.

 

Incidentally I spoke today to the FOS who tell me it is 6 to 9 months for an adjudicator to take up the case so hold onto your hats.

 

aa

[pompeyfaith]

well done and go for it sting them for as much as you can remember they have used that money and profited from it.

 

Regards

 

Pompeyfaith

[adamski]

Well Done!

Should they not also refund the associated interest on all these accounts?

[bathgatebuyer]

Great stuff! Seems like these battles have been going on forever and, at last, some real progress has been made :grin:

[alanalana]

Hello pompeyfaith, adamski bathgatebuyer,

 

Thank you for the posts and support.

 

I am about to draft a letter asking for 8% interest to be added to their figures and request they seriously reconsider their goodwill gesture. I will however sit on my letter until the RBS respond to my claim on the other 3 loans (or not as the case may be) time is up on 29 Jul but being a generous person I will not submit my complaint until first week in August. After all what is a week when the FOS have stated 6 to 9 months. It has taken 6 months so far and this fact will be pointed out to the FOS when the time comes.

 

Keep on with the fight;)

 

aa

[NitrousOxide]

Hi,

You paid interest on this and a hefty amount too.

I don't agree with what they say about the financial ombudsman either.

Well done so far.

[alanalana]

Hello nitrous oxide,

 

I have to ask is that chemical dangerous?

 

Thank you for the well done :DI have now a letter prepared awaiting further response from RBS. I am asking for their offer plus 8% from the day after the loan started up to 1 aug when I may send the letter. It does increase my claim by a few quid watch this space for detail.

 

aa

Edited July 17, 2008 by alanalana
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